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Lexus SC 430

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Comments

  • toyotas1toyotas1 Posts: 134
    Can you answer a few questions for us? What do you think of the new XLR and Benz SL? How does your car handle/ride? Are you happy with the ride/handling tuning? Is the trunk good for TWO sets of golf clubs? Are the seats good for "spirited driving"? Any chassis "flex" over uneven pavement? Did you test the CLK Cabrio before buying? (Sorry, to ask so much, but this doesn't happen every day!)
  • rayferrayfer Posts: 5
    just had my 15k service on the sc430. the main problem i have had in the year since i have owned it is the roof rattle. the dealer replaced the entire roof interior and it has solved the problem it seems.
    i went and sat in the new SL500 mercedes yesterday. the lexus interior is far nicer. i like the mercedes body style better though. they wanted 117k for the mercedes... i would rather buy his and her sc430's
  • squidd99squidd99 Posts: 288
    You ask: "can the sc430 go through an automatic car wash?" First, why not? What are you afraid of? I've driven mine at high speeds in the driving rain, and I doubt that a car wash is more severe than that. Do you think it will tear the top off? I don't think so. And secondly, why? If you have a nice finish (like Zaino) on your car, which you should, or even a good wax, an automatic car wash will just mark the thing up with swirl marks like crazy. In other words, I would think that the automatic car wash would not hurt the car, would would be devestating to the finish.

    I have seen the list of options the dealer can change in the computer (e.g.: I had him change my system so that both doors unlock when I put the car into "Park") and I don't think the rear windows are on there. In my experience, they are too small to make any difference, up or down. Some people have asked if they can be put up while the top is down, and now you want to know if they can be put down while the top is up. I've never wanted to do either, although your inquiry makes more sense. My guess is that they are too small to be up with the top down. Why they will not down with the top up is anyone's guess, but maybe it's because noone wants to ride in the back seat with the top up anyway. You will just have to sit your dog down and have a little talk with him.

    As for the other set of questions from toyotas1, "not much" re the XLR; the SL500 looks good (I saw one yesterday) from the front, but I don't like the back so much. It is a very large car for a hardtop conv. I don't like the interior much, either, and I think it's way overpriced; MB will throw in overpriced and indifferent service with every sale.

    The SC430 handles very well for a GT. It's not a Porsche and is not trying to be. For most pupopses, it corners like a snake in a rathole. The ride and handling are fine, and you can put a lot of stuff in the trunk if you do it right. With the top up, I expect that at least 2 sets of clubs could go in the trunk, but I don't know as I don't play golf. The number of tennis rackets is almost unlimited, though. With the top down, you are probably limited to one set (as long as you have the run flats/no spare option).

    The seats are very comphy and fine for spirited driving, but this is not a car you want to drive at its limits. I looked at the CLK's and did not like them at all. They are much bigger and far less luxurious. The interior in them is very plain. If you need a full back seat and a much bigger car, it's fine. I felt that the cars are so different that I don't think they are targeted at the same market, although I might be wrong on that. The CLK just did not look at all like what I was interested in, while the SC said "I am very different from anything else out there -- notice me."

    Or maybe that was the girls that keep asking me about it.
  • karklinkarklin Posts: 15
    I have had a Honda S-2000 traded for a Boxter and the Boxter for the SC-430 I like the last one the best.Beautiful ride lots of goodies.
    I would highly recommend it [email protected]
  • As prospective SC 430 buyer there are several issues, that have caught my attention while looking at previous posts.
    1. Tires. Has anyone opted for the non runflat variety and regretted it (cost, mileage, roadholding etc) or vice versa?
    2. How much is routine maintenance costing?
    3. Can anyone explain or even hazard a guess as to why there are 70+ SC 430 models for sale on Cars.com and less than 30 (2001) GS 300 models on the same website? Does this represent a glut of the 2 door?
    4. Is anyone getting the SC 430 for less than MSRP
    Thanks.
  • calstercalster Posts: 2
    Thanks for your reply.

