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Toyota Tacoma vs. Ford Ranger, Part XII

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Comments

  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Member Posts: 897
    I gotta say that if Ford keeps losing ground that fast, Tacoma might just catch up with Ranger in sales in next 1-2 years or at least get pretty close. Ranger outsells it only by 50%, pretty bad considering last few years.
  • allknowingallknowing Member Posts: 866
    In this rare instance I have to support tbunder. BMW's, until the last five years or so, were known to be problem prone. Their claim to fame was their handling rather than reliability. In the last few years that has supposedly changed though.
  • midnight_stangmidnight_stang Member Posts: 862
    Is not just a glorified compass. Well it is that, but much more. Especially when you park one vehicle on south padre island (in the middle of a 50+ mile long secluded beach) and one at the border in brownsville so you can get drunk in Mexico. It's kinda nice knowing behind which sand dune all your gear is.

    Or while on a business trip, you can easily find your hotel, the airport or other place of interest. Good when lost, great on the second trip when you want to go back.

    A GPS is great if you ever visit the Grand Tetons (in Wyoming) or Yellowstone National park, or anywhere in the mountains with nothing but a backpack, two poles and lots and lots of snow. Kinda easy to get lost, or know which snow flurry is hiding your car or a meeting point.

    And finally while you actually spend some time in the wilderness, a forest or mountain range. A topographical map and GPS is all you need to know where you are, where you need to go, and approximately how long it will take you to get there.

    I don't see why either of you can even put down a GPS. It's only the next stage of your compass.

    You can tell me which way is North, or North north east, etc.

    I can tell you magnetic north, true north, how far any place is from you, how long it will take you to get there at your current pace, what elevation you are at, topographical displays, any special routes through the wilderness, what MPH you are travelling, and any waypoint or special point of interest. Some even come with built in barometers, thermometers, sun/moon and sunrise/sunset calculators. So either bushwacking, or trying to get back to that killer camp spot from 2 years ago, The GPS is the best, most efficient way to go.

    Once my next vacation time comes around, and I decide to go camping, I know I can find some of the better scenic points out there without fail. And when searching for new ones, I don't have to worry about getting lost.

    Heck I've found caves that National Geographic's Trails Illustrated topo maps don't even have marked.

    Either way, once you get out someplace where you have little chance of running into any humanity, you might want a small handle tool that can do it all, instead of just pointing you towards the north magnetic pole. Otherwise I presume nothing about each one of you and your outdoor skills, except that those who camp in their pickup beds aren't really roughing it.

    Finally, sorry for the long message, but I dislike those who really don't know, attempt to speak with some authority.
    One point forever saved on my GPS, Hawksbill crag
  • lariat1lariat1 Member Posts: 461
    I agree with stang about the GPS I got a little handheld Magellan and I use it all the time. Another thing GPS is good for is tracking animals when you are hunting.
  • midnight_stangmidnight_stang Member Posts: 862
    Very good at helping you find a tree stand or a hidden blind in some woods. Most GPS's will tell you where it is at within 10 feet, anywhere on the planet.
  • scape2scape2 Member Posts: 4,123
    the Toyota crowd hates to talk about HP/Torque curves and open axles on the locker TRD..
    The Tundra is doing awful! I remember there were claims this truck was going to bury the Chevy/Ford/Dodge..
    The new S-10 is going to hammer Ford and Toyota. The new S-10 is going to have the 270HP straight 6 and be about the size of a Dakota. I am not really a chevy fan.. but.. this truck is going to kick some b.... The straight 6 is a top notch engine.. chevy did their homework on this one..
  • sonjaabsonjaab Member Posts: 1,057
    The taliban sure buys enought of 'em !
  • tbundertbunder Member Posts: 580
    WHAT is your problem?
    and as much as i would like to believe you are just having a bad night, (we're all somewhat of friends around here to some extent i think) i find that your namecalling and other stuff out of the blue is totally uncalled for. and im not saying that i dont believe you or your cousin about the military using dc tacos, i would just like to have some proof of it.
    was your post a joke that everyone mistook or what? scorp's right, its not like you. i dont even think i have ever posted stuff that vulgar. either way, it's definitely not you. what gives?
  • plutoniousplutonious Member Posts: 799
    "the Toyota crowd hates to talk about HP/Torque curves and open axles on the locker TRD.."

