BMW X3

bodble2 · June 2006

Now I like it even more! If they manage to keep prices close to current levels, then it is on my short list. :shades:

driver100 · July 2006

Pictures look great. Not enough changes to make me want to trade in my 2004...which was purchased. I do like the two tone interior and the platinum paint.

Last week I rented a Suburban. Was going to travel for 2 hours on a logging road. Asked for a Jeep but got this monster truck.
It was unbelievable...it was so good to get back into the X3 after this experience.
Just a brief synopsis;
*Climbing in and out is an adventure, especially for my wife,
*Even though there is a huge centre console the gear shift leaver is on the column. It is made out of tubular steel...looks like an old crank or something from Ikea to put furniture together,
*The inside door handles are hiding directly under the armrests where you can hardly reach them. The handle looks like more of that tubular steel and actually protrudes from a hole punched in the door,
*Parking is another adventure. Don't even attempt parallel parking. At the mall just go to the edge of the lot and use two spaces or a space on the edge where no one is across for you, or you might not get out,
*dash is made from cheap plastic with tiny buttons. With all that room inside, the dash is huge and rises so the view ahead is not great, and the design makes no sense...just plain ugly with hills and valleys that are supposed to do something...look beautiful I suppose.

Good features are a digital compass built right into the mirror, and if you are on a logging road it is truly built like a tank. Which leads us to the light steering and absolute NO feeling of the road.

It makes you really appreciate the X3.

driver100 · July 2006

Hey Mark...would Tina like to comment on this poor fellow on the "Will 2006 Styling Save GM"?

A week ago I purchased a new G6 convertible. I got a call yesterday from the finance manager that says I must bring the car back because the 0% interest I got doesn't apply to this car. I must drive 200 miles to take the car back, taking it back on Wednesday. They are trying to get me a new interest rate now. I like the car but I am not sure what I should tell them to get the deal I want. It is legal for them to tell me to bring the car back. I can get my old car back (if they still have it) which they wouldn't tell me. Has anyone ever experienced anything like this or have any advice for me? Let me know if I should post somewhere else or what also.

See Will Styling Save GM to reply if you care to, or anyone else with legal knowledge!

markcincinnati · July 2006

While it is true that my wife is a lawyer, I seriously doubt she could render any advice other than the same advice that a reasonably well informed non-lawyer could render.

She does not practice in that area and would be ill advised to offer "legal" advice even if she did. My best guess is that she could point you to resources that might help you and possibly she would suggest you retain (as in "hire") an attorney or use your present lawyer(assuming you have one.)

I am certain she could give an opinion as a well educated and experienced person -- but this forum is not really for that. Besides, any comment she would make, I am certain, would be an opinion and although it might be well-informed it certainly would not be the basis for any response on your part.

If this is a really important issue for you, you should, as a matter of prudence, contact your own lawyer, pay for the advice and take it or leave it.

I am assuming that she wants to engage in conversation about the cars (the X3 in particular), not even attempt to render anything that would even remotely be called legal advice.

I could be wrong, as far as I know, she has not seen my "opinion" nor my advice, such that it is, here.

She's asleep probably by now.

:shades:

driver100 · July 2006

No problem...thanks for taking the time to answer.

Most professionals probably don't mind giving a bit of general advice or a suggestion what to look for or look out for but that is certainly a personal or professional decision.

Although the problem was not directly related to X3's the reason I wrote was as a learning experience for fellow posters....because this could be useful information one day for anyone.

markcincinnati · July 2006

I rarely speak for my wife. I never speak for her as an attorney.

I know she checks in here; patience is a virtue.

My guess is she will not be participating here in any capacity other than as an X3 owner / operator.

:surprise:

Listen, when I seek legal services, I "hire" another lawyer -- not my wife.

Just seems to be an appropriate course of action. :shades:

div2 · July 2006

I can almost guarantee that no attorney will even hazard a guess until he/she has had an opportunity examine the signed purchase and finance contracts. The contracts may provide an "out" for the dealer- but again they may not. I'd certainly have an attorney look them over before I made the 200 mile trip to the dealer...

driver100 · July 2006

I'd certainly have an attorney look them over before I made the 200 mile trip to the dealer...

