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Minivans - Domestic or Foreign

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Comments

  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    Not exactly. The Infiniti I35 problems forum is practically dead. (Goes to show how reliable that thing is, right? :) )
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    Depending on your budget I would look at:
    1. Toyota Sienna CE (you get Toyota reliability and all, just without the bells and whistles of the higher end models, plus, at $24,000ish I think they represent a pretty good buy)

    2. Pre-Owned Ford Freestar SES because they depreciate like a rock, you get not great mileage but certainly better mileage than the Sedona (17/23) and you get some features like the fold flat third row that you can't get on the Sedona. Also, CR says that the Freestar/Mercury Monterey have "average" reliability, whatever that means. Used Freestars on our side of the border in my area are around $15,000.

    3. Mazda MPV LX because it's not terribly expensive and the other posters here seem to like it :)

    And Finally...
    4. If your budget allows, I would recommend the Honda Odyssey LX. You get Honda quality (sometimes a good thing, sometimes not so great) all the latest safety features and a split folding third row.
  • temp409temp409 Member Posts: 55
    If someone could test the straps of a 2001 caravan I would love to know for sure, I did report it to the NHTSA maybe Ill test drive a used one on a hill and put my husband in the back slam on brakes on a hill and just see if it will catch. If it is a floating thing in the rear that should catch then right? Maybe it didn't catch because we were only going about 35 and almost got stopped befour we hit the car in front of us. Im almost certain that all durango and caravans just have something faulty in rear catching mechanisms they do all the same way. I wish SOMEONE would test them for me. Mine was totaled so I can't test mine they say it cost over $2000 just to put the air bags back in caravan. I love my KIA today:D love them seatbelts they catch even when you lean up fast.:D Got the 2005 Kia for $16,5000 with 5 yr bumper to bumper with road side assitance plus 20 yr. 200,000 mile powertrain warranty so if it is a piece of junk who cares they are fixing it:D 5 star crash test rating too:D
  • cpsdarrencpsdarren Member Posts: 265
    If this is an emergency locking retractor that is engaged by sudden deceleration, it may not be possible for anyone to test it safely.

    You might find a dealer or other body shop that is able to test such a retractor. There may also be independent experts that can even verify a failed retractor after a crash. A google search for something like "seatbelt lawyer" would probably turn up numerous agencies with expertise and referrals if you believe injuries were caused by a related defect.

    In any case, I guarantee that the normal operation of your seatbelts is to lock the retractor in a crash. If yours didn't lock in a crash where they should have locked, then it is most likely an uncommon defect or a broken mechanism. If there was any kind of widespread problem of this nature that covered a whole model year of a poplular vehicle (or more), there would be much more publicity and many more deaths and serious injuries than from the Gen3 seatbelt buckle release problem.
  • hansiennahansienna Member Posts: 2,312
    Why can't you just drop the experience with the 2001 Caravan and move on? Millions of people are completely satisfied with their Caravan/Grand Caravan/etc.
    Are you trying to convince yourself that the Kia Sedona was a wise purchase?
  • 97xpresso97xpresso Member Posts: 249
    "plus 20 yr. 200,000 mile powertrain warranty so if it is a piece of junk who cares they are fixing it:"

