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Comments
The stock Goodyears on the Mazda3 do have a M&S rating - but they look like they would be very poor in the white stuff.
You are correct about the tread design... While not familiar with the tires on the S-model, most 17" performance oriented all-season tires do not have that great of snow traction.
regards,
kyfdx
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Even on a dry road a skinny tire will have more traction per square inch than a wide tire - so why don't drag racers use real skinny rear tires?
The issue with wide VS skinny tires in the snow is not traction per square inch - the wider the tire the more snow it has to push - imagine how hard it would be for Fred Flintstone's car to drive in the snow.
It is the opposite for snow... You need increased weight for traction, because the tires won't stick.
But, either way.... winter tires are best.. I'm sure there must be someone on here who has real-world experience this their Mazda S and snow..
regards,
kyfdx
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Nokian makes an all weather year round tire that is rated for severe snow service, if you don't want to change wheels.
http://www.nokian.com/passengercars_product_en?product=610503&- ;amp- ;name=NOKIAN+WR
Regarding tire width. On ice the trade off of more psi vs. more area is about even, although some tire makers claim that wider is actually slightly better. The charcteristics of the snow change as pressure is applied. Too light a load on the snow and it acts like lots of little ball bearings. Smash it down real good and it almost gets sticky. That along with less snow to push means narrower tires do better in the snow.
When you go to extemes though (huge amounts of pressure, or huge amounts of area), pressure always wins. Which stops better on snow and ice, a tobaggen, or set of mountaineering crampons.
Umm.. Is there going to be a test? lol
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My 2 bits worth....I got my 3S-GT with 17" low profile Goodyear AS tires on Dec. 11/03. I live in NW Ontario where we get real winters. So I got to "drive"????? my 3 in lots of real world conditions last winter. Snow, ice, slush, slush on top of ice, hard packed snow covered highways.
These tires were TERRIBLE. Thank goodness we don't have real hills around here. I am 57, have been driving for 40 years and have never put snow tires on any of my previous vehicles. Never felt the need to. Until these tires. I don't plan to drive my 3 much, if at all this winter but if I was I would absolutely be putting 16" steel wheels and snow tires on. Many on this and other forums have done so.
For sure, I would not want to be driving on these tires on hilly snow packed roads. It's the tires...not the car.
everfeb
I thought the 16" tires on the 3I w/ power windows have the same width as the 17" tires on the 3S.
Have just spent $950 on a set of four Nakayama Zoro10's accompanied by Hankook Ventus HRII 215/45/17 tires, the Hankook's are rated far superior to the stock Goodyears.
The new wheel combination weighs about 39 lb.s, an 8lb weight saving per wheel. I am expecting, and hoping, to receive a noticeable increase in an already good handling car. The Hankook's are also supposed to be quieter than stock. Acceleration should also increase, but not by a large amount. We'll see when I receive them in two weeks.
Also, I rented within the last six weeks, A Chevy Cavalier, Neon, and Corolla. The worst of the group was the Cavalier, with it's taxicab interior and land yacht handling. Next in line was the Neon, it had a noisy, unrefined engine,and an interior marginally better than the Cavalier. Out of the three the Corolla had the best interior and more refined driving experience, but it's engine was likewise noisy. And paying attention too detail, their stock radios were inferior to the 3's. The Corolla did handle better than both cars. All in all those three cars were not even close to the level of refinement of my 3S sedan, which I was most happy to return to.
Finally, I accompanied a friend to look at a BMW 325ci softtop. I couldn't help but peek inside the 325 sedan parked next to it. The interior looked like cheap vinyl or whatever, my Maz had an interior that would make it blush! It was listed at 29K, way to go Mazda!
I got a 3i as a loaner, it came with 16" toyo tires, compared to the much maligned 17" Goodyears, the toyos are noisy,hard,and feel less stable when turning. Any observations?
The Bridgestone Turanza LS-H is the most incredible quiet comfy riding tire. But after I tried'em on, I found out that there goes my steering feel out the window. Fortunately my '90 Protege LX's steering feel was abundant to begin with, so what's left over is just barely sufficient.
I doubt the Mazda3 w/ the electro-hydraulic steering assist & the subframe can afford to run on these tires w/o feeling numb.
has anyone tried the michelin pilot sport a/s ?
the 16 inch wheels that come with this car are the same ratio as the 17 arnt they?
2005 MAZDA3 SP23 Special Edition
4-Door and 5-Door
Product Information Bulletin
November 18, 2004
The 2005 MAZDA3 is a compact car with the spirit of a luxurious sports sedan, and there is no doubt
that consumers, like the automotive press, recognize it as a class-leader that can hold its own against
any Japanese or European import – including many premium brands.