I agree, and I don't expect free legal advice or for a solution without reading the contract. However, a professional could say what to look for in the contract and give some general advice, such as....
*see if the contract was dependent on financing being approved,
*don't take the car back until you talk to a lawyer
*if you do return the car make sure you are protected in getting your car back...watch what you sign
*watch out for a bait and switch, such as "we couldn't get 0% financing but we will do it at a special dealer rate of 20% or we can give you low monthly payments (they might last for 6 years)",
*Get financing arranged before you take the car back so if you don't get the 0% you won't just accept their terms.
*Maybe the deal is fine and the dealer is on the hook because the contract is signed and they made the mistake thinking this car was included in the 0% financing sale.
Once again, I don't expect a full legal answer and I know a lawyer has to see the agreement to comment on it.

(By the way I was only half joking when I asked Marks wife to comment, she might be too busy, have no interest in this, be in another type of field, it might be too much like work, etc. It was an invitation to comment if she would care too. On the other hand it was placed here just for general knowledge and to make everyone a little wiser hopefully...besides there's not much else going on around here lately).

bodble2 · July 2006

"Listen, when I seek legal services, I "hire" another lawyer -- not my wife."

Especially if it is concerning a divorce! :P

driver100 · July 2006

"Listen, when I seek legal services, I "hire" another lawyer -- not my wife."

A wise man indeed!

Do you do wills by the way? :confuse:

markcincinnati · July 2006

Nope, I am not a lawyer. My field is information technology; ERP systems selection, implementation and support. Of course, my wife doesn't use me to support our home ERP system either (as if.)

I believe my wife is interested in BMW's, X3's and driving in particular and will be a willing participant on many aspects of those matters.

Of course, I do not speak for her, but I do have an inside track to information and I doubt my insights are too far off the mark.

Ask her about driving schools, stick shifts and how much she loves her X3 -- now those are topics she will probably be quite eager to address.

11:25PM in Cincinnati -- over and out for tonight.

bargamon · July 2006

But I stayed at a holiday inn Express last nite.......

Read all the fine print in the contracts. Any questions you may have might reside in it.

Do you have a contract with them that states 0%?????

And what are the conditions?

basically once the deal is done its done. I have seen mistakes made and the dealer just eats it.

Now, on the other hand we all make mistakes and you have to ask youself what was the deciding factore for buying the car? Interest rate? And if so, would you not have bought it otherwise? Ok, the dealer is human and made a mistake, are you gonna hold them to it, or reach in and pay up?

What is the cost added if they give you a "new rate"?

Can you strike a compromise with them?

Do you want to screw them? What would make you happy?

Why they need you to come back? Can't they overnite you the paperwork? Get the finance dummy to drive to you?

Is this a morals lesson? INteresting subject!

Keep us posted and good luck.

driver100 · July 2006

Thank you bargamon,

Like your reply...good solid information. Much appreciated.

Particularly like; Why they need you to come back? Can't they overnite you the paperwork?

It did not happen to me personally..it is a poster on another form, but if we hear the outcome we'll report back.

div2 · July 2006

I just got finished fitting the front splash guards to my wife's truck. It was dead easy, taking all of one hour. The only tool I had to buy was a rivet gun designed for plastic rivets. The directions advise that you remove the front wheels, but it's not really necessary. I will have to remove the wheels in order to fit the rear guards,but I'm saving that job for when I install the BMW trailer hitch. At that time I'll also be fitting a new rear bumper to replace the one that was scratched in a local parking lot by an incompetent tourist(he lied to his adjuster, but fortunately I had the police report-after the adjuster looked it over he was all too happy to cut a check for just $211).

div2 · July 2006

Splash guards are probably a nice touch. Are they rubber, white or black? Or chrome?

