Subaru Legacy/Outback Wagons Maintenance & Repair

pilot1226 · May 2010

Okay, just did my second application. It worked well, this time I just did the two fine pieces of sandpaper, and that seemed to get rid of a lot of those scratch marks I noticed. Finished up with the powerball and a little buff from the microfiber cloth, and it looks great.

Mother's recommends you do it about once a month, but I think that may be a little extreme.

pilot1226 · May 2010

It's probably noticable while stopped because the airflow is letting it waft upwards (kind of like when you let your car idle, you can smell the gasoline fumes compared to when you're driving)

As for the smell itself, pop the hood. Take a peek around the oil dipstick and the oil cap, and make sure they're relatively hand tight (don't overtighten the cap because thermal expansion will make this a pain to try to get off). Check the oil level while you're at it and make sure it's not overfilled.

Then, if all looks good, take a peek around the engine block itself. See if you can see any drips. If you still can't see anything, there's some type of special flashlight/filter that will help any oil leaks illuminate. I think it's blue or red, something like that. If you go to an Auto parts store they should know exactly what I'm talking about.

camp8 · May 2010

Oil level is above the full mark. Is this doing any damage to the engine? I haven't gotten under the car yet, is it relatively easy to change oil and filter?

Mr_Shiftright · May 2010

It's easy to change the oil but a slight overfill won't hurt anything. If it's WAY OVER then that's not good and must be adjusted.

As for the smell, best case scenario was that someone was sloppy in refilling the oil (these engines tend to consume some oil between changes as they mile up).

Since you have a 2003, your engine is *not* prone to the dreaded Subaru head gasket leaks.

dakotadriver · May 2010

Changing oil on an Outback is extremely easy (I can only speak to the 2.5 4 cyl). As another person mentioned previously, it is best to check the oil level first thing in the morning as opposed to any other time to get an accurate reading due to the design of the boxer engine which takes a long time to drain back into the oil pan. If your oil level is still reading full you might want to check to see if it is contaminated with anti-freeze to make sure that you don't have the dreaded head gasket problem with this vehicle, as any oil that is burning could be replaced with other fluids leaking past a bad head gasket. Someone could have also spilled oil onto an exhaust part when the oil was last changed and that could be causing the burning oil smell. Good luck.

xwesx · May 2010

It could be an oil leak, which should be noticeable if it is bad enough to be dripping onto the exhaust. Common leak points on these cars are the camshaft seals, front/rear crankshaft seals, and also valve cover gaskets (often around the openings for the spark plugs). If significantly overfilled with oil (more than perhaps about a half-quart), one or more of those gaskets will surely fail in short order. Air movement while driving will push the oil back across the bottom of the engine and force any drips back onto the exhaust system as it converges behind the engine.

Another possibility is a cracked CV boot from one of the front axle half-shafts. As the shaft spins, centrifugal force sends the grease inside the joint onto everything in its path. That smell is fairly distinctive, though, as it is a much fouler smell than engine oil.

ateixeira · May 2010

First I'd wipe any oil spills on the valve cover.

Keep an eye on the oil level, just measure the same way every time.

If you smell it, though, it's probably an external leak/spill. Check the head and valve cover gaskets and the front and rear main seals for oil stains.

camp8 · May 2010

I changed the oil and drained 5 quarts, owners manual said to fill with 4.2 quarts. No leaking oil noticed from top side of engine, did see some had dripped on the exhaust down below. Wiped up all I could and drove around this weekend. I haven't crawled under the car again but I can still smell the oil burning. Must still be a leak somewhere. What do you suggest?

Problem #2 Transmission: When first starting out the transmission shifts fine. As the car warms up it seems to have a problem shifting between gears. Especially when I take my foot off the gas and slow down, then accelerate slowly. Car bucks as it goes back and forth between gears, finally selecting the lower gear and speeding up then shifting to the higher gear. On longer trips, over an hour, transmission is worse. When going uphill transmission seems to slip then catch a bunch of times before getting to the top of the hill when all is fine again. When I got home I checked the transmission fluid, level and color appeared fine. Any idea what is going on here? Can an adjustment be made or do I need a new transmission?

dakotadriver · May 2010

Although you could definitely have an oil leak somewhere, I would bet that the last person who changed the oil overfilled it and either something failed due to that, or, best case scenario, you didn't get all of the oil wiped off the exhaust and you are still smelling oil burning off another part.