    What really counts is how much power is getting to the wheels...and no 4x4 enthusiast is going to trade in their locker for Ford's minivan-derived LSD, LOL!

    "The new S-10 is going to hammer Ford and Toyota. The new S-10 is going to have the 270HP straight 6 and be about the size of a Dakota."

    Power without reliability means nothing. That's a lesson all those GM knocker owners have learned the hard way.
  • PF_FlyerPF_Flyer Member Posts: 9,372
    Justa reminder to keep it under control guys... doing a good job to this point!


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  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Member Posts: 897
    We have been saying this quite often now : "Do your research before you post". Taliban are the lucky owners of Toyota HiLux diesel truck, that's sold everywhere else in the world except North America (and maybe Central). If you try to blame Toyota for selling HiLuxes to T, you'll look real stupid.
    It's interesting....T is using HiLux as a mobile rocket launch platform (and despite the funny comments about both truck and shooter bursting in flames, it's obviously been effective otherwise they'd not be doing it), and US Army is using Taco DCs as mobile M-60 platform.
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Member Posts: 897
    Yeah, right, like TrailBlazer owned all the SUVs, right? With its' 6-month out of the dealership stalling engines that had to be recalled. I'm sure that problem was fixed, but Chevy will have something else in the bag for S10 owners.
    I've accepted the fact that Ranger makes more hp/torq in factory configuration. However, I still know that TRD charger can be installed (at the dealer, which is fine) and covered under p-train warranty. Whether or not you like it, the fact is this: Tacoma has a charger, it's under full warranty, and it makes a lick of difference where it was installed. It's not like your Ranger comes preassembled from the factory. There's distribution port where they put in little things here and there, there's dealer. I know it's hard to accept that Ranger is not on top of the curve, but hey...when you can find a charger for Ranger that'll be warrantied by Ford for the duration of p-train, we'll talk.
  • sjwsmwsjwsmw Member Posts: 131
    Any leads on changes for the 2003 Ranger or Tacoma? I am sure the Avalanche feature will find its way into either of these two pickups someday, but when. Also, any thoughts on a double cab Ranger?
    Thanks.
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Member Posts: 897
    No (significant) changes for 2003 Tacoma. The overhauled model will be out for 2004.
  • midnight_stangmidnight_stang Member Posts: 862
    Would make one think that the Ranger is not going to be remodeled for the 2003 model year either. A double cab would be interesting. So would a 4.6l v8.
  • sonjaabsonjaab Member Posts: 1,057
    Remember I had two troublesome Hi-LUxes
    In the cold snowy nasty NY. With the 1
    year 12k mile toyota warranty. Sure glad
    to read somebody has had a flawless one !
    Even it is the taliban ! Good thing my
    young cousins are over there now protecting
    your family and mine and giving PAYBACK !
    GO USMC, ARMY,AF, and NAVY!!!!........Geo
  • saddaddysaddaddy Member Posts: 566
    I'm sorry. It was a bad night, and its still going. It WAS a very poor attempt at a joke, but I can definitely see where it sounds like anything but such. Not sure what I was thinking. Thanx for saying that its not like me, hehe, I'll take that as a compliment. Thats the one and only time. Excuse me. I have the picture saved on another computer and will have to figure out how to get it online and the pic uploaded with this dialup connection.