    Don't know why I worry about auto car washes... I worry more about scratching the finish than anything else. Having had convertibles in the past, they were a major no-no because of the cloth tops, but I figured with the hard top it was probably OK. Then again, if I'm going to own this car, I should not be so lazy as to wash it myself .

    The dog, however, is not pleased . Then again, many folks don't believe that the dog ought to even be allowed in this car, but they aren't dog people.

    Thanks for your help.
  • joe166joe166 Posts: 401
    I bet the dog is wondering whether YOU should be allowed in his car. Pets are a great way to get humility.
  • squidd99squidd99 Posts: 288
    A reader asks:
    1. Tires. Has anyone opted for the non runflat variety and regretted it (cost, mileage, roadholding etc) or vice versa?
    2. How much is routine maintenance costing?
    3. Can anyone explain or even hazard a guess as to why there are 70+ SC 430 models for sale on Cars.com and less than 30 (2001) GS 300 models on the same website? Does this represent a glut of the 2 door?
    4. Is anyone getting the SC 430 for less than MSRP

    To the best of my experience and knowledge:
    1. Almost everybody has the runflats. I have no problem with them. From what I hear, the ride difference is not much and although you have the "security" of a spare, you have virtually no trunk space when the top is down. Depending on the weather, this can be a lot of time. Get the runflats. Life is too short.

    2. It's right in line with other Lexus services. Probably more than the Buick dealer charges, but you aren't interested in a Buick. The Lexus service and support is the best in the world, and it's not expenseive as MB; that's good enough for me. Finally, apart from routine service, in 10 years I've hardly had any other service calls at all. Nothing seems to go wrong on these cars. That's why they are at the top of the Powers survey all the time.

    3. Don't know. Could be because people on the waiting list got the car and it was different from what they expected. It's different from almost everything on the road, and it's not everyone's cup of tea. If you can find a deal on a used one, grab it. Around here, used ones were recently going for up to $10,000.00 over sticker due to demand by people far down on the waiting list. Wealthy people, I think. I don't know what car.com is, and am not sure you should generalize too much from the data you find there.

    4. Only in your dreams.

    Happy motoring.
  • 43810774381077 Posts: 31
    For what it's worth my Boston dealer's taking $2K off the list right out of the box. Of course, I'm a regular customer and when they do offer a number less than MSRP they usually hold to it within a few bucks. Isn't much negotiating usually.
    Also you have to remember that the economy isn't what it was, the T-birds are out( not that it's direct competition) there are new SL's on the street ( again not direct competition) and the SC is not a limited production and there are plenty of resales available. Typical resale seems to be one with 6 or 10,000 miles asking price mid $50's, $6 or $7K off list.
  • joeyb1joeyb1 Posts: 5
    I have a different opinion on Run Flats, and I think the choice may depend on where you live. I find them quite harsh. My car is only two months old, and I have had the rear subframe bushings replaced. And, they will be replaced again in a few weeks. This is common problem on the SC430(ref Tech. service Bulletin SU004-01).
    However, without a spare the trunk room is significant for a convertible. I can put my bicycle in the trunk without wheels. The OEM runflats have a rating of 140, so I would only expect about 15,000 miles from them.

    I've seen the ads on the internet. some may be people dissatisfied with the car. But, I suspect that a lot are from people who hoarded the cars when they were in demand in order to make a fast buck. Now they need to get rid of them.

    My understanding is that most dealers are charging MSRP, but that there are cars available.
  • Joe,

    Where do you live? How many miles did you put on your SC in those two months?

    Personally, I'm very happy with the runflats so far. I bought my SC at the end of 2001 and only have 1500 miles on it. My dealer sold me the car for a little (about $1 K) less than MSRP, I think so he could book the sale last calendar year.
  • squidd99squidd99 Posts: 288
    I've had my SC since May, have about 6,000 miles on it, and have no problem with the run flats. I think they are an excellent trade off for the top down space. I was told that I might get as little as 10,000 miles on them, but they still look pretty good, even though I drive it pretty fast and corner harder than necessary, just because I can.

