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For people, no, the RAV4 is easier to load full of people (and up to 7, vs. 4).
-juice
Steve, Host
-juice
Pete
Cable too tight on emergency brake, causing slight engagement of rear brakes?
I don't think these are the likely cause, since there would be overheating of the rear brakes and an odor; also, once some of the brakes had worn down, there shouldn't be further wear (no contact).
Final (possible) cause - carrying a lot of weight in the rear, if the brake system has an automatic proportioning system to direct more braking to the rear brakes in such a situation.
31k seems awful soon, have them inspect the parking brake to see that it's not stuck.
-juice
Cable too tight on emergency brake, causing slight engagement of rear brakes?
I don't think these are the likely cause, since there would be overheating of the rear brakes and an odor; also, once some of the brakes had worn down, there shouldn't be further wear (no contact).
Final (possible) cause - carrying a lot of weight in the rear, if the brake system has an automatic proportioning system to direct more braking to the rear brakes in such a situation.
Unfortunately it's the braking system that is causing the issue, the "brake force distribution" system or whatever Honda calls it. The end result is more even braking and it seems rear pad wear at an accelerated rate. I hear the rear pads are thinner than the front but don't know this to be a fact. At 31k miles my '04 ACCORD has about 25% left on rear pads and something like 60% front, that's what the dealer is telling me anyway.
I have an 04 Wrangler (hard top) that I'm considering trading for an E. I've done some price shopping, and I put quite a bit down when I bought the Jeep, so I'm not upside down (of course trade-in will vary by dealer). However, I've been reading this board and I see some of the same complaints I was hoping to get away from with the E. Basically, I've recently found myself driving all over the city each day, and the off-road capability I wanted suddenly wasn't so necessary. Plus, I get 16mpg. So I needed better mileage, a smoother quieter ride, and solid reliability. The E seems to fit this bill, but I do see some complaints. In the city highway loops, I always feel in the Jeep that I'm forced to go faster than the Jeep feels comfortable with by the speed of traffic. It's pretty aggressive. I'm certainly not a fast driver, but I'd like to have the ability to keep some of the "pushers" off of my bumper as well. Also, less road noise would be good, as long as I'm at it. I'd like to stay in a more utility-type vehicle rather than give up all my utility and buy a car. Is the Element too much like the Jeep?
If you can wait until the fall (probably late November), there should be a major upgrade to the Element, it's that time in its model cycle.
I am personally hoping to see the following upgrades (the lack of which has kept me away from the Element so far):
1. 5 occupant seating capability (can't have it now because the rear seats are designed to swing up and off the floor to the sides to open up a cargo area). I don't need the ability to haul 5 adults (and the Element's total weight capacity is a measly 650 pounds or so), but I do need the ability to haul a toddler in a car seat, a pre-teen, my wife, and at least one friend - 3 adults (two of whom are small and light) and a couple of kids, plus camping gear.
2. Rear seats slightly closer to the front seats (or which can move forward and back) so the rear seat passengers aren't sitting exactly over the rear axle which is probably the harshest ride position in any vehicle.
3. Upgrade from the current 4 speed automatic to at least a 5 speed automatic transmission like in the CR-V. This would drop cruising RPM and probably help gas mileage, which is 4 mpg lower on the highway (EPA ratings) than the CR-V.
4. Inclusion of stability control like on the CR-V.
5. Inclusion of standard combination side airbags (it's hard to mount side curtain airbags in the roof rails of the Element, but there are a lot of airbags that come out of the sides of seats that also include head protection, presently missing in the Element). Also knee airbags, which are starting to emerge as an important part of the front airbag set (too many reported knee and lower body injuries in many vehicles due to sliding out from under the seat belt and air bag).
6. Inclusion of standard floor mats. Yeah, we hear the hype about washable "hard" floors, but most owners need mats so they or their dogs or children aren't sliding or slipping, plus the hard interior increases the noise level.
7. Modification of the "suicide" rear doors so either you don't have to open the front doors to let rear passengers out (hard to do this redesign) OR repositioning of the front shoulder belts so you don't have to take off your seat belt to let a rear passenger out.
8. Inclusion of a cargo cover, either standard or as an option, for the "trunk."
Now from the list you'd think I don't like the Element, but I like it a lot more than the CR-V we have now (which is boring). I like the clamshell rear hatch; the FCX durable seat treatment; the upright, "look over" seating position; the "illegitimate love-child of a Hummer and MINI" looks; and the passenger car bumper compatible height (lower center of gravity for the Element).
