Minivans - Domestic or Foreign

jipster · February 2006

"the most standard saftey features..." "folding seats VS life changing, debilitating injuries or death of loved one"

Thats a pretty mean spirited statement to make art. To imply that one is making a choice between the folding seat of the DGC and risking the death of their loved one (by not buying Ody) is quite obsurd.

If you really cared about your loved ones saftey... wouldn't you have bought the Toyota Sienna with AWD? Aren't you afraid you'll be going up a snowy slippery hill one day, lose traction...and get rear ended by a semi?

I guess families who buy small or midsize sedans are just thrillseekers who live life on the edge???

marine2 · February 2006

I thank you for the comeback and explanation. I realize that people want to feel good about what they buy and I know Honda puts out first class vehicles. I also know for many years, Chrysler had more than their share of problems.
But it seems from what I have seen and heard, it's mostly behind them now.

My brother has a 1999 or 2000 Plymouth minivan.(Can't remember what he said it was now) But outside of a freeze plug and brakes and rotors he put on last year, it's been problem free. I think his has even better road feel than mine.

No one can go wrong buying a Honda. I just think for families that carry a lot of stuff in their vans, Chrysler vans are a better choice. For those that only want to carry their family and not mess up their van with a bunch of stuff, Honda is the best choice on the market.

I just hope all of us that buy foreign, (I'm included in that) haven't written off the American manufactures. American manufactures put a lot more money back into the economy than foreign ones do and many jobs and 401-Ks are invested in American companies.

97xpresso · February 2006

Hyundai has been getting great reveiws for their passenger cars. I have not seen any great reveiws on the Sedona, especially here at Edmunds. The most common complaint is that they will not honor their 10/100000 warranty. I would take a DCX van over a Hyundai van without question. I know the 2006 is supposed to be much improved, but it is too early to tell.

marine2 · February 2006

I would only wish American manufactures would make a turnaround as fast as Hyundai has. One year they were putting out bland, vehicles with a bad reputation for having many mechanical problems. The next year they they completely redesigned their vehicles and made them look great and their quality improved 500%.

But from what I heard, your right, they do try and wiggle out of their 100,000 mile warranty on many items.

My neighbor bought one and had problems with the power window. When he took it in to fix, they told them they couldn't fix it because that model wasn't suppose to have power windows and only a few were made and they had no parts for it. They would put a crank in it's place.

artgpo · February 2006

We do own a 4WD vehicle with all the safety features. 4WD is nuts here in Dallas, even more nuts when we move back to San Antonio.

There is no compromise when it comes to safety of one's loved ones. I stand by what I said even though I do not have a mean cell in my body.

vanbuyer2 · February 2006

I think people tend to paint the minivan makers (or any auto maker for that matter) with too broad a brush. I have been researching vans for a few months as I am a young father. In fact, my wife is having our second child on Friday and we have a 2 1/2 year old.

I have been reading these message boards and find it very troublesome that there is the perception that just because a Town & Country or Caravan is a Chrysler/Dodge, then it must be a piece of crap. Similiarly, just because an Odyssey is a Honda does not make it the most reliable family van.

I am not some buy american only advocate either. In fact, our current cars are a Honda Accord and a Toyota Corolla (I commute with the Toyota, the Accord is our "family car").

The Accord is a 2002 with 53K (I bought it brand new). And it is a piece of crap. Next week I will have the FOURTH transmission installed. The last one was installed just 3,000 miles ago. It is one of the worst built cars I have ever owned.

I fit right into the Honda demographic for an Ody. I'm educated, have a good job downtown, and a nice house in the suburbs. But I am also smart enough to know that not all Honda's are going to be great. I can also admit that maybe a Town&Country isn't so bad after all (even thought the 2000's and earlier had LOTS of problems).

My current Honda is not a safe car for my family because of the issues it has had. For many people a Chrysler T&C Limited with all the airbags and DVD (and yes you can get both... it is the sunroof you can't get with the bags) is a very reliable family car.

I think debates about all the aspects of the vehicles is great. Just remember there are bad Honda's, Toyota's, Chevys, Dodge's, etc. etc.

thegraduate · February 2006

Your subject line is very true...it goes both ways.

