Subaru Crew Problems & Solutions

ateixeira · May 2001

The inside would be a mulchy mess when I returned it! ;-)

I may borrow your trailer. Could not find used ones and new ones are twice what I expected. Let me plan a few days off so I have time, and I'll let you know well in advance.

-juice

rsholland · May 2001

juice. Just let me know.

Bob

erics6 · May 2001

I brought my Outback in on Monday and drove it with the Ron, the SOA Western Area Dist. Service Operations Manager. I was able to reproduce the pinging noise. He thought it was in the drivetrain/transmission area. Possibly the rear differential. (Obviously not engine pinging if that is the case.) The dealer found nothing loose under the car. They reset the computer as well. Later that day, Ron drove the car and hooked up his laptop to get data for the engineers. So... I guess I'm back at square one - except the pinging type of noise may be in the transmission/drivetrain instead of the engine. If the car isn't pinging, something is occuring when the car is driven at moderate load on a steady incline. Any thoughts?

Eric

ateixeira · May 2001

That complicates things. I've heard of metal shavings (even chunks) in differentials, but I think that would sound different.

-juice

paisan · May 2001

Nope the Impreza uses the headlights, but is easily overcome by disconnecting the ballast under the hood

-mike

kens · May 2001

Strange -- if it's not an engine problem, then why did they reset the ECU?

Ken

erics6 · May 2001

I asked them to reset the computer because of the other problem I was having - after the MAF sensor was replaced the engine started to shake at idle. (I don't think they had done that after replacing the MAF sensor.) Not sure if reseting the computer has helped at all, since I haven't had a chance to drive the car much. Ron talked a lot about fuel issues related to summer/winter gas. That was before deciding the pinging type of noise was coming from the drivetrain area.

vincer2 · May 2001

soon2bsubie,

The engine on my 2000 OB will not start if the factory alarm is triggered either from vibrations or from trying to start the car when the alarm is armed.

Vince

sibbald · May 2001

O.K., I know you hate it when we say this but, in Canada, DRLs have been in place for many, many years. I don't know what it costs in extra replacement bulbs (have not replaced one myself), but I do know that I am more visible to the other drivers on the road and like it or not, they save lives.
incoming........

pattim3 · May 2001

Hi! We do not use break in oil, so feel free to change it whenever you prefer.

Patti

pattim3 · May 2001

Good Morning. Actually, Ron is a great guy and he's very strong technically, so you're in great hands. The data stream that he downloaded on his computer will be reviewed by our technical engineers and they will see what is causing the ping. I'm sure it will work out okay for you. Keep us/me posted. I'll try to give Ron a call today to see what he thinks.

Patti

pattim3 · May 2001

They do run at 1/2 power of your regular lights, but I always drive with my lights on anyway. I'd rather be seen and in our '90 (which we drive the same way), we have always driven this way. We've only replaced a bulb once.

Patti

paisan · May 2001

Hey Patti, maybe in future DRL applications, you could suggest that SOA use a system similar to the one used in the F-body GM cars and the Corvette as well as canadian DC products. This uses a very bright yellow parking light, instead of the headlights. Also could I suggest that the rear parking lights be added to the DRL package. If those aren't acceptable, could I suggest that the headlights turn off if the driver turns on his parking lights? Just some ideas.

-mike

francophile · May 2001

I'm ambivalent about DRLs. On the one hand, the added visibility of oncoming vehicles in daytime is an obvious improvement. On the other, many of the DRLs I've seen can produce glare even in the daytime, and there must be a safety loss associated with that too. I also have started out in the dark in my Legacy only to later realize that I was driving by DRLs only, without having turned the headlights on, and that has to have a safety minus attached to it as well.

I like Paisan's idea; DRLs of a different hue, behind the turn signal lenses perhaps (they can blink when the turn signal is on, why not). As for DTLs (daytime tail lights), eh. If you do that you might as well leave all of the lights on all the time. A better idea IMHO would be a rear fog light as a standard or optional feature on more cars.

My Peugeot used to automatically reset the lights to low beams when they were turned off, thereby eliminating the problem of high beams being on under those conditions where the lights are on to improve other drivers' ability to see me. I always thought it was a fine feature.

Cheers,
-wdb

ateixeira · May 2001

50% power is fine. It's the early ones at 90% on high beams that bother me.

-juice

paisan · May 2001

Also what about the implications of DRLs in fog? I know when it's foggy on a few occassions I've ran with only my parking lights on for safety sake. With DRLs they could potentially be dangerous in such conditions.

-mike

lark6 · May 2001

Generally I don't like DRLs but if you live far enough north of the equator (or south, for that matter) they can be helpful where daylight is limited. Hence I can understand why they've been in use in Canada for so long. To paisan's point, if GM can take advantage of FHI technology why not vice versa? Use the Corvette DRL setup.

