I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today!

fintail · February 2013

Saw an oddity today - ~70 Eldorado, light green metallic with white top, faux landau bar attached, looked to be in decent survivor condition.

Also saw the local old lady who drives what I wager is an original owner 560SEC. She's tiny, and sits insanely close to the wheel, I shudder at the thought of an airbag deployment.

hpmctorque · February 2013

Our show was this month.

Have a great trip!

hpmctorque · February 2013

Not a big error. Your reputation remains untarnished. You probably have bigger things to think about than I do.

hpmctorque · February 2013

I've seen that one too, in the Cabin John parking lot.

fintail · February 2013

Oh yeah I didn't ask - going back to the home country?

tjc78 · February 2013

Fox Body Continental (85ish) this morning. Baby blue with navy cloth top. Looked well used and sagging in the back.

They are certainly a rarity these days.

andre1969 · February 2013

Years ago, one of my grandparents' friends came to visit her while I was there. She wanted to show off her new car (well used, but new to her), a Cadillac Cimarron.

Well, Granddad wasn't around, so he couldn't comment. Grandmom looked at it, and didn't know what to make of it, until her fried showed her the badge. Grandmom didn't know what "Cimarron" meant, but she definitely recognized the Cadillac crest.

I swear, Grandmom actually sounded genuine when she exclaimed "Wow, a CADILLAC!! You did better than me, I just have a Buick!"

But, a little later, after her friend left, Grandmom said to me, with a disappointed look on her face, "Is that really a Cadillac?" and when I told her yes, she said that she looked even more disappointed, and said that she preferred her Buick. I think whatever mystique the Cadillac nameplate had ever held for her was dashed on the rocks at that point.

hpmctorque · February 2013

Your Grandmom's reaction must have been typical. That said, I wouldn't mind owning a nicely maintained Cimarron now, to take to car shows. It'd get a lot of lookers, comments and questions.

ateixeira · February 2013

A conversation starter for sure.

andre1969 · February 2013

Funny thing is, in looking at the pictures of them today, I have to admit a weird sort of attraction to them as well. They're actually not bad looking little cars. It's just that it's so blatantly obvious what they're based on. And it got even worse in 1984, when the Cavalier went to quad headlights and the eggcrate grille.

The Cimarron sold pretty poorly, but I wonder if GM still managed to turn a decent profit on them? They were pricied a lot more than a Cavalier, but there really wasn't anything about them that made them much more expensive to build. They had nicer interiors, to be sure, but it was still just a Cavalier dashboard. And all the power stuff was optional on the other cars...if not a Cavalier, certainly a Starfire or Skyhawk. And finally, all the exterior differences were easy-swap items such as header panels, taillights, etc.

Mr_Shiftright · February 2013

An absolutely "mint" Chevy Beretta parked on 42nd st. in New York City. What was the last year they made those anyway? This car looked showroom new. Didn't they stop making them in the mid 90s or so? Must be somebody's baby, with a very $$$ little garage.

texases · February 2013

Thanks for reminding me - I saw a Cimarron yesterday, first one in years. Driving, so I don't know how it looked inside, but outside looked good.

Poor Grandmom, sad when that happens. Article in today's WSJ about that same thing, but with sports figures.

fintail · February 2013

The styling wasn't bad either, really. The Cavalier itself wasn't a bad looking car, fairly crisp, wagon looked decent. When I was a little kid, maybe first or second grade,a friend's mother had a "Type 10" fastback model that I thought was cool - I guess the styling was racy to my young eyes, and it had a sunroof - still an uncommon thing then.

I knew a guy in high school who had a Cimarron, a later flush lights model.

Mr_Shiftright · February 2013

a car company can never sit back and rest on its laurels---in this business, you do that and someone will eat you for breakfast.

Think of the irony of the 1970 Cadillac owner looking in either mockery, or if he was more dignified, in pity, at the little Honda 600 coupe rattling at idle next to him---the Honda being about the size of a lifeboat attached to the luxurious ocean-liner of a Cadillac he was driving.