After 17 Hondas (starting with a 1982 Civic DX), my parents have not had ONE experience like yours, but with Chryslers, we are 2 for 2 in lemons. I guess you could say those lemons left a sour taste for Chryslers in our mouths? Ba-dum, pshh!...anyway... My grandmother has nearly 80,000 miles on her 2002 LX Accord, with nary a problem (I drove it to a double funeral last week, it drove with no rattles or steering slack, etc...)
Her miles are nearly all highway (70 miles a day round trip at 70 mph). I actually have 157,000 miles on my 96 Accord LX, and the only problems with it are wreck-related; warped brake rotors, knocking suspension (only 1 side of the car), (guardrail at 35 mph, it happens!); NO MECHANICAL PROBLEMS.I'm sorry you've had a bad experience with your Honda. If I were in your shoes, I'd probably never own one again; and likely, if you had a Chrysler for 8 months and kept it in the shop for 4, you wouldn't get a third either, right?

Individual experiences shape overall perceptions, this is how the forums get skewed too far one way or another, and we are all guilty of it.

marine2 · February 2006

There is no compromise when it comes to safety of one's loved ones. I stand by what I said even though I do not have a mean cell in my body.

I agree that safety is important. But are you implying any car or van that doesn't have what the Honda has on it is unsafe? Have we been driving unsafe cars and vans around for the last 100 years? Doesn't a five star crash rating mean anything?

Should I buy a van because it has one safety feature that most others don't have, even though it doesn't fit my needs? Is your Honda unsafe for the driver because in their crash safety test, the driver's door broke open and the Honda has no air bag knee protection? If your wife drives your van sometimes, aren't you putting her life in danger? Do you see where I'm coming from Artgpo?

dennisctc · February 2006

Read JD Power owner satisfaction. Look at the other auto publications. The numbers do not lie.

The nice thing about JD Powers is everyone can find a part of it to back whatever claim they want to make. There are so many catagories and sub-catagories, it's funny.

BTW - I may not have been clear before, but you can't get stability control on the new Civics....WHY? I thought Honda was so focused on safety, and was a more caring, compassionate company?

As far as the Sedonna......All Minivan manufacturers should be shaking, Honda like features at DCX prices! I still doubt the quality myself.

dennisctc · February 2006

Could you provide the link? Thanks

dennisctc · February 2006

Heck, if you order RES on a DCX mini you have to forego the curtain bags. Want to bet ESC and head curtain bags are standard on the next generation DCX minis?

Just built a T&C Limited with both RES and Side Curtains with no problem? It may just be SWB models. I'll bet DCX will offer ESC and Curtains as options, if not standard. They offer these features on many of their vehicles as next generations are brought out - like every other automaker.

artgpo · February 2006

Sorry, my mistake: sunroof = curtain bag delete.

I agree with the graduate = 3 Chrysler products = 3 lemons (one bought back back by Chrysler under arbitration). DCX will NEVER again sully my driveway.

My previous van, a 2003 Olds Silhouette GLS, was probably the worst minivan the IIHS ever tested in the frontal offset crash test. Yes, Mr. Safety drove his beloved wife and occasionally other members of his family in that van. The funny thing about the Silhouette was that it carried the lowest insurance collision premium of any vehicle on the market in 2003 -2004. You can check that out on the IIHS website if those numbers are still posted. Maybe it was because Olds was a "geezer" brand? For the record I am a Year 1 Baby Boomer. I swore that I would never again subject my passengers and myself to anything less than the best as far as safety equipment went. I also find fault in having to buy safety as an option as you do in a DCX van (all the others on the market with the exception of the Quest, I think).

And yes, there IS something wrong with you if you opt for a DVD player, sunroof or paying less to get less over your family's safety. My goodness, how did my kids ever grow to be the mature, well rounded, educated adults they are without ever having a DVD player to take the place of family conversation on a trip? Please do not report me to the authorities!

marine2 · February 2006

And yes, there IS something wrong with you if you opt for a DVD player, sunroof or paying less to get less over your family's safety. My goodness, how did my kids ever grow to be the mature, well rounded, educated adults they are without ever having a DVD player to take the place of family conversation on a trip? Please do not report me to the authorities!

