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Jeep Liberty Diesel

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    renegaderrenegader Member Posts: 73
    Hi Farout, you asked me about my mileage, here are numbers of my last longer trip:

    Board computer mileage 25,9 mpg
    (2x295 miles, 2/3 on highway, continuous speed 82-88 mph. Rest of trip cities at max. 32 mph).

    I am surprised, because there is 10% better mileage after remove the original TracLock diff and installing Powertrax automatic locker.
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    faroutfarout Member Posts: 1,609
    justmecw: It sounds like you are a happy customer for
    K&N filters, and I am happy for you.
    However this subject was beat to death all ready once and maybe twice, and our HOST said that filters were to be talked about in that forum.
    Personally, I have NOT found the CRD to require less maintenance. Maybe in terms of how often you preform maintenance, but when you do as the Owners Manual says according to schedule B, there is much more! Not only that but it cost about 40 to 60% more on top of that.

    Farout
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    faroutfarout Member Posts: 1,609
    renegader: That is excellent fuel mileage! It is clear you know what you are doing, I am very ignorant of doing transmission work. Maybe you should offer your wisdom to DCX so we could continue to have a CRD in our liberties.
    How much is diesel fuel where you are? I paid $2.639 for B-20 today. First time to ever use B-20, but I was nearly out of fuel, and had no choice. I try to avoid Bio fuel.

    Farout
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    siberiasiberia Member Posts: 520
    Justmecw, out of respect for the forum I will not respond to all of your mischaracterizations and exaggerations of what I said and did not say. I’ve seen a K&N up close. I know exactly what it is. I just didn’t know what the filter material was. I will rely on logical members to draw their own conclusions about what I actually said.

    I like my CRD and I think it’s great in spite of a few minor problems. I am getting great mileage and mine runs fine with the stock exhaust and stock air cleaner. I am continually impressed with how well this small engine accelerates the CRD with light throttle.

    My concerns are due to other people’s problems that I hope I don’t get. But I would not accuse people with problems of fixing "what is not broken.”
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    faroutfarout Member Posts: 1,609
    siberia: You responded like a gentleman. Some how we seem to see eye to eye and a good number of Issues. I ran into a situation I never thought I would have to do. I was almost out of fuel. The only diesel fule that I could get was B-20! Which I said I would never use. Not so. I have only gone 60 miles and so far I can't tell any difference. When I get down to half a tank I will add some dino diesel.

    Farout
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    nescosmonescosmo Member Posts: 453
    farout.....We talk about this before my libby have the toe package and is the L.E. my tranny is the 462 RFE not the 545 that is why I was asking, maybe all the tranny problems are in the 545 and not in the 462.
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    justmecwjustmecw Member Posts: 20
    I apaligize if my response came across as harsh.

    I enjoy visiting this forum. I do so almost every night.
    The one thing that is getting old is that there is a few people that post in this forum that have proclaimed themselves as experts on the liberty diesel and not allowing other people to post without telling them that they are wrong. These people are experts on there own liberty not all libertys.

    There are people that visit this forum that want to hear other opinions then those from those few.

    Please allow these other people voice there opinions even if you disagree with them.

    Thank you for your cooperation.
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    eebroeebro Member Posts: 80
    Nes...

    Feel free to find as much information on a Chrysler 462RFE. I can find nothing. Having talked to Star Reps, Chrysler/Jeep transmission specialists, and European enthusiasts as well as owning the technical specification for the 545RFE, I have been unable to verify a smidgen of reality to such a beast as a 462 or 462RFE. In fact, the US version of the CRD (as well as the foreign sales version as far as I can ascertain) avails only the 545RFE as an automatic transmission, which is a 5-speed version with a part# that stands for:
    1) 5-speed version of the
    2) 45RFE 4-speed (which is a moderate/heavy duty--hence the 5)
    3) Rear drive transmission that is
    4) Fully Electronically controlled
    ...hence the 545RFE

    just as the 42RLE is the:
    1) 4-speed light duty (hence the 2) transmission that is
    2) Rear wheel drive with
    3) Limited Electronic control

    so that based on the notion that there is a 462RFE, it follows that you have a:
    1) 4-speed version of the
    2) 62RFE which is a 6-speed light duty transmission...etc
    So then why would Chrysler downscale a 6-speed transmission to 4-speed that is also a light duty version for a Liberty that has a tow package added (therefore needing higher tolerance against breakdown from greater specific forces)??? That doesn't make good sense. I've heard that the xx462xxx nomenclature is an internal Chrysler part number, but I've not heard of the 462RFE.

