Edmunds dealer partner, Bayway Leasing, is now offering transparent lease deals via these forums. Click here to see the latest vehicles!
Most popular vehicles
Popular New Cars
- New Acura MDX
- New Acura RDX
- New Audi Q5
- New BMW 3 Series
- New BMW X3
- New Buick Enclave
- New Cadillac Escalade
- New Chevrolet Equinox
- New Chrysler 300
- New Dodge Challenger
- New Ford Edge
- New Ford Escape
- New Ford Expedition
- New Ford Explorer
- New Ford F-150
- New Ford Focus
- New Ford Mustang
- New Honda Accord
- New Honda Civic
- New Honda CR-V
- New Honda Fit
- New Honda Odyssey
- New Honda Pilot
- New Hyundai Elantra
- New Hyundai Santa Fe
- New Hyundai Sonata
- New Hyundai Tucson
- New Jeep Compass
- New Jeep Grand Cherokee
- New Jeep Wrangler
- New Mazda 3
- New Mazda 6
- New Mazda CX-5
- New Nissan Altima
- New Nissan Maxima
- New Nissan Rogue
- New Porsche Cayenne
- New Ram 1500
- New Subaru Crosstrek
- New Subaru Forester
- New Subaru Impreza
- New Subaru Outback
- New Tesla Model S
- New Tesla Model X
- New Toyota 4Runner
- New Toyota Camry
- New Toyota Corolla
- New Toyota Highlander
- New Toyota Prius
- New Toyota RAV4
- New Toyota Sienna
- New Toyota Tacoma
- New Volkswagen Jetta
- New Volvo XC60
- New Volvo XC90
Popular Used Sedans
- Used BMW 5 Series
- Used Chevrolet Impala
- Used Chevrolet Malibu
- Used Chrysler 200
- Used Dodge Charger
- Used Ford Fusion
- Used Ford Taurus
- Used Honda Accord
- Used Honda Civic
- Used Hyundai Elantra
- Used Hyundai Sonata
- Used Tesla Model S
- Used Toyota Camry
- Used Toyota Corolla
- Used Volkswagen Jetta
Popular Used SUVs
- Used Acura MDX
- Used Acura RDX
- Used Ford Edge
- Used Ford Explorer
- Used Honda CR-V
- Used Honda Pilot
- Used Hyundai Santa Fe
- Used Jeep Compass
- Used Lincoln Navigator
- Used Mazda CX-5
- Used Nissan Rogue
- Used Subaru Crosstrek
- Used Subaru Forester
- Used Tesla Model X
- Used Volvo XC90
Popular Used Pickup Trucks
Popular Used Hatchbacks
Popular Used Minivans
Popular Used Coupes
Popular Used Wagons
Comments
Steve, Host
I have tons of ammo here showing the Escape sells for less in my region. Can you say 05 Escape Limited 4x4 for $22,975!! not just 1 or 2 like Honda 10 to CHOOSE from. Choice is nice. Or and 05 Escape XLS 2.3 Liter for $16,375 and 5 to choose from. And for Honda.. a CRV EX lease for $279 a month. $2,696 due at signing! LOL! MSRP of $23,040. This is a lease folks, not a buy. Pretty doggone spendy in my book when comparing it to the above Escape Limited for $22,975. Options on the Limited far out way the EX options.. Want dealership numbers? let me know....
Here is more Escape XLS 3@ $15,777 or XLT w/moonroof for $20,477.. this goes on and on..
Not too spendy in my book for what you get. 6 disc in dash CD changer, 4 wheel disc brakes, ABS w/ EBD, moonroof, alloy wheels, side airbags, etc. Can't get many of those items on a 4 cyl. Escape.
i think keypad entry is a great convenience feature, although not as good as the automatic transmission. don't have to carry my keys around and can unlock/lock any of the doors and the rear hatch.
scape2... what type of car top carrier do you have? i have the long type that can hold skis, etc... fits nicely on my explorer.
i saw a crv with rooftop crossbars. they didn't look adjustable, forward or back, like the ones on the escape.
