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News to me!
????
Side Curtain Airbags
For the past year, Honda has repeated that they will be offering side curtain airbags (with roll-over inflation), ABS, and other features on all trim levels of their SUVs. The goal is to have this equipment standard by the calendar year 2007.
The second gen Element isn't due until the model year 2008. That means the last year (2007) would have to include this equipment. It's not likely that they would make such an extensive change in the very last year of production.
On a five year design cycle, a Honda will most frequently get a "refresh" for the 4th year. For example, it is expected that the CR-V will get the SE trim this year. If the Element follows suit, it will get this equipment for the 2006 model.
FYI, one owner reported a fire similar to the ones occuring on CR-Vs after an oil change:
http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/crv_fires.html
If you DIY just make sure to clean the area up and make sure you don't double-gasket. Save the receipts, too, no matter who changes the oil.
-juice
Get the automatic transmission and AWD. The manual is tiresome and the FWD is slippery on the highway.
The inside does clean up easily but be prepared for the interior plastics to scratch quickly.
It's a trick I learned watching someone prep a car for delivery (PDI). They use the sticky side of the tape to pick up lint from the seats, so they look spotless (hairless?).
I tried it on the spot where my dog sits, which is between my two kids in the back seat, and it worked quite well. You'd never know I had a dog.
If it's a big dog you might need a lot of tape!
-juice
I've read through many of the forums and it seems lots of people are camping in elements. I just read that the battery is tiny (I haven't looked under the hood at all yet). Is there room for a larger one or additional battery? It seems it would run down with music playing, hot pot plugged into the 12volt, etc.
Thanks very much for any ideas people are willing to share.
Is it POSSIBLE that the "05 Element will have side curtain airbags as an option. I have looked for rumors and have found none, but that may just mean that Honda is really good at keeping secrets. i really think side curtains are important and I would hate to buy the car this month and find out that I could get side curtains in August.
I guess the flip side, is that if I wait until August to find out, and they do not offer side curtains, I will probably have to buy a 2005 model which would be more expensive than what I can buy right now. Does this seem logical?
Thanks for any input. I think I need a shove to help me decide whether to buy it now or wait a month.
Dan
They are.
I would wait for the 05's. If you aren't too picky about color you should still be able to find a 04 somewhere. Honda releases the new models around August-September so it won't be much longer. And even if you have to buy a 05 the price difference shouldn't be that significant. And at least you won't have to kick yourself in the rear later.
-juice
Pitbouv in Florida
The auto shifter lock was due to a throttle body service bulletin. You can pop the platic cover off the shifting housing and use your ignition key to engage your shifter temporarily.
Also, my wife crash tested our Element four weeks prior at about 35mph head on into a guardrail, so maybe this was a delayed reation to the crash for the ECM. She is fine!
By the way I am a rolling billboard for Honda on the weekends. I trailer a 2004 CRF250X dirtbike too! Great SUV, and best dirt bike I have owned in 26 years and 8 bikes later.
Hope some of this info helps!!
Taller springs would help, if any are made, because with an indy suspension that does raise the entire vehicle.
However - keep in mind you have an alloy block, that's not going to like dipping in a cold puddle when it's hot. You're just asking for trouble.
-juice
What surprises me is that stick-shift models seem to be so rare in the marketplace. On a vehicle with such a big fun factor, I would expect to see more.
1. Do I just not know the secret handshake, or do people just not know how to drive anymore?
2. As a purchasing strategy, will dealers compete on a special-order purchase the same as they might when they are selling out of inventory? I am willing to be patient.
You can sometimes get a better price if you order and wait, because the dealer isn't paying interest on that car for it to be in inventory.
-juice
I gave up on manual trannys in the late 80's. It's just too much of a hassle slogging through city traffic nowadays.
-juice
PS. I have noises coming from tailgate hinges (as explained by Honda service), anybody?
Tires can help a lot, FWIW. My Forester dropped a few decibels when I went from Dueler A/T tires to a quiet touring tire.
-juice
Can't have it all. A little more road noise is to be expected.
-juice
Look in the owners manual on cleaning instructions.
