Honda Odyssey vs Dodge/Chrysler minivans

kfdmed · January 2005

As a long time reader who has finally let his subscription expired ... they dont know didly. Not cars, lawn movers, or refrigerators. Lets have the same geeks who test toasters test cars. They have the most superficial reviews I have ever read. And please dont bring up there consumer ratings ... the thing I throw out every year. Much too long of a questionere. CR is a joke.

kfdmed · January 2005

You need to justify the amount you paid for your ody ... when you can get the same thing ... for a whole lot less from DC. Were talking close to 6K if not more.

stever · January 2005

Consumer Reports is a well respected publication. Use them (and us, JD Power, MSN, etc.). Then make up your own mind.

People have different reasons to buy different vans, and it's not helpful to berate individuals for making a personal choice.

In other words, lighten up. They're just minivans.

Steve, Host

marine2 · January 2005

Consumer's Report O5

Dodge G/C

02 03

E E Engine

E E Cooling

AV E Fuel

E E Ignition

AB E Transmission

AB E Electrical

AB E A/C

AB E Suspension

AB E Brakes

E E Exaust

Ave AB Power Equip

E E Paint/trim/rust

AB AB Integrity

AB E Hardware

Honda Odyssey

02 03

E E Engine

E E Cooling

E E Fuel

E E Ignition

E E Transmission

AB E Electrical

E E A/C

E E Suspension

E E Brakes

E E Exhaust

AB E Power Equip

E E Paint/trim/rust

Av AB Integrity

AB E Hardware

Neither van posted below average in any catagory

denver5357 · January 2005

"As a long time reader who has finally let his subscription expired ... they dont know didly. Not cars, lawn movers, or refrigerators. Lets have the same geeks who test toasters test cars. They have the most superficial reviews I have ever read. And please dont bring up there consumer ratings ... the thing I throw out every year. Much too long of a questionere. CR is a joke."

Interesting. You criticize CR for being superficial, then state that you throw out the questionnaire each year because it is much too long. I would think a long questionnaire would give results the opposite of superficial. And you throw it out because it is too long? You seem to play both sides of the fence here.

I agree that CR is an excellent source, but not the only one. It pays to check several. BTW, if you don't like CR, what DO you like?

isellhondas · January 2005

When people happen to agree with CR, then,they think the ratings are fair and accurate.

If, however, the car they happen to own or sell get's a bad rating, subscriptions get cancelled and the ratings are dismissed as meaningless.

Me, I happen to think that a lot of it is still subjective and a lot of it is pretty accurate.

Just another source of information for people to read and decide for themselves.

I do know, in the past, I've owned several cars on CR's list of cars to avoid that were just fine.

kfdmed · January 2005

The reviews are superficial. The yearly questionnaire is another issue. Edmunds, car and driver, auto week are three auto resources I find the most informative.

denver5357 · January 2005

"The reviews are superficial. The yearly questionnaire is another issue. Edmunds, car and driver, auto week are three auto resources I find the most informative."

OK, I can see how you are separating the reviews from the questionnaire. But the reviews are accompanied by data, and the reliability part comes from the questionnaire.

jipster · January 2005

I subscribe to Consmer Reports and recently Car and Driver. CR geared more toward the masses and CD more toward the "car entusiast".Both I feel offer informative info...just with different approaches.CR focuses more on comfort and reliability and CD more on drivetrain and 0-60 times.I've read van reviews from each...both some points that I would agree with and some I wouldn't.Some points/issues one omits while the other picks up.

Honda Ody won in C&D's 5 Best Trucks.Though the field nominated was fairly weak(i.e Buick Terraza,Chevy Uplander,Dodge Caravan...NOT the Grand or T&C,Pontiac Montana ,Saturn Relay and the Toyota Sienna.)

denver5357 · January 2005

"Honda Ody won in C&D's 5 Best Trucks.Though the field nominated was fairly weak(i.e Buick Terraza,Chevy Uplander,Dodge Caravan...NOT the Grand or T&C,Pontiac Montana ,Saturn Relay and the Toyota Sienna.)"