    Nor have I had any problem with the bushings as you describe, although I will look at the Tech Serv Bulletin and ask my service mgr about it when I take the car in for routine service in the next few weeks. Expect a full report here.
  • ben54ben54 Posts: 5
    Just had the 10,000 mile service on my SC430; been through the 1000 and 5000. I noticed on my invoice that the next service is due at 13,750. Before I go back to question the dealer, I'm going to ask Lexus "Central" if there is a TSB out on this. I was assuming an "every 5000 mile" service" (even thou I really don't think every 7000 would hurt). No driving extreems here in Dallas...except summer,..but we're not there yet...and thats the only reason I was using 5000 vice 7000... COMMENTS ANYONE?
  • evictorevictor Posts: 1
    I have a friend who bought recently a SC 430 from Longo Lexus in El Monte (near Los Angeles) for $2,000 under MSRP.
  • opentopopentop Posts: 3
    Just hit 5K and runs like a charm, changed out the run flats day one and no regrets. Not a squeak, rattle or other problem noted. Also got rid of the pie plate wheels day one.

    Tires: Dunlop S9000's with BBS wheels
  • 43810774381077 Posts: 31
    Can you get a set of golf clubs in the truck with the top down, or for that matter with it up? I've yet to find an SC on a dealer's lot w/o run flats to run my own test. How do the BBS wheels look? Did you select the Dunlops to soften the ride? I swaped out the Michelin Pilots on my CLK to Bridgestone Potenza's, got a much harder ride with no visible improvement in handling...the 9000's were the other option.
  • carnaughtcarnaught Desert SWPosts: 2,783
    ...are not really that hard of a ride thanks to the excellent suspension, IMHO
  • drrobertdrrobert Posts: 8
    Hi everyone out there; just curious if any of you have owned an SC300? I just got a 1997. Awesome car, but could use a little more power. Any suggestions?

    BTW, Ive read through this discussion, and just want to say for the record that looks are subjective and no one should claim that the SC430 is ugly. What is ugly to one person, may be just perfect to someone else. To each his own.
  • squidd99squidd99 Posts: 288
    A listener writes:

    "Hi everyone out there; just curious if any of you have owned an SC300? I just got a 1997. Awesome car, but could use a little more power. Any suggestions?"

    Yes. Trade it in on an SC400. The 300 has a six; the 400 has the V8, with about 280 hp. I had an SC400 for almost 10 years (which takes me out of the target audience of your question) and I never wanted for more power.

    Of course, now that I have the SC430 which has the newer Lexus V8 (4.3 L instead of 4.0, and 300 hp instead of whatever the other one had), I am enjoying even greater performance, acceleration and gas bills.

    Life is too short . . .
  • carnaughtcarnaught Desert SWPosts: 2,783
    ...1993 SC300. Although it was not the fastest car on the block, I never wanted for more power. The car, which was one of my best, had terrific ergonomics, seemlesss shifts and always made me feel like I was pampered. 0-60 times are not everything, although it was only .7 sec slower (0-60 time) than the SC400. So... just enjoy the car.
  • devokedevoke Posts: 33
    We are buying a new SC430 this week. We are in Mobile Al, but may be buying the car from Lexus of Orlando Fla. We were on vacation down there a few weeks ago and noticed they had $2k off MSRP. Nice folks there. Hopefully, my Lexus dealership, who are now friends, will match the price or make it worthwhile for the $2k difference. I really want to buy here, because I live here. Both dealerships seem to be super nice and very professional.

    The reason we are buying a Lexus, other than the obvious fact that this is an awesome car, is I have read nothing negative on Lexus reliability or service. The same can not be said of my Mercedes-Benz SLK230. Long story short, it had 21 visits to service in 2 yrs. We had to go to arbitration to get the arrogant folks at MB to do something about the car's problems. Bottom line is the arbitration took almost 7 months and almost $4k to complete, but MB had to refund our original purchase price, in full. The car has about 17k miles and was purchased in Aug '99. We just got the results this week. Buyers please beware MB will NOT stand behind their car when they create a lemon. AND, they will be arrogant about not standing behind it. They admitted they could not repair the car and offered me $6k less than Edmund's average trade-in price because the car had "problems." Is that a total lack of taking responsibility for a "lemon" or what?

