Fog Lights

kevin112 · October 2002

i just purchases a 98 dakota sport 4x2. unfortunately it doesn't have fog lights. what's involved in adding this feature? is there an aftermarket kit specific for this vehicle & does anyone know where i can purchase them? also my truck doesn't seem to have a lite for the glove box & ashtray. it's annoying. thanx for the help.

iowabigguy · October 2002

fog light kit is available from the dealer parts department. If I recall right the price is about $120. I believe it includes a replacement headlight switch and wiring. Rick

kansasbill · December 2002

I have a 2003 Chev Silverado 2500HD that doesn't have fog lights, but it has the fog light switch.
I want to add after market lights in the stock mounting positions.
I believe there must be factory wiring already included in my wiring harness and it is probably tied off somewhere. I figure that 2000 or 2001 and up are similarly set up. My question is if someone has already identified where the wiring is located and/or what color coded wiring to look for. A schematic or wiring harness routing guide are probably too much to hope for.
Bill

harvestmooon · January 2003

iVE GOT A 2300 hd ALSO BUT NO FOG LIGHT SWITCH. I DO HAVE ELECTRICAL CONNECTIONS RIGHT WHERE THE LIGHTS WILL GO WHEN I PUT THEM IN. TAKE A LOOK, YOU SHOULD SEE WHERE THEY PLUG IN. GET THE KIT FROM THE DEALER IF NECC. ANY WIRING DIAGRAM WILL SHOW YOU WHERE THEY ARE, NOT A BAD IDEA TO OWN A SET OF MANUALS.

davewarwick1 · January 2003

The fog lights in my 01 DDQC are worthless. I stopped at the local PIAA lamps dealer and they had no cross reference for replacement bulbs for the stock item (#806 bulb if I remember correctly).

Has anyone replaced their stock fog lamps and what brand/model number was purchased.

boat10 · January 2003

just ordered set of OEM fog lights for my 02 Silverado from my dealer. They are in the GM Accesories catalog. Includes all needed hardware, wiring, switch, FULL instructions on how to install. $93.00, tax included. I thought the price was reasonable

ahasher · January 2003

davewarwick1 , I too found the OEM PLASTIC lights useless on my 2000 QC, with a low wattage bulb. No replacements available. I upgraded to PILOT PL-119C I got from a local trucking shop, but Auto Zone Web Page says they carry it. I paid $82 for the kit. Exact match size wise for the airdam, 4 inch round glass with 55W halogen bulb which can be upgraded. Good wiring harness but not the factory switch, so i just spliced into the original light harness to use the existing dash switch. The mount brackets it had however was not what I expected, so I modified the OEM bracket to hold the new housing. It worked great,

and the lights are BRIGHT!!!!! Oh yeah, They also have AMBER glass for FOG light use. I took some pix of the mod and put them on my homepage:

http://home.bellsouth.net/p/PWP-ahasher

pwrplay27 · January 2003

My dakota came without the fog light option and I installed some myself. Any 4" round light will work. Pilot makes a specific kit that comes with the brackets and everything for about $80. I used APC 4" driving lights because I found them cheap for $30.00. You will need to drill a hole in the bumber bracket right about the rear of the lights. My lights came with a U bracket and I re-bent it into an L so I could bolt it into the hole that I drilled and have it meet the back of the bracket for the lights. As far as wiring the lights, I used a relay and tapped off of the parking lights for my on/off switch on the relay. I then wired 12volts to the relay and for the ground I ran a wire into the cab with a switch. The fog lights will turn off when I turn off my lights and vice versa. I also have the ability to turn them on and off from the cab when I want to.

davewarwick1 · January 2003

Thanks for the responses on fog lights. Looks like there are good lights out there and I will give them a try.

boat10 · January 2003

received my order I placed with my Rado dealer (GM ACCESSORY) and installed myself. A little work, but looks just like a factory done job. Only thing I don't like about them is you cannot turn them on without the headlights turned on. Anybody out there know how to get around this?
The accessory package had everything you need to put them on the vehicle, wiring harness, switch, mounting brackets attached to the lights (just like what comes on a factory order). I had my dealer reprogram BCM to make them work. NO CHARGE since I done all the work myself!!!!!
Well satisfied ........

stever · August 2003

Can someone explain why you can't run your fog lights without the headlights being on at the same time?