Here is a very brief summary of some of the findings (By the way all testing was done during light rain)
Ford Escape
The smallest engine of the group with the tallest gearing that produced the slowest acceleration (13.5 seconds from 0-100 kph). That’s about 62 mph by the way.
As part of the Escape’s revamp, Ford retuned its suspension for a softer ride. It worked as far as the ride goes but at a cost of sacrificing a bit in the handling category. The Ford was labeled as the most truck like to drive.
Its instrumentation caused a bit of a debate. Comments included “plain but eminently readable”, through “really silly to a “crime against humanity.” They did like the huge center console storage bin but did not think much of the quality of the materials.
Honda CR-V
Managed to place third in the acceleration test with a mark of 11.3 seconds for 0-100kph (Outlander was first at 10.7 and the Rav4 second with a 10.9)
The CR-V’s AWD system was really slammed in this test being called “Mickey Mouse” and “one sorry excuse for a 4 wheel drive system.” Apparently during the acceleration test it allowed “the front wheels to spin almost uncontrollably when accelerating flat out”.
I’m not sure if the AWD system or the Bridgestone tires caused this. But none of the others seemed to struggle for traction.
They liked the CR-V’s handling and ride quality. It also got high marks for its dash being of “high quality with an upscale look with classy gauges and a slick rotary HVAC.”
Some disliked the gear shifter location
I won’t get into details of the other 3 trucks, as this thread is a comparison of Escapes and CR-V’s. For what is worth, of the four people conducting these tests none of them ended up picking either one as the winner. One picked the X-TRAIL two picked the Rav4 and one the Mitsubishi.
Then you go on to say someone "proved" something just because a magazine stated it and it is something that disproves another poster or another magazine or source. You are way over the top and I hope many folks can be patient enough to get past your words and get to comparing the vehicles.
Everyone hear? MSRP only for the Escape. That means close to $29000 for a top of the line, fully optioned vehicle.
Now this is for the 5 speed. But I have seen times reported for the automatic that are less than 11.3 seconds posted above. I will find them and I will post them. So following a certain persons logic I guess that will show that the previous numbers are wrong. More importantly it shows how the CR-V beat the V6 equipped Escape. Beat it. Beat it. Beat it. That's the hammer portion of this post.
Enjoy:
Track testing confirmed our impressions, as the CR-V managed a best 0-to-60-mph run of 8.7 seconds. An impressive feat considering that the last Ford Escape we tested only managed a best time of 9.3 seconds, and that was with a 200-horsepower V6 under the hood. Not to mention that even with all this power, the CR-V still managed a very respectable 21.8 miles per gallon during our week-long test.
Even more impressive than the engine's power is the manner in which it's delivered. Most four-cylinders are plagued by excessive noise and vibration, but the CR-V's new powerplant remains smooth and quiet at all engine speeds. It's also less peaky, with a broad band of power that rarely leaves you scrambling for a lower gear. We have no trouble calling this new engine the standard for refinement in four-cylinder sport-utes.
Unless you drive a 2002+ CR-V with an MTX scape will most likely beat you in a race to 60. You'll be watching his tail lights if you decide to go for the 1/4.
Steve, Host
Also, how does Edmunds conduct the acceleration test? Some car reviewers will take a car up to redline before shifting into gear – even automatic transmission!! Of course, the reviewers are not concerned with long term durability but this method does extract the best 0-60 times. While it does favor high-revving engines (such as the Honda) over larger, low end torque engines (such as the Ford), I think we can agree 98% of the people will not be driving there cars this way. A more realistic indication of power may be 30-60 (as Steve pointed out) or accelerating up a hill with 2 passengers and the A/C on. My *guess* would be that most people will find the Escape more powerful.
Disclaimer: I have not driven an Escape but I have a test driven 04 CR-V EX with auto. I would describe it as “peppy”. In other words, plenty of “get and go” when I’m driving by myself, but I can see it being a little bogged down under certain driving condition, such as when I have my wife & salesman in the car and the A/C on.
I’m not sure if the AWD system or the Bridgestone tires caused this. But none of the others seemed to struggle for traction."
