Entry Level Luxury Performance Sedans

sweendogy · December 2011

Sounds like you found your next rig congrats. I also like the vw passat, after all it's car of the year . I would suggest you check out the turbo desil -Gets 700 miles per tank, but given your last posts the torque and potential sound coming from the engine might get you sideways. Does it come standard with 18's?

fedlawman · December 2011

Unfortunately, 18" wheels are standard. I would prefer the 17's, which are standard on the TDI. I've never driven a TDI, so I don't know if I would like it or not (the sound quality or power delivery).

Our Volvo is an I-5 and it's not the most refined motor either. My wife is the primary driver and she thinks it's fine, but I don't love it. The VR6 would be a little ($3500) indulgence for the rare occasions that I would drive it.

I also really prefer wood trim accents, but it's only offered on the top-level SEL. The SEL includes Navigation and real leather, which I don't want. Damn packages...

savetheland · December 2011

Yeah, but Passat has absolutely boring looks. The reason we pay extra for premium cars because want have style, comfort and good qaulity materials in interior and most of them perform well too. All those mainstream cars style range from ugly to boring and interior from ugly to cheesy. Nobody mention Volvo S60 so far btw. I find it is cramped.

sweendogy · December 2011

speaking of darn packages - i jsut did a little research and while your pricing on both the infiniti and mb c350 are correct you failed to mention a couple of things-- ONE you maxed out a G37- meaning it has all the options premium, nav, and sports package... but with the MB it was a bait and switch approach - remember they have 2 colors for free paint other colors cost 700bux...sure you added 1k in wheels(need those 18 inchers remember) for your MB-- but where are the nav packages- the leather?- 1200 bux if you want xenon lights, 2700 for the backup and nav, 650 for keyless start..get my drift- these are in the packages you added for the G--

Your Build
MSRP $40,575
Additional Costs $8,660 (this does not include a 700bux paint charge)
Transportation Charge $875
Total $50,110

Estimate Payment (no thanks)

Pricing is powerful -but to prove your point you must be true

enjoy the VDUB
(stay out of the left lane)

fedlawman · December 2011

I optioned both cars the way YOU listed in your post (#12838):
"Price out that nice c350 and see how much it comes out to with leather, a sunroof and 18inxhers."

I then explained that I don't like leather seating or 18" wheels and that the Mercedes I would personally order costs $41,450.

So, how is it on me that Infiniti bundles key features within bloated and overpriced packages? They do it on purpose to FORCE the consumer to spend thousands extra on stuff they don't want. Do you think it's an accident that in order to get the Sport Package, you also have to order the Navigation Package? That's $4000 for a laundry list of stuff you probably don't need and wouldn't have ordered, but you have to swallow it if you want your G37 to handle and stop a little better. :confuse:

So, if I were to buy a G37, I would have to pass on the Sport Package and simply get the Journey + Premium Package for $39,245. That's only $2000 less than the Mercedes. Every buyer has different priorities, so the numbers might be different for others, but for me, the value of the G37 (which is it's strongest asset) has been significantly diminished.

So how did this happen? Mercedes offers the C350 with sport suspension and moonroof standard, and offers the leather and 18" wheels a la carte. This serves the customer - if the customer doesn't want leather or 18" wheels, they don't have to buy them. Yes, if you want metallic paint on a European car, you have to pay for it, but at least you don't have to order the Shiatsu Massage and Curb Feeler Packages to get it.

And enough with the annoying "left lane" remark. In this era of 300 hp family cars and 400 hp pony cars, 328 hp is nothing to brag about. If you really spend that much time in the left lane, I hope you have the decency to check your rearview mirror often. :P

sweendogy · December 2011

guess im in the spin zone.. only 2k less- well yes lawman-(after you option them out the way you want it,)- its 2k less but again i guess i get the leather, the standard keyless start and yes the 700 paint job for free as well-- do i guess the spread is a little more then the 2k you speak of=- o wait i also get xenon lights which are standard on most as well.. please spare me on the ala cart stuff as if you add them up - you want leather well that will cost you, you forgot your previous arguement when you said the G fails to give standard features -- you want paint, you want leather, you want keyless start..your value being diminished is a joke- dollar for dollar-- its 7k in savings as equiped-- hello - thats some decent coin. The other thing you failed to mentioned is trying to find a MB as you want it with leatherette and no options-- good luck-- if you order one you will be paying msrp because you will have to order one.. please do homework because you are in a fight you cant win.. and your aggrument is strongly diminished..

