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VW Passat TDI

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Comments

  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    Thanks for the heads up!
  • jimlockeyjimlockey Member Posts: 265
    The coldest weather I've started one of my diesels is 19 which by northern standards is not very cold, but at 19 it only took a couple more minutes to warm up. Then another 5 minutes for the heater to start putting out warm air. This was with my Cummings. My Ford is not that cold natured and I can plug it in if I need to. As for the VW, it doesn't take as long and with heated seats who cares.

    My personal experence is I can't tell much difference. I love the new generation of diesels and plan on getting another diesel when I can afford it.

    One of my concerns about getting a diesel is someone is trying to buy out VW and they are the main people importing diesels automobiles to the US. I thank there are those who would like to stop diesels...................
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    Very good, I like those ideas. As long as CARB has their head in the wrong place I think all is fair...
  • dieselbreathdieselbreath Member Posts: 243
    RE: "All diesel cars are notoriously slow in warming the interior"

    You're close, sort of...
    Actually all engines that are all cast iron are slow to warm up, gas or diesel.
    VW diesels have aluminum heads, so the coolant is warmed quickly just like in your gas car.
    There's little difference. But an aluminum block gas enging will warm much faster, and even a normal (iron block, alum heads) V6 gas will warm faster than the TDI because its burning much more fuel.
    Its all simple thermodynamics.

    But for older designs that are 100% cast iron that was true.
  • weebil1weebil1 Member Posts: 10
    After about 6 weeks of struggle, I finally picked up my TDI today-so far so good. The original quote was $2000 over MSRP, but was whittled down (I had time to look for others at MSRP that could be shipped to my area) for $250 over MSRP. I suspect some of the "delay" was people with more cash flow stepping in to outbid me, as several cars "on the way" became unavailable the day before I was to receive it.
    Excuse #1 Sent the wrong car
    Excuse #2 Engine was "blown"
    I don't care to go into the hallaballoo the car I received supposedly went through. Let's just say I am happy to see my gas fuel needle stay in a consistant position after a days drive.
    And the sooner I figure out how to "shift" a Triptronic without taking my foot off the gas first the better. I'm going to get picked up on suspicion of a DUI really soon.
  • dieselbreathdieselbreath Member Posts: 243
    I read a few scary articles suggesting the TDIs may be discontinued in North America.
    Our Passat TDI Wagon is now officially scheduled to arrive in October and it will be a 2005.
    But it appears that Canada's allotment of TDI wagons is gone indefinitely (there are still sedans, but they are somewhat rare too).

    So, my wife will be keeping her TDI wagon for a LONG time once it arrives.

    I'd like to test an A6-TDI. Audi says they'll be selling A4 TDIs in Canada next fall, but aren't certain about any other models.
    The A4 is a tight fit for me.
    The Benz CDI looks interesting too.
    Anybody test one of those yet?
  • sebring95sebring95 Member Posts: 3,241
    You just never know what VW is going to do when it comes to TDI's. They have plenty of demand around the world for them, we seem to get the scraps. As for the Benz CDI, I've checked one out and it's a slick machine. The diesel is far and away more advanced/slick than anything VW offers to the NA market. My only complaint is it's RWD only which means it would be staying home even more than my current FWD TDI. I'm sure the Audi would come with AWD so that would interest me even more. You do realize the A4 is the kissing cousin to the Passat? Essentially the same interior specs. The mercedes feels about the same up front to me.
  • dudleyrdudleyr Member Posts: 3,469
    A4 has less room in the rear seat than the Passat.
  • cactus5cactus5 Member Posts: 22
    I live in Phoenix and have been interested in VW diesels. I have been researching the vw diesels for quite sometime, and I am sold on them. I would be interested in doing this. How does one go about doing this. I would like to know more about it. Thanks
  • dieselbreathdieselbreath Member Posts: 243
    This should be interesting...