    Read the Kia Sedona Problems Forum and see how well Kia honors their 10/100,000 warranty. Even if they did fix the "piece of junk" for free without giving you the run-around, How often can you bring it to the dealer, how many days can you go without use of your vehicle?
    Why are there so many new 2005 Kia Sedona's still sitting on the dealers lots with give-away pricing and huge warranties?
  • temp409temp409 Member Posts: 55
    Why can't you just drop the experience with the 2001 Caravan and move on? Well,
    I just bet if its your kids face you would have trouble MOVING ON yourself. and no Im not trying to convince myself about a Kia, don't you care if there are seatbelts that are useless, I just bet your kids who have to ride there care. I already KNOW the seatbelts are useless been there and learned by wrecking ours.
  • temp409temp409 Member Posts: 55
    VEHICLE DESCRIPTION: CERTAIN VAN, WAGON, PICKUP TRUCKS, PASSENGER AND SPORT UTILITY VEHICLES, FAIL TO COMPLY WITH REQUIREMENTS OF FMVSS NO. 209, "SEAT BELT ASSEMBLIES." THE FRONT SEAT BELT RETRACTOR MAY NOT COMPLY WITH THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE STANDARD.
    Consequences IF THE RETRACTOR DOES NOT WORK PROPERLY, IT WILL NOT ADEQUATELY PROTECT OCCUPANTS IN THE EVENT OF A CRASH.
    Corrective Action DEALERS WILL REPLACE THE SEAT BELT RETRACTOR. OWNER NOTIFICATION BEGAN AUGUST 20, 2001. OWNERS WHO TAKE THEIR VEHICLES TO AN AUTHORIZED DEALER ON AN AGREED UPON SERVICE DATE AND DO NOT RECEIVE THE FREE REMEDY WITHIN A REASONABLE TIME SHOULD CONTACT DAIMLERCHRYSLER AT 1-800-853-1403
    Hmmm they must of recalled it secretly cause this is the first Ive heard of it Just found this surfing the net.
  • hansiennahansienna Member Posts: 2,312
    AND the recall was for the FRONT seat belt retractor.
    Wasn't your daughter in a rear seat?
  • temp409temp409 Member Posts: 55
    She was behind drivers seat. Just goes to show ya even if yours are defective you won't know it until you wreck and it gets tested I guess. Our front straps which might apply to that recall work excellent caught me and her dad perfectly, NONE of our 4 rear shoulder straps would catch. Your best bet is just jerk them, all fords that I tried catch all of my kias catch just seems like common logic if they don't catch when you jerk them they won't catch when your body jerks them although I realize some are floating and if ours was then it was useless anyway at 35mph crash.
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    Congrats on your Sedona by the way. I think it's an excellent choice. (albeit there are many excellent choices in the minivan market :D )
  • sebring95sebring95 Member Posts: 3,241
    Until you comprehend/accept the fact that NOT ALL SEAT BELTS WILL CATCH WHEN YOU JERK THEM, your common logic doesn't stand a chance. And yes, it's very likely that the front seat belts are of a different design than the rears. On the Honda Odysseys, the front have completely different seat-belt system (pretensioners) than the rears.

    The fact is, YOUR seatbelts in YOUR van were faulty. And I agree, it is very likely that you'll never know if your seatbelts are faulty until you have an accident. It's possible your jerk-type seat-belts could break right at the point of impact. Who knows. You can only protect yourself to a certain extent, the rest is luck or lack thereof. I'm sorry your vehicle was defective and your daughter was hurt. Sometimes poop happens and it sucks, but passing on false imformation isn't going to help anyone. If anything, I'd recommend anyone with a vehicle over a few years old find out how to test your seatbelts to see if they're working properly.
  • cpsdarrencpsdarren Member Posts: 265
    VEHICLE DESCRIPTION: CERTAIN VAN, WAGON, PICKUP TRUCKS, PASSENGER AND SPORT UTILITY VEHICLES, FAIL TO COMPLY WITH REQUIREMENTS OF FMVSS NO. 209, "SEAT BELT ASSEMBLIES."

    The manufacturer will know the exact models, years and serial numbers affected. You should call that number to verify that yours was one of them. For example, this one appears to only affect MY 1999 vehicles.

    If you found it on the NHTSA website, it clearly wasn't a "secret" recall. In fact, the recall stated that owner notification began on August 20, 2001. If your model was affected and you weren't notified, it was probably an issue with lost mail or an incorrect address.

    Incidentally, one reason you may have different retrator types in your vehicle is because you probably have pre-tensioners and/or force limiters in the front seatbelt systems but not the rear ones. It may simply be cheaper or easier to use a different retractor system when a pre-tensioner is present.