The asian car companies "force" packages on you because it makes production easier-- and in doing so can offer a 328hp car for less.

I would rather you argue the VW passat vs the G25 then this -- please provide true $ for $ - or you will be called out and lose.

ive seen you in the rear mirror a couple of times-- this time on this topic--continue to take vw passat as this topic will pass in 2012.. have a happy new year.

tlong · December 2011

I would rather you argue the VW passat vs the G25 then this

Is the G25 engine harsh, too, or is it more refined than the G37? Isn't the 25 a four-banger?

sweendogy · December 2011

google.com

just came out- check it out

tlong · December 2011

google.com

just came out- check it out

I did that. It's a six and I found this posting when googling "G25 NVH":

"Well I have to say this is a bit disappointing.

I was hoping for a "G30" with a VQ30DD or something, but instead we get a VQ25 that's down a bit on power and still has NVH issues?"

Thanks for the help sweeney! :P

tlong · December 2011

I also found this interesting post courtesy Google:

"In almost every comparison test where there has been a G35 tested against the E46 3 series, it has lost. You stick to thinking that your mad horzepowerz yo! is where it's at. All I gotta say is, I regret not test driving a 328 before I got my G37. I test drove the 335, and that car was utterly amazing, but for an extra 12k more, I decided to stick with the Infiniti. I got my bike for my speed fix. And that is what I should have thought about when I was buying the car. I thought the 328 would be disappointing after the 335 and the G37, but I was wrong. I test drove one a year after I got my G37 and the car drives amazing. The engine feels a million times smoother than the VQ and the throttle is not as abrupt. The clutch is a million times better. It absorbs bumps and imperfections on the road better as well. Other than the obvious lack of horsepower, which any adult really would not miss nor exploit on regular roads, the BMW, in any range of the 3 series, is a dynamically better car.

Every time a comparison is done, same complaints come up for the Infinitis....too much NVH from the engine, disconnected steering, non linear braking, poor clutch engagement...and what do they do every year? Up the horsepower....go figure.

And they do aim it at a certain audience that buys into it that believes that horsepower matter more than anything else."

sweendogy · December 2011

NP -- my guess is they "dumbed" it down for people who are looking for quieter engines and proper cupholders= prob in your wheelhouse then

sweendogy · December 2011

wow google is something-- nice work -my favorite line is "You stick to thinking that your mad horzepowerz yo! is where it's at. All I gotta say is, I regret not test driving a 328 before I got my G37."

good research= does it say anything about the price spread?? any comments on the c350 we were speaking or are you just coming to your boys back with comparisions on cars we are not talking about--

i love the 335== infact im looking for a 2010 335 6 speed with low miles, m package and x drive to replace my g- dont want to buy new because they are way overpriced but can justify used- tell your buddy, yo..

tlong · December 2011

Google is great, yo!!!! :P

sweendogy · December 2011

Your welcome- yahoo is new 2 -love helping your boy but he's out of bullets - keep distracting the agrument it's great. Anyone who Wants to bring the Newley resigned c350 into a comparison vs a g37 I'm ready - bring friends like tlong - quite car lovers no matter the price

dino001 · December 2011

MB and BMW are more expensive for comparable equipment. One could carefuly option those to get somewhat close to G or TL, as long as they can let go some of those luxuries.

However, one of my biggest complaints is 3-seres and C-series having fold-down seat optional (except 328 wagon). There is really no excuse for that - 12K Kia and Hyundai have it standard - there is no excuse. It's all about hitting some arbitrary limit for advertising "starting at..." BS. I know, I have 328 - fortunately it's a wagon, so it has folding seats and sunroof standard, but sedan does not. What makes it worse, I see dealers actually ordering those without folding seats in large numbers. I can only imagine a brand new owner of 50K 335 trying to fold his/her seats and discovering the car doesn't have it. :sick: :lemon:

On many other options, I'm more agnostic - there are merrits to both approaches (bundling and not bundling). I tend to want almost everything, but "experimental" stuff (like adaptive cruise control or variable speed steering), but bundling sports package with Nav is a little too much, even if I would order both anyway. To me it's OK to bundle related items in package, like all convenience, all tech, or all sports. But cross-bundling does sound a little like making a run on customer's wallet, even if some customers would take them both.