Maybe I missed this from somewhere else, but did you say you had an automatic or a manual transmission? I've seen a few posts in the past where people discussed some shifting issues with manual trannys. With my automatic, it takes a little time to shift into 2nd when it is very cold, but works fine once it is warmed up. If you have an automatic, then I would definitely have someone look into that issue.

ateixeira · May 2010

Check the level regularly.

Also see if there is any oil in the coolant.

Was the oil that you drained free of coolant?

camp8 · May 2010

Thanks for the reply. I did forget to mention it is an automatic. I've had the car less than a week, but it seems to shift OK when cold, but gets worse at it warms up. Outside temperatures around here range from 50 to 70 lately. Does this sound like I need a new transmission, or just an adjustment?

camp8 · May 2010

Didn't see any coolant in the oil, or oil in the coolant.

ateixeira · May 2010

Hopefully, then, we are over-reacting, and it was just the spilled oil, and the smell will fade.

xwesx · May 2010

You might try flushing the transmission and replacing filters first to see if that makes any difference. Automatics operate via hydraulic pressure, so if it is having trouble finding gears the problem is likely due to varnish or internal seals.

A replacement transmission is a definite possibility, but I would try remedial action on the current unit first!

fibber2 · May 2010

Your tranny problems don't fit the usual Subaru mode. There is a known issue with some internal seals that harden with time. This usually makes it slow to engage the first shift from park to drive on a cold start without revving the engine to raise internal fluid pressure. Once it warms up, everything runs great. Yours has degraded performance once it warms up. First I've heard of that on these boards.

gearhead8 · May 2010

I have experienced a smell of burned oil after changing the oil on my 2006 Outback.
In my case, this was caused by oil from the oil filter being flung from the seal onto the exhaust header as I spun off the old oil filter. I resolved the problem by being careful to turn the oil filter more slowly as I removed it.

fibber2 · May 2010

As this filter arrangement dumps a fair amount of oil, I position a mini painters pan up under the filter to catch the flood, and drop the filter right into it as I spin it off. Hardly lose a drop that way.

bigian · May 2010

i'm needing to replace my rear aerial, the plastic teeth are broken on the old one. i've bought a new aerial, but can't work how how to detach the old one. any ideas? thanks.

ateixeira · May 2010

Sorry, what is an Aerial?

saedave · May 2010

Another word for antenna.

ateixeira · May 2010

Silly me, for some reason I was thinking the grille, probably because of the plastic teeth comment and the fact that I've removed mine several times.

robr2 · May 2010

Silly me, for some reason I was thinking the grille, probably because of the plastic teeth comment and the fact that I've removed mine several times.

:confuse: Why have you removed your teeth several times?? :confuse:

lilengineerboy · May 2010

Okay so the '05 Legacy wagon needs pads and rotors @ 55k. I am fine with the life I got out of the stock stuff. I am less excited with the price of the stock stuff. So I got ATE power discs and some Akebono ceramic pads.
I also picked up some M8x1.25 bolts that supposedly go into holes on the rotors to drive them off the hub. I have the Chiltons manual and the PDFs of the factory service manual for R&I calipers and rotors. I am a little worried about the parking brake hardware under the rotors. I saw that if the rear rotors won't come off, I can back down the star adjuster to get some clearance.
Is there anything else I'm forgetting?
It said to use DOT3 brake fluid...the stuff i got said its both DOT3 & DOT4 compatible. Are there any trade offs or recommendations?

fibber2 · May 2010

You are right to be concerned about the rears. I had a nasty rust ridge form that prevented the extraction of the rotor without retracting the mini-shoes. If you try driving them out using the bolts without retracting them first, you can damage the parking brake retaining hardware.

Also, apply penetrating oil in advance to those two threaded holes. The 'hat' is thin, and if you strip out the limited threads, getting the rotor off will be that much harder. I also had to apply a little penetrating oil around the 5 wheel studs as everything was well fused by rust (welcome to NY!!).