    On a lighter note, the locker thing is still misunderstood folks (scape). How does it not help in towing whereas a LSD does? I used it today to pull a boat out of the water and up a wet grassy 25degree hill. Locker sure did help me tow. Not that LSD would not have done the same, but to say a locker doesn't help tow is wrong. I don't hate to talk about the open axle and locker on my TRD at all. I don't pride myself on being able to beat someone of the line in my truck and need it to be the most capable offroad in relatively stock form. Thus, the locker is best for me. Any questions?
  • issisteelmanissisteelman Member Posts: 124
    I have a small, hand held GPS and I love it. I hunt quite a lot and used to rely solely on a compass The compass works great, but, when you are tracking a deer you can sometimes loose your bearings if you are not paying attention to where you are going. The GPS (used in conjunction with a compass) is really great because you can always find your way back to your truck. I simply mark the truck location in the morning and only check the GPS (to get a bearing and distance to the truck) when I've lost some confidence in my compass bearing. I don't think a GPS is a waste of money nor a bad tool. However, I'd never enter the woods without a compass as well (nor a Toyota Tacoma).

    Take care and I'll see you in the middle of nowhere searching for that perfect tree stand.........Steelman.
  • saddaddysaddaddy Member Posts: 566
    image
  • saddaddysaddaddy Member Posts: 566
    Im a rippin jenious. That was my first try, and im just learning.
  • saddaddysaddaddy Member Posts: 566
    Ford owner's definition of offroading... j/k


    image

  • h0udinih0udini Member Posts: 118
  • obyoneobyone Member Posts: 7,841
    http://www.web-source.net/html_codes_explorer1.htm

    check under img for a brief description. It's really no big deal.
  • saddaddysaddaddy Member Posts: 566
    LOL, don't steal my thunder.
  • h0udinih0udini Member Posts: 118
    it wasn't very informative. Is there a simple way to explain how to post a picture from the internet in this forum?
  • saddaddysaddaddy Member Posts: 566
    i typed

    "IMG src="URL HERE(http://......)"
  • sonjaabsonjaab Member Posts: 1,057
    From somebody that don't own one !
  • tbundertbunder Member Posts: 580
    jenious, genious= incorrect.
    it's actually spelled- 'genius'.

    also, if those tacos are military issue, why are they bright red? i still have doubts. i just don't see our military using vehicles whose based out of the country that started WWII. the uaw would be having fits if this were true, i'd assume. jmo
  • obyoneobyone Member Posts: 7,841
    regarding copyright infringement. If you have the approval of the owner of the pic, you can post it. If not, well, let's say that it usually doesn't last too long and you'll get a nice email from our host.
  • eagle63eagle63 Member Posts: 599
    what are you really trying to say about the tundra? :)
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Member Posts: 897
    Funny, I was under the impression that Germany started WW2 in 1939. Japan has joined up in 1941. It did, however, start a Sino-Japanese war in 1937 with China, but that's not WW2. Is this what students are taught in history classes in US schools, that WW2 was started by Japanese with bombing of Pearl Harbor?
  • midnight_stangmidnight_stang Member Posts: 862
    Eagle, I plead the 5th. I will concede that the Tundra is dark green. :)

    tbunder, according to uaw.org, the uaw make the Toyota Tacoma. It doesn't say the entire vehicle, but that can be assumed.
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Member Posts: 897
    The world does not revolve around America. WW2 started in 1939. Anyway......
    Nice pix. The story behind the Mall-roader (that F150) is pretty funny too, sad, do you remember the details of it?
  • saddaddysaddaddy Member Posts: 566
    the particulars. I do remember it being pretty funny, though.

    I figured you would have doubts, tbunder. Oh well, I tried. The pics of the ones with gun turrets are still pending. I can't wait to see those either.

    Just an addition for what it is worth, all of the rural mail carriers here in MS are equipped with tacomas for use. Just one way I see the gov't using these trucks, not very important, I know.
  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Administrator Posts: 11,146
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  • lariat1lariat1 Member Posts: 461
    If anybody is interested look up the role of the Ford Family and the Rockafeller family when Germany was building its war machine. You will find that if it were not for those 2 Germany would have had a harder time building their armies.
  • midnight_stangmidnight_stang Member Posts: 862
    Scorpio, I did not say "The world ... revolve[s] around America.", I was trying to clarify things as how tbunder's statement, or our interpretation of it, was not as intended.