For value-oriented people probably nothing beats Acura - you get everything except Nav/technology. I like it, but it does have its limits - front wheel drive base version is one and that ugly nose :lemon:. We still don't have it so bad here - you would have to see a price sheet on BMW in Europe - it's actually a book!!! Proverbial mirrors and steering wheel are optional. Of course, they also have three times as many engine versions, which creates many more permutations, but that's a different story entirely. Not to mention everything costs nearly twice as much (literally - $50K+ 335 would likely cost you almost 100 grand there).

fedlawman · January 2012

FWIW, I don't have a personal stake or emotions tied to this discussion because I don't own any of the cars in this segment. Also, I can research (and maybe eventually purchase) a boring Passat or Subaru Outback for my wife without craving more excitement because I already own an honest sports car that gives me more driving and ownership pleasure than any car in this segment ever could.

M-B C350 Standard features missing on the G37 Journey:

*Sport suspension with electronic control adaptive dampers
*Adaptive brakes with predictive brake priming, auto brake drying, and hill start assist
*14 way power driver seat with power lumbar adjust
*Power steering column
*Driver memory with settings for seat, mirrors, and steering column
*Auto dim rearview and driver outside mirror
*Moonroof
*Wood trim accents
*Rain sensing automatic wipers
*Split-fold rear seats
*Harman Kardan Logic 7 450 Watt audio
*9 airbags including pelvis and knee airbags
*Attention Assist to detect driver drowsiness

G37 Journey standard features missing on the C350:

*Xenon headlamps
*Leather seats
*Keyless start
*Free metallic paint

Please let me know if I've missed anything...

So, my assertion that the G37 lacks quite a few features seems to be valid. But more importantly, did you notice that most of the C350 features are performance or safety related while the G37 features are basically fluff? But to even things up as accurately as possible, let's load them both up as closely as we can...

So, a C350 with added Xenon headlamps, leather seats, Navigation, metallic paint, 18" wheels, and Keyless Start costs $46,440.

Now, a G37 Journey with wood trim, Premium Package, Navigation Package, and Sport Package costs $45,045.

It looks like the Mercedes is $1400 more expensive than the G37.

But the G37 still lacks electronic adaptive suspension, adaptive brakes, and attention assist. Also missing are headlights with adaptive highbeams, curve assist and headlamp washers, split-fold rear seats, knee and pelvis airbags, and rain-sensing wipers.

The C350 lacks DVD playback, Zagat Restaurant Guide, aluminum pedals, magnesium shift paddles, and a Viscous Limited Slip.

Draw your own conclusions - I'm exhausted... :sick:

fedlawman · January 2012

I discovered an error in my research. I'm not sure what I did, but the above described C350 actually costs $48,190, not $46,440. (Edit: the $1750 leather seats didn't get added in)

I also just noticed that when I added the wood trim to the G37, it automatically added the $1200 Technology Package, which includes rain-sensing wipers and pre-crash seatbelts. Since these are standard features on the C350, this doesn't change the math in my previous post.

The increase in the price of the C350 raises the gap between the Merc and Infiniti up to about $3150.

However, something else occurred to me...

Take the well equipped C350 described above and remove the metallic paint ($720), 18" wheels ($1040), and leather interior ($1750) - options which affect appearance only (barely, if at all) and have no effect on performance, comfort, safety, or functionality.

The same C350 now costs $44,680 - a savings of $3500!

Now do the same thing with the above described G37 and remove the wood trim...oh wait, the Technology Package requires the wood trim. OK, lets remove the 18" wheels...nope, they're part of the Sport Package that includes the upgraded suspension. Leather seats are standard, so that's not an option. OK, I hate to lose it, but what about the moonroof? Sorry, it's part of the Premium Package which includes driver memory settings and Bose premium audio.

The C350 now costs $350 less than the G37. Bundles = :mad:

sweendogy · January 2012

What honest sports car do you own?

Nothing wrong with outback - crocodile Dundee drive one for years.

fedlawman · January 2012

Happy New Year fellow enthusiasts!

SRP Lapping Video

fedlawman · January 2012

What trim level and options does your G37 have?

flightnurse · January 2012

Very nice Fedlawman.. I have wanted to get up your way and play on the racetrack. It reminds me of Sears Point errr Infineon Raceway... Does your baby have the 2.3l 4 cyl or a 6 cyl ?

flightnurse · January 2012

Sween has a G35.

sweendogy · January 2012

sweet rig-- love the rear flares at the back corner.

busiris · January 2012

I find it can be a bit embarrassing when you ask leading questions without knowing the answers beforehand.