    Cactus5: looks like a great way to test a car you are interested in, but uncertain of!

    Sebring: how do you feel about buying a new car for someone you don't know in another state? A little scary?

    One simple solution to consider is a letter of credit. Sebring puts up the money to purchase the slightly used TDI in the near future, but its in an LOC. Cactus knows the money is there and Sebring can't reneg on the deal, but also that he has to meet the terms of the agreement to release the funds (can't thrash the car, or put 20k miles on it, etc.)

    This is how you sell North American product into Korea, China, etc.
    They put the money into an LOC in a bank in your town, and you get the funds once the product arrives.

    In fact, there was several million dollars of Canadian beef crossing the Pacific when the mad-cow thing hit. Even though the product was banned in Korea when it arrived, the Canadian suppliers got paid (they met the terms in the LOC) which is lucky for them. It means the importers in Korea went bankrupt instead of the ranchers. (Don't ask what happened to the beef ... it didn't go to waste though)
  • sebring95sebring95 Member Posts: 3,241
    I don't know the full details of how my friend is doing this, but it's something like this;

    You pay me $2,000 for an option to purchase a used '04 TDI Passat at 7500 miles for $23,000 ($25,000 MSRP-$2,000). If for any reason I don't/can't deliver the vehicle, the option is refundable. If you don't exercise the option, you're out $2,000 (and I have an extra car to deal with). You get a slightly used TDI with 7500 miles for a pre-determined price. I get somewhat free new-car transportation for 7500 miles.
  • machaanmachaan Member Posts: 30
    When I was car shopping in March Gas GLS were available at invoice, while TDIs were at or above MSRP. $2000 buys a lot to gas, even at todays inflated prices. Add $1000 more if you can drive stick.
  • dieselbreathdieselbreath Member Posts: 243
    You're missing the other factors, but first look at your argument.
    2000 buys a lot of gas ... yes. At only $2 a gallon its 1000 gallons.
    But based on this price argument you'll be buying a Kia. Have fun!
    ... but seriously, if you don't drive a lot you are absolutely right.

    Where I live, a TDI costs more than a 1.8t, but the difference is less than US$1000. But even that $1000 buys EVEN MORE diesel than gas.

    Why a TDI will save you money:
    One can argue about the cheaper maintenance, but that's not the big story. Its resale. The funny thing about selling your car is that you have to find someone who wants to buy a USED car instead of NEW. And that's usually because they don't have as much money. So they often are concerned about operating costs, such as fuel and maintenance. And also how long it will last, because they're likely not planning to replace it until they have to.

    There are so few used VW Passat diesels to choose from (the owners hold onto them) that its hard to research, but there are lots more Mercedes.
    So I popped onto Autotrader and did 2 advanced searches:
    1996-1999 E320 sedan, over 100,000 miles, GAS fuel
    111 ads with an average price of $13547 and median mlg ~115,000
    1996-1999 E300 sedan, over 100,000 miles, DIESEL fuel
    22 ads with an average price of $17478 and median mlg ~140,000
    (to get median mileage I sorted the ads on mileage and then took the ads in the middle of the list)

    So, ignoring the cheaper fuel, using less of it, saving on maintenance, etc.. the story with Benz is that you can put 20% more miles on your car, and still sell it for a 30% premium over a gas model.

    Intangibles are that is sells faster (Passat TDIs are a sellers market because of HUGE demand from people who can't afford a new one) it performs better in "normal" driving, Plus that AUTO in the Passat TDI that everyone on this forum hates is actually a bonus at resale because manuals generally sell for less (and are harder to sell) than autos in the US.
    But that last argument is weakest for VWs, because the owners tend to be enthusiasts more than with other makes of automotive appliances.

