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Pontiac Grand Prix 2004 Redesign Questions & Comments
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Comments
Gradual change from the old Pontiac and the company can be a success. Rapid change to NOT even a bit like the old Pontiac, and they risk losing the old customers AND not appealing to the new target group.
I prefer cloth for comfort reasons, but if it looks cheasy, I'd go with the leather.
Thanks.
http://photos.yahoo.com/amulay2003
i posted up more pics. someone wanted pics of the cloth seats i believe. cant really think of any more pics to take but let me know if anyone wants to see anything.
http://photos.yahoo.com/amulay2003
thanks for the pics
And don't dismiss it as anti Detroit gibberish, it was glowing on the Pacifica in the same issue. Does GM have anything in the works to go against the Pacifica and Ford Freestyle? I don't think so, the Malibu Maxx is too small. GM, at the front of the Detroit pack at the moment, is going to fall behind if it doesn't!
http://www.cadillac.com/cadillacjsp/futuremodels/srx/flexibleutil- .html
The Pontiac people did a little presentation on one of the Universal sound stages. They brought in some guy from I think Motor Week to sing the praises. For comparison, they also had an Altima and something by Chrysler (an Intrepid?), but both were locked so you could only compare the outside.
To demonstrate the much talked about pass through and folding front seat, they lugged in a mini kayak. Then they took us out to a test track and had everyone put on helmets (supposedly for safety, but I'll bet it was just done to help get us in the mood of being real life race car drivers... right!)
Then we each got a quick two tours around the track. On the 2nd spin they told us to try the tap shift, but this didn't do much for me.
Then they brought us back to the soundstage and gave everyone coupons for free gas and a Pepsi six-pack.
My impressions of the event: hard to find... they did not post signs to where it was very well. Also, a LOT of waiting for the bus to take us back and forth.
My impressions of the car: not bad, but it definietly did not knock my socks off. The interior that everyone seems to like seemed rather plain to me.
It's a nice car, and I may buy one if the price is right. In fact, I'll probably compare it to the Altima and Accord Coupe and buy whatever costs less.
(Florida or Hollywood?)
I think Chrysler's the American on the move. There's something queintessentially (?) American about the Magnum, sort of Viperlook for the family. Ford shamelessly apes VW/Audi in its next design wave. Should be no surprise there, J Mays came from Audi, didn't he?
Except for Caddy's, GM's efforts in the other divisions have been weak and has developed no discernible design theme.
Chrysler's doing right to make a fresh start. Pacifica, Xfire & Magnum don't look anything like recent Chrysler offerings. Whereas I'd say new Malibu and GP look too much like the ones they're replacing!
Automobile is generally the most critical of the Big Four mags, towards all manufacturers, and therefore more credible also.
http://photos.yahoo.com/amulay2003
johnclineii: i couldnt agree with you more about how motortrend picks their car of the year (although the new G35 coupe is one great car). they put WAY too much emphasis on the car's significance in teh market.
1) looks too much like the previous Grand Prix and too much like a Grand Am
2) the competition in sedans now is way too stiff.
Anyway - I expect to (at least I'll try to) check this site before I leave for the evenet tomorrow AM. So: any specific issues I can check for anyone - poste here?
- Ray
Owned a '97 GTP w/Thrasher pulley and Magnaflows . . .
http://www.thecarconnection.com/index.asp?article=5833&n=157,- 180&sid=180
Anyway – on to the car. They had 1 car to display and Craig Singhaus (of Motorweek) gave a marketing pitch. I was able to crawl in and around it for a while.
Then on to the 4 cars and a low speed ‘handling’ course. I believe that these were all early production cars – as opposed to specially assembled one. All were GTPs with the Comp. Group / WS6, moonroof, and leather.
We were allowed 3 circuits – there was no place to exceed maybe 40 mph without mowing down a BUNCH of cones. I chose not do risk that. We had to wear helmets – affecting the ability to judge NVH.
So -
Power – Good power at these low speeds. Very smooth. Very easy to smoke the front tires at launch – over half those I observed driving did so – some quite dramatically, given the tight course. (This is with the standard traction control on - interesting.) Further, I expect that the 3.29 final drive comes into effect here. I believe this may lead to variation in published 0-60 and SS ¼ mile times depending on the level of expertise of the driver in launching high torque FWD automobiles . . . The Motorweek “road test” (update of the preview that aired a while ago) quoted the GM 0-60 time of 6.5 seconds, but made no mention of further performance numbers – no quarter mile time / speed.
[Possible S/C pulley swap? Looks like the same basic set-up as ’97 – ’03. Meaning a quick, easy, cheap 20 – 30 hp increase will likely be available for those willing to risk possible drivetrain warrantee issues.)
Trans. – As has been confirmed, the TAP paddles upshifts by pressing either paddle forward. In ‘(M) manual’ mode, you can start in either 1st or 2nd gear? Smooth shifts. TAP paddle positions swung beyond the noon / 6 positions in this tight course – and they were ‘in motion’ during much of the run. Thus, I will need more seat time to judge some aspects of their use. [Sadly, the GP is not a Grand Prix car – where full lock is typically not much more than 90 degrees!] The fact that the TAP allows a forced upshift at WOT at less than red line is a plus compared to BMW’s Steptronic, for instance.
Ride – no real opportunity to judge – see below under noise.