    Given your claims and conviction, I strongly suggest you find an experienced law firm that deals in vehicle safety issues. Discussing the details here might not be a great idea if you have a legitimate lawsuit and the vehicle manufacturer was at fault.
  • ClairesClaires Member Posts: 1,222
    It's clear that we don't know what sort of system is employed in the rear restraints of this vehicle, but we've all been advised of this particular incident, and a number of good suggestions have been offered. Although I haven't seen a filing about it at the NHTSA site, I'm hopeful that it'll be reported there as well. Having done all we can, discussing it further here seems to be bogging things down, so let's move on.

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  • temp409temp409 Member Posts: 55
    ALL 6 shoulder straps of the odyssey catch first jerk so does- Toyota sienna's- Which I loved the best but at $30,000-I can't afford it. Dodge & Toyota rode the best then Kia then Honda Odyssey rode the worse. I chose Kia because of the working seatbelts good price 16,500 plus excellent warranty. So you can see- I have MOVED ON down the road with my working seatbelts, I just wish all little children could have the same. If every van I tested seatbelts work first jerk why don't the Dodge caravan do the same as all others on the rear straps? Also I did post at the NHTSA- office of defects Investigation-- on 3/11/2006.
  • mrblonde49mrblonde49 Member Posts: 626
    5 star crash test rating too:D <<

    I think all the new vans have 5 stars
  • temp409temp409 Member Posts: 55
    I can not find where any crash test are done with pictures or information about if they put crash test dummys in rear seats when crash testing for front crash in vans. Can anyone? All new vans rate 5 star but msn autos rates 2001 caravan I had Poor in almost all categorys of crash testing. Im thinking for crash test frontal there are only dummies in the front seats, is that so?
  • cpsdarrencpsdarren Member Posts: 265
    "ALL 6 shoulder straps of the odyssey catch first jerk so does- Toyota sienna's- Which I loved the best but at $30,000-I can't afford it."

    You can get a Sienna CE for well under $25,000. A nicely equipped LE is well under $30,000.

    "If every van I tested seatbelts work first jerk why don't the Dodge caravan do the same as all others on the rear straps?"

    As has been explained numerous times in various forums, there are different types of retractors. Sometimes, different types are even used in the same vehicle. Being able to lock the retractor with a jerk is only a valid test of one type.

    That said, the switchable locking retractors in the Odyssey and Sienna can come in very handy for child restraint installation. Between the seatbelt mechanisms and locations, carseat installs in the third row of current generation Chrysler vans also tend to be more difficult than the others, in my experience.
  • cpsdarrencpsdarren Member Posts: 265
    "I can not find where any crash test are done with pictures or information about if they put crash test dummys in rear seats when crash testing for front crash in vans. Can anyone? All new vans rate 5 star but msn autos rates 2001 caravan I had Poor in almost all categorys of crash testing. Im thinking for crash test frontal there are only dummies in the front seats, is that so?"

    MSN Autos does not perform crash tests. You need to go directly to www.safercar.gov and www.iihs.org to find explanations of the testing done in the USA.
  • rorrrorr Member Posts: 3,630
    "I chose Kia because of the working seatbelts good price 16,500 plus excellent warranty."

    All vehicles sold new are designed to have working seatbelts, that includes the Dodge vans.

    "If every van I tested seatbelts work first jerk why don't the Dodge caravan do the same as all others on the rear straps?"

    Ummmm, perhaps because they have a DIFFERENT TYPE OF LOCKING MECHANISM?????

    A seatbelt which passes a 'jerk' test tells you two things:
    First, that it has a centrifugal-type of locking mechanism in the reel. Second, it is apparently functioning.