How did the world ever live safe before ESE or side curtains? Dennisctc brought up a good question. By your way of thinking, people are not putting their families safety in mind unless their vehicle has these things on it and should never buy a Civic, Focus, Dodge,GC or most of the other vehicles out there without these things on it. So what your saying, you should get it even if that vehicle doesn't fit your needs. I don't think so.

FYI, I am a pre baby boomer..

dennisctc · February 2006

Sorry, my mistake: sunroof = curtain bag delete.

Nope, in 2005 that was true but not for 2006...you can get both sunroof and side curtainss.

Actually now that I think about it, 3 Chrysler products and never a lemon, and none of my friends and family that I know of.

DCX will NEVER again sully my driveway. Have seen similar statements from Honda owners too, in fact EVERY manufacturer has their lemons.

And yes, there IS something wrong with you if you opt for a DVD player, sunroof or paying less to get less over your family's safety. My goodness, how did my kids ever grow to be the mature, well rounded, educated adults they are without ever having a DVD player to take the place of family conversation on a trip? Please do not report me to the authorities!

I have a friend who strongly believes no one should be allowed to own anything bigger than a Ford Focus - PERIOD!! Thank god we're still a free country and can make our own decisions and set priorities.

Perhaps I can't spend $25k for a minivan or don't need the space and opt for a SWB Caravan for $17k. Is this putting my family's safety 2nd to paying less? Am I a horrible person? Say I'm moving up from a 1980 Civic with no safety features, isn't this still better? What if I put the savings into a college fund for my children instead of to Honda?

tamu2002 · February 2006

"My goodness, how did my kids ever grow to be the mature, well rounded, educated adults they are without ever having a DVD player to take the place of family conversation on a trip? Please do not report me to the authorities! "

LOL. Agreed! I for one would not pay to have my kids watch MORE TV! I understand the long-trip-just-wanna-have-some-peace-time argument. And it's totally fine to do that once in a while (we admittedly do that at home). But for a family trip, I'd rather try other creative and fun ways to make a quality family time out of the trip than have the kids watch more TV.

thegraduate · February 2006

Road trips when I was little consisted of me in my car/booster seat with a map in hand...At that point I liked to count numbers. Soon enough I was reading maps and answering my parents' questions about what road we should take next (for educational purposes of course, they knew where we were going :P ). Now I know no less than five different routes to the coast (we go every 2-4 weeks), and 3 ways home from school (there just aren't that many!). I'd reccommend any parent putting a free rest-area map in their young'uns hands, even if they just color on it. They will soon learn how to go places, and learn a lot more than they will watching the "Aladdin" DVD on the way.

jipster · February 2006

DVD players do accept more than just Aladdin cartoons and PG rated children movies. There are many fine educational programs/shows available on dvd that are both educational and entertaining. Test and challenge your kids, during and after their viewing, by asking questions and their thoughts on what they have viewed/learned.

T.V doesn't have to be used solely to turn your kids into catatonic zombies, just to keep them quiet during short OR long trips.

artgpo · February 2006

My son, TAMU, BS Civil Engineering '96 and MS Traffic Engineering '97 (4 years for both degrees with a 4.0) and daughter, SWT BA Journalism '96 (3.6 GPA), NEVER watched a DVD (were none at the time)in the van (not the Dodge because they were too busy pushing). We would actually have a conversation and point out interesting places along the way. From age 4 my son would draw street and traffic signals. Today that4 year old is a 30 year old traffic engineer with TXDot.

artgpo · February 2006

Just for the record, the worst minivan I owned (out of the 7) was a 1983 VW Vanagon 9 passenger GL. Talk about a dud! Still, we loved that unsafe van.

We bought the 1994 Grand Caravan because I was able to special order it with ABS plus '94 was the first year for dual frontal airbags. Third worse car. The '93 Intrepid I exchanged under owner arbitration for the GC was a bit worse.