    All reports say Lexus will stand behind whatever they make and will replace it if they do happen to produce a lemon. I can tell you that means alot when you happen to get one.
  • 43810774381077 Posts: 31
    Or as more accurately stated "lack of", I finally got a rise out of my guys recently. I'm using a dealer 30+ miles from home owing to the attitude and horrible service locally. These guys have been pretty good, great compared to their peers, but have begun to adopt " the attitude". On my last visit, in response to that "you're dirt" look and tone they give you I suggested that I'd be a little less bold if my product were playing catch up with Lincoln and Cadillac in the JD Powers rankings. Got him really ticked, but at least knocked the smirk off his face.
    If only Lexus could match MB's style and technology, or MB could adopt the Lexus reliability, quality, service standards, one would put the other out of business. Right on to the poster who dragged them thru the arbitration process.
  • squidd99squidd99 Posts: 288
    I asked my service manager about the tech bullietin and the rear subframe bushings.

    He said it's no big deal; they have had about two cars so far on which they have replaced the bushings per the service bulletin. There is no recall or anything so major. He said there is a bad batch out there that go bad and make some noise. If this happens, you will hear it. If this happens, they will make it right and replace the bushings.

    As far as he can tell, it's pretty rare.

    It sounds to me like they have a pretty good handle on this, which is both very much like Lexus and, of course, the impression any Lexus service manager would want to convey.

    If anyone has any other information about these bushings, let us know.
  • drrobertdrrobert Posts: 8
    Thanks to squidd99 and carnaught for responding to my question.

    I may trade up to an SC400 one day, but carnaught is correct in that the 300 is such a great car that maybe I should overlook the 0-60 and just enjoy the overall greatness of the car in terms of handling and luxury, not to mention its a fantastic looking car.
    Thanks for the input.
  • squidd99squidd99 Posts: 288
    You are correct, sir.

    The SC300/400 is still one of the best looking cars on the road.

    Although I am having a blast with my new SC430, I sometimes, maybe a little bit, miss the elegant sweeping lines and beautiful curved front end of the 400, not to mention the luxurious ride.

    Enjoy it because it will be some time before there is anything else quite like it again.
  • aj123aj123 Posts: 1
    Hello All. Recently purchased White Gold Crystal SC430. After week noticed paint peeling off lower parts of front bumper as well as side of rear bumper. Dealer was great and replaced vehicle with new one--same color. Picked up yesterday, looked great, took home and noticed very small "pucker" on front bumper, where it meets fender. Bumpers are plastic and color that peaks through is black, in all instances. Is this just an isolated issue (pearl white the culprit?) or have you noticed the same problem? The problem would appear most prominently around lower portion of wheel wells on plastic bumpers only. But takes keen eye to notice. From my perspective, it appears Lexus may have a build/quality issue with respect to how the plastic bumpers are painted...Don't want to have to paint brand new car...Not sure whether to return this one too. Thanks!
  • I have a friend who also had problems with the paint peeling on plastic areas- this on a black sc430. My own silver 430 doesn't show any evidence of the problem.
  • carnaughtcarnaught Desert SWPosts: 2,783
    ...and have not noticed any related bumper paint problems but will watch for it.
  • squidd99squidd99 Posts: 288
    First of all, you guys (and Lexus) are going to have to decide if your cars are white, gold or crystal. Make up your mind.

    Anyway, mine is black (Bituminous Midnight Shade)and shows no paint problems on the plastic or other parts of the car.

    My only paint gripe is that a road stone hit the lower silver painted surface of the grill area, which scratched off the paint, leaving a small black spot (I guess it's plastic under the silver paint). For a while, I thought it was tar on top of the silver. When I examined it carefully, after the spot would not come out (damn spot), I asked the dealer if he would either touch it up or sell me a little touch up paint thing for the silver, like I have for the black paint.