Holy smokes, that's more than fairly weak. Almost no one compares the Ody to that subset ... it is always Ody, Sienna, T&C and sometimes Quest. What a weird sorting they picked. BTW, was this rating for the 2005 Ody or 2004? Thanks.

jipster · January 2005

denver,the rating was for the 2005 Ody.Reported in this months C&D.They did not mention any of the other vehicles( I guess it wasn't a full size comparison test). They just kept singing the praises of the 2005 Ody. "the latest Odyseey is just about the only vehicle of its kind that we regard as rewarding to drive." By saying "rewarding to drive"...are they unconsciously implying they were paid off? :-)

isellhondas · January 2005

Sounds like the new Odyssey is a crowd pleaser!

Payoffs? Ah...don't think so! Sorry...

macakava · January 2005

I guess that there was no need to.

C & D June 2004 minivan comparo results:

1.) 2004 Ody(NOT 2005)

2.) 2004 Sienna

3.) 2004 Quest

4.) 2004 DGC SXT

5.) 2004 Freestar

The 2005 Ody would have increase its winning lead further.

hansienna · January 2005

"rewarding to drive" = paid off?

EXCELLENT interpretation.

marine2 · February 2005

Dodge/Honda 2003 compared by C.R. Last year to have data on.

Dodge got 12 Excellents and two above average in 14 different categories.

Honda got 13 Excellents and one above average. I wouldn't call that WAY superior.

macakava · February 2005

C R 2005 Buying guide

Reliability Verdicts

Ody: 1999 rated -(Average)

Ody: 2000 - 2004 rated _/(Above Average)

DGC/T & C: 1999 rated -(Average)

DGC/T & C: 2000 - 2003 rated X (Below Average)

Let the numbers from a large sampling speak for themselves. It is information like this and others(such as C & D, Edmunds, etc) that one can use to make their buying decisions.

hansienna · February 2005

Problem is CR is afraid to disclose the actual numbers and their written material is often contradictory to the test results. It would be very easy for CR to state the actual numbers of each vehicle they list. IF CR provided these numbers, people would be much better informed. As it is, the biased opinion of CR employees distorts the results.

    I read of far more problems with the Odyssey transmissions than DC minivan transmissions here in the Town Hall by real people who own each. I am now afraid to buy a new Odyssey based on reading of the many problems reported in the Town Hall by people who have purchased an Odyssey. My nephew told me his new 2005 Ody EX has a "whistling noise" at speeds 35 MPH and faster.

    Most of the complaints about DC are by former owners who may have had a valid complaint and were not satisfied by DC dealers. Most of these were people who wanted a Honda or Toyota minivan but found that neither provided a serious competitor to the Caravan/Voyager, Grand Caravan/Grand Voyager/Town & Country until the first Sienna appeared about 1997 and the current Odyssey appeared as a 1999 model.

     Funny that none of the dozens of people I know who bought DC minivans have had any problems. Many are now repeat buyers based on complete satisfication with the Caravan/Voyager and later models from Chrysler which is now DaimlerChrysler.

dulnev · February 2005

I'm sorry, but can you please READ my post before you reply to it! I wasn't referring to reliability, but the "quality" ratings that CR assigns TO THE 2005 MODELS!

macakava · February 2005

Many of the problems that are stated are blown out of proportions by the relatively few affected.

The whistling noise problem is history - the fix is a simple one to the windshield cowl area. The transmission problem has been addressed by the recall - infact I would not be surprised if most of the owners affected were towing heavy trailers like a truck does and their vehicle was also not equipped with additional coolers for thr tranny, power steering, i.e. the trailer package.