Steve, Host

bowtieman1 · August 2003

Dont have a clue my 00 was the same way, I asked myself the same question. My new 03 can turn them on W/O the lights on. One of the many improvements GM made to the 03's

ronslakie · August 2003

I have a 00 DAK CC and I can put my fogs on with the headlights on but not with the high beams on. I thought this was the norm; suuposedly the high beams and fogs on together actually cause a loss of visisbility.

zueslewis · August 2003

when in fog, if you hit your high beams, they'll just bounce back at you and you won't see a thing. They don't get under the fog and let you see the road like low beams and fog lights do.

On a clear night, you could use both for max visibility, but I'd NEVER use high beams in fog -

Jim
From Coastal Texas with 98% humidity year-round - we know fog!

steveg44 · September 2003

Is there a preferred place or easy way to get the wiring through the firewall? I have an '03 Toyota Highlander non-Ltd.

steveg44 · September 2003

Can someone help? I need the color pattern of a hot wire to tap into to power the foglight installation. I found an access point to go through the firewall in answer to my post here, #15, if anyone needs that information.

tidester · September 2003

It doesn't look like you're having much luck here. You might try posting your question in Toyota Highlander or Toyota Highlander Owners: Accessories & Modifications.

Good luck.

tidester, host

sequoiasoon · September 2003

On the Sequoia there is a green wire that comes off the dash light dimmer control. This is the power from the parking lights. If you use it to send power through your switch to a good relay it doesn't use much power and makes sure you don't leave them on by accident. They will have power when parking lights are on, low and high beam also. You can also do the samething from one of the actual parking lights. Most of my fog light installs i run from the parking light itself. The relays and all power is fused and close to the battery area. I run a grounding wire from the relay to the switch to any convenient ground under the dash. If for some reason the wire going through the firewall rubs and short circuits, the worst that will happen is my fogs turn on but no other wires will accidently melt.

steveg44 · September 2003

Thanks sequoiasoon for the reply. I will look for that wire. I presume it is the same color on the HL. I was luck to run the wire through a rubber grommet on the firewall. I only need the power now. Was that a solid green wire?

iowabigguy · September 2003

Function
  DTI Color Vehicle Color Location
Start:
  Yellow BLACK/WHITE IGNITION SWITCH HARNESS *
Ignition #1:
  Blue BLACK/RED IGNITION SWITCH HARNESS
Ignition #2:
  Green BLACK/YELLOW IGNITION SWITCH HARNESS
Ignition #3:
  Wht/Blk N/A
Accessory:
  White PINK IGNITION SWITCH HARNESS
Brake Light:
  Orange GREEN/WHITE AT SWITCH ABOVE BRAKE PEDAL
Tach Signal:
  Green YELLOW/GREEN AT ECM PIN B4 **
Parking Lights:
  Yellow GREEN (+) AT JUNCTION BLOCK ON PASSENGER SIDE AT ECM
Headlights:
  Yellow
OEM Alarm Disarm:
  Brn/Wht RED/YELLOW (-) INSIDE OF DRIVER'S DOOR
Diesel Glow Plug:
  Red/Black
Clutch Bypass Wire:
  n/a
lower case colors are for the alarm maunfacturers wiring that provided this info. The Toyota colors are uppercase. This may help, Rick

iowabigguy · September 2003

Function
  DTI Color Vehicle Color Location
Start:
  Yellow BLACK/WHITE IGNITION SWITCH HARNESS *
Ignition #1:
  Blue BLACK IGNITION SWITCH HARNESS
Ignition #2:
  Green BLACK.YELLOW IGNITION SWITCH HARNESS
Ignition #3:
  Wht/Blk N/A
Accessory:
  White PINK IGNITION SWITCH HARNESS
Brake Light:
  Orange GREEN/WHITE AT SWITCH ABOVE BRAKE PEDAL
Tach Signal:
  Green WHITE/GREEN IN A 28-PIN PLUG AT THE ECM **
Parking Lights:
  Yellow GREEN (+) DRIVER'S KICK PANEL
Headlights:
  Yellow RED/BLUE (-) AT HEADLIGHT SWITCH
OEM Alarm Disarm:
  Brn/Wht RED THAT CHANGES TO BLUE (-) STEERING COLUMN HARNESS ***
Diesel Glow Plug:
  Red/Black ARMS WITH LOCKS
Clutch Bypass Wire:
  n/a N/A

iluv_wheels · September 2003

Has any one isntalled after market fog lights for Sienna?

steveg44 · October 2003

Thanks for all the assistance in getting my fog lights installed on my Toyota Highlander. One last problem. I am using a Toyota rocker switch with three leads on it and an LED. The leads, I am sure, are connected properly but the LED continues to glow with the switch in the off position and the power in the car on. The lights work fine. Is there something else that I have not done properly?