Fast forward a mere 12 years and the driver of the 1982 Cadillac Cimarron looks to his right at a quietly idling, roomy and comfortable 1982 Honda Accord--all things considered, every bit as good as the "cadillac".

Once again, what economists call the "Black Swan" hit Cadillac on its blind side--an unexpected turn of events to which some automakers simply could not respond adequately.

andre1969 · February 2013

1996 was the last year for the Beretta, as well as the Corsica. The 1997 Malibu replaced the Corsica, but I guess coupe sales had fallen off enough by that time, they didn't think the Beretta warranted replacing.

I liked the Beretta and Corsica when they first came out. Styling looked good, I thought. But the interiors were horrible. And when the Cavalier was redesigned and improved for 1995, I think it put some pressure on them.

texases · February 2013

"a car company can never sit back and rest on its laurels"

I see what you did there...

uplanderguy · February 2013

The Type 10 Cavaliers were rarely seen in my parts--and I lived 40 miles from where they were built!

The '82 Cavalier came out to much interest, somewhere in the middle of calendar '81. I can remember driving with a buddy over to the Lordstown plant on a Sunday and through a fence I saw one sitting there, before they were out. I was stunned at how the rear end was almost an exact ripoff of a Triumph TR-7.

When they came out, I was stunned at the price. A fully-loaded one could hit $9K--when the sticker of my new '81 Monte Carlo V8 (admittedly, not loaded) was $8,192. Furthermore, the 1.8 liter was reallllly slow, and the quality they talked about was hard to prove to me as I saw a new one on a dealer lot with the glued-on side molding on one door lying on the pavement near the car.

It was a lousy launch--as was the Celebrity that came out very shortly after. It, too, was expensive for what you got.

In '83, Chevy made the Cavalier engine a 2.0 liter that by all accounts was a noticeable improvement, and reduced the price of both the Cavalier and Celebrity. At that point, they became best-sellers, so it is possible to recover from a lousy launch.

fintail · February 2013

I've seen old ads that show the same - a nice early Celebrity was virtually the same price as a Caprice. One was a lot more car than the other.

Speaking of Beretta from another post, a friend of my mother bought a final run car, a 1996, teal (of course, mid 90s GM and all). It wasn't trouble-free.

Mr_Shiftright · February 2013

It's interesting, isn't it, how most 80s cars are disappearing from view at a rapid clip? Even the junkyards don't want them, because they take up room without making much $$$ in parts sales.

Even stranger is how my eyes would just glaze over vintage Mustangs or Porsches in NYC but would, no doubt, immediately lock onto a Cadillac Cimarron, as if to say "wow, you mean there's one left?!!" :P

ateixeira · February 2013

As a child of the 80s, even nostalgia isn't enough for me to want many cars from that era.

texases · February 2013

My neighbor bought a new '82 Cavalier wagon, and was immediately disappointed at the 16 mpg fuel economy. He was expecting MUCH better.

uplanderguy · February 2013

I did like the Cavalier wagons. When I bought my wife a new '90 Corsica, I asked if she wanted a 5-speed wagon instead (about the same price). At age 25 she didn't want a wagon.

I held people who bought Cimarrons in about the same regard back then, as I did those who bought Renault Alliances and Encores....that they must not even remotely be 'car people'!

BTW, on 9/3/88 (my wife-to-be's birthday), I bought myself a new bright red '89 Beretta GT, light neutral cloth interior. Big tires and nice-looking (IMHO) lacy wheels, and the 2.8 MFI V6. No spoiler--nice, clean looks I thought. I drove it for 74,900 miles and we traded in on a new '93 Caprice Classic. It was trouble-free but really too small for me as an only car at the time (not counting my '63 Lark I bought in May of '88).

fintail · February 2013

Other than some highline or tuned/exotic cars from the era, no thanks. I can think of the cars in my family then, and I wouldn't want any of them, really. Not that they were bad for the time, but it seems so much older and newer is simply better.

andre1969 · February 2013

It was a lousy launch--as was the Celebrity that came out very shortly after. It, too, was expensive for what you got.