How about you... Got any opinion on that?

sweendogy · January 2012

embarrassing, ok..

congrats on the new tranny in your rig-- shouldnt you be on a long trip right now?

http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.f24cc96/1!keywords=#MSG1

tlong · January 2012

Sween has a G35.

...the growler....but lots of power and it's a rocket! :P

fedlawman · January 2012

Thanks Flightnurse. I've lapped at Spokane and Seattle and they are great tracks. Unfortunately, I travel a lot for work during the summer months and probably won't get to lap the "great" American road courses (Infineon, Gingerman, etc.) until after I retire.

It used to be a 2.3L, but it's had a few upgrades...

EVO III 10.2 : 1 pistons
EVO III 2.5 crankshaft
EVO III 272 degree intake cam
EVO II 264 degree exhaust cam
Ported/polished cylinder head
EVO III valve springs
EVO III airbox
EVO III Air Flow Meter
EVO III intake trumpets
EVO III 48 mm throttle bodies
EVO III (big green) injectors
Gruppe A 2 piece 50mm exhaust header
EVO III lightweight flywheel
Powdercoated intake plenum/valve cover
Oil pan baffle
Z3 1.9 (short) shifter
Bilstein Sport Shocks/Eibach Springs
Eibach strut tower brace
Supersprint center resonator and muffler
17x8 BMW Style 5 two piece wheels
215/40-17 Pirelli PZero Nero tires

sweendogy · January 2012

indeed i do- back when i bot only 3 cars had similar power. one was the TL (we all know how I feel about the looks) the other was BMW 335. Price was my deciding factor. 4 years 29k miles- no problems except replacing pads at 20k which i thought was real early. 15mpg in the city also tough.

it is a rocket= but sounds like a tank according to my 95 year old grandfather.

edmunds helped me with the decision -
http://www.insideline.com/infiniti/g35/2007/comparison-test-2007-2008-sport-seda- ns.html

fedlawman · January 2012

Some reviews have said that the MY 2006 3.5 was smoother than the current 3.7 - that the bore and stroke job added a few horsies, but apparently increased the harshness.

Also notice that the peak TQ rating for the current VQ is only 9 higher than the MY 2006 car and occurs 400 RPM higher. Peak HP is up 30 but it arrives 700 RPM higher.

Robbing from Peter to pay Paul is a tuning trick the manufacturers use to raise the HP on paper. The rated HP is higher now, but a sacrifice in midrange grunt is the trade-off.

busiris · January 2012

Actually, my daughter is on the road with the car at this very moment, and since it's her car, well...

I elected to take the start of the New Year off and veg around the house...

nyccarguy · January 2012

He's actually got a 2.5 L 4cyl E30 EVO M3.

nyccarguy · January 2012

I love the pix & the video of your E30 M3!

I never realized how ~~cheap~~ competitively priced the new C350 really is. Built My Own C350 & it came out to $45,350 with standard paint, mb text, lighting pkg, & multimedia pkg. If you put the same options in a C250 Sport, it comes out to not that much less. Now MB doesn't give me a "row your own" or AWD option.

I quickly built my own 335xi w/ 6 speed stick, leatherette, metallic paint, sport pkg, 18" wheels, NAV, cold weather, & Sirius. MSRP $50,925. Now when the new ~~320i~~ 328i comes out with the turbo 4, this might get interesting.

Someone made a comment about special order BMWs. Yes, here in the northeast dealers stock mostly what people walk on the lot to buy (328xi with auto, premium, cold weather, nav). Ordering a BMW does not mean paying MSRP.

fedlawman · January 2012

Thanks NYC, I'm glad you enjoyed them! If you explore my Youtube page a little, you'll find a few helicopter videos I made with the new camera I got for my birthday last month. I'm still experimenting with it so they're a little rough...

Yes, I was very surprised to discover how much value is actually in the C350. Pretty cars, and impressive performance and safety too. I would never actually buy one though - too much technology to fail a few years down the road and too expensive to fix.

I am excited about the upcoming 328i though. I've never really liked the E90, but this F30, with significantly more power (torque!) and less weight, has the potential to be a real game changer. I predict it will steal a lot of 335i sales and be THE sales and value leader in this segment. I also think it's much better looking than the E90. And following current industry trends, it should also be less expensive than the E90.