steveg44 · October 2003

See my Highlander posts. If the Sienna is similar to the HL, it can be accomplished as a diy. The HL has 5" circumfrence bumper holes with false grills in them, which I took out and replaced with Pilot 5" PL-62's. Email privately with other questions. geller44@optonline.net

sequoiasoon · October 2003

Most 3 lead switches are ground, power in, power out. It sounds like you have the power in and out flipped. You obviously tapped into a "key on" power source if the LED lights when you turn key on. The foglights probably do the same if the switch is on. There might be a diagram on the side of the switch, it would show a bulb between 2 terminals, one of those is the ground (3 small dashes) and the other would be power OUT to the lights. This way the LED gets power when the foglights do.

clubman1 · May 2005

Hello, I am new to the forums and I hope I get it right. Anyway, I have a 2005 Galant ES. This model comes without factory fog lights. I would like to buy OEM fog light kit from Mitsubishi. I have been told conflicting stories as to the car having the correct wiring harnesses already installed in the bumper and the switch harness in the dashboard all ready for the switch. Some dealers are saying everything is there, some are saying harnesses may be needed. If all is there, I can probably install myself. If not I might have to give it to the dealer to do. Anyone have any info. as to the wiring etc. has anyone installed lights and know how hard it is to do.

Regards,, Clubman

stever · September 2005

Fall is officially here; anyone installing fog lights in anticipation of foggy winter days?

Steve, Host

pod · September 2005

My last four cars have had fog lights built in by the manufacturer (BMW, Supra, Ford truck and Mercury Sable). Under various conditions (including fog obviously) I have turned them on and off and must say that they did not contribute to a remarkably improved view of the road ahead. In fact there was hardly any difference at all except for the scattered light near the car. Are fog lights designed to make your car more visible to other cars in fog or are they alleged to improve road visibility for you. I don't find this. Any opinions?

tidester · September 2005

Are fog lights designed to make your car more visible to other cars in fog or are they alleged to improve road visibility for you.

Fog lights are intended to make you more visible to others. There is nothing magical about the color, from a physics perspective, since all visible wavelengths are pretty much equally scattered by fog droplets though the eyes are more sensitive to colors in the middle of the visible spectrum.

tidester, host

pod · September 2005

I am surprised since I always assumed that foglamps were to illuminate the road for the driver's advantage. If, in fact, they are intended to make your car (the one with foglamps) more visible to others, then they are analogous to running lights in a boat. Why aren't the standard headlamps sufficient to make your car visible to others? Is it simply a matter of the number of lights? Does the location of the "foglamps" matter? Could they be mounted on the roof of a car and be equally effective? Are there rear-facing (red) foglamps to protect from cars behind? Thanks for taking the time to chat. II ask these questions out of curiosity, not to be contentious. If you are correct then it is no wonder that I notice no difference (as a driver) in visibility when I turn on the foglamps in the fog. Am I the only one who was so off base in my understanding of foglamps? I am really surprised that I was so off base.

tidester · September 2005

Standard headlamps will be visible to others in a fog but I think the main motivation is to have a different color to indicate the source is a vehicle with fog lights as opposed to some other light source. Also, they are positioned low which is another cue that the source isn't, say, an amber traffic signal. Red (front or back) is out of the question because that's the color designated for brake lights. Also, as I mentioned before, the eye is somewhat less sensitive to red light than it is to yellow.

To aid the driver, fog lights do have a very sharp cutoff helping somewhat to minimize the problem of backscatter but also helping to avoid disorientation.

tidester, host

sequoiasoon · September 2005

Fog lights are designed to help illuminate the road. Most of the "factory" versions I have seen do not do a very good job, especially domestic vehicles. Fog lights as tidester stated have a very sharp cutoff (direct line on top) to reduce the amount of glare reflected by particle droplets (snow, rain, fog, even dust). Most of the better quality fog lights too be used for that purpose also produce a yellow or amber light that reflects less than white. Many of the BMW, Mercedes, Volvo, Jag utilize projector fog lights as they cast a more even amount of light. They also often have a single red rear facing one. You might notice on some of these at night when on that it appears to have 1 brake light on all the time, but then they step on the brakes and they all turn on normally. Check here for more info http://www.rallylights.com/hella/Beams.htm . Different manufacturers and DOT rules also make things difficult. DOT does not allow fog lights to be on with high beam so many manufacturers only allow them to come on with low beam and turn off when high beams are used. Unfortunately they often don't allow them to turn on with parking lights only as some do. When it's REALLY poor visibility I've found that even the regular headlights reflected too much. I normally add aftermarket fog lights (hella DE with an ion bulb too make them yellow) and allow them on with parking lights and high beam. The parking for reason as stated above and high beam as extra illumination when I can use high beams. The Hella DE's make a NOTICEABLE difference in lighting in front of vehicle and to the sides (they go almost straight out 180 degrees).

