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Price includes all rebates. MSRP of $33,056. Dealer is also in the NE area. I feel the price is alright all things considered but would appreciate any feed back +/-....has anybody out there done better?
Might pull the trigger saturday....all responses are welcome!
Kelly
AW 17 in wheels
CM Double decker cargo
DR Roof Rack
SR Sunroof
Exhaust Tip
Carpet Mats
Wheel Lock
MSRP: 32,200+
Paid: 27,062 + Doc
It was with $500 debate, now Toyota offers $1000.
Is this dealer telling me the truth ???
Rischard
Is this dealer
Would you detail the options package for us? I'm curious if you also have the side curtain airbags (GY). Did your $29,500 work out to about the invoice price, or was there a reduction off even the invoice?
$600 over invoice.
2005 4Runner Sport 4WD V8 Dealer Invoice is
$27,971.00
Remaing #'s are Dealer Invoice Costs
JBL CD/FM & 10 speakers -$476.00
Daytime running lights - $32
Double Deck Cargo - $100
Sunroof - $720
Rear Spoiler - $160
Valor Exhaust Tip - $42
Door Sill Enhancements ACSCO - $109
Preferred Accessory Package - $220
Destination Charge - $565
TDA - $609
Gasoline - $6
Dealer Hold Back - $324
TOTAL - $31,983.00
Hope this help you buy 2005 4Runner. I have a
copy of the invoice if you want to see it just email
me.
I also recommend reading http://www.fool.com/car/car.htm !!! Especially the FAX war is a crucial step to get competitive offers in order to have negotiating power at a local dealership. 2% over invoice is a fair value to demand.
I am the process of inquiring for a 2005 SR5 2WD V6, want to finish before the month expires to get that incentive ($1000) and I need to pin down the invoice cost/TMV cost for the following options (which are not listed under the Edmunds table):
AW 17" Alloy Wheels w/P265/65r17 tires
EH All-In-One DVD System
WL Wheel Locks
PN Anti-Theft Alarm System
M5 Carpet Mat Set (5 Pc)
As a first approximation I used similar percentages as other listed options. But I wonder if there's a place where all of this is spelled out. Also, has any out there ordered this all-in-one-DVD; there's no description on whether this is the little screen coming from the roof or is it the 2 screens embedded in the headrests.
Any input from the forum will be welcome.
P.S. Any one has heard if these incentives are going to be extended into february?
thanks for your input. I went thru the fax war gyrations of the motley fool but it didn't work. Of three inquiries I got acknowledge from 2, and only 1 called and we engaged in some discusion of models and options. Looks like dealers in Houston prefer to deal in person, not by fax nor internet. Time was running down on the $1000 incentive so I decided to arm myself with the best numbers and hit the dealer that gave me most info on my prospective car.
In the end I pulled the trigger last night with a
MODEL 8642A 2005 4RUNNER 4 DOOR SR5
STRATOSPHERE MICA 08QO/DARK GREY FG12 INVOICE MSRP
MFG BASE PRICES 23727.00 27495.00
TOTAL FACTORY OPTIONS 564.00 705.00
TOTAL PORT OPTIONS 269.00 533.00
DELIVERY 595.00 595.00
T.D.A. 275.00 0.00
M.A.F. 379.00 0.00
2%HOLDBACK MSRP 549.00 0.00
PIO HOLDBACK 42.00 0.00
DEALER ADDED OPTIONS 0.00 0.00
FLEET PRICE PROTECTION 0.00 0.00
1%FINANCE RESERVE MSRP 274.00 0.00
FLEET CREDIT 0.00 0.00
**PRICING TOTALS** 26674.00 29328.00
CODE -----------------------DESCRIPTION-------------------------------- --- INVOICE MSRP
AW17" ALLOY WHEELS W P265/65R17 80.00 100.00
CM DOUBLE DECKER CARGO 100.00 125.00
DR BLACK ROOF RACK 176.00 220.00
FE 50 STATES EMISSIONS 0.00 0.00
NE LEATHER STEERING WHEEL 176.00 220.00
RL DAYTIME RUNNING LIGHTS 32.00 40.00
TOTAL FACTORY OPTIONS 564.00 705.00
*PORT INSTALLED (BM) 0.00 0.00
*PORT INSTALLED (SN) 0.00 0.00
P4 VEHICLE SHIELD PACKAGE 95.50 349.00
M5 CARPET MAT SET (5 PC) 112.00 184.00
F1 VIP SALES FOLLOW UP 6.95 0.00
I2 PDS WITH TEXAS STATE INSP. 46.75 0.00
G1 VEHICLE FUELING 7.80 0.00
TOTAL PORT OPTIONS 269.00 533.00
PRICE AGREED = INVOICE+200 W/WHEEL LOCKS INCLUDED
MINUS 1000$ CASH INCENTIVE
PRICE AGREED = 25874.00 AFTER REBATE+TTL
I wasn't able to reconstruct this pricing independently from KBB or TMV Edmunds, so at first it was kind of difficult to validate. I did some cross shopping with another dealer (Sterling) which allowed me to corroborate the figures. In the end I bought from Champions on Gulf Freeway. It was hard nosed because when I came to trade in my van, they wanted to lowball it initially, until we arrived at a reasonable amount.