As for rear fogs I'm all for them. You only have to get around people's misperception that the driver is hitting the brakes. I live in a river valley (the Delaware - very near where I-95 crosses the NJ/PA border) and it gets foggy here often, even in summer, so I think they'd be handy. I've seen the rear fog light setup on UK-spec Foresters and I think it looks pretty elegant - I wish it was legal and available here.

Ed

paisan · May 2001

Some sort of rear light would be nice to compliment the DRLs if you must have em. Ed, I know the area well, used to comute Philly->Staten Island 2x a week when I was in school in philly. For a while (before I95 in PA got full of troopers and NJ was still a double nickle state) I would run up I95 and over to route 1. Now I just do the NJTP to Cherry Hill route when I have to go to Philly.

-mike

rsholland · May 2001

A different hue for DRLs would be a very good idea.

Bob

kens · May 2001

I'm all for a rear fog light. When I'm driving, I'm more worried about the people behind me than in front. They would be handy even when driving in the rain at night.

Ken

rsholland · May 2001

are good.

Bob

erics6 · May 2001

Yes... Ron seems to know his stuff. He honed right in on the drivetrain noise, once he heard it. I'll be using the car this weekend so I'll see if the computer reset helps with the shaking issue. My biggest frustration has been the dealer not clearly communicating what has been done to in attempting to solve the problems. For example, I wasn't told by the dealer that Ron hadn't been able to duplicate the noise (when he first drove the car last year), until just recently. I don't know if the computer had been reset before either. I realize it's difficult for SOA to get dealers to do this though. I do appreciate how responsive SOA has been.

-Eric

nygreg · May 2001

Could the noise possibly be an exhaust issue? Some catalytic converters will make a rattling noise when they fail, or maybe some rust is in the exhaust pipe. Acceleration and a slight slope might be consistent with this. Just a thought. Hope it's fixed soon for you.

-Greg

megawatt1 · May 2001

First time writer - great info here!
RE: DRL's - would like to have a way to "flash" headlights to other vehicles - the present setup in the '00 Outback does not allow shutting off the headlights in any switch position (I know I can pull up on the parking brake lever, or flash the high beams which is not always a clear signal) but would prefer a better solution.

nygreg · May 2001

megawatt! Join the chat tonight.

-Greg

ateixeira · May 2001

Welcome, Ralph. Join us tonight for our live chat if you can. It runs every Thursday from 9 to 10pm eastern time.

We'd love to hear about your scooby.

-juice

yerrot · May 2001

Hello- I just want to post my tale of woe and see if anyone has any thoughts?! I've had rubies for 10 yr and have been driving clutch for 15+...
At 3200 miles my 2000 BB wagon's clutch failed-- unclear reason(much fingerprinting)-- it was replaced under warranty. It continued to have shaking of the stick asp in low gears and in reverse intermittently and never seemed to change gears smoothly. I wasn't happy with the first dealers sac so took it to another at 7500 miles who agreed with me and again replaced it. It did much better after that although never has been perfect (or I'm too hypervigilant), and over the past month or so has started having a groaning/flunking sound intermittently in low gear/reverse in addition to stick shudder.. Sigh... Just took it to a third dealer at 14 I (the second closed) who says the problem is not with the clutch but rather that the transmission oil should be changed (for US$ 260).
I'm taking it to a private shop tomorrow for second opinion. Has anyone heard of any probs like this? I'm wondering if there is just some misalignment that they haven't been able to fix..
Thanks!

miche4 · May 2001

Now that I have my pops and the oil changed, I was wondering about getting the windows tinted in the 2001 Forester S. Has anyone had their windows tinted? I was wondering why the Forester did not have tinted windows. Any recommendation? mich

originalbitman · May 2001

I did my 00 GT wagon and am scheduled to have my 01 done Monday. Had Madico Autolux on the 00 but they stopped making it. Too bad as the color was licensed from RayBan... very nice. Going with Madico Onyx now. Best thing is to find a good installer. I got mine through my Soob dealer. YOu can also call other dealers and see who they recommend. I did all windows and moonroofs except the windshield of course.

Here are a couple of online resources:

http://www.angelfire.com/nd/tint/

http://www.autowindowtintings.com/main.cfm?action=home

bit

ateixeira · May 2001

yerrot: the price seems a bit steep just to replace the tranny fluid. Plus, the original stuff has to last at least 30k miles, probably more like 60k. I would call SoA to change it for free (however, I do agree with the dealer's recommendation to change it early).