    "The world does not revolve around America. WW2 started in 1939." I agree, how did I disagree? Why are you stating the obvious facts? Yes the war started then, but America's involvement was purely economic(oil embargos) and politically oriented until Pearl Harbor.

    lariat1, Don't forget GM too. Also, I am sure Toyota(Toyoda?) had some involvement with Japan's war efforts.
  • allknowingallknowing Member Posts: 866
    sc0rpi0 - You're technically correct, however, the world would not be here in its present form without the US. Consequently, in many respects, the world does revolve around the US (America).

    lariat1 - The Kennedy's were also alleged to be supporters of Germany before the US was involved.
  • scape2scape2 Member Posts: 4,123
    Locker vs LSD.
    Locker is better for Offroad no doubt. Locker cannot help you tow, may help pull but not tow. You have MPH restrictions in your handbook. The locker is NORMALLY an open axle. Do you not know what this means? and you own a 4x4?? Try taking a sharp turn while your locker is engaged and see what happens.. Lockers are useless to the everyday truck user. An LSD is better for towing, hauling and even usefull in pulling. do I need to go into how an LSD works? The LSD would have done just fine in pulling your boat out.. been there, done that..
    Its very obviouse you don't understand HP/Torque curves.. otherwise you would have looked a bit harder at the RAnger..
    I know this is off topic in this room. The straight 6 that GM puts out is very reliable. Are you one of those people whom are caught up in the myth that anything that says T O Y O T A on it is reliable no questions asked? This drivetrain is proving to be quite relaible and potent combination...
  • plutoniousplutonious Member Posts: 799
    is a LSD better for towing, hauling and pulling? If one of your tires is losing traction while towing, hauling or pulling I'd say you have bigger problems to worry about than LSD vs. locker, LOL! And in the case of pulling something and having a tire lose traction, I'd say a locker would work even been than an LSD.

    "Its very obviouse you don't understand HP/Torque curves.. otherwise you would have looked a bit harder at the RAnger.."

    No, I for one understand them perfectly, which is exactly why if I needed a serious work truck, I'd only get a diesel. But for a small compact truck whose towing capacity is very limited, it's not as critical as you make it out to be.

    But for the record, the V6 Tacoma out-accelerated the 4.0 V6 Ranger in that 1998 comparo, both loaded and unloaded. Maybe Ford's newer 4.0 can finally give the Toyota's 3.4 (8 years old now?) a run for its money!

    Whatever, doood!
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Member Posts: 897
    stang, tbunder said "country that started WW2", I'm just clarifying it. There's not a word in there about US involvement, you added that on later.

    ak: The world would not be in its present form without the USSR. Consequently, in many respects, the world does revolve around USSR (Russia). This can be said about almost any country (England for the technological revolution, Spain for inquisition, etc).

    Anyway, sorry for starting this up. Just wanted to correct tbunder. Lets not go deeper into the history of the world.
  • scape2scape2 Member Posts: 4,123
    A limited slip diff works with clutches. When one wheel starts to slip this slipping action engages the other wheel. A locker however is locked in and both wheels turn all the time. A LSD is far less expensive to rebuild and a locker, along with MUCH easier..
    1998 comparison!??? The new SOHC 4.0 will just plain outpower your Toyota 3.4...
    Pluto, you are talking to someone with over 15 years of offroad experience here.. How long have you been offroading? Where do you offroad? What are the classes of trails? name them from hardest to easiest please...
    Plane and simple is my Ranger will get me anywhere you Toyota will go..
  • saddaddysaddaddy Member Posts: 566
    the LSD is more useful than a locker when towind -- not "pulling." Maybe accelerating off the line??? Maybe going around a wet turn, but why should you go that fast anyway, stupid. With all due respect, the BS is getting deeper and deeper. I think I pointed out that the LSD would have done the same in my particular boat situation. I still consider that towing though.