Also, owned an '87 Nissan Van, probably the only van ever to have its entire production run recalled and bought back by the manufacturer.

Keep in mind every one of the previously mentioned vehicles were purchased new.

thegraduate · February 2006

Yes, but many parents today want nothing more than a nanny in the back seat (read: PIXAR movie). I didn't intend to say that DVD player in the back are bad, just that NOT having one can be an educational tool too. since your child(ren) may pay more attention to the unfamiliar places he is traveling to.

bluedevils · February 2006

art, would you please tell us why you are driving a minivan instead of something safer?

i am having a hard time figuring out how you got up on that safety high horse, having confessed to owning and driving the silhouette?

you do realize the relatively small chance that something bad will actually happen to your minivan and you and your family, right? any number of factors could contribute to a crash and how it turns out for the occupants. the presence of certain safety features does not guarantee better protection in a crash. it's all about percentages.

personally, a family would be much safer in a 10,000 pound heavy duty truck.

marine2 · February 2006

Just for the record, the worst minivan I owned (out of the 7) was a 1983 VW Vanagon 9 passenger GL. Talk about a dud! Still, we loved that unsafe van.

We bought the 1994 Grand Caravan because I was able to special order it with ABS plus '94 was the first year for dual frontal airbags. Third worse car. The '93 Intrepid I exchanged under owner arbitration for the GC was a bit worse.

Also, owned an '87 Nissan Van, probably the only van ever to have its entire production run recalled and bought back by the manufacturer.

Keep in mind every one of the previously mentioned vehicles were purchased new.

It seems artgpo that you attract a lot of lemons. I have bought a lot of Chrysler products in my lifetime, going back to a early 40's Plymouth, I think it was a 1941, to a 1948 Chrysler Windsor and 1954 Chrysler New Yorker I bought all used. I bought my first new car in 1965 was a Plymouth Duster. I had a bunch of little stuff go wrong with it. My next was a new Pont. Phoenix I bought in the 70's(A real piece of junk) I also had a Ford and in 1978 leased a new Chrysler New Yorker. The New Yorker I kept for five years and only had problems with the a/c switch. In 1993 I bought a new Eagle Vision ( sister to your Intreped) and kept it until 2004 when we traded it in on a new Civic. That Eagle Vision was the best car we ever owned. In 11 years, I only replaced the engine mounts, (Arizona heat and the A/C compressor and did both in the 10 year of owning it. I posted this before. I also bought a new 2000 Ford Focus which I loved to drive but the trunk lid was so small I couldn't even get a 17" monitor in it. I traded it for a new 2001 Dodge Dakota truck that I had no problems with either. Trading it in on this 2005 Dodge GC. four years later. In 14 months, I haven't had a lick of trouble with this one either.

I am old enough to know the junk America put out in the 70's and 80's. But they have gotten better and better. Especially in 2000. On a whole, we have passed Europe in quality and are not that far behind many of the Japanese makes. Yes, there still are some clunkers, but they're far and in between now.

I really take exception to people who say America is still putting out nothing but junk and because they don't have some of the stuff your Honda has on it, we don't care enough about our children's safety to buy anything but a Honda Ody.

artgpo · February 2006

Read my post and the IIHS' rating of the 2003 Silhouette. That van had the lowest insurance premiums of any vehicle on the market at the time. Probably due to the older, more conservative owners.

I drive a minivan because it is versatile, comfortable and am able to carry the entire family all at one time when we get together. I drive an Odyssey because, after 23 years of owning many other minivans, I decided to buy the best on the market with all safety features standard. Sure, I could drive a 10,000 lb. truck but what happens when it gets hit by a 20,000 lb. truck? I do not think driving a CAT on the street is legal.

Nothing can guarantee safety. A driver's license is the best example of affirmative action: everyone is entitled to one. You can be the smartest PhD driving the safest car but get killed by a dumber than a bag of bricks drunk. Given the choice of safety features over non-essential goodies like a DVD player, I'll go with safety. Anything I can do to shift the safety odds my way.

marine2 · February 2006

I drive a minivan because it is versatile, comfortable and am able to carry the entire family all at one time when we get together. I drive an Odyssey because, after 23 years of owning many other minivans, I decided to buy the best on the market with all safety features standard. Sure, I could drive a 10,000 lb. truck but what happens when it gets hit by a 20,000 lb. truck? I do not think driving a CAT on the street is legal.