    So, its been said before: if you don't put a lot of miles on (or won't own the car long) get the gas, but if you drive a lot or want a car that lasts forever spring for the diesel ... it pays in the long run.
  • dieselbreathdieselbreath Member Posts: 243
    Actually, buying a diesel VW in the US has nothing to do with economy or performance. Its about being different without standing out.
    Diesel owners are all closet anarchists.
    Watch out! (and never cut one off in traffic... )
  • dieselbreathdieselbreath Member Posts: 243
    I did the same classifieds search on Passats, and (as expected) there are very few.
    Here's the results:
    1996-1997 Passat sedan, over 100,000 miles, GAS fuel, 4-cyl. 5-spd.
    2 ads with an average price of $5997 and HIGHEST mlg 110,168
    1996-1997 Passat sedan, over 100,000 miles, DIESEL fuel, 4-cyl. 5-spd.
    2 ads with an average price of $6440 and LOWEST mlg 151,000

    2 datum does not a statistical sampling make, but even with 50% higher mileage (the other TDI has >175,000 on it) the TDI still sells for more.

    So if you drive a lot...
  • cactus5cactus5 Member Posts: 22
    You guys should know that I'm 53 years old and all my friends say I have a tendency to drive a bit to slow at times. Sebring brings up a good point,I would be SCARED to sign an agreement with someone I don't know. Personally I would be making a lot of trips over to California to get those 7500 miles on the car quickly and then buying my own TDI passat if I liked it. What is an LOC?
  • dieselbreathdieselbreath Member Posts: 243
    An LOC is a letter of credit.
    Its a monetary instrument where someone deposits money into an account for someone else (like a check, except backed by cash) and the receiver has to meet the terms of the letter of credit to discharge the funds.

    Think of it as a money order with some conditions attached. And if the conditions are not meant, then the person who provided the money gets it back.

    For example, you buy a $23,000 car after receiving a letter of credit from Sebring's bank stating that there is $22,250 held pending these criteria:
    - you must provide a Passat TDI to him with between 7500 and 8000 miles on it.
    - the deal must conclude before September 30th, 2004
    - there must be no damage to the car, of if there is your insurance must repair it first, and the damage cannot exceed $2000
    - etc.

    These are sample figures and dates and terms, but you get the idea.
    The LOC (letter of credit) protects you to make sure that if you live up to your side of the bargain you get paid.
    The LOC protects Sebring because his funds are held by the bank and you can't get his money without him getting the car as per the terms of the agreement.
    I'd suggested that the sale price be the tax-in purchase price minus $750 so you pay 10 cents per mile as conpensation for using a new car, but you guys can arrange whatever numbers you want.

    An LOC is a standard form of monetary escrow that is handled by most major banks. It is primarily used for payments for international purchases where neither the buyer nor seller has much legal recourse if something goes wrong.

    For example, when I'm buying electronic parts from Korea or China:
    If I send them money first and don't get parts, what can I do?
    But if they send me parts first and I don't pay, what can they do?
    If I put the money into an LOC contingent on the parts arriving (and meeting certain quality criteria) then they know that I've paid the money into an LOC and I can't get it back if they meet the terms.
    So, we arrange a deal. Then I put the money into the bank and they provide the vendor with the letter of credit verifying the funds are there. The vendor sends me the parts. I tell them the parts have arrived and are the right parts in the right quantity and acceptable quality. The bank releases the funds.

    Talk to your bank about a letter of credit.
  • machaanmachaan Member Posts: 30
    "You're missing the other factors, but first look at your argument.
    2000 buys a lot of gas ... yes. At only $2 a gallon its 1000 gallons.
    But based on this price argument you'll be buying a Kia. Have fun!"

    So diesel Passat is more fun to drive than gas?
    I prefer stick. Even if TDIs came with stick, they are significantly slower than
    most minivans(Sienna, Odyssey, Quest).

    If Gas and TDI are priced the same, I might have been driving a TDI now.