    Additionally, the tow package for the CRD appears to add nothing but a harness and hitch, which is quite different from the typical Chrysler tow package that usually affords an increased-capacity trans-cooler and radiator as well as load leveling shock absorbers on top of the hitch/harness.

    I'm not attempting to be abrasive, and I could be wrong with the details/outlay, as I have been in the past. However, I challenge you to reference the contents of your manual as well as check with your DCX shop specialist in your area regarding your Lemerty's transmission and setup. And, please, prove me wrong if I am. Let's get empirical data, here.

    Jones
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    tidestertidester Member Posts: 10,059
    Once again by your response you do not know ...

    I think a kinder gentler approach would be in order. Educate rather than posture. That will avoid flames and we'll all be happier. :)

    tidester, host
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    nescosmonescosmo Member Posts: 453
    EEBRO....great info sorry but you are right I look at message #7781, farout said it all, info came from Dan at Yark in Toledo. ounce again thanks.
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    renegaderrenegader Member Posts: 73
    Prices of diesel fuel are in Czech and Austria (and as I know in whole Middle Europa) about 1 EUR/liter.
    It is aprox. 4.8 USD/USgallon. You can make some little party every weekend for the money you save!

    In our Jeep selling points were warnings about using of Bio fuel under loosing of warranty.
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    eebroeebro Member Posts: 80
    ah...you're right. I recall receiving the final confirmation of the 462 story from Farout...thanks.

    Jones
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    new2dieselnew2diesel Member Posts: 148
    Hotelalfa,
    Where in VA are you. I would be happy to fill you in on all the "fun".

    To everyone who was following my troubles on this board: I went to the dealership where I purchased my replacement for the CRD and was told by the Manager that they picked up my old CRD from the repair facility after 44 days in the shop. The drove it to thier dealership. The next day after 5 miles it started shifting poorly again. They parked it. The next morning there was a large puddle of transmission fluid under the CRD. It is back at the Jeep delaership again and they are continuing to work on it. All I can say is THANK GOODNESS I DON"Y OWN THAT THING ANYMORE! :lemon: :lemon: :lemon: :lemon: :sick: I would be LIVID if That happened to me after 44 days in the shop. The good news is this only strengthens my case against Jeep!
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    faroutfarout Member Posts: 1,609
    nescosmo: I can understand how it's easy to make this mistake, I did the same. I called many places and with much determination I found out what the "462" transmission is.
    The 462 on the side of your transmission is used only in the factory as a bin or complete part number, that's all the 462 is used for. You do have the 545 RFE. There is no CRD made that does not have the 462 number on it. I was really excited that the 462 stood for a stronger transmission, and when I found out I felt rather let down, but so help me it's the truth. Hope this helps.

    Farout
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    faroutfarout Member Posts: 1,609
    justmecw: I am no expert at all, and never have claimed to be. However the K&N has been hashed to death, and the HOST asked that these topics be directed to that forum. Like I said before I am glad the filter works well for you. Others have not had good experiences with the K&N. It's good to say what works well no matter who says it, but to labor on about it then it needs to move to the right forum so those who have an interest in such topics can benefit from you experience.
    I have never seen anyone refused a post unless the rules were not followed, so anyone can post, and anyone can state their opinion.
    I do not agree with those who use oil above 5-40w oil. But There is respect, and when posts are made to say the opposite they are posted with respect, it's really simple.
    I encourage you if there is something you are able to provide a source for disagreement stand your ground. But be prepared for some not to agree. This is only a forum, and it's doubtful you will ever see anyone face to face, so relax be cool and just enjoy.