The BIGGEST things are good quality lights with excellent pattern control and a MUST is PROPER aiming. Directions are listed many places. Basically lights need to be lower to the ground than headlights. Park car facing a wall 25 ft away. Measure from ground to center of light on vehicle, go to wall and measure, the top of the cutoff line should be 4" less than what you measured at car. This way they are aimed slightly down, illuminate the road well, and don't blind oncoming traffic.

Many people that are adding them to their vehicles have no clue on this, don't care, they just want it to look good and "sporty". Unfortunately it's dangerous that way.

adraka · October 2005

Hello, I bought some old pre-lux fog lights at a garage sale and have managed to get my hands on an instruction manual for some other lights that come with a kit to help guide me along, I think I have the wiring down and have bought all the necessary wiring components. Now for my problem, I have a heavy duty round bumper on my old toyota 4x4, I cannot figure out how the lights are "suppose" to be mounted, although I can figure out other less orthodox ways to mount the lights. I am searching for some basic instructions that might show me if I need to purchase some sort of harness, or perhaps something else that I haven't even thought of. Can someone help me figure out where to find instructions on the internet, or have a definitive answer of exactly what I need? I have been hunting on the web for some idea, but have found nothing that helps. The lights are round, say pre-lux 36A on them and are pretty heavy-duty, the wires come out of the bottom where there is a nut screwed into the light, and that is it! Thanks to anyone who can assist me.

bigfur · October 2005

Are a joke in my own opinion. Took them off of my 01 Silverado and installed PIAA P-400 four way fog/driving lights. One set of white lights is on when my day time running lamps are on (not bright). An amber set come on when i switch the headlights on once again, not really bright. Inside the truck i can manually switch on the bright fog/driving lights and they make a HUGE difference in visibility as far as what i can see. In rain or fog the bright amber allows me to see the road alot better i think. On any given dark back road the driving lights will light up more than you could ever need. I dont use the driving lights that are bright on the road with traffic very much as i think they are pretty brighter than my trucks high beams.

scotian · December 2005

http://public.fotki.com/Scotian/300m/lighting/projector_foglights/

duggb21 · December 2005

I have an '02 civic ex and just bought some PIAA after market fog lamps. I would like to get them installed and have never worked on any automotive electrical stuff before. Any ideas on places to get them installed or cost estimates? Thanks for the help. If you think its an easy do-it-yourself kinda job any suggestions on how to get throught the firewall? Thanks

crazz · January 2006

Hi i was wondering if anyone had information on installing foglights on a 05 rav4, like making them work off the headlights. they say the lights are controled through the ecm. if anyone has this info i greatly appreciate it. i really want to install the lights so they work off the low beam side of my headlights.

Thanks a million
- Rich

tever · January 2006

I would like my Fog Lights to come on by the factory installed switch when I want. Not just in the normal drive mode. I also have the keyless entry. Manual schematic also. Need to find where to get R/T blue stripes for my 98 neon. Car is the Neon Pkg. (Stone Chips).

biscayne2 · February 2006

one of my toys is a 67 MG midget... Very,Very small car by todays standards. I dont think I could put enough lites on her. Its just that I like to be seen in all kinds of weather and night and day.. It has 1 road lite and 1 fog lite in front, the road lite is on just about all the time.... its kind of like running lite on todays monster cars. The rear fog lite I think gives people behind me a chance to slow down by seeing a brighter red lite than my brake lites are..

silverbullet04 · March 2006

I dont know about other states, but NJ it is illegal to run foglights with your high beams on, you will fail inspection. As for just your foglights...I dont think thats legal either. I notice on my new MC I can only use foglights with parking lots or lowbeams....Hope I helped

catam · April 2006

I have an 03 Suburban, I need a new drivers side foglamp. I was wondering if anyone knew where I could pick up a new one cheap, or an aftermarket set. I would want the aftermarket set to fit in the mount in the bumper and if possible use the same wiring connector. Thanks, Catam.

eharri3 · April 2006

I've done a ton of researh lately on this when buying driving and fog lamps so I figured I'd chime in. That 'scattered light near the car' is actually the purpose they are intended to serve, to light the ground immediately in front of you and the road markers edges where you won't be able to see when there's heavy fog or precipitation, so you can keep the car pointed straight down the road. Fog tends to hover a foot or so off the ground. Properly aimed, well designed fogs throw out a broad, but not very far-reaching beam with a sharp cutoff that starts immediately in front of the car, goes under the fog, fills out the dead spot before the head light beam, and go slightly beyond that while also lighting some of the sides of the road. If the weather's that bad out, you're going slow anyway so what is immediately in front of you is more important than what is a foot ball field away.