Another tip - at least on my '02 - there are stainless steel spring clips that also serve as the wear indicators. When you pull the pads out of the carrier, remove the springs and clean the track that they fit into well. I even filed the slot of some rust, and used high temp brake grease behind the stainless clips so that they fit in all the way. These allow the disk brake pads to 'float' and aid in their retraction away from the disk. If they are too tight, the pads will wear prematurely and unevenly.

lilengineerboy · May 2010

Thanks for the feedback. That was the trickiest part, but you are right, as long as I backed off that adjuster, the pads released and everything came apart nicely. Everything went back together smoothly and the brakes bled/flushed well. Interestingly, the pads and rotors both said not to bed-in the pads, but just drive softly for a few hundred miles.
I don't like the way the parking brake is working now, so I have to go back and turn the adjuster a few clicks the other way.
I've done brakes enough times on enough cars that it shouldn't worry me, but the first time I do it on any car, I am always stressed I'm going to run into something I haven't seen before.

fibber2 · May 2010

Very glad to hear it went well!

camp8 · June 2010

I bought a 2003 Outback without any key fobs. I just bought a couple of key fobs from ebay and tried to program them. Followed instructions, open door, close door, put key in ignition and turn from lock position to on position 10 times in less then 15 seconds. Horn should beep one time to indicate you are in program mode. Car does not beep. I have tried many times, but horn does not beep. I can't get into program mode. What else can I try?

ateixeira · June 2010

Hmm, are you friendly with the local dealer?

Wonder if maybe a battery reset would help? To de-program the previous remote that was synched with it?

Just a thought, try at your own risk.

fibber2 · June 2010

I'm assuming that you bought the car thru a dealer and have no way of ever recovering the original remotes or know the history of the car?

I ask, because there is possible interaction between the factory alarm system (if it has the alarm module installed - it was an option on my '02 that I added myself) and the ability to enter program mode for syncing up the remotes. I don't think that the system will enter program mode if it was left in either 'Valet' or 'passive arm' modes. Read further in your owners manual about these various alarm states.

camp8 · June 2010

You are correct, I bought it from a dealer and have no way of recovering the original remotes. Additionally, I only received one key which only opens the side doors and starts the car. Does not open the tailgate or the glove box, so is probably a valet key. I went to a subaru dealer with VIN to get a master key made. They made one but it did not work, dealer said locks have been changed. And yes the car does have the alarm system. I have set it off a few times, but was able to turn it off by putting the key in the ignition and turning off/on 3 times.

Last night I tried disconnecting the battery for a few minutes, then reconnected and tried programming fob again. Same result, no horn beep after 10 on/offs with the key. Seems like if I can turn the alarm off with the key off/on 3 times, I should be able to enter the fob program mode with the key off/on 10 times.

ateixeira · June 2010

Rats, it was worth a try I suppose.

xwesx · June 2010

No. If you have the valet key, it is not going to allow you to do the programming. Think of it like a computer with an "administrator" account versus a "guest" account.... you cannot install programs or change the system configuration with the guest account!

Is they plastic portion of the key grey? The valet keys usually are - the masters are black. Why you would get a car with only a valet key is beyond me, though. Sounds fishy. Did you get a "shady dealer" discount so you have enough money to deal with all the crap that you will undoubtedly encounter during your ownership experience?!

camp8 · June 2010

Key has no plastic, it is all metal, like a copy you have made at a hardware store. I was able to turn the alarm off with this key. Will a valet key turn the alarm off, but not enter program mode?

ateixeira · June 2010

I think the chip is embedded in the plastic part of the key.

xwesx · June 2010

That's crazy. So, you have a hardware store copy of a valet key. Nice. If the car runs, one of the original keys must be tucked up under the dash somewhere (though this could be the original valet key). The car will not run without the chip in one of the original keys very close to the ignition (when I was testing this with the "door keys" on my 2007 Outback, I had to have an original key within about 6" if the ignition - I could set one at the base of the instrument cluster and it would work, but that is about as far away as it could get).

The question is, why would someone do that? It is common practice locally when installing aftermarket auto-starts, but beyond that....

camp8 · June 2010

I have a 2003 outback, I don't think they were putting chips in the key back then.

xwesx · June 2010

Hahah... sorry. I was thinking it was a 4th gen car. I think you're right; they started the chipped keys in 2005.

morin2 · June 2010

Maybe, maybe not. My wife's 07 Forester - which we bought new, has an all-metal factory valet key. My 09 Outback factory valet key has a plastic upper - but whether it is purely decorative or contains a chip, I don't know.