They are matte anthracite which matches the lower body cladding exactly.

bodble2 · July 2006

Never thought I'd see the day when splash guards are discussed on a BMW thread! :surprise:

Thought I had wandered by mistake onto a Honda Fit thread, where armrest is the current hot topic of discussion!

:confuse:

driver100 · July 2006

Splash guards are probably a nice touch. Are they rubber, white or black? Or chrome?

div2 · July 2006

Personally, I am too lazy and incompetent to add any after market items. But I think splash guards actually could look attractive, and are probably quite useful.

They aren't aftermarket items. They are OEM BMW accessories:

My wife likes her truck to stay clean. Since our private gravel driveway is over 2600 feet long, I know that the guards help quite a bit-I also fitted BMW guards to her E36 and E39.

driver100 · July 2006

Never thought I'd see the day when splash guards are discussed on a BMW thread!

Sorry, I don't know proper etiquette for BMW ownership.
Why would you say that, although I think I get the point.

Personally, I am too lazy and incompetent to add any after market items. But I think splash guards actually could look attractive, and are probably quite useful.

driver100 · July 2006

I wish I had them when I drove over a road these city workers were putting tar on. They didn't warn you or anything.
I thought I would need a new paint job, I am sure it is still stuck to the inside of all the wheels and under the car.
I got a good tar cleaner and that worked quite well but flaps would have saved me a lot of work.
I also get a lot of built up dirt on the doors just under the mirrors, that is very hard to remove. This might solve that problem. I only wash my car about once every 6 weeks.
It's nice that they were made to blend in with the cars design.

div2 · July 2006

Well, like I said, they really aren't that tough to install. If you want to tackle it I can walk you through it. On the other hand, if you ever take a road trip to the Ohio Valley region let me know and I'll slap a front set on in under an hour. I'm a pro now... :P

driver100 · July 2006

I am going to keep that in mind.

A trip to the Ohio Valley region that is.

Not attempt it myself.

Karen_S · July 2006

A reporter aims to speak with anyone who has owned a vehicle and found its controls to be complicated. Please respond to jfallonedmunds.com by Monday, July 17, 2006, and be sure to include your daytime contact info and a few words about your experience.

Thanks,
Jeannine Fallon
Corporate Communications
Edmunds.com

nyccarguy · July 2006

I definitely dig the '07 X3 3.0 si. What's with the "s" now? They've got it on the Z4 and now the X3.

juanchypr · July 2006

Well one week with this post and nobody answers.
This forum is so quite

Information copile directly from BMW of North America

Explanation of the Name Change
The X3 3.0si will replace the X3 3.0i. The "s' is meant to differentiate the new more powerful engine from the X3 3.0i model it replaces. It also differentiates it from the X3 3.0i that will replace the X3 2.5i in markets outside the US. The US will continue with a single model startegy that was implemented for MY2006, by only offereing the X3 3.0si. ( The naming strategy is also consistent with the Z4.)

Start of Production August 2006 SOP

462 · July 2006

I have the opportunity to buy an 2005 X3 3.0 with all the goodies except Nav. It has about 13,000 miles and they are asking 29,800. Whatcha think??

clpurnell · July 2006

Nope, I am not a lawyer. My field is information technology; ERP systems selection, implementation and support.

Mark,

Had no idea we had career's in common. I work for the bully of the industry right now but may be going back on my own soon. I like the X3 thinking about replacing my dearly departed FX35 with one.

div2 · July 2006

$30K seems to be the current sweet spot for the 2004-2005 X3. If it's a CPO car it sounds like it would be an excellent choice.

wmdavis1 · July 2006

I looking at buying one of these vehicles. I previously owned a 1998 RAV4 and liked it size, ride, steering and reliability alot. Negatives for me were underpowered and cheap stereo/speakers. I would like something similiar, but with more power and a better sound system. The new X3 and RAV4 V6 seem like similar vehicles to me, but with the RAV4 being a more practical choice and the X3 a more upscale choice. I've never owned a Bimmer before and was wondering if a if anyone has familiarity with these vehicles and a knowledgeable opinion on whether the X3 is worth the approx. 50% price difference ($30K v. $45K)? Also, has the gas mileage figures for the new X3 been released yet? Thanks.

kyfdx · July 2006

If you really liked your previous RAV4, then the X3 is probably not worth 50% more than the new RAV4 (at least to you..maybe not to me, either)..