But I finally got my 4Runner and it sure runs like silk.....
Did you pull the deal off for 05 Sport? I am in NE as well. Looking to see how you made out.
Thanks!!
As far as I can tell, they are double dipping - not subtracting the holdback they are getting, and adding it back into the invoice price a second time.
What gives? Are they all playing this game, or do I misunderstand how Toyota's costs are calculated.
Note that the error I got was not a salesman's hand calculations, where he made an honest mistake - this was the computer printout !!!
Art
kirstie_h
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How about that finance reserve line item? Is that also supposed to be subtracted a la "holdbacks"?When I arrived, my invoice figures (Edmunds/KBB) where roughly $500 below. This is one of those where you don't wanna know more than you should because it's a fait accomplí - done deal. On the other hand I look at the bright side of it, I needed the car (as much as I wanted), our van was pretty much finished and I got a trade-in value that beat by $500 the original trade-in price by the dealer. By the way, I never mentioned trade the first day, only when I showed to pick up the car, and the new car price was frozen. At this point I used as leverage the fact we had spent several hours reaching price agreements, plus the fact I had another identical deal with a better trade-in price (+$500), and the real fact that the minute I walked out of there, my business was going somewhere else. Minutes later we cut the deal. The last straw was that I had my own credit union financing arranged, so they were not going to screw me there either.
alibajalajaula
I am looking at an 05 4Runner Sport V6 4X4. I was advised that Toyota is not currently building with the side air bags. The dealer searched the Northeast and NY region to try and find one that may have it
The dealer invoice adds all these numbers, including the holdback to get the dealer invoice. I believe this is wrong - the holdback should be subtracted from the Toyota invoice, not added, since this is a credit to the dealer, not a cost. In my understanding, the dealers who do this are padding their invoice by double dipping the holdback.
Do I misunderstand holdbacks, or is this practice widespread, misrepresenting the true dealer cost of a vehicle?
Art
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Kelly
Click on this link or type it in on your browser and it will lead you to an article explaining "Holdback". http://www.edmunds.com/advice/incentives/holdback/index.html It contains 3 pages of info. The bottom line on holdbacks is if you see it on the invoice, make sure it is subtracted from the cost of vehicle to you and not added on. Holdback is a deal between dealer and factory and the buyer has no responsibility for it. Print it and hold for referance. Holdback money usually last for 3 months. This helps the dealers pay for the financing cost while the vehicle sits on the lot. The longer it sits, the less holdback money the dealer gets from the factory until theres nothing left. Depending on what vehicle is purchased, holdback money can amount to $600.00 and above; see the article. So if the holdback time has run out, the dealer should not be charging you for stocking his lots with unsold cars. That's his problem and the factory. Bob.
Did pull the trigger on the '05 sport,6cyl,4wd (#8666) with SR,CM,RL,RF,CF...out the door for $27,700 (including all rebates).
Dealer seemed really eager to put the deal together.....I was in the chair only about 15 minutes after test drive and vehicle inspection.
In hind-sight I think I could have squeezed him a little more...dealer is in norwood. 2nd largest toyota dealer in the US (world)...salesman claimed they average 700+ toyotas a month.