The versatility is exactly the reason I bought my Dodge GC. I wanted a vehicle that could carry us and our grand kids. That would easily carry a sheet of plywood, air compressor or a dresser or chest if I wanted to get them. I wanted a vehicle that was big and safe enough and one that would hold a bunch of small stuff I like to carry but don't like to have it setting on the seats or floor, messing up the looks of my vehicle like I had to do with my truck. I could put it all out of sight from prying eyes that might look into my van. The Dodge GC gave me all these things. No other minivan on the market could.

My minivan also has a five star safety rating. Why should I buy a Ody because it has one more safety feature on it that the Dodge doesn't have. when the Honda will not for fill all my other needs? I may see your point if the Dodge got a 2,3,or4 star safety rating.

coltswin · February 2006

I will take the rear video and piece of mind over an attempt at creative family fun anytime. Thats nice in theory but not in real life unless your kids are some kind of angels.

thegraduate · February 2006

I'll be back later...gotta pick up my halo from the polisher's...

jipster · February 2006

"Given the choice of safety features over non-essential goodies like a DVD player, I'll go with safety"

Again, it's not an either or proposition artago. One is not sacrificing saftey by choosing a DGC(or any other minivan), over an Ody. You think people are saying, " I love my famiy, but I have plenty of health insurance...what the hay...give me a DVD player, throw in the complete Scoobie Doo and Power Puff Girls DVD series collections... and tear out those side curtain airbags and VSC to make it even" ??

If you truely wanted to shift the saftey odds in your favor, you would chose a Toyota Sienna with AWD(which is safer... as Ody does not have AWD) or a large SUV that has side curtain airbags,AWD and VSC. Instead you are tooting
your own horn on how much more you care about your family than other forum members do theirs. Not cool.

artgpo · February 2006

No toots, just my humble opinion of what works for me. What you do with you life and the life of your family is your business.

What is idiotic is saying that sticking your kids in the back and turning on the TV is a substitute for quality family time. And yes, I do believe that a lot of bringing up children has to do with quality time. Statements like that are like asking Britney Spears to be the spokesperson for child car safety.

jipster · February 2006

I believe you have again conviently ignored my question on minivan safety. If you believe in providing the utemost in saftey features for your family(who are all grown and out of the house?)...why not chose the safer Sienna with AWD or a large SUV (AWD,VSC, side curtain airbags)??????

FWIW..I don't believe anyone was advocating sticking the kids in the back and turning on the t.v as a substitute for quality family time. If a family were unfortunate enough to have to be "living" in their van...then I could see your point.

coltswin · February 2006

Lets see so do all the hours in the day have to be devoted to quality family time? Some of us need Quality "me" time. Sitting in a van traveling is not the best time for quality family time.

artgpo · February 2006

That is where you and I disagree. Raising children really offers little "Me" time, like after the kids are in bed. We found that traveling was some of our best quality time because we talked about what we were seeing and where we were going and kept the children interested.

I apologize to my fellow posters because I have taken us WAY off task. End of subject.

artgpo · February 2006

I believe you have again conviently ignored my question on minivan safety. If you believe in providing the utemost in saftey features for your family(who are all grown and out of the house?)...why not chose the safer Sienna with AWD or a large SUV (AWD,VSC, side curtain airbags)??????

Or I could go to a DoD surplus sale and pick up a used M1A-1 Abrams. Why is all wheel drive so safe? I live where it rarely snows and traction control does the trick. ESC will keep the van straight. If the weather is that bad I'll stay home and watch "Motorweek" reruns or listen to Click and Clack on the Net.

rorr · February 2006

"The versatility is exactly the reason I bought my Dodge GC. I wanted a vehicle that could carry us and our grand kids. That would easily carry a sheet of plywood, air compressor or a dresser or chest if I wanted to get them. I wanted a vehicle that was big and safe enough and one that would hold a bunch of small stuff I like to carry but don't like to have it setting on the seats or floor, messing up the looks of my vehicle like I had to do with my truck. I could put it all out of sight from prying eyes that might look into my van. The Dodge GC gave me all these things. No other minivan on the market could."