That's an easy one. The RT4WD system used in the CR-V has a safety valve. This valve prevents the system from activating if the rush of torque from the drivetrain is dangerously high. This effectively prevents people from slamming the rear wheels into action. This feature prevents damage to the system and can also prevent the fish-tailing or loss of control that will occur when the tire's contact patch is suddenly overwhelmed.
These testers were forcing the system to blow the safety valve. They just didn't understand it.
True enough.
TruckTrend did a comparo with the RAV4, CR-V, Escape, and Freelander a few years back. All vehicles were tested on the same track with the same methodology. The CR-V (an automatic) was faster than the V6 Escape on the 0-60 run.
Any questions?
Actually, the CR-V does have a "power hole". At certain speeds (highway passing situations), I find it difficult to get the transmission to kick down to 2nd gear, and the torque at these speeds (I drive an automatic) is very slow to accelerate. The vehicle is in 3rd gear at this point, but needs 2nd.
I generally floor the accelerator. Once the gears kick down, the CR-V moves fine, in fact, outstandingly.
Freeway merges are fine, since the engine is already spinning at a pretty high RPM when accelerating on the on-ramp.
Just goes to show you have to know the ins-and-outs of your particular vehicle, and drive accordingly.
Steve, Host
The overdrive does kick off. The problem is that the 2.4L engine needs to downshift from 3rd to 2nd. I find that the "Overdrive" (actually 4th gear on the CR-V) easily down shifts to 3rd. But 3rd doesn't have enough pull to move the car at passing speeds.
Steve, Host
You state "advertised in the paper" for 20,500, where then.. give me the dealership name and number will YOU?????? I will ask again.. Give me the name and number of the dealership that is advertising CRV-EX for $20,500.... you said it now cough it up...
Well, I too have seen better times for the Escape, I have seen as low as 8.2 for 0-60 times.. The fact is the V6 is more powerful and quicker than the CRv in automatic form. This debate looks familiar.....
I can immediately picture the guy from that Ford truck TV ad, who was trying to outdo Ford truck from the light stop. :-)!!!!
Is it really matters - is it 8.2 sec or 9.0 or even 10.0 in everyday life? Is it the most important thing in life to outdo that butt-faced stupid guy from the light stop?
These "rabbit starts" does not come cheap - you would pay extra for gas (law of physics!) , tires, additional maintenance and, God forbid, even for more trouble.
When somebody tries to outrun me from the traffic light stop - I am happy that this guy/girl go fast away - less trouble for me and others who are behind him.
1. They revved the Escape to get those numbers, too.
2. No one is saying that the CR-V is more powerful than the Escape. But the Escape is heavier and the gearing is softer. So acceleration is not as different than you'd like to think.
3. We have an automatic vs automatic comparison performed with the same testing methodology on the same track by the same magazine. See the TruckTrend article I mentioned above. The auto CR-V was faster than the the auto Escape.
Dems da facts.
Frankly, I figure if a person cares enough about acceleration that they are going to consider 0-60 times, they aren't going to buy an automatic.
Scape2 is always miscomparing because his prices typically refer to 2WD Escapes. He has no idea what properly equipped 4WD Escapes actually cost. When you get into 4WD XLT Sport editions and Limiteds, actual prices approach and surpass $25k.
I expect the significantly updated 2005 CR-V to cost more than the 2004 - but they are likely to remain cheaper than equivalent Escapes. Side airbags will be standard, whereas they are costly and hard-to-find options on the Escape. This alone will probably account for significant cost savings for CR-V buyers. They will also have VSA and 5-speed automatics, both features unavailable on the Escape.
Nor should they buy an SUV.
Does the '05 Escape already have a rebate? Newspapers here seem to indicate so.
It was $1000 back in June when we bought ours. Not many vehicles come "out of the chute" without some kind of incentive these days whether it be hidden or not.
All things considered the rebate is mighty low on the Escape. We could have bought an Explorer XLT for less than what the Escape cost us (less doodads too though) because of the $3000 + $1000 bonus rebate that was available at the time. GM has rebates of up to $6000 right now IIRC and I've seen TV ads touting up to $9000 off of any PT Cruiser and some Jeeps just recently. I don't know if the latter is all rebates but that's a pretty hefty discount.