The Element really, really needs some of the goodies that are stock on the CR-V, since there really isn't much price difference - better air bags, standard ABS, stability control.
Now for the real heresy - I'd be perfectly ok if they kept the "box" shape but deep-sixed the suicide doors. The suicide doors add about 200 unnecessary pounds to the vehicle (and increases GVWR), but little functionality. Honda claims you get a wider opening for cargo, but what's wrong with using the hatch for cargo loading? Meanwhile, parents everywhere get mad everytime they have to open their door and unbuckle to get the rear seat passengers out.
I am SO glad I didn't follow my impulses and get an Element when it first came out. In theory, it has a ton of neat features, but when you examine the features, they turn out to be inconveniences in many cases.
What I'd like to see is a new engineering team assigned to the Element, and told to make the Element into a bigger, meaner, MINI - give acceleration, handling, sportiness a higher priority. Ditch the "swing up" rear seats in favor of a solid bench with 3 position seating, but one that can be easily removed for cargo. Keep the FCX, and the floor, but add "padded" floor mats that can be removed and hosed down. Get rid of the "cladding" and adopt the EX-P "fully painted" look.
The Wrangler was much better off road of course, but the added camping gear I can carry with the Element and the seating comfort on the way to the mountains more then makes up for it. The AWD was actually more effective in the snow the in the Wrangler. I even tried to get stuck by driving in the deepest snow I could find, without success. But I had no difficulty getting stuck with the Wrangler in both snow and sand. Of course, I can't really even attempt the same rock strewn trails with the Element that I could with the Wrangler.
Its all a compromise but the Element ended up being the perfect vehicle for me and I highly recommend it.
I was also surprised with the depreciation of the Jeep. I thought it would be pretty good. But you should move soon if your going to sell it because I would guess the value of the TJ's will drop as soon as the 2007 Wrangler goes on sale.
I'm so happy with our Element that I will probably buy another one in a few years.
http://www.hondapartsdeals.com/HondaInstallGuides/Element/foglights.pdf
One suv I am going to look at is the new Suzuki Grand Vitara. Looks like it has a lot of cool features, along with more offroad capability. The only thing that scares me is that the "local" dealer isn't really in a convenient spot for me, and I don't know alot about the quality of the Suzuki. I feel like the Element is probably a better quality vehicle, but I like the features of the Suzuki more.
-juice
-juice
I think what we are going to do (and this could change by tomorrow) is to get the Element, with a hitch installed, and I will buy a utility trailer for the 5 or so times a year I need to haul landscaping type stuff for our yard.
Then when it comes time to get the boat, I will look for a 5-10 year old, V8, regular cab short bed pick up to use only for hauling and towing. This way I get to look forward to buying another vehicle in a couple of years (I am not anywhere near as bad as the people on the Chronic Car Buyer's board, but I still get a rush out of the process).
We have decided on an EX Element, but are now debating whether or not to get the AWD. I am also wondering how much we would miss the sunroof by going with the FWD model. With the sunroof being in the rear instead of the front, I don't think that is neccessarily a deal breaker for us, but part of me would still like to have it. On the other hand, I am thinking if we don't need AWD, we might as well get the FWD and take advantage of the better gas mileage.
Nice to see the ads are no less quirky than the vehicle.
I like seeing Honda take risks, not only with the product but also with the marketing. Their lineup is more diverse with the Element in it.
-juice
Their ads campaigns in the UK have won them several awards. Stuff like Cog, Choir, Hate Something, and a few others have earned critical acclaim. Wish that same ad agency worked here in the states.
And the cool thing was it was a car I've wanted to see make it to the USA - essentially a TSX wagon (euro Accord).
-juice
http://www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=15&article_id=10524
I suggest turning off your CAPS LOCK. People tend to ignore messages typed in ALL CAPS.
tidester, host
-juice
Hmmm!!! :surprise: Maybe this will be based on the new small SUV platform that will also be used on the next-geenration Honda CR-V and the new Acura RDX small SUV's?
Can I also get one without the flat black body parts?
How do you all like this vehicle overall and how would you compare it with the older ( I have a 2000 Jeep Cherokee, 6 cyl 4X4) Jeep Cherokee 6 cyl 4X4's?
Thanks!