If options are anything like the 2011 model, a base model 6-speed MT with a moonroof and heated seats (a la carte!

) should sticker for between $36K and $37K.

Do you think my wife will like it?

sweendogy · January 2012

http://www.edmunds.com/mercedes-benz/c-class/2012/road-test2.html

Review of the mb coupe. They also mentioned the robbing Peter to pay Paul of the engine. Would love to read a comparo test in sedan with the group.

kdshapiro · January 2012

This is the game one plays when comparing a German manufacturer vs a Japanese manufacturer.

One can either see what a given price point gives or option the vehicles as nearly as identically as possible and see the price difference.

The 350 is a classier car, but the G37 is definitely the value leader not giving up anything in performance to any other car in this segment. There has been a lot of discussion on the NVH at wot of the G37, I could care less as long as the thing goes, when I step on the gas. The enthusiasts will nit pick everything.

Different strokes for different folk. I do like the 350 and maybe will look at that as my next car.

fedlawman · January 2012

I agree with you completely KD. That's why I said the other day that it's not a fight with a winner and loser, but a circular discussion with no end.

I really like the G37 too, and agree that in Journey Trim, it's the performance value leader of this segment. Personally though, if I was shopping in this segment, I would want my sporty car to have an equal measure of luxury.

The European cars have the secret formula. Stylish and luxurious cabins, smooth powerful drivetrains, and sublime ride and handling. Infiniti is close, but not quite there.

carnaught · January 2012

I agree with you completely KD. That's why I said the other day that it's not a fight with a winner and loser, but a circular discussion with no end.
......................................The European cars have the secret formula. Stylish and luxurious cabins, smooth powerful drivetrains, and sublime ride and handling. Infiniti is close, but not quite there.

I agree with you but in saying this, you've kept the endless circle going. Can't we agree to disagree, the "different strokes for different folks" attitude, and just move on?

fedlawman · January 2012

It's the journey that gives me happiness, not the destination.

flightnurse · January 2012

Very nice Fedlaw the engine growl is just right when WO, I remember when these car came out, I just graduated college was making great $ and went with the MB 190E 2.3-16 with a 5 spd manual. I wish I still had that car.

If you ever have a change get down to Laguna Seca there is NO track like it...

flightnurse · January 2012

I have test driven a new C350 coupe, my only issue is the "sport" package isn't that much sport.... If MB would do a real sport package and place a manual tranny in it, I think they would sell more.

So now I'll keep my 2011 328i with M sport package and 2005 330is with the ZHP package.

flightnurse · January 2012

I have ordered two BMW's, one was my 2005 330is with the ZHP package and did the Euro Delivery option. Of course I saved 10% with that option.

My partner and I ordered our 535i two weeks ago for delivery at the end of April for a Euro Delivery. Price was tenitive but we saved roughly $4300 and delivery date wont be know until middle of Jan.

fedlawman · January 2012

We're the same age flightnurse. I had a buddy in college who's dad had an MB 190E 2.3-16. He kept it for a year and traded it for the next FOTM car.

The E30 M3 and 911 were my two dreams when I got out of college. Unfortunately, I was a poor Army 2nd Lieutenant in 1987 and couldn't afford a $35,000+ car. I had to settle for a Honda CRX Si.

Would love to lap Laguna Seca. My brother is in a club that laps Willow Springs and I have vowed to make a pilgrimage down there one of these days as well. The challenge is fitting my track wheels, jack, jack stands, brake fluid bleeder, etc. in my tiny E30.

Do you attend HPDE's?

sweendogy · January 2012

Agree lack of a manual in big engine form is negative - certainly enthuiaists like yourself. I would also argue that lack of awd in big engine form will also hurt north east sales

busiris · January 2012

I agree with your comment on paying MSRP on ordered BMWs... I have special ordered every BMW I have ever owned and never paid MSRP.

sweendogy · January 2012

Living up east in a big city with only a few BMW dealerships (2)within 10 miles and given its clientele I cannot see the local dealerships offering great deals on a new model 3 series for 2012. When you talking about not paying MsRP does that mean your getting it for 500 less or is it 3k less? ( this is not a "leading" one, so you should be ok) how many special orders have you had?

nyccarguy · January 2012

special order BMWs:

My Dad special ordered an '04 X5 & then an '07 X5. Both deals were $1000 over invoice.