Ford has been lowering their rebates recently but losing sales because of it. We won't hear how that has effected the bottom line for another two months. The real test for them is just over the horizon though as they get ready to ship three completely new cars to dealer lots. Word on the street right now is that the Mustang will start off with low interest rates and no cash. I don't know about the other two though.
Side airbags will be standard, whereas they are costly and hard-to-find options on the Escape.
I have to disagree. We had no trouble finding an '05 Escape with the safety canopy and if we couldn't, ordering one the way you want is no problem either.
As for the price, I don't think $425 is all that expensive to protect the upper half of every outboard passenger in a crash/rollover. Also, just because Honda is making them standard doesn't mean you are getting them for free.
Will the next CR-V have curtains or the same side torso-only bags they currently offer? There is a big difference.
I agree that sporting enthusiasts would be better served with another vehicle (from a bang for buck perspective), but SUV-driving, sport drivers do exist.
"All things considered the rebate is mighty low on the Escape." - Baggs
The rebate is low, only when compared with other Fords and Chevies. The CR-V has no rebate, at all. $1,000 is a grand more than Honda has to pay customers to buy the CR-V.
But there are likely other incentives that exist (other than rebates). These include bonuses paid to the dealer, rather than the customer. So that $1,000 figure may only be what the public sees.
"Will the next CR-V have curtains or the same side torso-only bags they currently offer? There is a big difference." - Baggs on bags
It is rumored that the CR-V will have curtain-style side airbags for the front passenger, along with the same seat-mounted bags that are offered today. The curtains will include a roll-over protection feature similar to what Ford offers on the Explorer (the bags stay inflated if the vehicle rolls).
The reason why this rumor persists is that Honda has promised to have these features (along with ABS and VSA) on all truck models (every trim) soon. Honda of Canada has also released information stating that they are getting these features in 2005.
The Escape has this as well. That's what the Safety Canopy system is all about.
Why have curtains for the front passengers and not the back too? That seems pretty lame considering everyone else is offering protection for all rows these days. Maybe curtains for all rows will be an option?
But there are likely other incentives that exist (other than rebates). These include bonuses paid to the dealer, rather than the customer. So that $1,000 figure may only be what the public sees.
Honda does the same thing. How else do you explain people buying their vehicles for less than invoice?
I've seen proof of Honda incentives in other threads. More prominently on Accords and Civics. Can't speak for the CR-V.
Yes, Honda does use dealer incentives. At this time, no one has found evidence of them being applied to the CR-V. The CR-V is still selling as fast as they can build them.
Vehicles like the Civic and Accord have incentives as they compete in the toughest markets as volume vehicles. Most evidence suggests that the Ody has incentives because it's an old design (competition from the Sienna has forced Honda to put down a little cash to move the inventory). And of course, the Acura RL needs big incentives to move that pig off the lots.
But all that is secondary to the point I was making. You wrote that the rebate for the Escape is "mighty low". IMHO, that's a bit misleading.
$1,000 might be a low rebate for Ford or Chevy. But compared to the Hondas, that rebate is huge.
Also, that is only the customer rebate. It is not the entire range of incentives on the Escape. Money is also spent in the form of buying down interest rates, rebates to the dealer, and other "dealer incentives". This allows the dealer to lower the price further.
Honda has recently raised incentives, but the average of ALL their incentives for their ENTIRE fleet is not much higher than only the customer rebate on the 2005 Escape. It's lower than the recent rebates for the 2004 model.
http://www.detnews.com/2004/autosinsider/0408/04/a01-229485.htm
To borrow a term from the world of golf, the Escape has a bigger handicap than the customer rebate suggests.
The Escape is a good seller but they still have to add a rebate. I'd rather a vehicle be priced right from the beginning.
That's the real issue. Sticker prices for the Escape have risen quite a bit over the years as have those on many other domestic brands/models. The rebates are not the sole cause for these increases but are probably the major reason.
On vehicles like the Escape, where the rebate is lower, you really aren't getting a good deal. It just looks like you are. The rebate really only lowers the price to where it should be.