One has to look at the bigger picture and certainly CR is a source of information as do Car & Driver, Edmunds, etc. I am sure that the numbers of owners CR received feedback from is far larger than the complainers we read in these forums and as such is a more statistically accurate report. Supplying that level of details/granularity of the actual numbers is not practical unless if it were for a PhD thesis and is not much interest to most readers.

hansienna · February 2005

My nephew has not yet responded to my e-mails asking if the Honda dealer has yet eliminated the whistling noise in his new 2005 Odyssey EX purchased November 30, 2004.

I have sent him information gathered from the Town Hall stating the simple fix for the whistling noise and wonder why he has not responded.

mrblonde49 · February 2005

C R 2005 Buying guide



Reliability Verdicts



Ody: 1999 rated -(Average)

Ody: 2000 - 2004 rated _/(Above Average)



DGC/T & C: 1999 rated -(Average)

DGC/T & C: 2000 - 2003 rated X (Below Average)



Let the numbers from a large sampling speak for themselves. It is information like this and others(such as C & D, Edmunds, etc) that one can use to make their buying decisions. <<

I just looked up on the Consumer Reports website (the most current data) and found some differing results than what you posted:
Honda is average (not above average) for 02, DC is average for 03 & 04 (not below average)

I can also report that the '05 DC models have the check mark for recommended next to them as well.

isellhondas · February 2005

Pick up the telephone and call him if you're that curious?

denver5357 · February 2005

"I have sent him information gathered from the Town Hall stating the simple fix for the whistling noise and wonder why he has not responded."

Maybe the whistling noise is preventing him from hearing the ding that tells him he has mail? (tic)

masterpaul1 · February 2005

"Many of the problems that are stated are blown out of proportions by the relatively few affected.

The whistling noise problem is history - the fix is a simple one to the windshield cowl area. The transmission problem has been addressed by the recall - infact I would not be surprised if most of the owners affected were towing heavy trailers like a truck does and their vehicle was also not equipped with additional coolers for thr tranny, power steering, i.e. the trailer package."

Hmmmmmmmmmm! Funny how one judges.

hansienna · February 2005

ROFL. Great response.

hansienna · February 2005

Hard to do without having the telephone number.

marine2 · February 2005

I got a chance to see the 2005 Honda Odyssey today when taking in the wife's Civic for an oil change.

I must admit it is a very nice van. As vans go, I would say it's at the top of the heap as far as looks and has a lot of nice little extras that are not on my Dodge. Looks a lot more classy than my 05 Dodge G.C.too.

Comparing them is a lot like comparing a Caddy to a Buick. It seems like they are priced about the same as they compare a Buick to a Caddy.

While I liked the Odyssey a lot. I am not a bit sorry I bought the Dodge. With already having a car that is less than a year old, I am not interested in paying the thousands more to have a (Caddy)Especially with the features that I have on the Dodge G.C.

My big attraction to the Dodge was the stow and go seats and all the storage space. I never expected to get an AM radio, with both CD, cassette and six speakers with it too. The most I ever had in a car was four and either a cassette or CD. Then I find I have the radio controls on the steering wheel. Another feature I never had. Then the salesman points out the overhead console that not only gives me outside temp. and compass, but a computer that tells me how many MPG the van gets and how far I can go on a tank of gas. Heated outside mirrors, power drivers seat, three way A/C, power sliding doors and power rear hatch. Tire,low air warning light on the dash and power rear windows.

Later I discover Chrysler put a battery saver feature on the van so the battery won't go dead if I don't close the door tight and the over head lights stay on. It saved me from not being able to to pick up the wife two days after buying the van when the grand kids pushed them all on and I didn't notice it for awhile.

Like I say, I think the Honda looks a lot more classy. But with everything I have on this van, the smooth ride and the quietness it has, I feel like I have a Caddy, that I paid a Buick price for and got it with 0% financing. I am a very happy man.

denver5357 · February 2005

I liked the T&C a lot, though I bought an Ody. And I am sure you will enjoy your van.