Mich: I have a 35% tint all around. It's not that dark, but helps reduce glare and keeps things cool in the summer. 20% tint is darker and looks better, IMO, but check out both and see what you prefer. Mine was $170 for dyed tint film, the metallic stuff costs more. Ask to see an installation and make sure it's bubble-free and the edges are tucked in.

-juice

originalbitman · May 2001

I did 20% on the rears and moonroofs, 50% on the fronts. Going limo on the moonroofs this time.

bit

dnickel · May 2001

I did 28% all around - metallic (Formula One - Millennium) looks good - I didn't want to reduce my night visibility so at this level you can hardly notice looking out the window. Looking in you can still see in the car (it's not blacked out) but it tinted enough to look good. Nice heat reduction in the summer. Metallic has better optics (esp at the darker levels)

evilizard · May 2001

Go Metallic, it doesn't turn purple and bubble 5 years down the road. Better heat reflection (it reflects some energy as opposed to absorbing it all) and you get a slightly mirrored look (depending on darkness). I had 35% done all around with 20% on the moonroofs on my wagon. You should be looking at around $200 for quality stuff with a quality job. Moonroofs are extra.

kens · May 2001

Had all the rear windows on my Forester done with a 20% Madico metallic tint and love it!

http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1013602&a=12601901&p=47108787

Ken

miche4 · May 2001

Again, thanks everyone for the window tinting information. In Anchorage I only had one business that does window tinting. I have a black Forester so Kens picture really sounds great. mich

hammersley · May 2001

My OB is tinted, but has some scarring & the color isn't great... how much more trouble (aside from the obvious peel job) will a retint be?

Cheers!
Paul

originalbitman · May 2001

Ken - That's Madico Autolux right? They don't make it anymore. The replacement is called Onyx and is metal but like many new metal tints it is not reflective and is gray rather than Rayban greenish. Bummer.

Paul - The hardest part is the defroster wires in the rear window. Could get damaged in the removal process.

bit

nematode · May 2001

I found one dead mint low mileage in 1991 and had the cash all ready within 1 week and then I find out that some scrub bought it out from under me. At the time that was my dream car and this car was perfect. To date, it still makes me sad....but not too sad because I ended up saving a little longer and got a 1990 (91 first production year) 3000GT VR-4 (high mileage).

pattim3 · May 2001

Good Morning!

Do you have a case with us yet? If not, please call 1-800-SUBARU3 and speak to one of our Reps. Please tell them that I want to know about your case file and identify yourself as one of our Edmunds family.

I look forward to looking into this with our Rep.

Patti

mav61 · May 2001

Hello, I am new here and came across this board while doing research on Subaru engine ping, a condition which I have had since I purchased my 01 Forester S AT last July. I have a case number with SOA #266749. My experience with Subaru on this issue has been extremely frustrating and I am very dissapointed with SOA, Subaru of New England and the dealership, Car Mart Subaru of Wilmingtyon, MA. At 14,000 miles I am now at a point of either trading this vehicle or submitting a lemon law claim because Subaru refuses to aknowledge this condition as a defect, rather now calling it an "operating characteristic" My engine ping can be severe on long hills but mostly is just there in the background while accelerating and after the car downshifts (anytime under a load). It is more pronounced when the car is at operating temp and in warm weather. I have tried all different brands of gasoline and octanes. The dealer replaced the timing belt and tensioners at 2500 miles to no avail and has recently used a solvent to try to remove "carbon deposits". They akcnowledge the noise as sounding like octane ping but have no solution and SOA tech support claims this is not a problem, they know some engines exhibit this noise, have taken these engines apart at 100,000 miles and found no damage, etc, etc....

I do not understand the relationship between SOA and the local New England manufacturers rep but to date I have been unsuccesful in arranging a face to face meeting with the district technical manager. I finally received a call in mid April from the dealer saying the manufacturers rep wouldlook at the car and I would have to drop it off on April 25th or 26th. (I asked but for some reason they also said I could not be present while the rep drives the car). Unfortunately the day they schuduled was at a time I was out of town so I had to go through SOA to let them know the date was no good but the first week of May would be OK. I am now still waiting to hear back. No one at SOA can provide me a phone number of this MFG rep so I can speak directly with him/her and set up a mutually convenient time /place. Why the dealership has to act as a middleman and conduit for the MFG rep is beyond me and this process simply delays everything. I also do not understand why I cant be present to meet with and drive the car with the tech rep to point out and discuss the problem, as I did with the dealership tech.