    A seatbelt which fails a 'jerk' test tells you NOTHING. Zip. Nada. You can't make ANY conclusions about a seatbelt which fails this test.
  • temp409temp409 Member Posts: 55
    So all kia sedonnas work first jerk all toyota sienna work first jerk all ford winstar work first jerk all of honda odyssey work first jerk, and well then the ONLY ones that dont in the mini van world are-(dodge caravan) and my daughter has her face smashed- isn't that enough for some people to come to the conclusion that the only ones that FAIL the jerk test ALSO fail the wreck test. It failed for us but somehow you think it may magically work for you? Thats a big risk my daughter could have died.
  • ishanbishanb Member Posts: 5
    Please, let's move on. temp409 either can't or won't accept the explanation that the Dodge Caravan may use a different type of seatbelt tensioner system for the rear seats compared to the front and that testing with a "jerk" is not appropriate for certain kind of tensioner systems.

    Enough already.
  • boxwrenchboxwrench Member Posts: 55
    temp409

    You failed to mention in all your posts about seatbelts if the air bag(s) deployed in your crash? I'm assuming your DC was a '91 or newer. Just curious that in 35mph frontal crash, the air bag should have deployed.
    Some how I survived over 55 years of driving and a lot of those years were without SEAT BELTS, Air Bags, Stability Control, and a lot of other safety things that are on cars nowadays. Maybe it's because we didn't drive as FAST at today's drivers. 'Course, there were fewer cars on the road then, but also many more 2-lane roads, and not many 4-lanes.

    Hope your Daughter is improving everyday. I'm sure when it is her turn to start driving, she will remember the accident, and be a SAFE driver.

    Regards
    Boxwrench
  • vbhvbh Member Posts: 3
    SEEKING INFO:
    (1) 2007 model Odyssey or Sienna: Are these vans going to have the T & C middle seat fold-away capability?
    (2) Any after-market protective liner (or such like)to attach to mid & rear seats for the folded-down seat position?
    Purpose is to protect seats when van used to haul materials and they are shoved/pushed into "cargo" space.
    Thanks. Mark
  • temp409temp409 Member Posts: 55
    It crushed in the the front drivers corner airbags worked perfect front seatbelts worked perfect. I loved that van would of never wanted another until we wrecked and she was hurt so bad for NO GOOD REASON we were only going about 35 and skidded about 15 or 20 ft befour hitting.If anyone should of gotten hurt I would of thought it would have been me or her dad up front thats the only part that got any damage but because the lap belt held and her shoulder belt didn't is why only her face and head got hurt on that handle on back of drivers seat. But yep thank God shes doing well now. I don't think its a dirty secret you shouldn't talk about if seatbelts are not working but it seems some do. Any of you guys work for Dodge or something? lol Im not going to suit you so chill out, just fix the faulty rear catching mechanisms in your rear shoulder belts! Then Ill stop whineing.
  • hansiennahansienna Member Posts: 2,312
    Neither Honda nor Toyota release advance information. :cry:
  • 97xpresso97xpresso Member Posts: 249
    As long as people reply to your repetitive posts, you won't stop whineing. Have you contacted an attorney? You have a solid case if your seatbelts were defective. I don't think you will though, because you're afraid you might be wrong.
  • badgerfanbadgerfan Member Posts: 1,565
    On the Grand Caravan/Town and Country DaimlerChrysler twins, when the second row seats are folded into the floor they are completely covered and protected by a separate cover which also covers up the wells and acts as the floor when the seats are not folded down. I don't know of any need for more protection for the seats than that.

    For further protection you could also add additional floor mats, I suppose.

    On our 1996 Caravan which, of course, does not have any seats that fold into the floor, I used black 36" wide vinyl carpet runner to make custom fit mats for the second and third rows. This approach has the advantage that this carpet runner material can easily be cut with a scissors to fit around the seat supports which holds the mat in place nicely and also provides a "wall to wall" mat that protects the carpet completely, unlike aftermarket and OEM mats which are always skimpy and ill fitting. This vinyl matting material is quite inexpensive as well. Can usually be purchased at most big box hardware/lumberyards like Home Depot, Lowes and Menards.
  • cpsdarrencpsdarren Member Posts: 265
    "Some how I survived over 55 years of driving and a lot of those years were without SEAT BELTS, Air Bags, Stability Control, and a lot of other safety things that are on cars nowadays. Maybe it's because we didn't drive as FAST at today's drivers. 'Course, there were fewer cars on the road then, but also many more 2-lane roads, and not many 4-lanes."