A few years back, a friend gave me a bunch of old car magazines. Mainly Road & Track, I think, but there were some C&Ds and MTs in there as well. I remember one of them doing a test of a 1982 Caprice, and this was in early 1982...when the gas crisis and recession were still in full swing.

Yet, they mentioned that Caprices were still selling for about sticker price, while the Celebrity, a new wave family car of the future, seeming like the right car for these fuel-hungry times, was piling up on the lot, with big incentives required to move them.

texases · February 2013

One 'common' car from then that I would like back - my '83 GTI.

But not in a car accident, it'd fold up like a beer can...

dieselone · February 2013

Other than some highline or tuned/exotic cars from the era, no thanks. I can think of the cars in my family then, and I wouldn't want any of them, really. Not that they were bad for the time, but it seems so much older and newer is simply better.

I definitely agree.

ateixeira · February 2013

Always an exception to prove the rule.

My roommate owned an '84. It broke a lot, though.

au1994 · February 2013

I agree with you on the Type 10 fastback, that was slick looking for the day. Mom and Dad looked at one along with the Omni fastback. We ended up with the Omni. Served us well for a few years.

texases · February 2013

"My roommate owned an '84. It broke a lot, though. "

I must have been lucky. I had my GTI for 12 years, only time it broke was when the timing belt went. Could have been my fault for not changing it earlier...

au1994 · February 2013

I had an 89 Beretta that I got in 90 with about 9k miles on it. I ran it up to about 70k in 5 years (college car so it sat parked a lot of the time) until I traded it on a Tacoma. I think they gave me 3k for it.

Bright red w/gray interior. Good looking car, interior was ok for me but I was coming from a 66 Mustang. Just so-so on reliability...didn't have pwr windows and the drivers side would pop its track every so often, alternator went out in a remote section of highway on the way back to school. This was pre cell phone days (or at least it was for poor college students) so that was interesting, ECU went out and the paint on the roof was orange peeling shortly after I got it.

But was an absolute dog performance wise. It had the 2.0 4 cyl and 3 spd auto. Passing on 2 lane highways should have won me a medal for bravery.

tjc78 · February 2013

Being a land yacht lover, I'd take any Panther based vehicle from the 80s. Also on the list, RWD Lesabres, Electra-Park Ave, Fleetwood Brougham, Mark VII LSC (HO motor), 84-87 Shelby Chargers, and of course the only collectible American car from the 80s.... (shouldn't even have to say the name)

andre1969 · February 2013

Same here...pretty much anything mid or full-sized, RWD, and V-8 from the 80's would keep me satisfied.

Actually, let me narrow that down a bit...nothing with a Diesel 350, and also nothing with an under-sized (<300 CID) V-8. And if it happens to be a Pontiac 301, only if it's in excellent shape and lovingly maintained! :P

ateixeira · February 2013

He replaced it with a Dodge Shadow with the 2.2l turbo. Wasn't much better. Today he drives a Jeep Wrangler.

ateixeira · February 2013

Give us a hint. First name G, middle name N, last name X?

tjc78 · February 2013

I think you may have it.

boomchek · February 2013

Thanks hpmctorque, I will.

Oh yeah I didn't ask - going back to the home country?

No we're going to Israel for 3.5 weeks to see my wife's grandparents. They're getting older and haven't seen their grandson yet (our son) and we wanted to see how they're doing after my wife's father (their son) passed away a few months ago. We keep in touch with them and my wife has other family there but it will be nice to see them in person.

I'll probably rent a car there as well. When we were there 5 years ago we had a Daihatsu Sirion, which was a fun drive. We will see what we might end up with this time.