Mazda is now proud to introduce the 2005 MAZDA3 SP23 Special Edition. The SP23 is based on 4-
Door and 5-Door “s” models equipped with the 2.3L engine, 17” alloy wheels, side sills, and leather
trimmed seats. The SP23 adds high-value features that are not commonly found in a compact car –
features that exceed customer expectations in the segment. These features include:
Exterior
• 17" alloy wheels with high gloss finish
• Automatic on/off headlights
• Automatic rain-sensing (adjustable sensitivity) with 2-speed and fixed-intermittent front
windshield wipers and washer
• Special Edition "SP23" badges on each front door
• LED rear combination taillights (5-Door only)
• Exclusive exterior color: Carbon Gray Mica
Interior
• Leather trimmed seats and door panel inserts (Saddle Brown or Black)
• Heated front seats (driver and passenger)
• Pollen filter for air conditioning
• Bose premium audio system with 7 speakers including subwoofer
• In-dash 6-disc CD changer
• Instrument panel trim insert - black (gloss-type finish)
• Steering wheel trim inserts - black (gloss-type finish)
• Standard floor mats, carpeted
Overall, the additional SP23 equipment contains great value and is priced only $990 over the base “s”
model with Sport Package (4-Door) and leather trimmed seats.
SP23 options include a 4-speed Sport AT automatic transmission, power sliding-glass moonroof,
navigation system, and the SP23 Security Package which contains:
• Anti-lock Brake System (ABS) with Electronic Brakeforce Distribution (EBD)
• Dual Front Seat Mounted Side-Impact Air Bags (front coverage)
• Side Air Curtains (front & rear coverage)
• Xenon High-Intensity Discharge (HID) Headlights (Low-Beam, Manual-Leveling)
• Tire Pressure Monitoring System (TPMS)
• Theft-Deterrent Security System
The SP23 is a limited production vehicle and will be offered in only one Special Edition exterior color:
Carbon Gray Mica. The leather trimmed interior will be available in two colors: Saddle Brown leather
(November 2004 thru May 2005 production); and Black leather (February 2005 thru May 2005
production).
Looks like this car, w/ enough leg room, is designed to compete w/ the TSX & the new Jetta V, but w/ the DSC missing.
This is the 1st time a 3 w/ 6-disc changer can be equipped w/o the moonroof. & this is very important, 'cause I, being 5'11", need to raise the 3's driver seat all the way in order to stretch my legs comfortably, & the only the moonroof-less car can provide enough head room.
We just bought an '04 RX-8 w/ Bose, which sounds better than the more powerful stereo in our '04 TSX & the even-more-powerful stereo w/ Sony speakers in my '05 Focus ST.
& finally, the Carbon Gray Mica exterior w/ brown-leather interior should look really classy, as the only 3 so far w/ an impressive exterior is the Titanium Grey sedan w/ the sport package.
If I'm in the market for a Mazda3, then this would be the one! Too bad, we already got more than enough cars at home, & our TSX is always the one nobody wanted to drive when their choices also include the '04 325i & the '04 RX-8. Otherwise, we'd have passed buying this grey TSX(@ a whopping $29800 out-the-door-price paid at sticker) & wait for this hot-looking 3!
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According to the insurance institute for highway safety a best pick rating means the belted driver in a real world 40mph frontal crash most likely would walk away with only minor injuries.
Some of the cars that scored poorly compared to the Mazda3 include...Focus, hyundai elantra, suzuki forenza, nissan sentra, saturn ion, dodge neon, kia spectra (poorest performer since 2001), chevy cavalier.
That is not quite accurate. Actually, the Elantra and Focus received a "Good" score from the IIHS, their top rating, but did not score quite high enough to be a "Best Pick." The Spectra and Cavalier, on the other hand, scored "Poor" on the test, so to say they scored poorly compared to the Mazda3 is certainly true. The others were Average to Marginal.
Note that three cars scored higher than the Mazda3--would you say the Mazda3 scored "poorly" compared to them?
This was a frontal crash test only - from what I have read Mazda scores a 3 out of 5 on the side crash test - but they only tested a car without the side air bag option. Based on other cars that have been tested both with and without side air bags - it seems like cars with this option pick up 1 at least one additional point.
yes I would...but according to the press release that I have from IIHS they don't have anyone scoring higher than the MZ3. The press release lists 18 models... From what I see is "G" is the highest score and the Mazda3 scored a "G" in all catagories recently tested..as did some others. It was nice to see that on all the shows humping the IIHS tests, they singled out the top results of the Mazda3
That's just crazy!