    But they don't have that in silver for the grill where I have the nick, and they had no suggestions. Maybe I should just get a generic silver touch up paint at AutoZone and try that, unless anyone has any better ideas. I think a close match would be better than a black spot.

    This is not a big problem, but I appreciate your time.
  • ahhaahha Posts: 5
    Does anyone know of a high quality outfit that chromes the stock wheels on the SC430 and LS400?

    I seem to be lucky so far..no rattles...no paint problems on my Twilight Amethyst SC...still only 2600 miles..after almost 1 year.

    Squidd99, love the Zaino stuff..buying more!!!
  • I find if I have a problem, and just ask the service manager to deal with it, when I pick the car up, it is dealt with. The more a person gets involved, the more the person will have to do. Tony
  • Is anyone else a bit dissatisfied with the transmission in their 430? I really do love this car, I knew I was buying a GT, not a true sports car, and maybe it's because this is my first automatic in some time, but if there's one complaint I have it's the hesitation and lack of smoothness in my car's pickup. Very un-lexus-like compared to the GS and earlier SC I have driven in the past that are responsive to a feather-light touch and amazingly smooth. Are others getting this? Maybe I should take the car in to be checked out (1500 miles).....
  • joeyb1joeyb1 Posts: 5
    I would certainly talk with the service guys.

    What I think you are feeling is the Drive-by-wire system. I noticed a one to two second delay in throttle response. The service technician knew exactly what I was talking about and said it was the normal operation of the car. Although I would still prefer more response, I have gotten used to it
  • I have an 02 SC430 with 14000km's on it. Just took it out after being stored for the winter and sure missed driving it, but what I did not miss is the VERY VERY hard ride that comes with the Run Flats.
    Every bump I hear a clunk coming from my the back of the car, both sides. Sometimes its so loud sounds like something is broken, I have noticed it much more after not having been in it for 4 months while it was stored, now I hear about the TSB and the bushings, read all the posts in the fourm and found nothing much about it. Anybody got the details of the TSB and does what I describe sound like the problem?
    I will contact the dealer about this but I like to have the info myself before I start talking to them.
    Now that I think about it my 1996 SC400 had a very similar problem, clunking over bumbs in the left rear over the wheel well, was in the shop for 3 days a week after I got it and they put in a bunch of new parts and I never heard from it again. Weird....
  • 43810774381077 Posts: 31
    The main reason I don't own an SC is the lag you mention. However, when I returned from my initial test drive totally dissatisfied the salesman sent me back out with instructions to use the sport mode, keep it in third gear and to shut off the automatic pilot ( the electronic skid control or whatever it's called). The performance and response improved considerably. It's a shame you have to trick the car to get it to behave better, but MB has the same problem with the auto pilot engaged so it appears unavoidable. The solution for all these companies is to have "off" as the default on all these electronic control devices and let those who want to idiot proof the car turn them on. I have the same problem even with my wife's 300. If you want to drive it hard with the controls on the computer is constantly cutting power when it senses you're driving too fast. She has taken to shutting the thing off.
  • topgun7topgun7 Posts: 412
    Silver430, I would definitely get the bushing. I have a Indigo 430 and had the bushing done about 1 1/2 months ago. We did not have the clunking noise but felt the harsh ride with the run flat. My wife refused to drive the car. We went to the dealer, pointed out the service bulletin to them. It made a very big difference in the day to day ride of the car. In high speed, it feels as stable as before (I had only taken it up to about 90 after changing the bushing). My wife actually like to drive the car now. You may want to go to www.clublexus.com. In their sc430 forum they have a thread that discussed in detail about the bushing change and has some more folks posted their experience with the change.
  • I made my way over there and got a heap of info on the TSB for the Bushings. My car is in my dealer as I write this. I am interested to see how much of a difference it makes. Thanks again topgun7
  • gandrogandro Posts: 3
    I am considering purchasing a 2002 Lexus SC430.
    Unfortunately, all come into the dealerships on the west coast with runflats. From owners comments and my own test drive, I would prefer the ride with non run-flat tires. Besides in the years I have driven, I have never replaced a tire
    When I had a flat I either called AAA or used a can of fix-a-flat. So with the SC430, I will not put a spare in the trunk. So to all of you SC430 owners, can you recommend a Non Run-Flat set of tires? My preference is ride comfort, wet traction (not snow), and noise. Performance is secondary, but of course I don't want to sacrafice too much, if possible.
  • squidd99squidd99 Posts: 288
    I've had my car since last May, about 6 weeks after the first deliveries were made, and I have not yet had to deal with getting new tires.