But, if you lease, you may find that price difference is more like 20%, and I would certainly consider it..

regards,
kyfdx
(not the host here)

bargamon · July 2006

Your asking the wrong crowd.

These guys and gals are the owners of X3's and most seem pretty happy.

The RAV4 looks like a very nice vehicle and toyota products are exellent.

How long will you keep the vehicle? Leases can work out great on BMW's!

4 years included maintenence on the BMW.

In the long run, the X will cost you more but its percieved value. If you like it, and can afford it and WANT to spend for it, then your answer is it.

I think the X3 is a great value for the money!

wmdavis1 · July 2006

I will definitely look into BMW leasing options. I had my RAV4 for nearly 8 years, and I would plan to keep my new vehicle for a similar length of time. I was under the impression that leases were more beneficial if you only plan to keep the vehicle for a shorter duration (2-3 years). Also, I'm interested in how the gas mileage on the 2007 engine. I've heard it should be better, and I think the gas mileage on the current engine sucks. Surely BMW can do better than that! The RAV4 V6 gets 22/29 city/hwy I believe and BMW should be able to approach this, or am I missing something related to the performance? Thanks for your comments.

juanchypr · July 2006

:shades: Legendary BMW 6-cylinder power :shades:
BMW 6-cylinder engines are of the inline variety. This layout is rare these days as most
vehicle makers use V-6s, primarily because their compactness suits tightly packaged
front-wheel-drive cars :sick: . An inline layout takes more space, but BMW favors it for its
smoothness and sound. Indeed, the expert media consistently applaud the Bavarians
for doing so. In an early drive of the X3, the German magazine Auto Bild alles allrad 1
noted of an X3 3.0i with automatic transmission that Even when one doesnt select the
Sport mode, the smooth inline engine revs handily to its redline before the transmission
shifts smoothly to the next gear.
The X3 engine is of BMWs acclaimed M54 engine architecture, whose salient points
include 
 Aluminum block and cylinder head
 Dual overhead camshafts/24 valves
 Double VANOS 2 steplessly variable intake- and exhaust-valve timing
 Dual resonance intake system.
Previously, 2.5- and 3.0-liter engine versions powered the two X3 models; for 06
3.0-liter version continues in the X3 3.0i with 225 hp @ 5900 rpm and 214 lb-ft.
3500. It delivers a decidedly lively 0-60 time of 7.6 sec. with manual transmission,
sec. with automatic. Again we turn to Edmunds.com for an objective assessment:
Even though the competition fields more powerful sixes, this engine, which BMW
uses in its cars, continues to be a favorite of ours. It's smooth as silk, has a ripping
exhaust note when you wind it out and performs like it's hiding 40 more horses under
the hood.

driver100 · July 2006

The new X3 and RAV4 V6 seem like similar vehicles to me, but with the RAV4 being a more practical choice and the X3 a more upscale choice.

If you are practical minded the RAV4 is probably your better choice. Some people believe price for what you perceive to get means the lower priced vehicle is really the better value.
What price do you put on; amazing feel of the road, all the power any normal human being needs, perfect ergonomics, tremendous engineering (the battery is in the rear to give perfect weight balance), I don't know if the X3 has taken the crash tests but I am pretty sure it is as safe as any car in it's segment (this seems to be a priority to European makes). And, if you do keep your car for 8 years I will bet the X3 will be a classic and will be worth much more than the RAV4, we are talking classic European designing that lasts - in fact 10 year old BMW's and Mercedes look better than most manufacturers new cars.