I don't understand trading in a car without the original keys. I hope you made a fuss about it and got the price of the car reduced a few hundred for that screw-up alone. To me, its suspicious and I might have walked on the deal.

fibber2 · June 2010

My '02 came with three keys:
A bare metal key stamped Subaru which I carry, a black plastic key (wife), and the grey (IIRC) valet key which is somewhere in my desk draw. No chips in '02, as the security system was an option.

You might consider talking to your insurance agent about the problems you are having and see if they can look into the DMV database for a lead on the previous owner. Appeal to them on the fact that the asset is at risk for theft as someone has viable programmed remotes out there that you cannot clear out of the system. In many states they have to power to obtain this info, but often will not do it based on privacy concerns.

dguier · June 2010

After Replacing a blown head gasket on my 96 OB the engine fails to start. I have checked spark and fuel both. Engine will turn over but will not start. Any ideas?

:sick:

Mr_Shiftright · June 2010

Okay, if you are sure you have fuel, spark and an injector pulse, the car should start, even running badly---but if there's nothing then we have to look at how you worked with the timing belt. So maybe a compression test is in order here.

You can double check for fuel or injector problems by squirting some starting fluid in the intake---if the engine kicks off momentarily, you might have fuel pressure in the rail but no injectors opening.

You might also pull a spark plug and try to see/smell fuel on it. You can also buy inexpensive spark testers.

I'd try all these double-checks before you go tearing off the timing case cover.

visiting host

ateixeira · June 2010

Make sure all the hoses are connected, even a little emissions vapor hose can cause it not to start.

dguier · June 2010

Thank you for the advice. I am checking everything again and have determined that the primary resistance on the coil pack is right at the limit and I am getting weak (yellow/orange) spark. should I replace this or save the $100?

fibber2 · June 2010

I haven't had a spark plug out at the end of a wire in a very long time, but my gut says the arc should be blue-white.

jhd · June 2010

What do you guys use to condition moon roof seal? I do not want that thing to leak water one day. I heard that you should not use silicone based conditioner on that seal, since it dries out.

morin2 · June 2010

My current cars don't have moonroofs, but on previous moonroof seals, I used 303 Aerospace Protectant for up to 11 years and never had a problem. I still use it on my Subaru door seals & yes, I believe it is silicone free. We had a 94 Legacy that was treated every 3-4 months with 303 and the seals looked as good as new 16 years later when we sold it, with no cracking or drying.

aiwa112 · June 2010

I am looking to buy a Legacy their are other awd cars on my list too ie: cr-v, matrix. I would like to know what everyones experience with maintenance costs were like with subaru. I need awd cause I live in NJ and the snow storms we had this year were horrible

ateixeira · June 2010

It's pretty similar to other cars, the only real difference in service is the rear differential gear oil needs to be changed (30k or 60k miles, depending upon how crazy you are about maintenance).

It's easy, though. 2 bolts, one quart of 75w90 gear oil. Easier than an oil change.

That's it.

What surprises me is you list the CR-V, which competes more with the Forester, and the Matrix, which was discontinued and competed with the Impreza and Outback Sport. Avoid the Matrix, because the AWD model made only 123hp last time I looked. You can't get out of your own way. The Impreza has been at 165hp since 2002.

doctort · June 2010

A similar problem is stumping me with my 2003 Outback wagon. The power door locks work manually from inside, but the remote key has no effect at all. I've replaced the remote control and reprogrammed it, but still nothing! It's tough to have a small baby and have to use the key in the door to lock and unlock the car. What could be wrong?

dakotadriver · June 2010

I had the same problem with my 2001 Outback remote. I went into Radio Shack to replace the battery and the clerk told me that he was noticing the same trouble with other people and their remotes, and that it was a broken solder point inside the remote which is causing the batter to not connect to the circuit. He took out a solder gun and re-soldered the connection and my remote has worked perfectly since.

Subaru Legacy/Outback Wagons Maintenance & Repair

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