    Consider yourself lucky, like me. Motor vehicle crashes remain the #1 cause of death for kids 1-14 and in age groups all the way to 35. The majority of those fatalities are to unrestrained and improperly restrained passengers.

    I used to ride unrestrained as a kid all the time. I survived. Many others didn't. Highway fatalties have dropped slightly over the years, despite the huge increase in vehicles and miles traveled. Fatality rates have dropped significantly since the late 60s. I'm glad I was never involved in a crash when I was a kid or I probably wouldn't be typing now... My kids have a much better chance and would probably survive some very severe crashes that the front seat passengers would not survive.
  • cpsdarrencpsdarren Member Posts: 265
    "If anyone should of gotten hurt I would of thought it would have been me or her dad up front thats the only part that got any damage but because the lap belt held and her shoulder belt didn't is why only her face and head got hurt on that handle on back of drivers seat.

    A faulty shoulder belt retractor is a possibility, but there are other possible causes for the injuries you describe. For example, some types of less common crashes, especially those with vertical motion like a rollover, can actually disengage some seatbelt retractor systems. Another possibility is a passenger who was not wearing a properly fitted shoulder belt at the moment of the crash. Most kids 4-8 [and some older] do not fit adult seatbelts very well without a booster or child restraint. Kids often circumvent an uncomfortable shoulder belt by slouching, leaning or putting it behind their back or arm. Correctly used boosters and child restraints can resolve these issues. Similarly, any slack in the shoulder belt before the crash could have led to injuries. Anything from a retractor with low tension to a shoulder belt that got caught in a booster seat guide can be a factor, too.

    It is also a little unusual that lower abdominal injuries were not present, as these are usually the primary type of injury on someone restrained only by a lap belt in a severe frontal crash.

    "I don't think its a dirty secret you shouldn't talk about if seatbelts are not working but it seems some do. Any of you guys work for Dodge or something?"

    You asked a question and received many valid responses about how different types of seatbelt systems function. If you don't choose to believe them, then your best recourse is to have your seatbelts inspected by an independent expert. If you believe your seatbelts are defective, you should pursue a lawsuit and possibly save other children from harm if the defect is more than an isolated failure.

    In that you seem not to trust responses here, I think you would be best served by directing future questions about defects to a lawyer, crash reconstructionist or forensic engineer with expertise in this area. At the very least, you won't have to worry that they are working for Dodge. Plus, they could quickly determine if a faulty retractor was responsible for the injuries or not. A simple tug on the shoulder belt is NOT a conclusive test. You should consult an expert in person if you have doubts or do not understand the issues involved.
  • vbhvbh Member Posts: 3
    Thanks for the info.

    Honda/Toyota's loss: it's obviously not worth waiting for a pig in a poke.

    Mark
  • vbhvbh Member Posts: 3
    Thanks for the help/info.

    You all are why I cherish info boards.

    Mark
  • rorrrorr Member Posts: 3,630
    "...come to the conclusion that the only ones that FAIL the jerk test ALSO fail the wreck test."

    A failed jerk test tells you NOTHING unless you know what type of locking mechanism you have. So how do you know it 'failed' the wreck test? You are ASSUMING. It's been pointed out that a large number of factors (principal amoung them being IMPROPER restraint) could lead to a seatbelt 'failure'.

    "It failed for us but somehow you think it may magically work for you?"

    You DON'T know that it failed. If you HONESTLY believe that there was a defect, why haven't you retained legal counsel?

    "Thats a big risk my daughter could have died."