Sorry for the length of this post but overall, I am very dissapointed with Subaru on this issue. From my research I know that a number of others have expereienced this problem with similar stonewalling by Subaru. In some rare cases people have had "countermeasure" pistons installed under warranty to correct the problem but I dont know if this was for older models or engines...my dealer knows nothing about these. In any event, it is a known fact that consistent engine ping or knock is a bad condition which can result in piston damage and premature engine failure. A brand new vehicle should not exhibit this condition or "characteristic". By the way this is my first Subaru. Any opinions/assistance welcome......thanks

p0926 · May 2001

Paul- Check with a reputable tint shop. I asked the tech when he installed mine and he said that it isn't difficult to remove. I'd go with a metallic film if/when you retint, most manufacturers will guarantee them against peeling and fading.

-Frank P.

locke2c · May 2001

Mario,

I agree with you that in no circumstances should an engine that pings (detonates) no matter what remedies are tried should be considered "normal operation". This is a modern, computer-controlled fuel injected engine! If the problem can't be resolved externally, it's clear to me engine disassembly is needed and parts will probably need to be replaced. Let's assume worst case-- after everything external to the engine is checked and eliminated of suspicion, then I would feel very confident that a new engine would solve the problem. Is an entire engine needed? Probably not, no.

That said, I am very confident Patti will be able to get you started on the right path. Her dedication is pretty remarkable and we all appreciate her assistance.

-Colin

supersoob · May 2001

Mav61 - I have a '98 OB and '01 OB. Don't have any pinging in the '01. The '98 is another story. However the situation you refer to ("countermeasure pistons installed under warranty...") seems to be prevalent in the '97, '98 and '99 model years.

locke2c · May 2001

He can't rev it up. I'm not going to look back at the previous posts to see exactly what post # it was, but I suggested basically the very same thing and Eric's reply clearly indicated to me that he can't reasonably avoid this. Shifting the automatic manually to work around it shouldn't be "the" solution.

Knock and pre-ignition are not the same thing. Take 30 minutes some time this weekend and read this:
read me

-Colin

francophile · May 2001

Within the past week I have seen the word "ping" applied to an apparent transmission problem, a piston slap problem, and maybe even to what it really refers to, pre-ignition of the fuel/air mixture when an engine is operating under load.

Color me confused :-)

Cheers,
-wdb

locke2c · May 2001

point made, but Mario's problem is indeed detonation judging by this comment:

My engine ping can be severe on long hills but mostly is just there in the background while accelerating and after the car downshifts (anytime under a load). It is more pronounced when the car is at operating temp and in warm weather.

-Colin

kens · May 2001

bit -- I don't remember exactly what the name of the tint was, but I do recall the shop owner telling me that the tint has a cool "Ray-ban" like look to it. I'm guessing it's Autolux. Too bad they discontinued it -- I scratched the film on one of the rear windows when I was putting my snowboard in the back. I was wanting to have that replaced, but sounds like now I'll have to get the entire back re-done.

Ken

kens · May 2001

Patti:

I'm taking my Forester in today to Carlsen Subaru in Redwood City to have that tranny whine checked out. I've given them the case# I was assigned. I'll keep you posted.

Question -- can you find out what kind of grease is supposed to be used for the ball-socket at the base of Subaru manual shifters? I'm referring to the end of the shifter opposite the handle that pops into the center console.

Ken

locke2c · May 2001

I backed into a friend's truck back in December, most of you probably don't even remember. I didn't post pics but I will show some before & after. For those that saw my car in the photo gallery, yes it's on the right side. ;-)

Anyway, I waited through the winter to see if anyone would hit me. Nope...

I got estimates in December from $950 - $1200. This week I went again, and a bodyshop I've used before is fixing the fender, painting the fender, bumper cover and fuel door, doing a paintless repair on a dent below the rear side window, AND prep & painting the sideskirts for $1100 including tax. Schweet!

It goes under the knife 5/21, probably have pics by Thursday of that week. I can't wait to see the car without the (lightly) wrinkled rear fender and with body-colored skirts instead of flat black.

-Colin

vincer2 · May 2001

Mario,

I've had several recent posts on engine pinging in my 2000 OB. The pinging/knocking with my OB is almost identical to yours. I left the car with the Subaru dealer this past wednesday and asked them to drive it for a few days to listen to the pinging. I spoke with them today and they have acknowledged the "rattling problem" and are working on it. They also acknowledged that it is not normal and can and will be corrected. They should have the problem corrected today by making various sensor adjustments.

I'll post the corrective action after the problem has been fixed. Don't get frustrated with your Forester because its a well engineered vehicle. Unfortunatley you've encountered quite a bit of difficulty in making arrangements for problem resolution. Hopefully Patti can provide some assistance to you.

Patti, since engine pinging seems to be somewhat of an elusive issue for Subaru Service depts is there any chance of publishing a tech bulletin on possible corrective actions?

Vince

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