    I am wondering what other factors I am missing apart from the tiny TDI badge on the trunk.
  • weebil1weebil1 Member Posts: 10
    O.K., granted I just came off of driving a Jeep Wrangler (15-20mpg) but I grew up driving stick shifts. I just spent the day getting familiar with my new TDI, and now that I can get a grip on when to use the shift-triptronic dohicky without feeling for the clutch, I have to say, it's alot of fun. I have never driven a diesel before, but in speaking to people who inquire about my new car, there seems to be a misconception that diesels have no zip. NOT TRUE! Loads of power, and you can control it by dropping the gears like you would in a stick, and I love watching the MPG monitor show me 42MPG on a straight away. I will be keeping the car long term, and I drive alot for my job, so for me it's worth not going through the &%$#* at the dealership for another 10 years-maybe more. Also, as Biodiesel increases in availablity, I fully expect to spend the $600 for a conversion kit and fuel up at my local restaurant! (not just yet, it is a new car...)
  • dieselbreathdieselbreath Member Posts: 243
    Not only is bio-diesel a reneweable resource (unlike decomposed dinasoars there is an endless supply) but it has no sulphur in it too, so no acid rain!

    Between diesel engines and bio-diesel fuel, North America could tell the arabs where to pump their oil!

    But even if all commuters switched from their SUVs to TDIs, the need to import might disappear between Alaskan, Canadian, and continental US production of crude.

    I've never heard of a conversion kit. Most people just run a mix of Bio & normal diesel in a stock VW. Please correct me.
  • dieselbreathdieselbreath Member Posts: 243
    ...TDIs came with stick, they are significantly slower than
    most minivans(Sienna, Odyssey, Quest).

    Huh? Compared to a Passat, those minivans handle like a John Deere!
    Our last Passat rode on Yokohama AVS tires, but the next one will have 17" Bridgestone RE750s. I like out-cornering BMWs for fun. How can a van that has to slow to a crawl for a corner be faster than a car that can take corners safely at over twice the posted "slow to" speeds?

    The secret to speed in a Diesel is never slowing for the corners!
  • sebring95sebring95 Member Posts: 3,241
    The diesel can also easily be modified for substantially more power quite easily. You'll need a supercharger, a few grand worth of suspension, and some megga grip tires to keep up in a minivan. My "ultra-slow" Jetta tdi turns 0-60 in about 11 seconds according to the mags. I've got less than $450 in mods and run 0-60 in about 8.5 seconds and still get 45-50mpg like clockwork.
  • sebring95sebring95 Member Posts: 3,241
    If Gas and TDI are priced the same, I might have been driving a TDI now.

    I am wondering what other factors I am missing apart from the tiny TDI badge on the trunk

    I recently considered buying a Passat TDI and for kicks priced a gasser. There was basically $2,000 difference between similarly equipped cars out-the-door (no rebates or deals on TDI's). Diesel is $1.75 this morning, Premium gas (required on 1.8T) is $2.15. Break-even is 60,000 miles assuming they're worth the same on the resale side. But they aren't. The TDI will likely be worth at least $2,000 more on the resale side so the only thing you're out is some interest or present value of cash. In fact, the TDI will likely be worth more than $2,000 more than 1.8T on the tail end. Blue-book value on my '00 Jetta TDI is $1200 more than a 1.8T Jetta. The 1.8T was actually more expensive than the TDI when they were new.
  • weebil1weebil1 Member Posts: 10
    Yes. Sorry. Mixing my sources. You would need a conversion kit to run vegetable oil (you can then pick up old fry oil, filter it, and burn it as fuel. The conversion kit (my understanding) is for that. (which can be FREE! The oil not the kit). The car must start and finish on regular diesel, but once you are moving the kit switches you over to the vegetable oil. There are some places refining it and selling for a $1 a gallon, but I haven't seen this yet. I have been on the road behind someone with a Bio Diesel sticker and had the strange hankering for a Burger and Fries...
  • preferdieselspreferdiesels Member Posts: 30
    In addition to my Passat TDI I have an '03 Odyssey that my wife drives (they don't offer diesels or I would have one). Since I drive both vehicles at different times during the week I can tell you that the VW TDI is NOT, repeat NOT "significantly slower than most minivans...", and in my opinion the TDI is considerably faster than the Odyssey.
  • jimlockeyjimlockey Member Posts: 265
    No people who buy diesel vehicles are buying them for its performance.