    However, let's say for a second that you are entirely right. That still does not mean that Fords best LSD and Toyotas locker are part of a towing and pulling packages. They are part of the respective OFF ROAD packages of each model. With that said, call it a hunch, but I would believe most people purpose those packages with off roading MORE in mind than towing and pulling. I know that's what I was thinking when I got my truck with the locker. I have said this like 200000 times and you still bring up the same irrelevant point. You said yourself that the locker is better off road, so why can't you see that it is more appropriate in an off road package than an LSD?

    Again, I say: lift a tire off the ground and tell me what happens. I bet you, that if me and you go thru the same spot where a back tire simply lifts off the ground and all three other tires stay on the ground, my 2wd w/ locker would make it as easy as you. Of course, you didn't answer that the last six times I asked it, though. Why would you now? You will NOT go anywhere a locked Toyota will, I am sorry.
  • eagle63eagle63 Member Posts: 599
    no matter how many times he posts his HP/torque curves, he gets the same response. nothing. He just doesn't get it that no one here cares about HP/torque curves. don't worry vinny, I'm just giving you a hard time. although I do question this statement:
    "A LSD is far less expensive to rebuild and a locker, along with MUCH easier.."
    -you're right. but fortunately, lockers generally don't need to be rebuilt, whereas LSD's do.
  • midnight_stangmidnight_stang Member Posts: 862
    "you're right. but fortunately, lockers generally don't need to be rebuilt, whereas LSD's do."

    That is true, but it's easy to see why. Because in any given 60,000 miles, a locker is "locked" for maybe 1-2,000 miles tops. While the Limited Slip probably see's around 30-40,000 miles of use (any clutch wearing incident). Just estimations, but you get the idea.

    Locker, good for off-roading, but not for turning. Good for "pulling boats out of water", but again, nothing over 20-25 MPH, or turning.

    Limited slip, good for always on traction, especially payment and turning/curves in road. Good for towing in general, and pretty much any safe speed.

    Pro and cons for each, just depends on what application you buy and use your compact truck for.

    pluto--->I do not know if you have considered it or not, but the 1998 model 4.0L Ranger has about 47 less horsepower than the current 4.0l. Maybe it is time to retire the review from 1998.
  • tbundertbunder Member Posts: 580
    scorp says the world does not revolve around the U.S. yeah, right bud. and yes, i did misspeak about what country started ww2. i did mean with us, and you knew that. sorry to make my statements so hard to understand. also, if you want to see where simpson college ranks among colleges, check out us news and world report. you'll see its #1 in the midwest.

    pluto- stang has just said it. its time to deal with the present. and that being said, the trd only scores a 3rd place in truck contests.

    anyways, i think im retiring from this board. i am considering buying a mazda protege5, yes a 100% japanese car that is actually built in hiroshima and shipped over. its cheaper than 4x4's, and more functional for me right now than a truck (better mileage, funner, cheaper, and not like everyone else). not to mention it is imo, one of the coolest cars out, with the sportronic auto/man shifter.

    so take your lsd/locker/off-road/whatever discussions we've rehashed here umpteen times over the last 8 mos, and leave my name out of them. its been fun. when i buy another 4x4, ill chime in again.
  • plutoniousplutonious Member Posts: 799
    Ditto saddaddy's comments, scape2. You haven't explained how your LSD helps you tow, haul or pull. I don't see many people's tires "peeling out" and losing traction when they tow, haul or pull, except for maybe on a slick boat ramp when pulling a boat. The locker is even better than the LSD in that situation.

    Just curious, isn't the non-TRD Tacoma available with an LSD anyways? Pick which one you want, then!