    Correct. Precisely my point. Unless you KNOW that the seatbelts failed (and a jerk test will not tell you this), precisely WHO is running the big risk based on an assumption?

    If you put your entire faith in seatbelts which lock when jerked (which you appear to have done), but a seatbelt lock malfunction was NOT the cause of your daughter's injuries, then aren't you RUNNING A RISK of the same thing happening again?
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    Ma'am,

    I don't work for Dodge, in fact, I would never own a Dodge or Chrysler product due to the various quality problems we had with their transmissions and suspensions over the years. I don't believe that a large, multinational multibillion dollar corporation has sold millions of minivans with rear seatbelts that don't work, or we would have heard about it by now. I believe you had a lemon, or a faulty seatbelt, but I do not believe all Chrysler products (or vans, what have you) have this problem.

    I'm a Honda guy, and will be until they screw up, but for now, this horse is dead, and the further you talk about this, the less credible you seem and instead become just a whiny consumer. It would do you good to give this a rest.

    By the way, it seems to me you'd have bought a used van with more safety features than your Kia, since safety is a high priority.

    Give the issue a rest for a little while; you've made your point, and by now, EVERYONE has read it two or three times at minimum. It's time to move on.
  • temp409temp409 Member Posts: 55
    I don't know who to contact to get crash test done on rear occupants of caravan and that would probally cost more money than I have. I don't want to file a lawsuit but mom says I should, we rear ended someone on the On ramp,the wreck was our fault although we didn't get a ticket. I feel safe now in the Kia also, I know what the gen3 buckle looks like there are pics. of it on internet at unsafebelts.com so I watch for it I think thats only in older DaimlerChrysler vehicles haven't seen it in any I test drove. I know her seatbelt failed I took it off of her myself after the wreck which was probally stupid since her neck could of been broke but it was just instinct. And she never said her neck hurt only her head and face. Even if I do chose to file a suit and I win alot of money like some others have, they will not recall, I dont care about the money but it seems to me thats ALL DaimlerChrysler cares about and that makes me mad. I just want them to make it safe, DaimlerChrysler didn't recall when they lost with the gen3 buckle. A recall is what I want my neice and nephew ride in a durango that does the same way they are in carseats now so its not as big of a problem until they are under the shoulder strap and depending on it. My daughter is 12 it should of worked. I don't know for sure what I want to do and I realize I am aggrivating people by just whineing on and on. Sorry! Ill try to change the subject - I love my kia but I dread all of the maintence I may be facing according to the kia problems board here but oh well my Daughter jerks the seatbelts says "LOOK mom they catch the FIRST jerk everytime" she feels safe now and so do I. Just maybe if i whine all over the internet, DaimlerChrysler will see fit to put the same catching mechanism that ALL other van companys do in rear.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    I don't know who to contact to get crash test done on rear occupants of caravan

    It should be free, it would just involve time, not money (although for most people, time IS money). Call the area rep for Chrysler. I'd be making the Regional reps know that it will take a lot for a civil suit not to be pursued. We can all sympathize with you, but it won't get you anywhere otherwise.
  • rorrrorr Member Posts: 3,630
    Just out of curiousity -

    What if Dodge had the same type of locking mechanism as all the other manufacturer's and, after the accident and your daughter's injuries, you jerked on the belt and it worked?

    Would you just shrug your shoulders and go on not caring to know why it failed to protect your daughter?

    My point is that, at this time, you have no idea if you had a faulty belt or not.

    "..my Daughter jerks the seatbelts says "LOOK mom they catch the FIRST jerk everytime" she feels safe now and so do I."

    I'm glad you both feel safe in your new van. I hope you enjoy many safe and trouble-free years in it.
  • mrblonde49mrblonde49 Member Posts: 626
    I should, we rear ended someone on the On ramp,the wreck was our fault although we didn't get a ticket"

    You rear ended someone on an on ramp, leaving 15-20 foot skidmarks (from another post)? I can't picture how that would happen..