     Hook a V8 or V10 to a 5th wheel and drive it to and through the high mountains, then hook a diesel and you will feel the diference and save money while you enjoy the better performance. You will also get another 100 to 200 thousand more miles out of a diesel engine, and the trade-in is higher for a diesel. Yes you pay more for a diesel vehicle because of nothing but pure greed.

    Now drive a VW diesel or even better drive a MB. Not to many people can afford the MB's but the new 320 appears to have the best we have in the US for a car. Go to Europe and you will be able to drive several diesels better than anything we have here.

    The one thing that stands out in a diesel is torque. How do you fell torque. Two ways. Take a highway with plenty of hills that you have driven before, put it in curise and it will stay there most of the time. The diesel will have the torque to pull the hills without down shifting out of overdrive. I have done this with my V6 and my VW. You can also do the same in town. You might be speeding a little bit in places, but incourage your diesel vehicle to go into overdrive (between 40 & 45) sa soon as possible and you can watch the tach go down and the engine smooth out. They have plenty of torque to hold that speed all day long. This is one of the ways to get better mileage in the city.

    For the past year the oil companys have been reducing the amount of sulfur in diesel. Most of the East and West coast and Texas have reduced the amount of sulfur in diesel fuel. Again, Europe has already done so. Cut the sulfur and add a particle collector the diesels will burn as clean as a gas vehicle.

    As long as GM, Ford, and Toyota have control of the automobile industry you will not see much more in diesel vehicles in the US. I hope I'm proven wrong.
  • ratbert1ratbert1 Member Posts: 72
    "As long as GM, Ford, and Toyota have control of the automobile industry you will not see much more in diesel vehicles in the US."

    unfortunately I think you're right. Because of where I live, I need AWD. Right now my only hope is a deisel Jeep Liberty in 2006 when NY allows them to be sold. Ideally VW will sell a diesel 4-motion here, but... fat chance of that happening. In Spain I saw a 4-motion diesel Golf. Maybe someday, but I'm not hopeful. a 4-motion Passat is too expensive for me. Then add the $2k for TDI and forget it.
  • sebring95sebring95 Member Posts: 3,241
    a 4-motion Passat is too expensive for me. Then add the $2k for TDI and forget it.

    They don't even offer (and have no plans to offer) a 4motion Passat TDI here. I know someone that converted a 4motion Passat gasser over to a 2.8L euro spec TDI six-speed though. There's a 4motion Jetta diesel running around somewhere on the east coast (his previous project). That would be a pretty safe buy if you could track the thing down. The Passat swap he just did is waaaaay too technical and there's probably about five people in the US capable of working on any electrical issues. It wouldn't be hard to swap in a 4motion system though if you can get your hands on a Passat TDI to begin with. I think they're tougher to get they hybrids.
  • ratbert1ratbert1 Member Posts: 72
    I wasn't saying that they even made one, only pointing out that, because of where I live, I need AWD and would love an AWD TDI. But IF they made a 4-motion TDI Passat I couldn't afford it. I just have to wait for the 4-motion TDI Golf to make it here from europe I guess.
  • dudleyrdudleyr Member Posts: 3,469
    Before we had all these SUV's running around you could even get a Camry with AWD, or a diesel. I don't think you could get both together though.
  • ratbert1ratbert1 Member Posts: 72
    I definitely want more AWD cars to choose from. My wife is itching to get rid of her Saturn FWD and there are not many options without considering an SUV. We'd like to make the switch before the winter.
  • 2fastdre2fastdre Member Posts: 59
    You will not find a AWD or 4WD Diesel car in the United States (unless it's somebody's one-of-a-kind creation).