In my case I had 2 Jeeps and I thought, why does anyone pay 50% more for a vehicle, aren't they all pretty much the same, get you from point A to point B?
When I took the test drive I didn't want to give it back. I tested a few SUV's (and various rental cars), but why look further. It is the perfect vehicle, and a tremendous value. There are few vehicles that can combine the practicality, safety, style, engineering and pure enjoyment of driving, like an X3.
As for mileage I get about 25 hwy and 20 city (premium fuel don't forget). Not as good as a Toyota, but excellent considering the size of the engine and the weight of the vehicle. 4 year warranty with service counts for something.

Once again if you are an extremely practical person you won't be happy.....but if you want to really appreciate driving and engineering, then you have to go for a test drive!

The X3 showed me there is a whole different world out there.

kdshapiro · July 2006

"If you are practical minded the RAV4 is probably your better choice"

LOL. Let's be fair. If I *really* am practical minded, a RAV4 V6 is too expensive, there are other alterntatives for less money. /ot

Let it be said this way. If money was no object I would rather have the BMW. The X3 handles like a sedan, the RAV4 handles like a truck compared to it.

driver100 · July 2006

If you are practical minded the RAV4 is probably your better choice"

I mean between an X3 and RAV4 - IMO the RAV4 is being more practical.
If you want to be even more practical, go with a Hyundai Tucson

If you want some enjoyment in your life, and won't feel guilty about it....go with the X3.

kdshapiro · July 2006

I agree. The X3 is luxury item. Sort of like comparing Rolex to Timex and have the Timex win on value. :confuse.

driver100 · July 2006

I agree. The X3 is luxury item. Sort of like comparing Rolex to Timex and have the Timex win on value. : :confuse:

Well put....perfect!

bodble2 · July 2006

Ahh...I'm not so sure that if the RAV4 is a Timex, the X3 is a Rolex. An Omega, or a Tag Heuer, perhaps.

Come to think of it, the RAV4 would be more like a Seiko. :shades: Save the Timex for the Tucson.

wmdavis1 · July 2006

To be fair, Consumer Reports recently rated the new RAV4 its top smaller SUV, although the X3 was not included in the comparison. For less money, I could get a lesser vehicle like a Hundai, but that doesn't mean I would get a better value. The real question in my mind is for more money would I get a better vehicle/value in the X3. The consensus here is a resounding yes! I'm looking for feedback on what makes the X3 a better value. It certainly looks sharper. A prior message suggest that the engine should be superior. Gas mileage seems to be a negative. So what else makes the X3 a Rolex compared to the plebeian RAV4?

bargamon · July 2006

You drive them back to back and make up your mind. You'll do the right thing.

Right now Im fixing up my sons 02' outback. Doing all the work myself, low miliage car and paint was neglected. 8 hours with Merzerna products and the thing is drippingly shiney! New Alpine stereo with iPod integration, blue tooth for phone, , subwoofer, new speakers, and I even drilled the metal and put a stock spoiler on it! new Triple treads make it nice. After years of Mercedes and Audis and not touching those cars Im having a blast tinkering with this car. The point, I'll have less than 14k in this (manual tranny to boot!) and the thing only has 50k on it. SOunds great, lots of toys and it looks really great!

Drives nice and quiet, stereo is fun, and best of all I don't owe a dime on it. I'll drive it for 6 months and then planning on picking up a fresh x3 in munich in the spring and give sunny boy his ride. The point, oh yeah, its very capable car but its really no fun.

I had my hondas and toyotas when thats what I could afford and then fell for nice german cars. This will be my first BMW and Im all about the drive train. Might still consider a 3 or 5 series.

36 month lease and say good "BUY" and get a new one!

If repairs gonna bug you out then stay Japanese! RAV is nice choice. Just don't confuse these german cars as costing more and should be trouble free! The more you spend , the higher the sopistication and the more things can break! It happens. Im not trying to scare you but some people bug out over the cost. My wife drives a Sienna van and is very happy with it. She does not want to know about repair bills! Thats why I say with warranty cars! Hers just came off it but toyotas are not so bad with long term repair history.