    You have other safety issues much more pressing than the seat belts catching.

    Have you ever thought maybe it's misplaced rage, since the seat belts issue could have been avoided completely.

    Keep your daughter safe. You feel safer in your new van. Drive safer, too...
  • temp409temp409 Member Posts: 55
    If -after the wreck when I went to look at van and rear seats caught I would of thought It was only her 1 that was defective and just let go under pressure but NONE of the 4 in rear will catch it was such a OBVIOUS problem and frankly the ones in very rear-3rd row are even worse than middle where she was. Im just thankful to God my boys were not back there thats where they usually ride but since they are 18 and 14 they don't want to go with us much anymore. Hmm so I should call where I bought the van and ask how I can get in touch with a Chrysler rep? That sounds like a good idea to me but then I wonder why so many people have suied over the gen3 if they are willing to fix faulty stuff hmm Ill let you know how it goes only thing is where I just bought the Kia is ALSo where I bought the caravan and I hate to piss them off. I know Ill call a diffent chrysler dealer and ask. Ill let you know what they say.
  • temp409temp409 Member Posts: 55
    First car stops sudden I think he couldnt see if it was clear cause suv was SO much bigger than his little car and suv kinda started to move to the right and blocked his view so he just stopped at the end of On ramp then Suv was brand new and must of had excellent brakes. Suv stops sudden and we= no anti lock -we skid and hit suv in front of us. I really thought we were going to stop in time but well we didn't. no one in all 3 cars would of been hurt first two drove away after it was all over with cops and stuff She-daughter was the ONLY person hurt. ANYWAY Im going to look in phone book
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    We aren't referring to a defect with "if they catch when you tug". We mean they didn't catch during the crash, AS MANY CARS WITH THE PENDULUM TYPE SEAT BELT (JUST LIKE YOURS) SHOULD DO.

    temp409, please, PLEASE, realize that TUGGING THE SEATBELTS DOES NOT PROVE A DARNED THING!!!!!. Don't worry about pissing off your dealer The fact that you arent pursuing legal action (something I don't understand, but that's not my call) should make them very happy.

    Ask your dealer (or if you prefer, another local dealer) how to contact Chrysler's regional representative. Make sure you tell them you have a lawyer, that will get you more answers (hopefully).

    Keep in mind, many lawsuits on the gen III is no different than any other company. Where a product is sold, a defect is possible, and where a defect is, a lawsuit may be close behind.

    *****TUGGING THE SEATBELT PROVES NOTHING WHEN YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT TYPE OF BELT SYSTEM YOU ARE DEALING WITH*****
  • cpsdarrencpsdarren Member Posts: 265
    "I don't know who to contact to get crash test done on rear occupants of caravan and that would probally cost more money than I have."

    You don't need a crash test. If you are genuinely interested to know what went wrong, then you need to retain an experienced crash reconstructionist and/or forensic engineer with a highway safety background. They can inspect the seatbelts and retractor system and give you a good idea of the failure without any type of crash testing. You can google those terms to find someone in your area. In case you do file a lawsuit, most of these professionals can also serve as an expert witness on your behalf.

    For example, these turned up on a quick search. There are dozens more:

    http://www.accidentreconstruction.com/

    http://www.thecrashlab.com/

    http://forensicaccident.com/

    http://www.johnmuse.com/
  • rorrrorr Member Posts: 3,630
    Never mind. I think it's a lost cause. Obviously, belts that don't pass the jerk test don't work. Period. That other system is purely a figment of our imagination.

