Edmunds dealer partner, Bayway Leasing, is now offering transparent lease deals via these forums. Click here to see the latest vehicles!
Honda Odyssey vs Dodge/Chrysler minivans
This discussion has been closed.
Popular New Cars
Popular Used Sedans
Popular Used SUVs
Popular Used Pickup Trucks
Popular Used Hatchbacks
Popular Used Minivans
Popular Used Coupes
Popular Used Wagons
Comments
The 240 HP, 242 ft-lb engine alone puts the Odyssey into a different class. The 3.3L 180 HP, 210 ft-lb V6 on the GC eL seems more in league with Windstar or the GM minivans.
Among other things not found standard on the eL:
-5-speed automatic transmission
-Convenient folding 3rd row seat
-Standard lap&shoulder seatbelt in all positions
-Seatbelts with switchable locking retractor for convenient carseat installation.
-Standard side airbags with automatic child disable feature
-Standard 4-wheel disc brakes with traction control
-Standard 5-star crash results in all NHTSA tests, a "Good" rating in the IIHS offset crash test, and a 4-star rollover rating with the highest SSF of all minivans.
For our money, there are enough other differences to make it an easy choice. Sure, there isn't 3-zone air control, a trip computer or padded armrest, but different things are important to different families. Your mileage may vary, obviously. Good luck with your choice.
There are quite a few features that the DC vans have that also do not appear on the Odyssey.
The Infinity sound system is really great. The Odyssey sound system is Windstar category.
How about the roof rack ? You need a step ladder and a torx bit to adjust the ODY roof rack. The heated windshield under the wipers, the auto door locking at 16 MPH, and the adjustable rear window wiper are all features I wish my ODY had.
I have rented many DC vans newer than the 96 I owned. There have been many improvements in the DC vans over the 6 years. Competition helps us all. I would like to take the best features of the Odyssey and DC and make one van with all the best features. DC should do the styling.
One other thing I have noticed common to the ODY and DC (and 1 Windstar), under full acceleration, all will spin the front tires on dry, level pavement. The limiting factor on max acceleration from a stop seems to be the tires. I never had any complaint with the 3.3 L engine in the 96 DC van I owned entering Interstates, passing, etc.
Like I said, everyone will obviously have different priorities for their money.
I thought Carleton1's comparison was too simplistic. Hopefully, anyone comparing the two vehicles will do careful research on their own instead of taking our words for it:-)
It's not as if he hasn't driven a 2001 Honda Odyssey EX or a new 2002 Honda Odyssey EX-L Navi to REALLY decide which fits his needs better.
You value the Honda name, the good reliability, and the good safety, and if everyone only valued those three things, people would only be driving the Honda van, BMW/Mercedes/Acura/ SUV's, Volkswagen Passats and so on. Not a bad thing at all, because they are all phenomenal vehicles in my opinion, but there are other cars out there for a reason.....choice.
If he chose the new T&C for padded armrests and triple zone air, more power to him, because he was given the freedom to do so.
I'm not so sure about that, caviller. Carelton has driven more of these minivans with different powertrains than just about anyone here on this board. He has driven two Odyssey's with both the 210hp and 240hp VTEC V6 engines, a Grand Caravan with the 158hp V6 and a new 2002 Town & Country with the updated 180hp V6. And I'd be willing to bet that if you asked him which was the best engine, he would tell you that they all have their high and low points.
Yea, sure, the Odyssey has a 240hp V6 for 2002 vs the 215hp found in the Chrysler minivans. According to many reviews, the Odyssey does not have very much low end power and takes some time to get going, which cannot be said about the lower horsepower Chrysler V6s. I bet the "puny" 156hp 3.3 V6 in my 2000 Town & Country could beat a 2002 Odyssey off the line. But as for racing with a 240hp Odyssey above 60mph, that's another story...
My point is, just because Honda has a 240hp engine in it's van doesn't mean it totally leaves the competition in "a different class." That 3.5 V6 has its high points and low points just as everything else does. And as for features, there are a ton of features that Honda doesn't offer that DC minivans do. Mostly in the comfort and convienence departments.
Where can I find a stock Odyssey with heated memory drivers seats, steering wheel radio controls, adjustable foot pedals, suede interior, heated windows/mirrors galore, power liftgate, tri zone climate control, power center console, trip computer, and more all wrapped in beautiful sheetmetal? Keep looking my friends, keep looking...
-Adam
However, what I liked most in Ody is 'wider front window' and 'wider side mirror', which gives me a better command of view. This is a kind of unexpected surprise. I am really happy with the new car. On the other hand, what I missed are 1) automatic door lock over around 15 MPH, and 2) dual temp control for front seat passenger.
Well, G.Voyager was also a nice car, and I liked it a lot, especially for the first 3 years. No issue there. Strangely enough, though, all the troubles came out after the 3-year warranty expired. Is the vehicle programmed this way?