You cannot hose out the interior unless you do not care what damage it causes. So, technically, you CAN hose it out just like you *CAN* house out the interior of a Camry.
However, the water will get into and pool in the spare tire tub, rear heating vents, electrical components and so forth. The vehicle was not designed to be hosed out. You can use wet mops, rags, sponges, squeegee etc.. It is much easier to clean up spills than carpet, but just don't hose it out or pour buckets of water in there.
Hosing out the interior is an urban legend perpetuated by automotive journalists who made comments in their reviews without fact-checking first.
yeah they strictly recommend that you swab it down, not hose it out.
I leave my carpet mats down most of the time anyway
Still can't do that in most cars, though.
-juice
I serously doubt any salesman would tell someone that...ah...nevermind, I'm sure some probably have!
People tend to remember the unique, gee whiz features on concepts that make it to production. Maybe that's why the myth lives on.
Sorry to have brought it up!
-juice
Here is my situation - I drive an 4 door Accord EX with leather interior that is a stick. I love the way it drives and it was a real bargain in my book.
Enter new family dynamic. My wife and I will have an infant child joining us this year. We plan a second within 24 months.
I have a one lane driveway. My wife does not (willingly) drive a stick. Her car is a Subaru Outback wagon, LL Bean with an automatic.
By leaving the Accord, I would solve 2 problems - wife-friendly-automatic and a car that sits higher to get infants in and out of car seats.
I have never driven with an infant for any length of time in my Accord, so to be fair, I am not sure if an automatic might be better than a stick for a new father too from a distraction standpoint.
The Element it is but one option. I like that it is a little lighter and seems to drive a bit more aggressively than larger options. It also does seem to retain a degree of FUN.
I resist some others more mainstream options like the Odyssey or Toyota Sienna minivan, or Honda Pilot. I just don't see myself driving something that big -- but maybe with kids you need to make concessions. I don't want to get the Element and then be trading it in for a minivan that I should have gotten in the first place.
The Element has a lot going for it. It has a lot of room for not a lot of money. It has an automatic tranny. Same motor and rough mileage as Accord. Burns regular gets decent mileage. It sits up high. It weights aprox. 3500 pounds instead of 4500 pounds for a minivan - ie better handling and mileage.
The interior seating materials seem essentially kid proof! The inside flooring is plastic for easy clean outs.
To some degree, it seems that the easy clean interior would be less stressful for me. I keep my cars VERY clean - something I am sure will change with kids.
To some degree I could think of an Element more as a TOOL and stress less than with my "fancy" leather clad Accord EX or fancier sport ute like a Pilot or even a Forester.
Here is what I am looking for - car with automatic tranny, high rear seat height so you can lift kid across into car seat instead of
stooping into rear.
This would replace my car. We would keep the Subaru. An Element costs about the same as my Accord did, a bit cheaper. SO I can pick one up for essentially the cost of 2 years of depreciation on my Accord.
Other options considered:
The usual 3rd row minivans from Honda and Toyota, a Honda Pilot
V6 Accord with Automatic (solves tranny issue but not ride height).
Elements are affordable and don't depreciate much, so even if you change your mind, you won't be in trouble, really.
I say go for it, you only live once.
-juice
I have seen several young families in Elements. The height, interior room, and low-maintenance interior make this an attractive option for couples with young kids.
"I have never driven with an infant for any length of time in my Accord, so to be fair, I am not sure if an automatic might be better than a stick for a new father too from a distraction standpoint"
I have had a 2004 Accord EX-L automatic and now a 2004 Accord EX-L manual transmission. I also have a 4 month old son. We bought the automatic Accord (even though we both LOVE manuals) because I was pregnant and we thought it made sense. Come to find out, it doesn't really make that much of a difference because it's hard to reach them in the backseat anyways and if you need to check on them it's better to pull over anyways than to be distracted from the road. Once we realized this we sold our 04 automatic and bought a 04 manual. Love it. We had a 2003 EX-L coupe manual before the 04 EX-L automatic and both of the manuals have way more personality than our automatic did.