    Am I the only one to recognize the irony here? The DGC owners have completely clammed up on this issue, and the most ardent posters attempting to clear the DGC name are.....Odyssey owners? :confuse:

    Who'da thunk it?
  • temp409temp409 Member Posts: 55
    http://www.ertyu.org/~steven_nikkel/neontsbs/2000/28-957-00.pdf#search='DaimlerC- hrysler%20representative%20safety'

    I went here found a number talked to a VERY nice guy who recorded the phone call he said that a specialist that deals with seatbelt matters will call me tomorrow they were out for the day now. He got the vin number from my van and made a file. Im sure all will be recorded. Thanks to -thegraduate I think that was the best advice, seems like the Christian thing to do to just deal with them first. Maybe now at least the 2007 will have same catching mechanisms in rear as the front. Ill let you know how the call goes tomorrow. What I really want is to see a child size crash test dummy put in the rear in a crash test at about 35 mph and just see what happens I would bet ALOT of money NONE will catch. Should I insist on a recall? if that is the case? I bet they will not do a recall because they didn't for the gen3 case they just pay the people off. I don't want that. I just want them safe for everyone. I loved that van and I told him that and it should be a easy fix if they will only put the same catching mechanism in rear belts of caravans and durangos that they put in the front. Anyway Ill keep ya posted and thanks for listening to all my whineing.
  • hansiennahansienna Member Posts: 2,312
    DaimlerChrysler minivan owners appreciate the responsible postings by many Odyssey owners.

    MANY owners of DaimlerChrysler minivans have posted concerning the unfortunate incident and the data they posted has been ignored. Most of the data posted by Odyssey owners has also been ignored. Is there any proof that the child was actually wearing the seat belt properly?

    I have grandchildren riding in both a 1999 GC SE and a 2002 T&C LX where their parents put them in either a child seat or a booster seat that is securely fastened. We do NOT drive any vehicle until ALL passengers have properly secured their seat and shoulder belts.
  • pusterracingpusterracing Member Posts: 186
    We do NOT drive any vehicle until ALL passengers have properly secured their seat and shoulder belts.

    AMEN!!
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    Come on guys. We've beat the seatbelts topic to death. In fact, I have a friend with a 97 Grand Caravan and their seatbelts seem fine to me, but perhaps I haven't done the jerk test.

    I also don't drive anywhere unless all occupants are properly buckled up.

    Interesting how I'm defending DCX yet I own a 2002 Odyssey EX :blush:
  • ClairesClaires Member Posts: 1,222
    Come on guys. We've beat the seatbelts topic to death.
    Agreed. For those of you just joining us, here's the information that has been reported numerous times over the past several days:

    *Temp409's daughter was injured in a crash. She attributes this to faulty seatbelts in her Caravan.
    *Her rear seat belts did not catch on the first jerk.
    *The effectiveness of seatbelts cannot always be tested by jerking, as they employ different mechanisms for catching.
    *The catching mechanism employed by the rear seatbelts in her Caravan is unknown.
    *She has filed a complaint with the NHTSA and has contacted Chrysler to begin an investigation.
    *The seatbelts on her Kia pass the jerk test and she is happy with her current vehicle.

    Now, unless there's something NEW to add to the seatbelt issue, let's get back to the topic, which is Minivan Shopping. I'll be removing any further rehashing of seatbelt issues from this point forward.

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  • temp409temp409 Member Posts: 55
    The same pendulum cathing mechainism that is in the front is in the rear. I said NO WAY have you tried jerking on them and he said yes he knew they didn't and I said did you know of ALL the minivans Dodge is the ONLY ones that dont pass the jerk test all the way around then he said "Well I dont go around jerking on seatbelts." I laughed and said ya well I bet you would if what happen to us just happend to you. He says what do you want out of this, I said I just want to make children safe. I asked Has there been crash test done for the rear occupants of caravan and he said contact NHTSA I did a girl answers phone doesnt know. She gives me email address to ask a question. So now Im waiting for a reply ALso Diamlerchrysler wants me to let them go get my van and do a inspection and Im not sure what to do. Im going to ask a lawyer.
  • rorrrorr Member Posts: 3,630
    So, DCX confirmed that the belts have a "pendulum catching mechanism"?

    Interesting.

    IF this is the case, I wonder why the front seat belts catch when jerked?
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