    What's my four-wheeling experience? Well, the very fact that you ask what class of trails I drive on tells me you're a recreational offroader. I don't four-wheel for fun, for me, it's part of life. For almost 10 years I've been through the worst, roughest, flooded, dilapidated "streets" in Mexico, and my truck spends 90% of its time on ranches in south central Mexico which resembles a jungle more than anything. There's no way you can convince me a LSD is better for climbing up a muddy, caliche, bumpy hill than a locker. If you want to classify what I've been driving in the last decade, be my guest.

    Stang: "but the 1998 model 4.0L Ranger has about 47 less horsepower than the current 4.0l"

    Wow, so in 1998 the Ford 4.0 was only making about 160 horses, while the Toyota 3.4 was making 190? It's taken Ford 8 years to make a 4.0 outperform Toyota's 3.4? And it only outperforms it by 17 horses? Is that really something to be proud of?
  • scape2scape2 Member Posts: 4,123
    A locker is better for offroading, better than an LSD.
    But, how often will the average person use this locker? Maybe 2% of their total driving time? A locker is only supposed to be used in extreme conditions. Most people don't even know when to use thier locker or how to use thier locker. a limited slip diff has much more use and function for the everyday user. The locker is normally an OPEN axle, do you not understand what this means? Its funny how some will beat thier chests about offroad ability. Yet stats show over 90 percent of 4x4 vehicles barely even see a gravel road. The Ranger offers a nice ride for city streets, yet give you the aiblity to visit your natiional forests, parks.
    plut.. made my point.. I use my RAnger in the Cacade Mountains.. MT Hood, MT St. Helens, Jefferson, 3 sisters.. look them up on a map. I have also been into the Tillamook National Forest area, Coast Ranges of Oregon/Washington. I have been to Lions Back/Utah/Nevada and rock climbed with Jeepers on many occasions(not my Ranger).
    The Ranger is a capaple truck, just as capable as a Toyota. Toyota trucks don't come with some magic potion for offroading. 1998?? Why are we going back into the past? The new 4.0 will out pull/perform/haul the 3.4 in the Toyota. You have to rev the heck out of the Toyota to get any power. The Torque/HP curve on the Ranger is much more aggressive and truck like.
  • midnight_stangmidnight_stang Member Posts: 862
    "It's taken Ford 8 years to make a 4.0 outperform Toyota's 3.4? And it only outperforms it by 17 horses? Is that really something to be proud of?"

    It's important if you like to drag race stock compact pickup trucks. But even you were bragging how the 1998 Tacoma could out accelerate a Ranger. Maybe it's time for a retest? Even you should understand the difference of 30% extra peak horsepower.

    You also forgot that the Ford 4.0l has more torque in either model, clearly a product of it's extra cubic inches. You also forget (or don't know) what a Torque curve (or lack thereof) does for a vehicle on the street with a payload or not. You see peak numbers. I see peak numbers at more truck specific RPM's. I also am a bit familair with the properties of 2valve and 4 valve applications in relations to low, midrange and high-end power production, and of course what good ole cubic inches (no matter how refined you think it is) relates to great power once you leave idle RPM. Someday you won't be as pushy thinking one truck absolutely rules the other in all categories. Either way it's time for a modern comparison, that realizes both pro and cons.

    " I don't see many people's tires "peeling out" and losing traction when they tow, haul or pull,"

    That's true, except when you are driving home and it rains. If you are towing an ATV, or two motorcycles in a trailer, and it starts to pour, which would you rather have to help you take that curvy on-ramp onto the highway? A locker or a Limited Slip Differential? Both have it's applications. Locker for off-roading, Limited Slip for anything with a turn involved.

    "For almost 10 years I've been through the worst, roughest, flooded, dilapidated "streets" in Mexico"

    Wow, that's pretty cool for a 1998 truck that you had owned since 1992.
  • saddaddysaddaddy Member Posts: 566
    Most people don't need a locker, most people this and that.

    MOST people don't buy the offroad package.
    MOST people that buy the offroad package want an off road truck.
    MOST people who buy an offroad package want their truck to excel in that arena more than street racing, handling, and towing.

    Why is that so tough to understand?
This discussion has been closed.