I wanted to make a slight detour on the way back, renting a car in Amsterdam and driving to Poland for a few weeks to see my family since we will have the time, but being away for a month and a half might be a bit too much for our 3 year old son and it'll cost us a bit to change the return tickets.

ab348 · February 2013

I remember reading the introductory reviews of the J-cars in the car magazines and they all commented on how slow and underpowered they were. GM people tried to brush it off by saying it was the price of fuel economy. They also commented on some of the cost cutting, I recall, like the lack of a finish molding at the ends of the headliner.

I remember driving them when they were new and liking the interiors of the optioned-up versions (GM always did good interiors back then) but it was bog-slow. I had a rental Omni for a week in '84 and by comparison that thing was a hot rod. By then, Chrysler was using the K-car engine in the Omni and it moved it quite well. The remainder of the car was quite cheap-feeling though.

fintail · February 2013

That'll be an adventure, driving in Israel. Although the European drive might be more enjoyable.

fintail · February 2013

My dad had a Horizon hatchback for several years - it was a decent enough car for the era.

fintail · February 2013

Passing on 2 lane roads is fun in an 85 Tempo, too - I remember that vividly. You had to floor it and pray.

boomchek · February 2013

That'll be an adventure, driving in Israel.

Not too bad, and not like anything you see in movies or news about the middle east. The roads are normal, traffic rules are normal, no donkeys or anything like that sharing roads. I did it 5 years ago and it was fine, only sometimes other drives make risky moves and are a bit agressive (nobody stops for pedestrians) but otherwise it's fine.

omarman · February 2013

I had the same impression with a rental Omni 2.2/automatic back in the 80s. It's strange, but the Omni was ahead of its time (no really) because it was bigger than other subcompacts when it first came out. By the mid 80s, other subcompacts were growing into the size where the Omni started/finished.

As a rental, the Omni seemed okay to me, kept up with traffic and got the job done. But the interior bits and ergonomics were dreck. The manual inside hood release looked like a re-purposed dipstick. :lemon:

fintail · February 2013

Probably people with more situational awareness than here, anyway.

I see Sixt has Sirion or equiv for under $20/at at Tel Aviv, with a diverse line of small cars - highlines are pricey though.

boomchek · February 2013

Yeah I priced out a CTS and it would have been like $5k for 3 weeks lol.

A subcompact will run me about $500-$600 with insurance for same amount of time.

fintail · February 2013

I got something like $300/day for an E class...no thanks.

When I rent overseas, I buy their insurance too - but domestically, the Amex insurance is a deal. When you get back, post it on the rental car thread, I'll be curious to see what you get.

uplanderguy · February 2013

I absolutely preferred Omni/Horizon rentals into the '80's, over K-cars.

Mr_Shiftright · February 2013

50 Studebakers Destroyed In Fire

Folks, make sure your collector cars are well insured and appraised!

ateixeira · February 2013

That's a shame.

Too soon for the "that'll buff right out" jokes?

busiris · February 2013

Uplanderguy has to be in mourning... He's the Stude guy...

The thing that always gets me about tragedies like this is the total lack of protection given to the value of the assets.

You can rest assured that if I had a shop(s) full of collectible cars it would be equipped with some sort of fire protection, even if it was only a simple sprinkler system.... At least, something that might give me a chance of saving some of the vehicles.

It's like power tools. I can't count how many times I've seen someone spend a small fortune on a deluxe power tool, yet refuse to spend the extra $15-20 for a moulded plastic case to store it in when not in use. Usually it's crammed into a storage cabinet or left lying on a shelf, exposed....5 years later, its all beat up.

I'm not trying to beat this guy up or anything, but he's lost something he can NEVER get back, regardless how much he's insured for...

Maybe I'm just too sensitive to stuff like this because something similar happened in my hometown when I was in my early 20's ...there was a guy with all types of old collectible cars. Had them stored in an old barn, and wouldn't think of selling them. Well, one night the barn burned, along with all those non-replaceable cars. It was a absolute travesty...And, he had zero insurance...

By the way, Chesnee is about 50 miles from my house...

boomchek · February 2013

There's a thread like that? I'll check it out, thanks.

I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today!

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