    Although I know some owners have swapped tires back and forth between the two types, there are not many who have done so, and there is just not too much experience that owners have had with different sets of tires because the car model is so new.

    Get the size from the spec sheet, and ask around at a local tire store that you trust (that means, not a big chain because they will want to sell you what they have; go to an independent dealer who carries high performance tires; if you are looking at this car, you probably know a tire store like that).

    Also talk to your dealer, because you need to specify non-run flats on the car. That set-up does not have the pressure sensors - it's more than just a different set of tires. The dealer may have some choices for you. If not, you will have the choice of taking what Lexus supplies and driving on them, or you will have to unload them at a considerable loss and get new tires which maybe will be better for your purposes and maybe not.

    If you really don't want run flats (and you will find that about 80 to 90% have them, so this will limit your choices) see what the dealer suggests, and try to get him to put on the car what your needs suggest. I have found Lexus dealers (OK: one dealer, but over 10 years) to be most accommodating. I think this is your best bet since you want something non standard at delivery.

    As for your desire for a tire providing ride comfort, wet traction, low noise and relatively high performance, let me know if there is such a tire. If there is, by the way, it will be soft rubber and high milage will not be on the menu.

    Let us know what you find out, because a lot of us will be in the replacement tire market in the next year or so. (Especially as the run flats, which most of us have, are only good for 15,000 miles or so -- we shall see.)
  • I would also like some info on replacment tires. I have a shop that I can talk to in the area here that might be able to lend a little insight into the matter. As an aside, I just had the bushings replaced on my car and the difference is amazing.
    I think that I will get away from the run flats on my next set of tires but that being said because my car is a very low mileage car the tech'gy. in the run flat tires might be vastly improved by the time its ready for new tires. Although I am not sure where the whole run flat industry is heading but thats another issue all together.

    The ride that I now have is what exactly what I expect from a car that is riding on the tires with the size, design(run flat), aspect ratio and speed rating. I am much much happier with the car and no longer think the run flats are to blame for the clunking and such that I used to endure on a regular basis from my cars rear end.
  • carnaughtcarnaught Desert SWPosts: 2,783
    ...leading to replacement of the bushings?
  • amg55amg55 Posts: 1
    I ran across this comment on the Mercedes board: "Comparing the Lexus to the new MB SL500 is ridiculous. Its like comparing the smell and appeal of a beautiful rose to the smell and appeal of a wet dog's [non-permissible content removed]".

    Rather strong commentary from the MB boys.
    Anyone here seen the new Mercedes SL's?
  • squidd99squidd99 Posts: 288
    Sure, we've seen them. They are on the MB dealers' lots, and the magazines have had articles and photos for the last two months.

    And the cars should be compared, as they are both 2 seat (more or less) luxury folding hardtop convertibles. The comparison is not ridiculous, even if one's opinion is that one car is far superior to the other.

    For example, if you compare them on price, the MB is much more expensive. If you compare the Nav systems, the MB system is extremely old, CD technology that is not only virtually obsolete, but prevents you from using the CD player to play music while you are using the Nav system. (When I'm on the highway, which is where I use the Nav system the most, is the same time I play CD's the most.)

    Then there are the subjective comparisons, such as which car is better looking, and let's not get into that, because you can't win that argument. (Some people walked out of "Moulin Rouge.")

    Both are good cars, and each will appeal to a lot of people. It's a great comparison, and not as ridulous as the example give.

    Of course, that's just my opinion, I could be wrong.
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    Exactly. There isn't much to compare here. The SL wins on just about every count, except for a nav system and stereo.