They don't go very far or very high because if they hit the moisture or fog they'll be reflected all over the place and create glare. So don't expect your fogs to improve long or medium distance night vision when it's clear out. Get driving lamps for that.

I find most OEM fog lights are weak and low-wattage and aimed way to low, to the point where they're basically illuminating the ground underneath the front bumper and not much more. This was the way the ones on my Dakota Quad were and based on that I assumed fog lights in general must be pretty much worthless. I then tried an aftermarket 55 watt set from Pep boys for 45$ and aimed them carefully. Before with the OEMs on they lit up an area maybe 3-4 feet in front of the truck and threw a very narrow, limited amount of useful light 8-10 feet to the side. The new ones completely fill in the dead spot between the front bumper and where the headlight beam starts and light up whole houses on the side of the road. It's amazing, even inexpensive entry-level aftermarket lamps will out-shine the overpriced OEMS. The stock ones on my Dakota Quad cost anywhere from 150-200 from a dealer for a complete kit and put almost no useful light in comparison. Even just one single Dodge fog light at a dealer costs nearly twice as much as an inexpensive complete aftermarket kit.

So I guess in short I would say yes, most OEM fogs are there purely for decoration. I think they put the cheapest ones they can get from their suppliers on there just to be able to say they offer fog lights on their vehicles. But alot of aftermarket ones make a real difference in inclement weather.

Also, I did alot of experimentation with aiming using the precise textbook methods on PIAA's website and elsewhere on the web as well as my own subjective measures of where I thought they would be most effective. Turns out the angle of aim where I get the most useable light on the ground with minimal useless light thrown up in the air happened to coincide with the PIAA method, which has the top of the beam about 3-4 inches below beam center on a wall at 25 feet on level ground. Too high and I had alot of weak, unfocused light in the air doing nothing for me. Too low and they didn't light up enough of the road in front of me.

bigfur · April 2006

Have an 01 Silverado...similar front bumpers...and installed four way piaa lights into the factory fog light openings with very little trouble. Work great and light up a long ways.

jbollt · July 2006

I am a new owner of an 07 Camry Hybrid. Unfortunately, they do not come with, or even offer fog lights, as the XLE model has as standard. Has anyone researched the installation of the factory lights in the 07 Camry Hybrid, or how about after market?

I see there are several posters in the Camry Hybrid threads with the same quiery, so I thought I would post here to see what anyone has to say.

Thanks

mahiri · July 2006

I just bought a civic si and am considering getting fog lights installed, in part b/c i live in sf. Please excuse the following stupid question: Are they only for looks or will they really come in handy in san francisco? thx.

Mr_Shiftright · July 2006

Depends if a) you get really good ones or not and b) if they are aimed/focused properly. Yeah, if they are quality items, it makes a difference in parts of San Francisco, like going over the GG Bridge or in the Sunset district. But I doubt you'll need fogs in North Beach!

The fogs should cut a wide low beam and allow you to see the sides of the road better. If they are aimed too high they will just bounce back at you.

mahiri · July 2006

When I bought the car, the dealer offered me a fog light option for $619. Are fog lights from the Honda dealer probably good ones? I'm hesitant to go after-market because I want them covered under the new car warranty.

Mr_Shiftright · July 2006

My opinion is that dealer-added accessories tend to be good quality but overpriced...so your decision is kind of a toss-up. I didn't add them on my new car because the price seemed too steep, but now I'm still searching for an aftermarket product that fits well and is of good quality. I may have to resort back to the dealer option at some point.

karuso · November 2006

I am also the owner of an 07 Camry Hybrid. I also wanted the fog lights as well.

Take a look at this link, and let me know if this helps (unless you have found this already).

http://www.blinglights.com/shopbling/store/comersus_listCategoriesAndProducts.as- p?idCategory=56&curPage=2

jbollt · November 2006

thanks karuso..i will check them out....have you installed them?

wellies · March 2007

Hi,
Can some one tell me should, when i switch my rear red foglight on, the side lights come on at the same time, or should only the rear red foglight come on. Thanks, Rob Wilson.

Fog Lights

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