Uh, actually, you can do all of the things you listed with the Odyssey. The only (I repeat ONLY) difference is that one must plan ahead a bit and take the mid-row seats out before you go to HD to get some plywood, or haul that dresser/chest/etc.

And yes, the Ody has in-floor storage as well. Of course, with the Ody, one doesn't have to empty out all the junk in the storage compartment in order to haul that plywood/dresser/chest/etc..... It can stay right where it is. I guess that makes the Ody more versatile.......

jipster · February 2006

"Or I could go to a DoD surplus ales and pick up a used M1A-1 Abrams."

With the priority you place on saftey..perhaps you should try to go to DoD Surplus and pick up a used M1A-1 Abrams. Just make sure you get one with the side curtain airbags and VSC. You could also ask Dod to bore a couple holes in the turret, so you and the kids can discuss the scenery as you are traversing the countryside.

jpnewt · February 2006

Ask Herb Brook's family why not to buy a Sienna. Just because you have AWD doesn't mean you can not lose control. That's where VSA comes in handy. Plus you get to spend considerable more money on a Toyota vs. Honda.

marine2 · February 2006

Uh, actually, you can do all of the things you listed with the Odyssey. The only (I repeat ONLY) difference is that one must plan ahead a bit and take the mid-row seats out before you go to HD to get some plywood, or haul that dresser/chest/etc.

And yes, the Ody has in-floor storage as well. Of course, with the Ody, one doesn't have to empty out all the junk in the storage compartment in order to haul that plywood/dresser/chest/etc..... It can stay right where it is. I guess that makes the Ody more versatile.......

It would be interested to see if things like tennis racket, diaper bag,furniture pad and other stuff would fit in the little hole Honda provides. While yes, if you plan ahead you can carry those big things. But many times you go to the store or park an swap and see something your not planning on buying. Then it's go home take the seats out and drive back, load it up, take it home and put the seats back in. With mine, I don't have to do that. Except taking stuff out of the bins and putting it in the rear bin. I'm ready no matter what comes up. With the inside of the Oddy, I don't think to many people would want to carry any thing big in it anyway. I know I would have to think twice.

jpnewt · February 2006

I take it you are referring to the Stow and Go package in the Dodge. And while it is a great concept I'm sure your grandkids don't appreciate sitting on basically a hard piece of wood in the middle row seats. The Odyssey will hold a piece of plywood if need be. And keep in mind that "one" more safety feature may be the difference between life and death. Not a good statement!!

rorr · February 2006

"Just because you have AWD doesn't mean you can not lose control. That's where VSA comes in handy."

To clarify - all Sienna minivans equipped with AWD also have some form of ESC (VSA is simply Toyota-speak for ESC). It's not a case of choosing either AWD or ESC.

Conversely, with the Ody you get ESC and ESC only.

Now, to be fair, if you live in South Central Texas (like I do), it's a real head scratcher trying to come up with reasons one would 'need' the superior accelerative-traction of AWD on a minivan......

jpnewt · February 2006

Just interested in why you purchased the Odyssey over the Sienna? Also went to school in Austin at Concordia, what a beautiful city!

rorr · February 2006

"...I'm sure your grandkids don't appreciate sitting on basically a hard piece of wood in the middle row seats."

While I favor the 2nd row seat comfort of our Ody over the DCX vans, the sto'n'go seats aren't THAT uncomfortable. Comparing them to a 'hard piece of wood' is a bit harsh.

Next thing we know, you'll be calling the Ody the 'BMW of minivans'..... :P

marine2 · February 2006

I take it you are referring to the Stow and Go package in the Dodge. And while it is a great concept I'm sure your grandkids don't appreciate sitting on basically a hard piece of wood in the middle row seats. The Odyssey will hold a piece of plywood if need be. And keep in mind that "one" more safety feature may be the difference between life and death. Not a good statement!!

