Saab 9-3 Sedan

hungshy · July 2003

As my look. Aero is same model as Vector. I look at other country saab web site found there are only two model in Taiwan which are Linear and Aero. no Arc or Vector from some other country as I see. Does it run faster? I can't feel from here.

vcjumper · July 2003

http://www.canadiandriver.com/testdrives/03saab9-3.htm

pandp · July 2003

I am in market for a new car in the bay area. After reading through the message board, I am interested in the 9-3. This is going to be my first new car purchase so I wanted to gather more information. I found some information on the manufacturer to dealer cash and the 0% financing deal. But the cash incentive ends this month and I am looking to buy in August or maybe early September. Are there any info about new promotion in the coming months? I am looking at Linear with automatic. I wonder what is the ballpark range I should expect. Most of you guys seem really enjoy the Saab fun. I hope I am not making a bad decision to steer away from the wise choice of Camry or Accord.

renee_etoile · July 2003

any suggestions on the stereo upgrade for the 93s?
has anyone purchased the upgrade offered by saab?

catherine9 · July 2003

How comfortable are the back seats of the 9-3 Linear? I very often travel with adult passengers. Does anyone know how the seats compare to the Passat? Thanks for any info.

mcdermott2 · July 2003

Does anyone know if you can get the 5-spoke rims on the 16" tires or if you will be able to in 2004? I had a 5.0 mustang and the rims were similar to the ones on the 16" I have seen and they were a real problem to clean. Thanks

cman321 · July 2003

best way to upgrade the stereo is to buy the ARC over the Linear. The ARC is about the same price once you add all the linear options to it.

Even the 300w stereo needs some work. I am probably going to replace a couple of the speakers. 300w is plenty of power, but the stock speakers stink

5speeder · July 2003

I'm thinking seriously about buying a used 9-3 in the $10-$12k range. That means a '99. Most of my other cars have been Toyotas and Nissans in the past and I am a bit leary of Saab's reputation as not the most reliable nor economical to repair. Do those of you who own Saabs past the warranty period typically buy exetended warranties? Although I'm a "buy and hold" guy when it comes to cars, I've never bought an extended warranty and, with my Japanese cars, never regretted it. But if I buy the Saab, I think I'd be more comfortable with the warranty. I've done a little research on these warranties and can see they vary widely in price and coverage.

Those of you who have 9-3's past the mfgr warranty period, what kinds of problems have you had and how expensive were they? Anyone have any recommendations as to what type of coverage I should get? Any companies better than others? Can you buy an extended warranty from Saab for a used one?

Thanks for any responses.

5speeder · July 2003

I'm also considering a used Volvo. Looks like my money'll go a lot farther with Saab in terms of getting a newer model with fewer miles. I've seen it said on these boards that Saabs make excellent buys as used cars because they depreciate so fast. Makes sense to me, but I usually associate faster depreciation rates with "throw-away" cars or cars (ahem) no one wants. My perception of Saab is that it is on par with Volvo in terms of reliability (or lack thereof), durability and cost of repair. I don't care much for what's in vogue, but my perception is that those who do view the two cars pretty much the same. So why the difference in depreciation?

kyfdx · July 2003

This is just from people I know who have owned Saabs... Terrible reliability, with Mercedes-like repair and maintenance costs.
Volvos: More reliable.. high maintenance costs, but not nearly the amount of repairs as compared with Saabs.

My .02 Coming from Toyota and Nissan, this may be a car you want to avoid. Never own an Audi or a Saab out of warranty.

I'm sure others may disagree..

regards,
kyfdx

manamal · July 2003

The recent saabs are better, at least according to CR. I did not have my SAAB long enough to tell (was totalled).

It is not as cheap to run as a Honda, but the car is more comfortable and fun (IMHO). And the hatch has a lot of utility.

Remeber, for 10-12 K, you can get the 9-3 or you can get an accord.