    You will find a few AWD/4WD cars that are quite a bit more expensive than your Saturn. You can look at:
    VW Golf R32 AWD,
    VW Passat 4Motion,
    Audi A4 quatrro,
    BMW 330 xi,
    Mercedes C240 4Matic,
    Infiniti G35x,
    Subaru anything AWD,
    Mitsubishi Evo AWD,
    Volvo S60 AWD

    2fastdre.
  • dieselbreathdieselbreath Member Posts: 243
    Then add the $2k for TDI and forget it.

    Where does this crazy figure of $2000 come from?
    I see in the latest Automobile Mag article on diesel vs. hybrid, they have a little review of the Passat TDI and mention that you have to pay an EXTRA $205.00 for a TDI over a gas Passat.

    My Beetle TDI cost CDN$1100- more than a gas Beetle, but the base Beetle engine was the cheap 2.0 gas, not the high performance 1.8t like on the Passat, so the difference should be higher.

    Please lets stop talking about this HUGE premium in price when it doesn't exist!!!
  • sebring95sebring95 Member Posts: 3,241
    Please lets stop talking about this HUGE premium in price when it doesn't exist!!!

    He's talking about real world instead of sticker prices. The Passat TDI's are typically selling for MSRP (especially wagons) and have no incentives. The gassers are easily selling for invoice and have rebates. I can buy a 1.8T 4motion cheaper than a FWD Passat TDI. Course the TDI pays for itself in 40k miles in fuel cost alone. Nevermind vastly superior resale value on the diesel.
  • dieselbreathdieselbreath Member Posts: 243
    Your pricing is quite different there.
    Seems that most Passats are going at MSRP around here.
    I haven't heard of any rebates in Canada from VW EVER!
    They only offer reduced interest occasionally (like 1.9% on Beetles, Jettas, Golfs, but not Passats)

    Also, it seems most people order their cars around here, whereas a lot of people talk about "waiting for inventory" of Passats in the US.
    What's up there? Why would you wait for whatever the manager selects rather than spec'ing out your own car?

    I read that in Europe, about 60% of Golfs are custom orders.
    There are over 1/4 million variations to choose from.
    That equates to over 1000 custom vehicles manufactured per day!
    And that's just Golfs for western Europe.
    Of course, we don't have the variety here (like about 8 different engines, 6 trannies, 2 vs. 4-wd on most models, ...)
  • sebring95sebring95 Member Posts: 3,241
    There's only about five options available on a Passat TDI anyway. ESP, leather, Cold-weather, and color. Dealers can typically trade to get what you want, assuming it exists. When supply is as tight as it is now, nobody will trade for anything. I had a very small window to buy a Passat TDI Wagon a few weeks ago. Arrived and the person it was spoken for couldn't pony up the cash and dealer called me. It was green with grey interior. I probably would have bought it if it had tan interior. Another guy was in line behind me if I didn't want it. He seemed excited to have it regardless of color. I think he would have bought even if it was missing tires, lol! Some folks get way too excited about this stuff!

    I personally don't like to order, I'd rather show-up, actually drive the car I'm going to buy, and then make the decision. I'll be bored with it if I had to wait on it to come in, lol!
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    I just got an email from a Las Vegas dealer that has 5 Passat TDIs in stock. That includes one TDI wagon all priced under $27k. A GL Sedan is $23,635. I am thinking of driving over and grabbing one.

    http://nitra.vwdealer.com/findlay-nv/en_US/
  • todd53todd53 Member Posts: 47
    "Where does this crazy figure of $2000 come from?"