    Farout
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    faroutfarout Member Posts: 1,609
    eebro: Please see my note #7786. The fact is there is no such transmission 462 RFE, it's only a factory bin number. I went to lots of effort to find this out. From this point if any one doubts this then let them believe they have a one of a kind transmission. Every CRD has a sticker on the left side of the transmission with the number "462" but it is a 545 RFE. Maybe this will settle this, but only until the next time.

    Farout
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    eebroeebro Member Posts: 80
    farout,

    Thank you, sir, for your thorough clarification. As the CO would say here at the Naval Air Station at Pax River, "you da man!"

    Jones
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    hotelalfahotelalfa Member Posts: 4
    new2diesel,

    I am in Richmond. You can see my email address in my profile here.

    The irony is that everyone here and at Jeep has a vested interest in keeping the CRD story positive. At some point the bubble will burst.
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    faroutfarout Member Posts: 1,609
    hotelalfa: I think you might have spoke more than you met to say. Even though We have a CRD, I am very open about what ever problems our CRD has happen. At one point after several people were having some serious issues with their CRD,s and we had some problems with shifting into 5th lockup at 65 mph. Nothing the Tec tried did any good. We were seriously considering that we had made a huge mistake. Thank the Lord our Tec R&Red the PCM. From that point after replacing the PCM, not only the shifting improved but fuel mileage went up by 3 mpg. Then I got in contact with a CRD Tec that really knows the CRD in every way you can think of. He works at Yark Jeep in Toledo, Ohio, his name is Dan.
    I am thinking that this vehicle will preform as we had thought from when we bought it. It is important to remember that 11,000 CRD's were made for US use, and the number of CRD owners on this forum are not ever 1/100th of one percent of all the CRD owners.

    Farout
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    nescosmonescosmo Member Posts: 453
    FAROUT.... As hotelalfa said we keep the CRD story positive.
    I think that the 11,000 CRD that were made in the US and the rest that were made in EU; Toledo run out of steam. They run out of engine and tranny and they never thought that the CRD were going to be so sucessfull. I think that the CRD will come back on the 08 with the same engine and with a Particulate filter to pass EPA remember that the ulsd fuel is the key for the success of the new CRD.

    nescosmo.
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    winter2winter2 Member Posts: 1,801
    Here is an update since I installed the K&N air filter.

    Besides the significant decrease in turbo lag, I have noticed that power delivery is more linear. Instead of "sag and shove", power delivery is smoother and less abrupt, almost like driving a naturally aspirated gasser except there is much more low end wallop.

    Still to early to assess fuel economy effect but I have done some short highway runs and FE is unchanged.
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    anomiousanomious Member Posts: 170
    Hey! X neighbor!!! I just installed a "Summit Racing" 26" chambered muffler and when I read your message, I ran out and got me a K&N... I have used K&N for years on my old Cherokee. I will install it later today!
    As far as the oil in the filter is concerned...It's minor compared to the amount of oil that the CCV dumps into the intake system...
    The muffler alone has made a big difference in quietness and performance. I will get back with the total results after the K&N is aboard! :) LK
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    hotelalfahotelalfa Member Posts: 4
    farout,

    I wish I could be as optimistic as you. Owning a motor vehicle in 2006 shouldn't demand so much troubleshooting and searching for solutions as you have done.

    The CRD is fun to drive and in theory a great concept - until you are stuck alone on the highway at 7 am on a Sunday.

    If you manage to get long term value and enjoyment from your CRD then I am envious. And, it will be your success, not Jeep's.
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    justmecwjustmecw Member Posts: 20
    Sence i have had my Jeep I have found that it takes three things to change it from running good to running AWSOME.

    First I installed a K&N air filter.

    Second I changed to a 2 1/2 flow master muffler.

    Third I started using ULSD diesel.

    The two biggest changes were the muffler and the diesel.
    I did not relize how much difference the diesel made until the gas station that I was getting the diesel from had gotten a dilivery of the old diesel by mistake.