5speeder · July 2003

Thanks kdfyx. Hadn't heard that Saabs had more repairs than Volvo. I looked at carpoint's relaibility ratings for 99 9-3s and for 98-99 S70s and both cars got green lights in all categories. BTW, re: my Toyotas & Nissans, I have owned at the other end of the spectrum too: an MGB and a VW Jetta so I have a pretty good idea of how bad it can be! My Camry has spoiled me!

manamal--Thanks! As you say, "for 10-12 K, you can get the 9-3 or you can get an accord." I've found out that the comparable Accords at that price are generally a year older than the 9-3! I looked at a '99 9-3 this morning, a stripper with auto as the only option, only 48k miles and pristine shape in & out, with all 36k service done by dealer. They want $10.4 for it, including a 36 month GE warranty extension. Looks good to me, think I'll do it. My rational rationale (for my wife): safety trumps reliability! That's my story and I'll stick to it!

kyfdx · July 2003

Nothing is worse than driving a car you don't want. Good luck!!

kyfdx

rsorganize · July 2003

Had been looking at the 2003 Audi A4 Avant and LL Bean Outback. Drove the Audi 3x, recently, including a 100 mi. drive. Beautiful car. Unfortunately, it just feels too small in the drivers 'cockpit'...seat a bit too narrow and the console rubbing my right leg, as well as blocking any leg movement on longer drives. Like the (less scintillating) LL Bean. Had driven a 9-3 about a month ago. Dealer never followed up. Very nice ride! Now: essentially moved away from Saab because of lack of AWD. Those of you from snow country (I'm in WMass, near the VT. border): how does it handle the snowing hills? We had Volvos w/rear-wheel drive and heard all the 'It really snows in Sweden' arguments!! Won't fall for that, again! So, not interested in hearing about Sweden...would love to hear real-life/road tales from the US and/or Canada. And, for you cyclists out there: can you fit your road bikes in through the trunk or would I always have to use a rack? Peace.

jratner · July 2003

I can only give you my input on a Saab 9000. It was my wife's favorite car. 94 9000CS
It was very very good in the snow. This was with all season Michelin MXV4 tires. The car did not have traction control.
My guess is that for a 4 cyl. car it had just the right amount of start up torque to get going in the snow.
We kept the car until 2000, then sold it to my uncle who still has it. 115K and still going.
JR

sopecreek · July 2003

but my father used to have Volvo 760 turbo purchased in 1988. It lasted around 150 K, which was great because my parents didn't maintain it properly at all. It was also fun to drive. Didn't have many problems either, only a couple. But when it did have a problem, the cost of repair was just unbelievably high. I remember when my mother broke a rear turn signal plastic cover and tried to replace it, the price of the cover alone was around $250. Hopefully, Saab's affiliation with GM will lower the cost.

goose1207 · July 2003

I've owned two SAABs and the reliability on the '92 900 turbo convertible was terrible. I dumped it after a year. The other one was a '95 SE convertible that was very reliable. The only problem I had was with the convertible top (common in MY95) which was fixed by the dealer under warranty. I would consider a later model SAAB, ie, MY95+. The QC issues primarily pertained to the pre-GM era. One of the best indicators of any potential problems would be the vehicle's service history. Try to get the records if you can.

The higher the miles, the higher the cost of an aftermarket warranty. I would skip the warranty on the SAAB if you know a good independent mechanic that knows these cars.

renee_etoile · July 2003

well yes, . . . but i already have a linear.
i'll trade it for an arc if you want it though.

injunguy · July 2003

I'm looking at the '03 93 linear, automatic with sunroof and 16" and TMV shows me a price *below* invoice. Is this really true? However, I'm a little hesitant since I've been reading a lot about the engine stalling issue on this board. Does anyone know if this is a major issue with most 93s? In general, how is the reliability as compared to an Audi A4 1.6T and a BMW 325?

adrob · July 2003

Yes you should be paying less than invoice. But don't feel sorry for the dealer. He (she) is getting a check for $3,500 from GM(3500 marketing support). I just picked up an Arc yesterday and paid a little less than the TMV (thanks Edmunds). There are numerous reasons for this. Holdback, marketing incentives and volume disounts (quotas or goals for the dealer to obtain better deals and floor financing) etc. Also, if your trading then the dealer will make something on your trade as well. Mine paid just about 100% of Edmunds estimate trade value.