Which dealership did you end up getting the 4Runner from? Ensign or the other SLC Dealer.
I might be looking, but I am closer to Brent Brown or Karl Malone.
Thanks to everyone for their help.
$50 over the KBB.com invoice price, before the $900 rebate.
$32,960 MSRP, $29,250 invoice (KBB), final cost $28,400.
Dealer is Toyota City in Brooklyn Park, MN.
I'm also in MN considering a 4Runner. Did you shop around between the dealerships? Did you have to negotiate hard to get that price or were they dealing openly?
Also, was it a truck on the lot or an order?
Thanks.
Yes, the truck was on the lot. I must say I'm not crazy about the appearance of the rear spoiler, but anything on the lot in this area will have it (for some reason, Toyota thinks everyone in the Chicago region needs a spoiler. Argh...).
Good luck! Please post your results when you swing a deal.
Is this True?
http://pressroom.toyota.com/photo_library/display_release.html?id- =20050128
Toyota Announces Price Adjustments on Selected 2005 Models
01/28/2005 Torrance, CA
Toyota Motor Sales (TMS), U.S.A., Inc., today announced new base vehicle pricing for certain 2005 model year cars and trucks.
The price adjustment for 15 selected Toyota and Scion models reflects an average Manufacturer's Suggested Retail Price (MSRP) increase of $142, or 0.6%. Scion models receive the following average MSRP increase: the xA subcompact, $50 or 0.4 percent, the xB urban utility vehicle, $50 or 0.4 percent and the tC sports coupe, $50 or 0.3 percent.
Toyota models, and their average MSRP increase, include: the Sequoia full-size SUV, $100 or 0.3 percent, the Tundra full-size pickup truck, $100 or 0.4 percent, the Camry Solara coupe, $100 or 0.4 percent, the Land Cruiser full-size SUV, $300 or 0.5 percent, the Matrix crossover utility vehicle, $100 or 0.6%, the Corolla compact sedan, $100 or 0.7 percent, the Camry sedan, $150 or 0.7 percent, the Sienna van, $200 or 0.8 percent, the Highlander mid-size SUV, $200 or 0.8%, the Echo sedan, $100 or 0.9 percent, the RAV4 compact sport utility vehicle (SUV), $200 or 1.0 percent and the 4Runner mid-size SUV, $300 or 1.0 percent.
The price adjustment on all 15 models will take effect on February 7.
MSRP is 29,700. Invoice is approx. 26,400. After the 1,000 rebate, price is 25,400. It looks like the offer is 500 under "invoice". Seemed kind of low considering that it was his first offer.
Here is the kicker: they then appraised my Tacoma (I insisted on getting a quote before getting my truck appraised) for about 2,500 less than the trade in value on both KBB and Edmunds (within 100 of each other). The truck was washed, cleaned, buffed (sparkles like a diamond) before going to the dealer. Cosmetically and mechanically, in excellent shape . . . just passed inspection (in Feb.) and replaced front brake pads. I then pointed out that the configuration they used to appraise the truck was incorrect (left out several options). Anyway, an hour later the trade in value was "raised" to 1000 below the value on Kbb and Edmunds. I walked (was ready to seal the deal just couldn't force myself to accept the trade in price). What do you think?
BTW: In addition to the quoted price, paperwork is approx. 150, and of course taxes (one of those sure things in life).
Thanks for any advice.
I know sources like Consumer Reports say that you should first negotiate the new car, then introduce the trade, but unless you're really willing to buy the new car outright and sell the trade yourself, I consider this bad advice. Too often the dealer will feel like they have you over a barrel by getting your committment on the new car so they can low-ball the trade. Further, my experience is that trade-in appraisals vary much MUCH more than the deal that they'll give you on the new car price. So you're really more concerned about the +/- $2K variance in trade value than you are with the +/- $500 variance in what the dealer will do on the new car.
If you don't want to sell your car yourself, I think it is a better idea just to do the entire negotiation in one step - negotiate on the difference between new car and trade + TTL. This simplifies things and you get out of the problem you just got into.