A well cared for BMW used might be a great value if bought right. If were looking for a good deal, I'd find an 05' with low milage for about 30k Still a better vehicle than the RAV, has a few good years left before the warranty runs .

Its not an 07, but its not 45k either! Good luck!

bodble2 · July 2006

"The consensus here is a resounding yes!"

You're on a X3 board! BMW owners are as partisan as they come! Try posing the same question on a Toyota board, and see what responses you get.

stever · July 2006

Here's the spot to see if people are driving a Rolex or Timex:

BMW X3 vs Subaru Forester/XT vs Infiniti FX 35 vs Toyota RAV4

kdshapiro · July 2006

"I could get a lesser vehicle like a Hundai, but that doesn't mean I would get a better value."

I somewhat disagree with this statement. Recognizing there are all manner of vehicles out there...the purpose of a car is to get you from point A to point B, the car with the best value is the least expensive one that accomplishes the mission. You may decide to get a more expensive vehicle over one that accomplishes the basic task, but that doesn't make it a better value. It makes it a more expensive vehicle. For $10 vs $70K a Timex certainly wins on value, but the Timex doesn't have that certain something the Rolex does.

The X3, at the expense of gas mileage will run rings around the RAV4 because it handles like a sedan and a BMW. If that type of handling is not important, the RAV4 should be fine.

I'm partial to the Forester XT myself, which has won numerous awards and has been rated the top small SUV by various publications for a few years in a row.

You should take the X3 and RAV4 out back to back. If you don't notice any difference, it's because you haven't driven both cars hard enough.

And the forum that Steve linked to has lots of good reading.

stever · July 2006

When I google for "Timex Repair" I get 1,720 hits. Even fewer hits for Casio or Swatch repair.

When I google for "Rolex Repair" I get 74,400 hits.

hmmm, ok, searching for "BMW Repair" flops up 106,000 hits. That's more than Hyundai Repair or Toyota Repair or Subaru Repair.

That has to be enough data to support a PhD dissertation right there.

davidc1 · July 2006

Most people don't repair Timex watches. They just get a new one.

I think X3 is a pretty good "value" when leasing only. $40k is a lot for a small SUV and you have more choices at that price range. Hard to beat X3 leases though. My guess is that RAV4 fully loaded should lease for a similar amount.

tidester · July 2006

Most people don't repair Timex watches.

Funny you should say that. Of all the watches I have owned the Timex I am wearing right now has been the most reliable - and at a fraction of the cost of all the others. Apparently, we don't repair them 'cause they don't need repair!

tidester, host

bodble2 · July 2006

"...we don't repair them 'cause they don't need repair!"

Right on!

And I doubt that there are less repairs for Hyundai Tucsons 'cause their owners are throwing them away rather than repairing them! :P

driver100 · July 2006

"...we don't repair them 'cause they don't need repair!"
IMO a Timex and a Tucson are two different things (ha ha). A Tucson you would repair, but a Timex you aren't going to repair, you just buy a new one. Anyway, I am sure there is some valuable information in those repair figures, but I am not sure what it all means.

However, let me approach value from another viewpoint. My wife just stopped for a red light in her 2003 Mercedes C Class Station wagon. She got slammed by a 1996 Toyota Tercel that didn't stop. The rear bumper has to be replaced and a few dents in the lift gate have to be taken out. The Tercel was crumpled from the front bumper to the windshield. My wife and passenger have no injuries. The garage that does the repairs explained how the rear bumper in European cars is made to hydralically give and there are spacers etc. to allow the rear to crumple, absorbing most of the shock of the crash.
I guess my point is that value is not just cost, or design, or feel of the car. Also, factor in safety, and I like the fact the manufacturer respects me enough to make the safest vehicle possible...what value do you place on that.

And, a Timex watch on a BMW guy, what's that???? :confuse:

tidester · July 2006

And, a Timex watch on a BMW guy, what's that????

Simple. It's a matter of reliability!

Also, safety is not usually an issue with watches.

tidester, host

BMW X3

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