Note, however, that I am in a highly competitive market with three dealers within 25 miles and 7 within 50. The extra leg room and about $5,000 swung me over the 325i. Good luck.

detroitdriver · July 2003

I have noticed that the TMV for the 9-3 is below the Invoice price. Does anyone know if the TMV is accounting for the current $3000 factory to dealer incentives?

After reading #1863, I think my question was answered

) The TMV is accounting for the incentives so they can't be subtracted.

wmquan · July 2003

For vehicles where the dealers are anxious to sell and incentives are in place, forget about TMV and focus on getting invoice - incentives. Start there, and if you want, go $250 above that amount.

Saab dealers are hungry, and deals are to be had. The supply is plentiful and while demand is up compared to the previous model, it's probably not where Saab wants it to be.

cstowe · July 2003

So I guess I am confused....

I am eligibile to take advantage of the GM supp. discount. The sales price for SAABs under this program "seems" to be about the same as invoice price. OK. Now on the GM supp. website the "discount" for 3500 (on a 9-3) has a notation that says it "represents factory to dealer cash offer which may be passed on.."

Is not this the same thing as the "marketing support" cash listed on edmunds? And if so, then how is this any type of deal? It seems like I would get 3500 off either way. NOt really a deal for GM suppl.

What am I missing? Do I get 3500 off twice?

stratixman · July 2003

In looking at Edmunds TMV numbers, it doesn't appear that Edmunds acounts for either the dealer prep fee ($130+/-) or advertising fee ($250+/-). You want to keep that in mind when you compare dealer quotes which incoprorate these. Myybe you can get them eliminated by the dealer, but if not they will skew the comparison of TMV to the quote, making your quote look slightly less favorable. It must be nice living where ther's more than 2 dealers within tolerable distance to shop. I've been waiting for nearly 4 weeks for the only Arc that meets my preferences (options and color) to show up at my dealer. Gets to be a bit dicey towards the end of the month since the current promos expire 7/31 and may or may not be replaced with comparable deals in August. Probably will be, but you don't know. If one is looking for a lease, Saab subsidized leases right now are about as good as they get. 1.2% equivalent over 36 months on the Arc, for example.

wmquan · July 2003

Yes, the help files for Edmunds TMV mention that they won't factor in "legitimate" fees.

Saab apparently does charge a preparation and delivery fee that may vary from state to state. There is also an advertising/doc fee that varies from state to state.

The way to better identify these costs is to ask to see the actual Saab invoice (one that is actually made by Saab and not the dealership). If it's on the invoice, it's more or less "legitimate."

So, restated, I'd start bargaining at Invoice + verified fees - incentives (cash back or otherwise). Then maybe go $250 above that (dealer makes the holdback plus the $250).

Edmunds is not reflecting the GM supplier discount. There is a separate price for the 9-3 that reflects one or two GM employee and/or supplier discounts (I'm trying to recall how my invoice looked like, there was at least one line item). I don't know if you get the current cashbacks on top of the GM employee or supplier discounts, but someone else here can answer that.

mcdermott2 · July 2003

Has anyone had 17" rims on any of their cars through the winters in northeast. Can it be done without buying a 16" set? Will there be different rim choices for the 16" in 2004?

detroitdriver · July 2003

I am in the same situation. I am a GM employee and typically we can get ~10% off of MSRP. I am looking into to see if I can get the factory to dealer incentive subtracted from my GM discount. If not it doesn't, than a Saab has no benefit to me.

kyfdx · July 2003

On Saabs, the supplier price is edmunds invoice price, plus $130 dealer prep. Subtract the incentive from that. Not positive, but I believe the incentive varies according to trim.. ($2500 on linear, $3000 on arc, $3500 on vector.)

regards,
kyfdx

needashave · July 2003

I purchased under this program and it was effortless. Under the program rules, the dealer is obligated to pass all incentives to the buyer. The dealer faces penalties if they try something else. Just let them know that you know the rules.