- Mark
My requirements were a vehicle that was Salsa Red (preferred)or Gold, a SR5 V6 RWD, it have 17" wheels, the roof rack, leather wrapped steering wheel and shift knob. I figured I could purchase floor mats after market and save a considerable amount based upon the $225 MSRP from the dealers and $188 invoice price. I wrote up a letter outlining these requirements, indicated that I would be purchasing the weekend of January 29th (last weekend of January), that the vehicle must be in stock and available for delivery, there were no second chances for their best drive out price including all fees and taxes, no trade was involved (but I did have a car I could have traded) and that if a deal was offered and I came in and the deal changed I would walk and take my business to another dealer. I then sent this letter in the form of an email to all the Toyota dealers internet departments (found the contacts online) and waited for their replies, which began coming in almost immediately.
I was surprised that the dealerships I thought would respond with the best pricing (Atlanta, Stone Mountain , Mall of GA, and World Toyota) actually responded with some of the highest pricing and in the case of World continually responded with vehicles that were not in stock (I assume they were tyring to get me in the door for an attempt to switch me to another vehicle). The dealerships with the best price and most aggressive stance were Cobb County Toyota and Cherokee County Toyota and I would have purchased from one of these two dealerships if they had the color I was seeking (salsa red was my preferred color), but there seemed to be a shortage of this color. Many dealers quoted me the one I eventually bought, but all were quoting me around $27000 plus tax (6% or another $1620) and tag ($70). Cobb County and Cherokee quoted me drive outs on a gold 4Runner equipped as I stated for $25900 ($24276 purchase price, $1554 tax, and $70 tag & title). Marietta Toyota also offered a good deal, but it was on a 4Runner that was Salsa Red that was over equipped for my needs (sunroof and upgraded stereo among other options I didn't need).
As I stated earlier I eventually purchased the vehicle from Sandy Springs Toyota since they had it in stock and negotiated fairly. I did pay about $350 more than I would have to Cherokee or Cobb County Toyota, but I got the color I wanted and in addition to all the options I requested the 5 piece floor mats. The first offer on drive-out price they made me on the vehicle was $26500, I countered with $26100, they came back and split the difference at $26300 - then the wife factor occured (she said she wanted it) and since I felt good that we got a good deal I went ahead.
Sandy Springs Toyota was very easy to work with and we took delivery from them on Wednesday, January 26th. The finance guy we worked with was very good as well, not pushy, and provided no undue surprises.
So here are my recommendations for buying a 4 Runner:
1. Know what you want including options and aggresively shop it to all the dealerships in the area. You will identify the serious dealerships quickly.
2. Have your financing arranged before you start contacting dealerships. Credit unions currently have great rates.
3. Know the invoice cost of the vehicle, options, and holdback and start your negotiations from the invoice cost of the vehicle and options less the holdback (usually 2% of MSRP for Toyota) and less any rebates or marketing incentives. This information is available for free from Edmunds, and for a fee from Consumer Reports and I did purchase a 3 month subscription for $39 which I felt helped me drive a excellent deal. I found Consumer Reports information to be more accurate.
4. Don't go to the dealership (except to test drive the general make you are interested in at least 1 week before you begin the actual purchasing process) until you have a firm price from a dealer and they have faxed you a buyers order. In other words make them commit on paper before you go to do the deal. I did and it worked very well.
5. If you go into the dealership and something is not going per your predetermined agreement - leave. There are at least 2 other dealerships out there dying to have your business.
6. Watch out for extra fees (documentation and marketing). I simply ignored these and made them part of the price I was paying for the car.
I too live in the Atlanta area was impressed by the deal you recently earned on your new 4Runner. I've been considering the purchase of a good used 03-04 model in the low to mid $20K range, but seeing what you paid for an 05, I may pursue a new one.
Your homework and patience obviously paid off. Anyway, I hope to learn from your lessons. One thing I've always heard is that dealers typically make significant profit from the loan. You stated your dealer had a plan with your credit union and you got a good rate. I too use CU's and have saved tons of $$ over the years.
My question to you is, if you walk in with you own loan, aren't you going to see resistance to negotiate? I wonder if you could have obtained as good a deal if the dealer didn't have a plan prearranged with your CU. My CU, Associated CU, offers their tax saver loan, in which they use your home equity and the interest is tax deductible. I want to use this type loan, but not run into a wall when I try to low ball the dealer. Comments? Thank you. PE
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Thanks!