    In my oppinion it now runs like it was designed to and it seems like it has less EGR toubles.

    Someone please tell me if Im wrong about this: less retrictive exhaust makes less backpressure makes less EGR flow.

    Im sure when they designed the motor they did not disign it to have a reduced size muffler. And we all know it was disigned to run the lower sulfer diesel from Europe.

    By changing these three things it is just allowing it to run the way it was disigned to run.
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    siberiasiberia Member Posts: 520
    Someone please tell me if Im wrong about this: less restrictive exhaust makes less back pressure makes less EGR flow.

    This seems logical to me. I don't know what sensors the CRD uses to control the throttle inlet valve that ensures EGR flow under certain conditions. This might be a bit of a leap, but enhanced exhaust flow may be able to defeat this system somewhat. This might be why DC restricted the exhaust a little to begin with. Anything that decreases EGR flow without throwing error codes has to be a good thing for performance - doesn't it?

    Prior to my EGR valve failing in the closed position CRD seemed to have less lag, a little better mileage and absolutely less black smoke.
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    winter2winter2 Member Posts: 1,801
    The addition ULSD (S15) makes to performance is the improved cetane. Cetane for S500 is about 40 - 43. The cetane for S15 is or should be 47 or more. In Europe, the EU requires their diesel fuel to have a cetane of 51 or better. Higher cetane, better performance, cleaner, faster burn, more power.
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    thstrangerthstranger Member Posts: 60
    Around here all i can find is "less than 500 ppm" diesel fuel !! how many "ppm" will "ulsd" have ????
    thanks,
    Skeeter
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    bmartinpebmartinpe Member Posts: 51
    The dealer had just replaced my lower ball joints under the recall, but did not check the alignment after doing so. I thought that any time the front suspension was worked on, it would need to be re-aligned. DCX agreed with the dealer. See below.

    Dear William:

    Thank you for contacting the Chrysler Group Customer Assistance Center.

    The lower ball joint recall does not include an alignment. If the
    dealership would have determined the vehicle needed an alignment this
    matter should have been discussed with you.

    We suggest that you contact the service management for further
    assistance with this issue.

    Thanks again for your email.

    Sincerely,

    Karrie

    Senior Staff Representative
    Chrysler Group Customer Assistance Center
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    zachinmizachinmi Member Posts: 228
    You will eventually see stickers on the pumps saying something like "Ultra Low Sulfur Diesel - 15 PPM or less - approved for use in 2007+ highway diesel engines"

    Probably not that precise language, but something similar.

    ULSD is 15 parts per million (PPM) or less.
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    nescosmonescosmo Member Posts: 453
    I would like to find out what muffler can i install that give me low noise and better performance than the one i have. You all talk about size of piping, what size of pipe would i need to have what i want. thanks..........
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    justmecwjustmecw Member Posts: 20
    The exhaust pipe on the desiel liberty is 2 1/2 but the muffler is a 2 1/4. I had just the muffler changed to a 2 1/2 flow master. It is now only slightly loader then with the stock muffler.
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    winter2winter2 Member Posts: 1,801
    DynoMax has a cat back system for the CRD. Someone else mentioned 2.5 inch pipe in a very recent post.

    I just found the paper with the diagram and part numbers on it from DynoMax. It does show 2.5 inch pipe.

    The part numbers are 51002 for the adapter that goes between the CAT and the muffler.

    The tailpipe is part number is 54288. There are two hangers, 35337 and three mufflers 17748, 17289, and 17513. The last two are the Ultra Flo model. The 17289 is the stainless steel version while other is aluminized steel.

    Hope this helps.
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    winter2winter2 Member Posts: 1,801
    Not quite an ex-neighbour yet. If we cannot sell our house in Maryland then the move to Florida is toast.

    You say something that is of interest to me namely the amount of oil in the CCV system of your CRD. Are you seeing a great deal of oil in th CCV or aftercooler hoses? Which oil are you using? Could you be over filling your CRD with oil?
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    winter2winter2 Member Posts: 1,801
    Farout's words about the trans are true. Every Liberty CRD has a RFE545 in it.