Happy motoring! BTW, the Arc ROCKS!!

gpetto · July 2003

ADROB,
So you justgot an Arc for less than TMV? I too am looking at the Arc and the TMV on the car equipped the way I'd like is $28,620, vs $31,038 invoice price. How likely is it that I'll be able to get it for that much below invoice?
If you don't mind me asking what was your final number?
Did you have any other special discounts?

adrob · July 2003

The answer depends on a number of factors. While I believe the market is pretty loose on these right now, the end result depends on the dealer. I had no other "discounts." I did have numerous Saab dealers to choose from so they know there is competition in the area. (7 dealers within 50 miles) Not only for their car but others. I was looking at a Passat (I loved my Jetta V6, now my wife does), S60, 325i, and Acura TL. The Saab was my top choice but I would have been happy with the others too. Second, I traded in a car and while I got a fair price (basically Edmunds est trade value) the dealer is going to make a grand or more on resale without having to do much to the car. So they will factor that in to the "deal". Moreover the dealer had at least four of the vehicle I bought in the color I chose on the lot with probably 20 in other colors, so they move a lot of cars.

If your dealer is the only game in town and has little inventory he may not be as negotiable. See #1687. The push here is to clean up the inventory backlog and make way for the 2004's. Other factors include quotas and volume discounts that may motivate a dealer to move cars, especially at the end of the month/quota period.

Note, most of the ARCs I saw were pretty loaded with the various options, touring pkg, heated seats (were up noth a bit)etc.

All told, with the 3500 off you should be able to get pretty close to or perhaps a bit under TMV. Good luck.

bigdaddycoats · July 2003

I went and looked at a 9-3 Arc today. There seems to be a very good lease deal that apparently ends tomorrow. Here is what I was told.
MSRP - 32960
Arc with sunroof and premium paint, manual trans.
my price - 29901
36 mo lease w/ tax - 331 per month
first month and sec. dep. due at signing.
Seems like a very good deal? What does anyone else think?

catherine9 · July 2003

What else do you have to pay at signing? Acquisition fee, etc.? Just wondering b/c I'm interested in leasing an automatic Linear. Your deal sounds great to me.

renee_etoile · July 2003

stop bragging :P

Any technique tips for those who may have used the touch-up paint?

needashave · August 2003

Are you still enjoying your new ride? Hope you are having a good summer here in Chi-town. I'm just about festival-ed out myself. Stay well.

renee_etoile · August 2003

yeah, definitely festival-ed out but it still gets me happy after a nice car wash

I haven't decided where to take it but I can't wait to get my stereo system upgraded; do you have any suggestions?

summer's been good- it's already august so I'm a bit weary but it's still relatively warm so i'm savoring the sun. Hope it's not too rainy this week

detroitdriver · August 2003

Does anyone know if the incentives that ended on July 31 will be extended. I have not been able to find any info on this. Thanks.

bigdaddycoats · August 2003

have been extended to the end of Aug. I have a deposit on a Arc with manual and sport wheel package that is currently in port storage. Here is the deal I got - 36month lease, 12k per year, 1rst payment and acquisition due at delivery, $329 per month. I think that is a very good deal for what you get. Very nice car, I can't wait to get it. Just hope I can sell mine first.

arcman · August 2003

I had the pleasure of picking up my new 9-3 ARC last Saturday. I had purchased the car through the GMINTHEDRIVEWAY program which is identical to the GM supplier program. I had no problem what so ever getting the current mfg. to dealer discount ($3500). In fact when I went to pick my car up Saturday I had asked my dealer about the discount and he informed me that the discount is there to help the dealership to make the sale, not to keep it since it really does not add all that much to thier over all profits. He suggested that when you first talk to what ever dealer you go to be right up front with them regarding the mfg. to dealer rebate. The second suggestion and I whole heartily support it is to make contact with the "Internet" sales person. What I did was go to different sites like Carsense, Carweb, BJ's wholesale club,etc., as well as the following site http://www.carbuyingtips.com/
I filled out the quote request form and I noted to contact me via email. I had received 3 replies from the "Internet" sales person. I called them and finally settled on one and it was an ejoyable experience.