My Mom special ordered her '05 530i & then her '08 328xi. Both a good deal as well.

shipo · January 2012

I've "Special Ordered" both of my BMWs as well, one for delivery here in the U.S. and one for European Delivery; both were had for about $1,250 over dealer invoice.

sweendogy · January 2012

NYC and shipo thanks.
I think my hesitation with buying German special order is the overpaying factor. My 4 new cars, 3 have been Japanese one a VW so I was all about the deal when buying new. I think Paying MsRP or close to it is for suckers- its good to see you can get a decent chunk off when special ordering.

markcincinnati · January 2012

Maybe it is just the congestion caused by all the high-school and college students home for the break, but here in our somewhat small city, Cincinnati, it is approaching impossible to be able to actually DRIVE (meaning the car is moving at a speed higher than 20MPH) unless one seeks a rural route.

Now, me, I go to and from work 5 days per week, travel the 200 mi RT between Cincinnati and Columbus once per week and sleep late the other day. I do not (and really don't plan to) "track" my car (never have).

So I go through German and now Japanese "luxury performance sedans" one after another -- ordering upsized wheels/tires, sport packages, sport seats, sport suspensions, whatever has sport in it. I used to fight the good fight and order cars specifically so that I could get manual shifters. I chipped my turbo cars, changed out the air filters and BPV's to squeeze out any additional power I could (from the turbo's of course).

For what?

A quick dash to 35MPH, before I had to abruptly mash the brake pedal or rear end the guy parked on the highway in front of me! That's what.

I read the reviews of the new BMW 328 (with the turbo 4), and I really got excited (for about 9 minutes) when I saw the acceleration figures -- but then I thought, "I probably can't even use that much power on the entrance ramp to I-71S" (I'd rear end someone.)

Nevertheless I continue to want more -- I want my cars to be ever quicker (they're already fast, even the puny ones can go 130MPH, which is where many of the Germans place the "limiter") even though it is hard to imagine regularly (or frequently) being able to enjoy the ever quickening acceleration from the Americans, Europeans and the Japanese.

I want ever larger and sticky-er tires, firmly sprung and electronically controlled suspensions, the whole enchilada -- and for what, the one time I can carve that corner (without fear of hitting a deer in the headlights -- literally Bambi.)

I have become irrational about the performance -- I want more more more, whereas traffic and circumstances of urbania and even sub-urbania allow less less less -- of the cars I drive. Perhaps that is why my fondest memory (and my all-time favorite car) is of a 1995 Audi S6. At least, way back then, I could actually slip the car into first gear and rapidly release the clutch and floor the accelerator without rear-ending the guy in front of me being my first and foremost thought.

Now I am driving a car that is as fast as any on this board and faster than many. Moreover, the thing is capable of holding its own in quickness too. Good luck in being able to actually enjoy the performance.

Yet, with 31 months to go on the lease, I am wondering -- what will be quicker, sticky-er and have more technology next time?

Completely irrational.

I'm thinkin' the evolution of the new BMW 3 (in the next 30 months) or the G from Infiniti (and possibly another Acura) or maybe back to my old love, Audi will provide more more more. By then, however, I'd imagine that an occasional sprint to 55 or 60 will seem "freakin' awesome!"

Drive it like you live (or rather, as you would like to live).

:confuse:

fedlawman · January 2012

Mark, great post (as usual). We're all in the same boat, but we're enthusiasts so we want the potential, even if we can't use it.

We live for the occasional empty decreasing radius onramp (and we know where all of them are located within 12 miles of home), and we want to have the torque to squirt through a gap in traffic when we're stuck behind a LLC. Like owning a jetski or an airplane - we can't use it all the time, but when we do, it's a blast.

But your reasoning is sound. That's why I would even entertain the option of owning a Passat or Subaru - ELLPS power and cockpit, but without the brand cache and chassis prowess that I can't use.

BTW, my company car is a Chevy Malibu, so M-F, onramps and the occasional bare stretch of road don't have anything to offer me but temptation. When I'm on my commute and happen to see someone in a 993 or worse, an E30, it just makes me wish I was in my personal car...which I do drive to work occasionally just for the fun of it.

Entry Level Luxury Performance Sedans

Comments

Helpful Tools

Most popular vehicles