My 99 Odyssey does cruise real smoothly at 80, with plenty of acceleration left (I have had it over 100). I have 51K miles on it, and it runs just like it did new.
The EX that I have does have audio controls on the steering wheel for it's puny (relative to a DC Infinity) sound system The LX did not have the steering wheel audio controls in 99, at least. That may have changed in later years.
As I have posted, I owned a 96 DC and have rented a few newer ones. I have to say that DC has addressed one of my complaints about the 96 on the newer vans. The head lights are so much better now.
I completely agree.
"It's not as if he hasn't driven a 2001 Honda Odyssey EX or a new 2002 Honda Odyssey EX-L Navi to REALLY decide which fits his needs better"
I never said otherwise. In fact, I repeatedly said different things will be important to different people.
"You value the Honda name, the good reliability, and the good safety,"
Please don't put words in my mouth.
Actually, 'Name' does not factor into my decision at all. I think brand loyalty and perceptions are overrated and often misleading. We've owned a Subaru, Chrysler, two Saturns and two Hondas in the last 10 years or so. All have been good vehicles. I'd buy any one of them (or any other) if it met my needs.
As for reliability, please reference any of my previous posts where I have stated that I don't think there is much difference among most new vehicles.
You are correct about safety, however. It is my #1 priority in a vehicle purchase.
"and if everyone only valued those three things, people would only be driving the Honda van, BMW/Mercedes/Acura/ SUV's, Volkswagen Passats and so on. Not a bad thing at all, because they are all phenomenal vehicles in my opinion, but there are other cars out there for a reason.....choice.
If he chose the new T&C for padded armrests and triple zone air, more power to him, because he was given the freedom to do so."
I agree. I'm glad there is choice, it only makes the competition improve. Again, I never said or implied otherwise.
In fact, I'm glad Carleton1 posted what was important to him. It's nice that I have the freedom to post what is important to me, also. Now anyone reading this forum as part of their research gets both sides. Everyone wins.
Cheers.
Point well taken. In fact, I have not driven any of the 2002 models. On the other hand, I did find the 2001 Odyssey LX to be much peppier than the 3.3L 2001 GC I drove (test drive and rental). Consumer Reports did also, incidentally. The 205 HP Odyssey (EX) beat the 3.3L 180 HP Sport by 0.1 second from 0-30mph, 1.5 seconds 0-60, 0.6 seconds 45-65, and 0.9 seconds in the quarter mile.
Please keep in mind that Carleton1 was comparing the Odyssey LX to the GC eL, which does not have the 215 hp 3.8 V6. If you do find any comparison showing the 180 hp, 3.3L 180 HP GC beating the 240HP Odyssey off-the-line, please post it. Those are the models we were comparing.
I did not mean to imply the eL did not come with ABS. Also, my information was from the Dodge spec sheet on the Grand Caravan, as it said the eL had rear drums ( http://dodge.com/pdfs/caravan.pdf ). Apparently, the T&C has slightly different specs than the GC. It also showed that the GC eL did not have traction control.
I don't necessarily doubt your claims about acceleration. If you do find comparative testing from any auto mag that shows the 180 hp 3.3L in the Grand Caravan eL (or equivalent) to be faster than the 240 hp 3.5L in the Odyssey LX (or EX), please post. I test drove the 2001 models, where the Odyssey had an engine with less power and torque than the current Odyssey. As I posted, my findings did (this time) agree with Consumer Reports.
Congrats on the new vehicle, BTW.
I'm not sure if you thought I was implying you bought a Honda because it was the posh thing for minivan owners to do nowadays, but I just assumed you bought your Odyssey with the intention you were making a very wise decision with a great product, which would be a Honda. But I can understand your take on the whole brand loyalty thing.
I guess I am a little two faced though, because I think of myself as mostly a Japanese car kind of guy and usually think little of many of the American cars I see on the road.
I've had Toyota's for the past 21 years (All completely trouble free which is amazing) and I just got my son a new Honda Civic. I keep on buying Toyota's and Honda cars because I know I'm getting a good product from a solid name. And when I say solid name, I don't mean that out of snobbery. People don't buy 200,000 + Accords or Camry's to look cool, they buy them because it's a Toyota or Honda product, no questions asked. (My opinion of course)
The reason why I don't stop buying Chrysler vans is because of I guess a little brand loyalty, but also because now that I know what you can get on Chrysler vans but not on Honda or Toyota vans, there is really no incentive for me to switch.
I got hooked on Chrysler because in 1988, there was basically the King of Minivans - Chrysler or the Ford Aerostar. My first Chrysler van was in 1988 and I haven't looked back since. Until something catastrophic happens that would make me loath Chrysler forever, I suspect I'll keep on buying there vans for a long time to come.