Here is the car breakdown:
2003 9-3 Arc
MSRP
9-3 Arc $30,090.00
Destination charge $675.00
Steel Gray Metalic $500.00
Sentronic Automatic Transmission $1,250.00
Sunroof $1,200.00
Heated seats & Headlamp washer $495.00
Touring Package $1,195.00
$35,405.00
Dealer Net
9-3 Arc $28,387.00
Destination charge $675.00
Steel Gray Metalic $450.00
Sentronic Automatic Transmission $1,238.00
Sunroof $1,080.00
Heated seats & Headlamp washer $446.00
Touring Package $1,076.00
$33,352.00
GM/SCUSA supplier $33,506.00
supplier discount $1,017.00
Employee Price $32,117.00
employee discount $1,712.00
If I can be of any more help please feel free to ask, that's what this forum is all about. Now if you don't mind I can hear my car calling me to take it for another long drive.

Enjoy

mjwills · August 2003

HI all. Anybody have a rough idea what an 03 loaded (auto, sunroof, touring, etc) vector with 3500 miles would be worth? Mine was totaled with a rear end collision from a pickup. I cannot find any values anywhere and want to make sure I get what it is worth from insurance. We will probably get the same car, they hold up in crashes really well.

Also - I read all these incentive posts - what is the rebate for this car? $4000? I also get the GM employee discount, do any others apply?

Thanks.

expat0007 · August 2003

What was your final price? Was it $32,117 or $32,117 - $1,712?

I also am eligible for the employee discount through a related GM retiree. I am trying to figure out if I can afford a new Linear by looking at your pricing.

It looks like anyone can get a Linear with sunroof, auto transmission and 15" wheels (thought they were standard feature?) for $26,239 + $49 dlr processing fee at a nearby dealership in Maryland; the list on the car is $30,610. If I remember correctly, the GM discount would get me another 5% off which would be about $1300 for a new final price of $24,939.

Have I got it right?
Tnx.

arcman · August 2003

The final price prior to the mfg. to dealer rebate was $33506. If you deduct the rebate ($3500) if came down to $30006.

In this situation the employee price would be
Employee Price $32,117.00 before the rebate.
employee discount is $1,712.00 off of the msrp

I am sure you realize that the less options you select the lower the price.
The beauty of this is that the dealer is required to show you the complete breakdown. This way there are no hidden charges.

I believe the only major difference between the Linear and the ARC is the engine. Also since I wanted dual automatic climate control and the infotainment radio I had opted to move up to the ARC.
I will say I had thought that my last car (1999 Buick regal) was a nice ride boy was I wrong. This car is a true pleasure to drive. Now I know why the commercial says "Most people that test drive a SAAB, buys a SAAB". In fact my mother (78 yrs. old) who really never gave a hoot about any of the cars they had owned told my father after I took her for a ride that she wants him to trade in their Pard Avenue and get the exact same car I have. To me that speaks volumnes about the car.

I truly wish you the best and I hope you are able to do it. If I can be of any more help just ask. Also not knowing what part or Maryland you live in the dealer I went through is located in Wilmington Delware.

mooselook · August 2003

Just completed a round trip from NJ to Maine (>1000 Miles) in my 2003 Linear. I took delivery of the vehicle last November and now have approx 9500 miles clocked. Equipped with 5 spd manual, I averaged between 34 and 36.1 MPG according to the computer, with 3 adults aboard and fully loaded with luggage. Cruise control was set at 75 mph for the highway, which was the majority of the trip.
The trip computer function that calculates estimated arrival time is amazingly accurate and came within 15 minutes on a 10 hour day! I can't say enough good things about the balance between performance and economy that this engine/vehicle delivers!

brucec35 · August 2003

We bought a loaded Linear back last November. Sounds like prices have really fallen with the incentives and you're all getting great deals. Those leases sound unbelievable. The irony is, we wish we'd waited and got an Arc at a better price, but if we had, we probably would not have bought one at all, since the wife's job situation is now less stable than before.

It's not a perfect car, but we like it the best of any car we've had, including two much more expensive BMW's.