    Ever since the gas prices have been on the rise, my local dealer has been commanding $2,000 OVER sticker price for all TDIs, not just the Passat. And they are pre-selling every one of them even at that price. So this extra cost, for those who are willing to pay it, would be yet another premium over the 1.8T. Luckily, I was able to fly under the radar so to speak, when I purchased my Passat GLS TDI sedan in late April for $1,950 below sticker price, including the $1,000 loyalty rebate. At the time, the Passat TDIs just began arriving, so I guess the dealer didn't realize what a hot commodity this vehicle would soon become.
  • sebring95sebring95 Member Posts: 3,241
    From what I've gathered, they only started building the tan leather (or leatherette) at the very end of the model run. I only know of one and they "ordered" it in Janaury. Just came in as an '04 a couple weeks ago (black with tan). Dark blue with tan leather is what I was wanting. GLS includes the sunroof here (at least it did last year).
  • preferdieselspreferdiesels Member Posts: 30
    I have now driven my Passat TDI 3456 miles and used 114.2 gallons of fuel. That computes to 30.26 MPG on my calculator. Not too bad, but I would like to see it get 35 mpg. On the eight
    fill-ups since I took delivery the best it has done is 32.6 mpg and the worse is 26.6 mpg.
    I have not yet had an occasion to use a full tank on all highway driving, so I don't know what the mpg would be. We take all our trips in a Honda Odyssey which gets 24+ fully loaded driving 75-80 on the highway. How I wish Honda offered a diesel in that vehicle.
  • bjbird2bjbird2 Member Posts: 647
    My 2002 1.8T gets 32mpg highway and 27mpg average city/highway driving, very close to what I'm hearing the TDIs are getting in real world driving.
    Seems like the only advantage to the TDI is the lower fuel cost, but then I paid $1.85 per gallon for premium with my last fill-up at Sam's Club. It would take a long time to make up the $2k difference in the cost of the car with such a small fuel cost difference. Are there any maintainance costs for diesels that gasoline engines don't have?
    I suppose the other TDI advantage is longevity and re-sale.
  • btravelenbtravelen Member Posts: 2
    Regarding price, anyone who buys a vehicle for MSRP is apparently not willing to do the 'legwork' to find a discount on these vehicles. After finding several 'stingy' dealers I found one that quoted me a much lower price and he still made a fair profit.

    If you can afford the sticker price and feel good about paying it, more power to you. Just don't claim that that's the best you could do.
  • jtrujillo86jtrujillo86 Member Posts: 300
    Okay, I have a little dilemma on my hands. I'm trying to talk my mom, who is a hard core, long loving SUV driver, into purchasing a Passat TDI. She has owned two Chevrolet Blazers since 1989, a 1989 and currently a 1999. This one IMO is a piece. It's clock reads about 80K miles and it's been plagued with steering issues, leaky oil cooler lines, bad door bushings, fit and finish issues, ect. She badly wants a Trailblazer after this one goes six feet under. She of course will have to wait four years to get any vehicle since I'm going to college and she's helping me out. Now to my dilemma (sorry it took so long): how can I convince her to convert to a Passat TDI or *possibly* a Jetta TDI? I say possibly on the Jetta because I think going from a Blazer to a Jetta would be like culture shock for her. I REALLY want her to get away from the crappy ride, poor quality and horrible fuel economy that her SUV has handed her. She's single, has no other children and has no reason that I can think of to own an SUV. She claims she feels "safer" and she can see better. Yeah, too bad that the Passat has AWESOME safety reviews compared to the Blazer...anything has better safety than the Blazers I guess...it just doesn't seem to phase her. Anyway, anyone have suggestions on what I could do to convert her? I just downloaded a Passat brochure from the VW website, but it doesn't talk too much about the new 2.0 TDI and it's awesome bennifits. I guess I could just have her go test drive one...