A lot depends on how advanced the AWD system is. The simplest AWD systems have no locking or limited slip mechanism in any of the differentials. With such a system, you can get stuck just as easily as a front wheel drive vehicle. More advanced systems add traction control or limited slip differentials, and thus more wheels must lose traction for you to get stuck. Better AWD systems should always be better than a front wheel drive vehicle, traction control or not.
I don't know the details of the system on the T&C, but quality snow tires or chains on a FWD vehicle (preferably with traction control) should do very well in all but the worst situations.
Our Odyssey (stock Michelin Symmetry all season tires) does very well in Chicago snow, but it is very flat here. Even so, our Subaru Outback gets going much quicker in unplowed or slippery areas. Our Outback does have a slip limiting mechanism in the center and rear differential, so three wheels must lose traction for the vehicle to spin and get stuck.
Also see:
Traction Control vs. Versatrak
AWD vs Traction Control
I cannot remember the specifics of how the system transferred torque fore/aft and left/right, however, that system (currently in use on the DC MiniVans) is one which is capable of (as the Subaru ads say), “Transferring the power from the wheels that slip to the wheels that grip.” That said, an AWD MiniVan from DC is superior to ANY FWD MiniVan (regardless of manufacturer or traction control options) when it comes to motivating it in snow or slippery conditions.
Best Regards,
Shipo
Without knowing the exact details of an AWD system, it would be a pretty large assumption to know how much better than a FWD+traction control it might be.
The company that designed the Chrysler may be very good. On the other hand, even Porsche was known to make a vehicle now and then that wasn't up to the standards most people expected (914)...
Come on man, give credit where credit is due. There is not one single FWD MiniVan in the world that can move through snow or other marginal traction environments as well as an AWD equipped DC MiniVan.
Best Regards,
Shipo
You may have inferred that, but I did not imply it. In fact, if you read back a bit, you'll notice that we did own a Chrysler (Cirrus) and thought it was a decent vehicle for the most part.
With regard to the AWD, I admitted that I did not know what type of AWD system is in the Chrysler minivans. Without knowing that, I find it hard to make a conclusion like:
"There is not one single FWD MiniVan in the world that can move through snow or other marginal traction environments as well as an AWD equipped DC MiniVan.:
You are probably right, but it may not be as big of an advantage as you indicate. To answer the original poster's question, it would be nice to know what type of limited slip device (if any) is in each of the three differentials. If it is similar to Chrysler's Jeep Quadra Drive system in all three differentials, I'd be very impressed. Maybe they use something similar to a Torsen in the center and rear, that would be impressive also. Even a computer-controlled hydraulic system like on some newer Audi and Subaru models would be very good. On the other hand, if there's simply a viscous limited slip in the center differential with nothing in the front or rear and no traction control, I wouldn't be very impressed. Better than FWD and traction control perhaps, but not much.
I stand by my claim that a FWD vehicle with traction control and quality snow tires will do the job in most winter conditions. For hilly areas like the original poster mentions, a good AWD system may be necessary. Maybe that applies to the Chrysler minivans, maybe not. Perhaps one of the Chrysler advocates can provide a link to the details of the AWD system they use?
I chose the Odyssey because of it's size, safety ratings, and standard equipment. I also need the extra power. I live in the mountains about 30 miles east of San Diego. My home is at 2100 ft. elevation. At least 4 times a week I drive to and from sea level at highway speeds (70 mph here). The last hill into town rises about 900 ft in a little over a mile. (In fact, just going to my friend's house on the other side of our little town is a +/- 800 ft. elevation change). I needed a van that, fully loaded, could get me up the hills without getting run over. The Odyssey is that van.
I am very pleased with my choice and am glad you are happy with yours.
I can remember in 95 on our trip to Yellowstone in a Chevy 454 pickup pulling a 29ft. 5th wheel getting behind those oh so slow now DC original style mini vans who couldn't get out of their own way. Here I am weighing almost 15,000lbs. and I could pass those things. To this day I think that is the main reason I don't care for DC vans. Stupid, I know, but some things are just hard to change. If DC vans prove out to be more reliable than past ones and I'm in the market for another van and they have on board navigation I will try to deal on one even though padded armrests do ME no good and triple mode heating I would never need.
Steve
Host
SUVs, Vans and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards
Steve
Host
SUVs, Vans and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards
Steve
Host
SUVs, Vans and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards
One reason we bought the Odyssey is because we live so far from Home Depot, etc., that whenever we needed to buy anything large, we had to take the car and the truck. We needed something big and attractive. Getting the DVD player that my daughter (and husband) can watch without my having to listen to it was also a plus.
The Odyssey is not "over-hyped." It is a very good vehicle with some very positive features that are not matched by any other van. This does not mean that it is the best for everyone or even the best overall. The same thing can be said for DC vans. It all depends on what you're looking for.
Also, Chrysler is still offering its 100,000 mile warranty if you have any concerns about the long-term reliability of a Town & Country...
-Adam
http://carpoint.msn.com/browse/win_4020964.asp
-Adam