As I understand it, manufacturers choose which vehicles they supply for these tests and some are too cheap to offer up vehicles equipped with side air bags. If this is true and not an urban myth then someone at Mazda needs their head examined.
Here is the Dateline NBC link for the PR:
http://www.iihs.org/news_releases/2004/pr121904.htm
Makes me feel much more confident, as I just purchased one over Thanksgiving weekend. VERY happy w/it btw.
Allen
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Mazda wants to be listed in the "under $15,000" group - even though (I would guess) 98% of all Mazda3 cars sold are priced above $15K. If you take the i model and add SAB option the MSRP is over $15K ($15,025).
Also - some people with complain that it should be an option - so they don't have to spend the extra $7-800 if they don't want to.
It is not always true that if the quantity goes up the price goes down (in the short run anyway). For example - maybe the supplier of this part is running close to capacity and they would need to get the additional parts from a higher cost secondary supplier -
Some people (not me BTW) could not care less about safety features - so even if it saved $50 putting this on every car - so it was ONLY a $750 option Mazda could loose these sales.
I don't care about alloy wheels either, but Mazda makes me buy them in order to get a Mazda3 that has features I do want, like a height-adjustable seat and a power package (windows, locks, mirrors). And they make me get SABs and SACs even if all I want is ABS (or vice-versa).
I don't get it either.
Also, the law of economics clearly states that as your purchases increase, the price decreases.
Only in a perfect market and that assumes that additional equipment/capital/buildings/people to manufacturer the increased quantities are free and available. Luckily, Honda is in a position that it can foist additional items onto their loyal customers. That's not a bad thing.
Maybe one of the economists on the board could explain - if increased purchases ALWAYS mean lower prices - why does the price of gas/crude oil GO UP when demand increases - seems like the more people buy the higher the price goes?
Or if you want to stay on topic and talk about cars rather than oil - what will happen to the price of a Mazda3 if all the people that are shopping for Civics and Corollas decide that them MUST HAVE a Mazda3? Do you really think that with all of this INCREASED PURCHASING that most dealers will LOWER the price of the Mazda3? I have a hard time hearing the sales manager say - Gee I have 50 Mazda3 cars in stock and we have 1,000 people trying to buy them - maybe we should drop the price by a few hundred dollars - because it is an economic fact that if more of something is demanded the price must go down!
What was meant in the original statement, I believe, was that if you buy in bulk from a supplier, other things being equal, your cost per unit purchased should be lower. For example, Honda has made SAB/SAC standard on the Accord this year. Purchasing a larger amount of those materials from its supplier(s) should enable Honda to achieve purchasing economies of scale (say, a a better contract price for that item due to a higher volume comittment) and have a lower purchase cost per unit.
With respect to what you're saying about oil, or the Mazda 3 situation, your intuition is right. The law of supply and demand holds that given a constant supply, prices will increase when demand increases. Given a constant demand, prices will fall when supply increases, and rise when supply decreases.
I hope this helps!
Happy holidays!
~alpha
PS- Where can I find MSRP and Invoice pricing on the MZ3s SE? Is it available here on edmunds yet?
Maybe this is obvious - maybe not - A purchase by one company is a sale for another - so I don't see your point that I am looking at sales rather than purchasing. They are really just two sides of the same coin - the economic analysis will be the same for both. Think about it - if you could ALWAYS lower your unit cost by increasing the quantity purchased - just agree to buy more and more and more until the price is lowered to ZERO - then buy even more and the supplier would be paying you to take their product. Dumb right? But this simple (& stupid) example should prove that buying larger quantities does not always mean a lower price.
I will agree that many times if a company wants to buy a larger amount it can get a better price. But that is not always true and in fact sometimes the opposite is true.
You prove this in your post. You say "The law of supply and demand holds that given a constant supply, prices will increase when demand increases" So if Honda and Mazda and all the car companies decide that they want to put 8 air bags in ever vehicle that is produced that would increase DEMAND - which would (could) increase the price.
Yes--dumb. Let's put aside the dumb arguments for a minute and look at the economics of the situation. Prices will seldom be zero (I have "bought" several "free after rebate" products, so price can be zero...), but they decrease as demand increases due to a number of factors, including 1) fixed costs being spread over a larger number of units, 2) variable costs reduced due to manufacturing efficiencies available due to more units produced (Toyota for one is great at doing this), and 3) greater demand bringing in more competitors, lowering profit margins.
Take digital cameras for example. Five years ago, a basic 2 mp unit cost about $1000. Yesterday I saw a full-featured 3.2 mp unit on sale for $19.99. Demand has soared since 1999, but prices have plummeted as more suppliers entered the market and the technologies have matured.