Thought this was interesting and relevant to this thread in particular ... I assume everyone has seen the new Money magazine (arrived at our home yesterday) where the 2005 Ody is selected as the best VALUE in minivans? I think that says something. True, the "reviews" are very shallow and quick. But the selection as best value is based on a number of factors that combine features/reliability/safety with cost. Our view of the T&C was it might be a better value than an Ody assuming the price was much lower (and it was when we negotiated). But Money seems to indicate otherwise, at least in a general sense (because face it, Money isn't going to have greatly detailed car reviews).

stever · February 2005

Looks like Money said the same thing three months ago:

CNN Money

Steve, Host

marine2 · February 2005

Great article on the new Odyssey in CNN Money and I am sure they are right. I am sure anyone who buys one will be very happy with it.

I will also be happy with what I bought and what I paid. As I said, the stow and go seating was really what I wanted for the way I wanted to use the van and all the goodies that came with it was like icing on the cake for me. If I tried getting many of them on a car, I would be paying many thousands more for them. And heck, it even rides like a car.

denver5357 · February 2005

"Looks like Money said the same thing three months ago:"

Actually, this appears to be different. The link goes to an article where the Ody is picked as the "best" minivan. The article in the new issue says "best value." And the link shows Money as picking the Tacoma in the truck category, while the new magazine we received picks the Ford F-150 (or whatever that is called). I assume the addition of looking at value changed the truck ranking, but it did not change the minivan ranking. That's what I find interesting, the value tag.

stever · February 2005

Heh, I do sort of wonder if they are rehashing a story with a slightly different twist so they have new info to put in the magazine.

But value is different from reliability or performance, etc.

Maybe the new article will show up on CNN in a week or two, and I can rehash my link posting. :-

)

Steve, Host

dulnev · February 2005

marine2, this was a good a well-thoought out post, but what's scary to me is that you've posted probably a 100 anti-Odyssey posts prior to even seeing the vehicle!

marine2 · February 2005

Most of those post had to do with the older Odyssey and what Honda owners were saying about their own vans. When there are many posts out there complain about wind noise, sliding doors that won't close and etc. I don't have to see or drive one to comment on it. I am sure there are people out there that never owned or drove a Dodge mini van but knew about their past reliability and commented on it. Hopefully the problems with the older style Odyssey won't show up on the new ones. Same as I hope with the Dodge.

hansienna · February 2005

After closely comparing one son's 2001 Ody EX purchased NEW and another son's 2002 GC Sport purchased as a used vehicle.

    The 01 Ody has more flexible 2nd row seating, the Magic Seat, and more comfortable seats while the 02 GC is quieter with a smoother ride and has separately controlled temperature for driver and front passenger.

    The 2005 Ody EX is a very nice vehicle and I like the 8 passenger capability plus the location of the spare tire better than the 2005 GC SXT...but the GC SXT has the complete overhead console. Otherwise, the 2 are very comparable.

    If resale value is important, the Odyssey is the winner but for comfort and nice extra features the Grand Caravan wins.

marine2 · February 2005

For me it boiled down to how much I wanting to spend and what I planned on using it for, plus features.

I didn't want to pay out anymore than I had to because of the other new car we had to buy. And I wanted the stow and go seats and storage.

I was always hauling stuff in my Dakota C.C.,but never liked the idea that I couldn't carry more than the smallest stuff inside without it laying in the floor or seats. The truck always looked messy.

I liked my brother's Dodge van when I drove it. But several times I had to help him take the seats out to get stuff in it, when we were moving kids or family and they were really heavy and awkward to get out.

Then some makers came out with fold down seats that I liked, but that didn't take care of not having anyplace to hide stuff like you could in the trunk of a car. I might as well keep the truck. That is until Dodge came out with the stow and go seats. It gave me the best of two worlds. I had plenty of room to carry stuff and gobs of room to hide stuff so my van looked neat and clean all the time.

Then I find out I can stow just one seat, still have plenty of storage and plenty of room to get the three grand kids in and out of the van quickly and have plenty of room for the dog to lay down without him having to set on the seats. I was a happy man. The Dodge van met all my needs. I couldn't ask for anything more.