    Jeremy

    BTW, the amount of gas that a mid-sized SUV uses like the Blazer uses is downright disgusting, let alone something like a Suburban or Excursion. I filled up my Mom's tank today...$28.00 midgrade and I noticed she only got about 210 miles to her last tank...that crap should be illegal!
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    Sounds like you have a real sales job on your hands. The TrailBlazer/Envoys are gas hogs according to my partner that owns one. He traded his 2 year old Tahoe on the Envoy and it is worse mileage. His wife wanted something a bit smaller. The TrailBlazer is a quite a bit bigger than the old style Blazer. You might take her for a ride in a BMW smaller SUV also. They have great emission ratings and somewhat better quality ratings than the VWs at this time. If price is the issue then the Passat TDI is your best bet. I know how she feels about seeing over the sea of PU trucks and SUV's. And they all keep getting bigger not smaller.
  • jtrujillo86jtrujillo86 Member Posts: 300
    Yeah my mom is pretty strapped for cash right now and until I get out of school. The BMW will definitely be out of her league. However, she has NEVER owned a non-American vehicle in all her 39 years. That is probably going to be my biggest problem of getting her into a VW.

    JeReMy
  • sebring95sebring95 Member Posts: 3,241
    You'll make your life a lot better if you just leave her alone. She's obviously happy with what she's driving regardless of what you think. I should write a book called "how to make your life better by minding your own business", LOL! My wife has owned nothing but SUV's for many many years (i'm talking waaaay back, landcruisers when they weren't even cool!!) as well and has no desire to drive anything else. I have an Audi A6 that sits in the garage most of the time because she'd rather drive her SUV. She went with me to look at a Passat TDI wagon awhile back and just laughed at it. She did have a much better reaction to the hemi Dodge Magnum, but the mpg would be down there with her GX470 I think!

    I agree with Gagrice, the smaller SUV's really don't do any better on mpg than the big ones so don't bad-mouth the big ones too hard. I have a 4x4 V8 Tahoe I use for long trips, airport runs, some towing, etc. and it gets better mpg than any of the smaller SUV's we've owned.

    I say you should let your mom help you with college, get a job, and buy yourself a Passat. Then you'll both be happy!
  • sebring95sebring95 Member Posts: 3,241
    I have not seen anyone getting numbers similar to your gasser with a diesel. Prefersdiesels numbers above are nearly all city driving IIRC. Based on what I've seen in other forums (with a lot more Passat TDI members than here), your city/hwy average is similar to all city driving with the TDI. Most seem to be averaging about 32-35mpg in a mix of driving, and 35-42mpg in all highway driving. These are all fairly young engines as well. The highest is a guy with 6300 miles and a lifetime average of 35mpg in what appears to be about a 70/30 split of hwy/city. My Jetta mpg rose as I crossed the 10k mile mark. My average jumped about 2mpg between 2k-10k miles.

    Maintenance wise, the TDI fuel filter maintenance is more important than a gasser. I generally change my fuel filters around 20k miles regardless of gas/diesel, but most gassers don't "require" them as often. At least on paper. On the flip side, there's no spark plugs, wires, and coils to maintain on the diesel.
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    That's probably the best advice. When you can afford a TDI get one and take her for a ride. She still may not want to give up her SUV. I took my wife for a test drive in a Passat. She just looked at me and said too small. She has driven an LS400 for 15 years and MB full size sedans before that. She has a little Mazda 626 for grocery/library runs. She will not take the Mazda on the freeway. Once a person gets used to a given size car it's hard changing their minds. I will say her 1990 LS400 still runs and looks like new, with only 79k miles. She will drive my Suburban but prefers her Lexus.
  • dougmgdougmg Member Posts: 13
    I was all set to order a Passat TDI. Then I found out there are no manuals. HOW CAN THAT BE?
  • dudleyrdudleyr Member Posts: 3,469
    Doesn't make sense to me either. Why would you not have the most efficient powertrain (by a large margin) in a vehicle that is all about efficiency?

    For my needs, I would rate a Passat wagon TDI manual over any car available in this country (Yes that includes luxury cars etc). The automatic does not even interest me in the slightest.
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