It seems the only people that say those middle row seats are uncomfoortable, are people that don't own stow-n-go seats. Are the as soft as the Honda seats? No. But in 14 months I have owned mine and the four times I have had friends or family in it, no one has ever said they were uncomfortable. I have not read a review of anyone saying they are uncomfortable. So it's nothing but sour grapes people. A way to try and put down a great idea.

jpnewt · February 2006

When I sat in and compared the Odyssey, Sienna, and Caravan one after each other it did feel that uncomfortable. It may be a Harsh statement but that's what it felt like. I would not want to go on a long trip sitting in those seats.

jpnewt · February 2006

Did you drive it to dinner or on a nice vacation trip over a few hundred miles? It sounds like you are strickly American and would never consider a Import because it's the right thing to do.

rorr · February 2006

"Just interested in why you purchased the Odyssey over the Sienna?"

Price.

To get a Sienna configured the way WE wanted ('05 XLE w/ package #6 to get the sunroof, CD changer, and all the safety goodies), it would have cost us better than $3k more. In all honesty, we liked the Sienna a bit better overall but not enough to swallow the $3k diff. Also, due to Toyota's choice of umpteen different packages + Gulf State Toyota's penchant for adding extraneous junk, actually FINDING a van equipped the way we wanted in the color we wanted was a major headache.

OTOH, I located 3 Odyssey EX-L's in our prefered color (Ocean Mist)in stock at different dealers within easy driving range and was able to play the dealers against each other to get a reasonable deal. Been happy ever since.

travler · February 2006

They don't own it because they're uncomfortable.
However, it is a great idea. Just needs some modifications.

rorr · February 2006

"It would be interested to see if things like tennis racket, diaper bag,furniture pad and other stuff would fit in the little hole Honda provides."

Haven't tried a tennis racket; I don't play tennis. Yes, it will take a diaper bag, furniture pad, etc. (particularly since I removed the rotating lazy-susan tray to increase the storage space).

"But many times you go to the store or park an swap and see something your not planning on buying."

You've got to be kidding. I'm 42 years old and I've NEVER bought something that large on a spur of the moment deal. Ever. Maybe I just don't live life on the edge as much.

Besides, if I or my wife is in the van, it means the kids are with us. Even if I had sto'n'go seats, I'd STILL have to take everybody home and come back by myself to get whatever the heck it is which would require removal of the 2nd row.

Taking stuff out of the mid-bins to put in the rear bin? Uh, wouldn't the rear seat be folded too? If both rows are stowed, WHERE DO YOU PUT ALL JUNK from the mid-row bins?

Remember the rule: the amount of junk hauled around in the minivan is directly proportional to the storage space. The larger your in-floor storage bins, the more junk you've got to relocate to fold your seats.

Ody owners, on the other hand, don't have that problem. What is stored in-floor STAYS in-floor even if the mid-row seats are removed for hauling large objects.

rorr · February 2006

"It sounds like you are strickly American and would never consider a Import because it's the right thing to do."

Actually, marine2 also owns a Civic.

Yeah, I was surprised too......

jipster · February 2006

"Next thing we know, you'll be calling the Ody the 'BMW' of minivans'"

Perhaps our new friend also likes to drag race and take highway exit ramps at 85mph...mon!

For most models the Sienna is priced much less than the Ody. Sienna has been offering $750 in rebates in my region.

marine2 · February 2006

Did you drive it to dinner or on a nice vacation trip over a few hundred miles? It sounds like you are strickly American and would never consider a Import because it's the right thing to do.

I took my cousins up to the Grand Canyon from Phoenix about four months ago, with no complaints. I even asked them, because of people on here complaining about them. I have sat back there for about 45 min once. I can move the seat back and forwards and adjust the back so it leans back and it's very comfortable as long as you move the headrest up to the top position.

Yes, I have bought American a lot, but if you read some of my previous posts, you will see I have a 2004 Honda Civic also. I would never say I would buy only foreign or American. I do think we are helping our selves and our country by buying American more than buying foreign though.

jpnewt · February 2006

LOL I would never have guessed.

Minivans - Domestic or Foreign

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