So I guess it boils down to what your going to use your van for and what you want to always carry in it. If it's mostly to carry people, it looks like the Honda would be the best choice. Great looking van with many features. It just didn't meet my needs. None of the others did either.

hansienna · February 2005

His NEW 2005 Honda Odyssey EX purchased November 30, 2004 still has the "whistling noise" and he was disappointed with the gas mileage on a recent 600 mile round trip.

Why may I be in trouble? YES, I recommended the Odyssey EX as my recommended "first choice" in a new minivan when he started shopping last summer and now I drive a 2002 T&C LX.

jipster · February 2005

Hans....my MPV had a whistling noise when bought.

They said the rear hatch needed adjusting. Which eliminated the noise.Didn't say anything about the roof rack.

dulnev · February 2005

"His NEW 2005 Honda Odyssey EX purchased November 30, 2004 still has the "whistling noise" and he was disappointed with the gas mileage on a recent 600 mile round trip."

He'd be disappointed with the mileage, if he drove faster than 60-65 mph. Driving at my normal speed of 75 mph I get no better than 22mpg in the Touring with VCM!

hansienna · February 2005

Preliminary report was 23 MPG on his trip. After locating the phone number, I called but he has not been home when I have called and has not sent an e-mail reply.

He, his wife, and children love their Odyssey even though the mileage was not as high as he had expected.

merc4 · March 2005

I have a 2005 EX.

I would love to know the simple fix for the whistling noise before it drives me crazy.

Thanks for your help.

macakava · March 2005

Back to the dealer (a recall? I believe) to have the cowl on the hood replaced/fixed.

merc4 · March 2005

I called the service department at my dealer and they claimed that they are not aware of the whistling problem.

Does anyone know the name of a dealer who fixed this problem on a 2005 Odyssey EX? I would like to contact that dealer to find the details of the repair.

macakava · March 2005

I read about a few Ody owners in this forum over the past few months that had this same problem solved at their dealers.

Maybe one of them would come forward. Or Steve, OUR HOST, can trace them.

stever · March 2005

Try an Advanced Search for Odyssey Cowl (or a Google site search like "odyssey cowl site:edmunds.com").

Here's one example:

pdg, "Honda Odyssey 2005+" #3071, 6 Feb 2005 5:35 pm

I didn't run across the TSB number off-hand. Note that the roof rack may be the problem and not the cowl.

Maybe you (Merc4) should just call Honda USA and tell them the problem is well known on the forums but your dealer seems either clueless or intentionally unhelpful.

Steve, Host

merc4 · March 2005

Thanks for the info.

I do not have the factory installed crossbars.

I'll give Honda USA a call.

tmac · March 2005

Here's the quandry: We own a 2001 Dodge GC ES which is fully loaded (leather, heated seats, power doors and liftgate, power seats, everything) with only 44k on it. It's been dealer maintained and is covered under an extended warranty we bought from Dodge when we bot the car new. So far it's been very reliable. Car is in mint condition.

My wife loves driving the Dodge but we're also attracted to the Odyssey Touring. Fold away seats in the Honda would be an advantage for sure. She'd love to have a sunroof. Also more airbags. KBB says the private party resale value for the Dodge is $15k and trade is $12.5k.

Should we keep the Dodge for a while longer or go for the Odyssey?

97xpresso · March 2005

Go for the Odyssey, if you can afford it, because I doubt you will see nothing near the resale values you listed.

badgerfan · March 2005

Well, if you like to blow your money on new cars, buy a new one.

Your Dodge GC is barely broken in and also covered by an extended warranty, and your wife loves driving the car. So why feed money to a dealer for a new van other than that you have the new car itch?

All vehicles lose the most of their value in the first 3-5 years, then it tapers off much more slowly, so if you change now, you have basically maximized your out of pocket expenses for owning a vehicle.

cccompson · March 2005

Keep the Dodge and have a sunroof installed in it with the money you will have saved.

Honda Odyssey vs Dodge/Chrysler minivans

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