    The local Jeep Dealer here in Delray Beach says it is a stout trans that has been quite trouble free and reliable.
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    anomiousanomious Member Posts: 170
    Hi! I really like my Summit Racing chambered muffler # SUM630725P. It's 26" long plus the 2, 2"' lomg ports. It's 2 1/2" straight through. I love the quietness and the added performance...Also it's only 3 1/2 inches in diameter.

    Check it out... http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=SUM%2D630725P&N=7- 00+400304+306110+115&autoview=sku

    I hope it's ok to give a link to a specific part!

    Good luck friend! LK
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    anomiousanomious Member Posts: 170
    Hi! Neighbor!!! I'm using Shell Rotella T 5w-40! I am just keeping the oil level in the cross-hatched area...not full up. When I change again I will install my fumoto valve and measure the oil so that I will be able to calibrate my dipstick.
    Taylorsville is pumping B-100 again!

    :) LK
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    joe233joe233 Member Posts: 43
    I'm interested in getting a CRD but have some concern about the problems I have seen posted here and other boards.
    Is this just a few vehicles having issues or is the CRD really a problematic vehicle?
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    whitgallmanwhitgallman Member Posts: 121
    We're seeing 49 cetane on fuel at the plant.
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    dmrohiodmrohio Member Posts: 1
    OK, I have a standing quote right now for the following:
    2006 Jeep Liberty Sport 4X4 CRD
    Inferno Red
    Trailer Package
    Smoking Package
    Leather Wrap Steering Wheel
    Speed Control/Fog Lights/Deep Tint Sunscreen Glass
    Sirius Sat Radio

    Sticker Price $27,250
    Quoted Price $22,800

    Does anyone have an opinion on the price? It seems decent to me for the package on this truck. Naturally, I'm worried about all of the problems I've read about here online, namely transmission, EGR as well as overall fuel economy.

    I'm not one to spend a ton of time working on new cars nor do I want to be driving around in a rental as mine is being fixed. I guess my overall concern is that Jeep only produced 11,000 of these things for the States and I'm worried that four years down the line someone is going to say "not available" or "really expensive to replace/repair".

    Opinions?
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    cerichcerich Member Posts: 9
    yeah buy it, late production isn't as problematic.
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    bulletbob709bulletbob709 Member Posts: 2
    It's a very good price and a good package as it is exactly what we bought except ours is Brilliant Silver without
    Satellite Radio.

    We have 14K on ours with no problems at all except two recalls that never tripped computer lights. I've always used the Power Service additive, LSD diesel while anxiously awaiting the arriva of ULSD, and 5W40 synthetic oil on a 6K cycle.

    It's been an outstanding vehicle for us and we are pleased.

    As far as parts go, don't worry. All but engine is still made in the US and available. The engine and its sisters are still being made in Italy and it's possible the CRD will
    still be made in Toledo for export. I haven't stayed fully up on other posts here with that info.

    The worst part will be tech knowledge at the dealership
    and as many posters have observed that is hit and miss.
    Some places have truly talented and dedicated techs and others have a sleepy bear mentality as in "I ain't ever seen one of them before".

    You have to remember, too, that many boards like this
    are frequented by people who do have problems with their vehicle and are exasperated and perhaps even desperate and
    mad looking for any available help.

    Yes, we have considered purchasing an extended warranty
    and with info provided by posters here will investigate that angle. It may be well worth it. We have 22K miles and 28 months to decide.

    Our mileage is 19-22 in town, 23-25 on the highway at mostly 75. The 4X4 is terrific in bad weather which for us is
    torrential rain. I occasionally pull a heavy trailer, within limits of course, without any problems. The CRD doesn't even downshift on a local hill.

    Overall we are very pleased with our Jeep CRD. I do hope DCX is indeed serious about bringing quality diesel power to the US market.

    We don't have our emergency supply of diesel at home as yet.