    M
  • sphinx99sphinx99 Posts: 776
    In my opinion, both are ok looking cars. The SC430 definitely has grabbed my attention each time I've seen it, but usually as much for how well it's been detailed as anything. I've seen lots of mud-covered SLs (just like everything in Detroit gets mud-covered during winter) but I don't think I've ever seen a SC that wasn't sparkling. Go figure. The SC does look much more futuristic. I suspect it's going to age quite nicely; it's a look I hated that's slowly growing on me as I see more and more of them. The fact that it has such an astonishingly high quality exterior finish (I've never seen paint deeper and more lustrous than what Lexus gave the SC) gives it an air of wealth and luxury that's pretty rare in my opinion.

    I don't think the new SL500 looks all that elegant. I finally saw one, it looked very sporty and my fiance called it "cute" but I actually preferred the older style a little more. In inheriting some of the styling of the SLK it also inherited that "cuteness" - I suspect this would get named in the "chick car" discussion if there were more financial parity between the genders. The one I saw was a silver color, which probably contributed to the so-so response I had. Silver is a nice blend-in color on any car model, a rich black SL500 would probably be much more eye-catching.

    I don't think in terms of looks you can point to one car and call it heads or tails better than the other. It's personal opinion. I do think the SL has a more blending-in design, while the SC is more extroverted.
  • squidd99squidd99 Posts: 288
    Most of the articles I have read agree that the SL500 is an extremely advanced car in regards to current automotive technology. Innovations abound in suspension, braking, very nifty folding top, really big engine, etc.

    But it costs close to twice what the SC430 costs, so it ought to offer more. That is why I am very surprised that the NAV system is so bad and I understand that the sound system is also not as good as it should be in a car of this stature.

    As far as appearance goes, the interior is generally considered to be not as elegant as the Lexus, and it does not have the leather storage space behind the front seats, which we all love so dearly.

    On the outside, both cars are good looking (who would pay this kind of money for an Aztec???), but they are very different, and will appeal to different people in different ways. If you drive a Navigator, you probably won't like either one, even if you could get a good look from way up there.

    Since the price difference is so great, the question for me is whether I would pay extra for what the SL has to offer. When I was looking for a convertible (to replace my SC400), I did not like the SLK because it was too small (same for the Boxter and the little BMW), but I gladly paid more for the SC430, which costs more than those cars. (I also drove the Jag XK conv for a weekend, and my only thought was "way overpriced," and this was a year before I even knew about the SC430. That's still my opinion of that car; but it is fun to drive.)

    I do not know whether I would pay the extra amount for the SL500, but, if I were in the market, I would take a good look and probably a few test drives. If someone gave me one, I'd keep it.

    Your mileage may vary.
  • karklinkarklin Posts: 15
    Does anyone know how to remove the CD changer from a Lexus ES-300 that is mounted in the glove compartment.Any help would be appreciated.
    Thank you kindly
    [email protected]
  • opentopopentop Posts: 3
    I have Dunlop S9000's with BBS wheels. Greta looking, great performance tires. The dealer also reinstalled the run flat sensors so the tire pressure light didn't stay on in the dash. I opted to put the spare in trunk.

    Unless you want to replace the $120/each pressure sensors, don't use flat-fix cans. They damage the sensor. You can opt to leave the sensors out but then you need to either disable the light, somehow elegantly cover it, or let it annoy the heck out of you.
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    Well that may be true, the SL does continue the Mercedes design them, but updated and sleeker, while the SC430 looks like nothing else, with no previous cars to draw upon from Lexus, so I'll give you that the SL may blend more. With the SL you'll know it's a Mercedes, the SC well many still ask me what it is.

    squidd99,

    The rest of the car is soo good, a stereo and a Nav system won't even matter, plus Mercedes is switching to a DVD based Nav system this fall. Stereo??? Well lets just say the Germans are very, very slow to change things like that. They're still as pigheaded as ever. Do you know what it took for Porshe and the others to finally offer a decent cupholder?

    M
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