For example, I don't have actual numbers in front of me but, an '05 XLT optioned the way our former '02 was would cost at least $1000 more than it did back in '02. Back in '02 there was no rebate and there was no special financing on the Escape. Period. Now we see that some minor conveniences have been removed but still the sticker price has risen and rebates are a permanent fixture. It's pretty simple math actually but it's easy to ignore.
Obviously this doesn't apply to all vehicles with rebates. The Explorer's sticker surely has not risen by $4000 so Ford is losing out on some profit there. But with the Escape I don't think Ford is losing much, if anything with a $1000-$1500 rebate. Maybe they do towards the end of the MY when the rebate heads upwards of $2000 but for the most part they found a way to keep Escapes rolling off of the lots in light of some very stiff competition. And again, they don't have to rebate away their profits on this vehicle much if at all.
$1,000 might be a low rebate for Ford or Chevy. But compared to the Hondas, that rebate is huge.
That's really what I meant but you brought up some other good points.
Also, the rebate on the Accord I was referring to in my previous post was valued at several thousand dollars (I think $3000). But it was "hidden" dealer cash and I guess the dealer has the right to limit how much they want to dish out, and that guy got lucky. My point is, Honda isn't innocent when it comes to incentives. They just hide them a lot better because they still can. If Ford and GM come out with some real winners in their car lines the Honda and Toyota might be playing catch up.
For the masses out there who just need utility and love Honda quality, then the CRV should be fine. If you drive both vehicles and then choose the one you like better, then these posts don't matter.
Don't forget to take note of the upgraded sound systems. The Escape has a great 7 speaker set-up.
The Escape has a great 7 speaker set-up.
I'll second that! Completely blows away the base Escape stereo as well as the 7 speaker BOSE system in our Mazda6.
Now if I can only find a way to tie a portable DVD player into it...
Steve, Host
I am still waiting form the CRV crowd for a Dealership and a phone number and vin# for where you can get a CRV-EX for $20,500.... I am waiting..........................drive? varmit? civc? whomever... prove it..!
tidester, host
You are wrong. The TT article I am quoting compared an automatic CR-V to an automatic Escape.
"How can you "rev" the Escape to redline its an automatic?" - scape
Step on the gas hard and hold it down until the transmission shifts.
If you are referring to clutch-drop launching, then Steve is correct regarding foot-braking. We remind you of this stuff every time 0-60 acceleration is brought up.
And, BTW, for the sake of anyone else reading this stuff (for the 50th time)... Red-lining an engine and side stepping the clutch will not always result in the best acceleration times. It often results in way too much wheelspin and the car goes no where. As noted earlier, such an action would cause the CR-V's AWD to deactivate making wheelspin an even bigger issue.
Courtesy Ford
05 Escape XLT 4x4 5 @ $20,875
3.0 V6
Full power options
Speed control
air
power 6way seats
05 Escape XLS 6@ $15,675
2.3 4cyl
automatic
air
power options
CD player
This is Front wheel drive not 4x4..
Dicks Mekenzie Ford
05 XLS 3 @ 15,788 4x2 4cyl
05 Escape XLS 17,988 4x4 4cyl
05 Escape XLT 4x4 5 @ 20,488
Landmark Ford
05 Escape Limited 4 @ 21,777
Leather, AC, 3.0 V6, Moon roof
Now for Honda
Tonkin Honda
CRV EX auto
MSRP of 23,040
This is the lease for 279 a month, you need to put down $2,696 to get this lease. This is a lease, not a buy.
Beaverton Honda
CRV LX 4x4 lease
249 a month. need to have 2,616 dollars down to get this lease price per month. MSRP is 20,890, sale price is 19,570.
This is proof here folks. I am not going to type this all out again. An LX CRV for 19,570 vs an XLT Escape for $20,488. a 1000 dollar difference. The XLT has more options than an LX CRV. I called on the XLS Escape for $17,988. It is optioned with a 4cyl and very close to the CRV LX. A 1,500 dollar difference!
Proof, you pay more for Honda products. Your resale should be better.
I haven't about any Escape stalling issues lately - did Ford get that little fiasco fixed? Hmmm, the last report on an '03 stalling was back on June 7th; maybe the stalls are tapering off. (Complaint Number 10083407)
Steve, Host