    We were in the path of Katrina and the fuel lines were unreal especially for those who didn't top off ahead of the storm. We didn't have the diesel then but have given much thought and called a couple of people about how to set things up and even with the same original CRD B5 fuel blend.

    Good luck with it and we hope you are happy.
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    faroutfarout Member Posts: 1,609
    winter2: If a TC in a CRD is gone why don't they get a DCX rebuilt? I beleive the man hour cost is more to have a Tec rebuild with patching worm parts, than getting a CDX rebuilt, R&R labor is the same cost, and rebuild time might be more, especially if it takes two trys. Makes me wonder why new2diesel dealer did not just put a in rebuilt, in the second place. Now it's the trird time maybe someone might just wake up.

    Farout
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    zachinmizachinmi Member Posts: 228
    My two cents - while I'm a big fan of biodiesel, I wouldn't store it as an emergency fuel unless you were planning on rotating regularly. Pure biodiesel is only good for about a month after production. Blends like B20, B5 etc. are typically good for up to 6 months. Pure petrodiesel is good for up to 12 months depending on how fresh and pure it is. Basically, any reserve needs to be rotated, but if it contains biodiesel it will have to be rotated more often.
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    faroutfarout Member Posts: 1,609
    dmrohio: I do not know if you know that X service men and women get a $500. rebate? There is also a $3000. rebate as well. Most dealers are eager to dump their 06 load. We bought a daughter a Liberty Sport gas this weekend and it was was $6,000. off at the end price. Your deal sounds ok, but they just might go a tad bit better especially because this CRD has been sitting from last may when they stopped making the CRD. You might try Yark in Toledo. They gave a very good price on a Sport that was loaded up more with extras. See if they will come down $800. more. Can't hurt to ask.

    Farout
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    faroutfarout Member Posts: 1,609
    joe233: There were 11,000 CRD's made total for the USA. I doubt that there is even 1/100 of 1 percent on this forum. If you can get a good deal have no fear. Some have had problems, true. The odds are some will come out with issues tat the factory should have caught. But the most important thing is do you have a excellent CRD Tec to work on your CRD if you buy one? The Tec is the biggest problem, not the vehicle.

    Farout
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    faroutfarout Member Posts: 1,609
    bulletbob: We have 20,300 miles on ours. You make your points clear and to the point, and I agree with your post, and will say AMEN!

    Farout
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    winter2winter2 Member Posts: 1,801
    I agree with your analysis. I am surprised that DCX is not simply replacing the TC with either a new updated part or remanufactured part. If they are doing what you say they are doing, then it is nuts in my view.

    FYI. The tech here is Delray Beach says that the addition of an extra trans cooler is a very worthwhile addition even if you do not tow. My interpretation of this statement is add the cooler.
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    winter2winter2 Member Posts: 1,801
    Forty-nine cetane!! I was expecting maybe forty-five. That should be helpful. I will still add some cetane improver to bring the fuel to the EU standard of fifty-one or higher.
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    mdamickmdamick Member Posts: 277
    I had the fuel filter replaced the other day. I got 1/2 block before it died. I figured that they did not fill the filter up full, and spent about 5-10 min pumping and trying to start.
    Got it going, but that evening it started the infamous shudder. It would also give an intermittent MIL light with a code of P0039, which I have not been able to find. I have driven ~250 miles with these problems.
    Today, I thought of "burping" the filter. I opened the air release valve and got quite a bit of air from the filter while pumping it up.
    I have put ~100 miles on since then and no shudder.
    Those of you with this problem may want to verify that all of your fuel lines are tight and also try to let some air out of the fuel filter assembly.
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    arvmanarvman Member Posts: 95
    Got the jeep back after the airflow control valve got replaced.had a chat with the tech and they're learning some tricks to working on the C.R.D.'S.There aren't many of them in the area so mine and another one are the guinea pigs,which is fine since it's on their dime.Seems getting parts is an issue for them,however the service is fine.Truck is running great and I'm still willing to deal with some growing pains,cheers...
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