The Accord has an OK amount of room for an infant. However, the stroller does take up a significant portion of the trunk. Since your wife has an Outback wagon you could use it for trips to the store when you plan to buy lots of stuff. And the Accord should be more than adequate if you are taking a short trip and don't need that much luggage.
"The Element has a lot going for it. It has a lot of room for not a lot of money. It has an automatic tranny. Same motor and rough mileage as Accord. Burns regular gets decent mileage. It sits up high. It weights aprox. 3500 pounds instead of 4500 pounds for a minivan - ie better handling and mileage."
The gas mileage actually tops out at 26 MPG, maybe even 24 MPG since you will be buying an automatic. The Honda Odyssey gets 18/25. Even though the Element is lighter than the Odyssey, an Odyssey with the 240HP V6 is significantly quicker than the Element and would probably be an easier adjustment coming from a 5-speed Accord.
"I resist some others more mainstream options like the Odyssey or Toyota Sienna minivan, or Honda Pilot. I just don't see myself driving something that big -- but maybe with kids you need to make concessions. I don't want to get the Element and then be trading it in for a minivan that I should have gotten in the first place."
At first we thought that a mini-van was too large. After we had the baby and put the stroller, diaper bag, and car seat in we quickly realized a mini-van was not such a bad idea. So we leased the 04 Ody using Honda's attractive lease program of 24/12,000 for $330 p/ month inc. taxes with no money down. This allowed us to keep our Accord and Civic Si while giving us a baby hauler through the period where he requires the most stuff. If you can spare the extra $$$ this may be a viable option. You get to keep your current cars without losing the depreciation (which in most cases will only be a few thousand less than the total of payments for 2 years on the Ody) and you have a back-up vehicle in case one of your primary vehicles is out of commission due to repairs or an accident. It gives you a couple of years to see if you really need a minivan at a minimal expense compared to buying a new SUV or van. If you are looking at a well-equipped Pilot or Sienna the price difference between those and your Accord would probably cover the cost of the Odyssey.
The V6 Accord would be nice, but again I think you will find the mini-van will be much more convenient during the first few years when you have to haul around everything but the kitchen sink for the baby. Also, with the van if you travel with friends or family there is no need to take 2 vehicles or move the car seat from car to car. And the price I listed above is for a EX with factory DVD so you will have most of the goodies from your Accord + the DVD which could be a life-saver on family trips.
Perhaps a minivan is the most pragmatic solution.
If I just wanted the ride height and did not need to change to an automatic tranny, I am sure an Element with a manual would be fun. Or a Forester XT for that matter!
For those with experience with young families and the Element, how "kid proof" has the interior proved to be?
As for the CR-V - I also really like that vehicle. The problem for me is I am tall and long legged (6' 4" and 36" inseam). I fit very well in my Honda Accord and the Element. The CR-V is strangely a little tight in the front seat for me.
I don't think the CR-V or Element have telescoping steering wheels so that limits what you can do to get the wheel out of the way of your legs. For some reason the Element seems better. Maybe because the seat is higher off the floor?
I think the EPA measurements may indicate the CR-V has more front seat room. But for whatever reason with my tall body, the Element seems to have more.
I also wanted to thank everyone who participates in these discussions. This is the first place I came before buying my Element a year ago and I found everyone's advice very helpful. I love my Element and am convinced that it is the best car available. Period.
Oddly the rear seat has almost too much rear legroom. They could move the front seats about 6" farther back and it would still be comfortable for rear seat passengers.
I've sat in an Element but haven't driven one or spent enough time in one to tell if it has the same issue.
-juice
-juice
I already have many stains on the seats in the E. I have many stains on the seats in our Ford truck. My opinion is that leather is the best way to go. It's actually easier to keep the seats in our Volvo clean because nothing sticks.
The main drawback of the doors is that the front seatbelts are mounted on the back doors, which means you must not only open the front door, but unbuckle as well.
Now that my kids are old enough to climb in and buckle themselves, entry/exit is no big deal except when they close the doors in the wrong order!
Don't get me wrong, I love the E. We feed our cows out of the back, go muddy places, etc. But I might be trading it if Toyota brings the FJ concept out.