Handling – Overall: Responsive. ‘Rotates’ well. 225/55 BF Goodridge Comp T/As howled under high load – but hard to tell how they would sound under normal (umm . . ) “brisk” street driving. Again, further, real world test drives will certainly be required.
Steering – Again: responsive. Good feel, given conditions.
Interior –
Overall, the interior impressed me with a good overall presentation, logical and clear control and display placement, excellent legibility, and very good quality of materials. The climate control offers flexibility – 2 intermediate positions on the rotary knob between each of the 5 primary / main Mode settings – for fine tuning. A good design.
DIC: much improved in display and flexibility / functionality from the one in my ‘97. Several personalized settings possible. Trans. temp can be displayed, for instance.
?? “18 HUD functions?” I see 17 listed in the “Getting to know your 2004 GP” guide (from page 12) = Vehicle speed, high beams, turn signals, 8-position compass, secondary PRNDL, outside air temp., TAP up/down gear position & Upshift ISO, Radio station frequency. Single CD: track number, Multiple CD: disc number and track number, Cassette Active, Check trip computer, Cruise Set, Traction Control active, Traction control off, Stability control active, and Stability control off.
Room:
Front seat - fine (though understandably a bit tight with a helmet on).
Rear seat – sitting behind myself (6’0” and about 225) there was probably only reasonable room for someone 5’6” and 175. And toe space was very tight, as I typically drive with the seat lowered as far as possible. OTOH, I could probably have adjusted the driver’s seat somewhat to provide a bit more room, if necessary. And again, all cars I examined had the optional moonroof and a possible impact on headroom. The fold flat forward passenger front seat, that produces a sort of desk – including the mesh / netting found on the seat back as a mechinism to hold the things I often just toss into the passenger seat, is quite an interesting and useful feature.
Comfort –
Front seat excellent – bolsters felt more supportive than in some other cars that look like they ought to be . . .
Rear seat – probably OK for people of, say, 5’ 6” to 5’ 9” tall - though a fold down armrest would certainly be useful – and this seems rather an odd omission.
The traction control can be turned off – and so can the Stability system – according to the information I see. But there have been instances (the new G35, for example) where the traction control system cannot actually be completely disabled.
Noise – Again, NVH very hard to judge given course and helmet. No visible or audible problems with the section of the course that including several tacked down tire tread ‘bumps’. Structural integrity seemed ok – particularly given the huge hole you can open between the trunk and interior.
Styling – Well, this is clearly VERY subjective, I acknowledge. But now that I have spent a while around several of these new cars, here is my reaction. This is an attractive car. The lager rear spoiler as well as the quad round exhaust tips and the grill inserts available as RPA-s all further enhance the appearance, in my view. The red painted calipers look terrific through the wheel spokes – but may be a cleaning nightmare.
But then, I’d probably replace the exhaust with a Borla, Corsa or Magnaflow a.s.a.p. anyway . . .
Conclusions –
It was certainly great fun to toss these cars around with someone else responsible for replacing the tires! BTW: I checked 2 of the front left tires (clockwise circuit) for wear – and they looked to be holding up rather well to the abuse.
The new GP is clearly a large step forward. Though I’d love to see 300 + HP and TQ, a six speed trans. and AWD, I suppose that is not likely now anytime soon. They have addressed several of the reasons that I did not buy a new GP when the time came to trade my ’97 GTP. I will drive one or 2 when the time comes to trade.
If anyone has further questions, post and I’ll try to answer – but it also sounds like new GPs are hitting some dealers.
Enjoy, all!
- Ray
Who probably made a mistake by taking a ride in a NASCAR stocker at over 165 mph
No this is the first dealer I have gone to with this wheel condition. I am curious to see how the public will react when they order cars with this package and find out they have to shell out an additional $595.
http://www.mpt.org/motorweek/carofthemonth.shtml
After contemplating the CTS and GP, I am close to pulling the trigger on a very good lease deal for a CTS. While the new GP is very nice and sporty, I already had a 98 GP, so I'm looking to try something different.
BTW, one of the dealers was willing to do GMS pricing with their in stock 04 GP's already!
I agree it seems funny but it's all in what is available from regional managers. Market share plays heavily on allocation of units. Also what I ran into is the smaller dealers refuse to dicker on price. The big dealer sold me my GTP at invoice. The unit sticker on my GTP is $30,370. Now if they could just put the damn car on the train and ship it I would be happier.
Does anyone know why GM has taken the Grand Prix off of the order selection web site for dealerworld. Now we have no way of finding out what patterns are available for build. If someone can get a new link to it please post it. It was a very usefull tool.
The old site is http://eogld.ecomm.gm.com/NASApp/domestic/vehiclesel.jsp?regionID- =1&divisionID=7# But it does not have GP on it
http://eogld.ecomm.gm.com/NASApp/domestic/proddesc.jsp?butID=1&am- p;regionID=1&divisionID=7&vehicleID=238&type=0
I've read the comp-G suspension is quite a bit rougher than the regular GTP. I've driven the comp-G and it does seem rough. But I can't find a non comp-G model to test drive.
Want to order or locate a car ASAP, but am hesitant since I can't test drive the plain GTP. If the ride quality is the same, I'd either go with a GT2 or suck it up and spring for a loaded Comp-G since I really want the SC engine.