Has anyone priced painted and installed spoilers at the Dealers?

catherine9 · August 2003

Why do you say your Linear isn't the perfect car? What problems have you had? What don't you like about it? If my Volkswagen breaks down one more time, I might lease a Saab. I just don't want to make the mistake of purchasing another unreliable vehicle. Except for reliability issues, my VW golf is actually a great car in terms of handling, steering, pick-up, etc. How is the Linear in terms of handling? Thanks in advance for answering all these questions!

hungshy · August 2003

Glad to hear that you and your family had one wonderful trip with great Saab. It's really good for long trip traveling as I thought. I feel it everytime I and my family took long trip. since last November we out 12,500 miles into our first Saab 9-3. We are very comfort with this car. Maybe it's only Linear not like Arc has more power. But we love it both exterior and interior look. I and my wife all love Vector's metal trim interior but not like the wood trim in Arc. So if we buying the car now. We might still choose Linear to have 16" wheel for everyday useage.
Check those previous review post. Do I need to feel lucky our Saab doesn't have those problems? I hope those are only part of problems for Saab. To me, Saab is very reliable car.

oldsman01 · August 2003

Hey all, been a while since I frequented this board but I'm back to considering a 9-3 again. My heart still prefers a Cadillac CTS(especially with the 255 hp V6 in the 04s) but the only way I can afford one right now is an absolute base model. And I don't expect to see any really good deals on 04s for a while. So I'm back to thinking that a 9-3 Arc would probably satisfy me for 3 years(then maybe a CTS-V!). I remember when I psoted here last, there was talk of $2-3500 rebates on 9-3s depending on the model. Any such rebates or discounts still on? I should be able to get the car at GMS pricing(basically invoice) and am looking to do a 36 month/15K lease. Even with the 0% for 60 months, I really don't want to buy for 2 reasons. One, I don't have an overly large amount of cash to put down as I am at best, even on the value of my current car. Which leads me to point two, I wonder how Saab resale is. I'm not a "resale snob" the way some folks are, but the resale on my 01 Intrigue is truly pathetic. The car is in excellent condition and at best, I'll break even if I sell it. And the price of that car was HEAVILY discounted when I bought it. Anyway, I haven't been to a dealer in a while so I guess I need to go, but what I'm wanting is an Arc with automatic and heated seats. 36 month lease with 15K annually and no more than $1500 down. You guys think I can get a lease like that for around $399 a month?

regfootball · August 2003

hard to say, the deal for a 299 a month on the linear is still out there, but by the time you go to arc and up the miles to 15k per year, you may be at 399.

mumbhai · August 2003

Hi All,

I bought a Arc in May and I have been to my dealer once since (for the 30 day inspection). I complained to him about the rattle from both front doors (more the passenger door) and he claimed that he couldn't reproduce it so nothing was done about.

This is driving me crazy and I can't even drown it out with loud music because bass only makes the rattle worse!

Does anyone know a good solution for this?

Thanks and regards,

BC

pichula99 · August 2003

mumbhai,
I test drove 2 9-3 models. The Arc had an annoying rattle in the front passenger door. Then I drove the Vector, this was even more annoying, both front doors had that rattle noice. I tried to stop the rattle in the front driver door by pressing it with my hand but it didn't work. I was going to buy the Arc model that same day, but was very surprised of the noice(had check from peoplefirst for 35000 in my hand). Later I told the dealer about those noices in the car and he looked at me very surprised. He didn't pay much attention and said something like:"Sure we can get rid of those noices if we find them". I realized they were not paying much attention to my concern, and also realized that they were not going to do anything about it if I eventually made the purchase. So I decided to back-out from the deal. I think if they want to make money, they have to pay attention to the customers concern. I already had that bad experience from my Chevy Malibu. So I think, for now, I'm not going to buy GM. I had enough with my Chevy($3000 in repairs, but that's another story). Anyway, I just want to add that I also test drove the 9-5 Aero. No rattles and the car drived great. The only problem is that for this car, payments would be almost like a mortgage. I don't have so much money. So good bye Saab.

Saab 9-3 Sedan

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