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Cadillac STS/STS-V: What's New for 2007?

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Comments

  • sls002sls002 Member Posts: 2,788
    The Seville (FWD) is on a shorter wheelbase. The base Deville is a six passenger bench seat car. The base Seville was a 5 passenger euro style seating. Cadillac liked to think the FWD STS was a sports sedan, but the market did not buy that. I would say that the DTS and STS were very similar, with the Seville TS on a shorter wheelbase. I like my SLS with premium luxury package.

    The new RWD STS is a sports sedan. With V6 a nicely equipped STS can be had for under $45000. A base Deville with minimal options to make it into a respectable Cadillac, runs nearly $50,000. For that you do get a V8.
  • exalteddragon1exalteddragon1 Member Posts: 729
    about the lack of the new STS rear quarters, when the competition all have smaller seats? Car and driver started this nonsence, and now a bunch or nay-sayers are joining the fray.

    What gives?
  • volvodan1volvodan1 Member Posts: 188
    It's compared to the Deville that it is smaller. To the CTS customer it is better.
  • scottphillipscottphillip Member Posts: 249
    The sound system (Bose 5.1) and navigation are incredible. The STS is certainly comparable to the 5 series and E class.
  • sls002sls002 Member Posts: 2,788
    Motor Trend did complain (not sure offhand about C&D). Novemeber's Motor Trend had a letter to editor pointing out that Motor Trends pictures of rear seat room showed that the BMW was even less roomy and they did not comment on that. Motor Trend agrees that the STS is better than the BMW, but the Malibu Maxx is more like it.
  • bigmike5bigmike5 Member Posts: 960
    I didn't want to be a troll here, that was not my intent. I just set the front seat to a comfortable depth for my size and then got in the back. There was not much room for the knees, that was all I was saying. They did scoop out the back of the front seat giving a little more room because of the concave effort. The wife's 00 Eldo has about the same space but without the scooped out area. Of note, when you look under the Eldo's hood you find about 9" of unused space in front of the motor, which alway made me wonder what they were thinking when they could have put those extra inches in the rear seat area to improve rear seat comfort.

    The salesman I talked with about the STS also stated that the 8 gets better gas mileage than the 6. I can believe that, as the wife's Eldo with the Northstar engine has gotten 30 m.p.g on our longer road trips pushing 70 mph. My 6 cylinder Chrysler 300M only gets 26-27 in the same kind of driving.
  • exalteddragon1exalteddragon1 Member Posts: 729
    that teh V8 is more comfortable with the cars heft, and that the V6 has to do more work to keep it at speed.
  • rcf8000rcf8000 Member Posts: 619
    The eight gets better mileage than the six because of the lower (numerical) rear axle ratio (in the 1SE version).
  • sls002sls002 Member Posts: 2,788
    If you don't understand what a "sport sedan" is, then the STS won't make any sense to you. In any case, the Deville is the Cadillac with rear seat legroom, at least according to the "standard measurement", with more rear seat legroom than front seat legroom.

    The V6 has a 3.42:1 axle ratio standard with no optional ratio, while the V8 comes standard with the 2.73:1 gears. The 2.73:1 axle is very similar to the 3.11:1 "axle" ratio for the FWD Cadillacs with the "base" northstar V8. The FWD base engine is EPA rated about 2 MPG better than the "high output" northstar's, which have 3.71:1 gearing.
  • drivenowdrivenow Member Posts: 45
    Does anyone know any details of the STS-V?? Will a dealer take a deposit on a V??
  • sls002sls002 Member Posts: 2,788
    There is talk of the STS-V having a supercharged/turbocharged V8. I am guessing that the STS-V will be a 2006 model at the earliest. I would suggest talking with your dealer(s) to see what they have to say. Until Cadillac announces something, the dealers probably can't do much. However, they could put you on a "list", and call you when they know something.
  • exalteddragon1exalteddragon1 Member Posts: 729
    The STS-V will not with with a 425hp blown Northstar, it needs a special engine like the one in the Merc, specially designed for the car...

    Or meybe they could just Supercharge the LS2 or LS6.... can anyone say 500 across the board!
  • eaton53eaton53 Member Posts: 356
    Or they could just do one of these 751hp monsters that no German sedan can hang with...

    http://www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=15&article- - _id=8720&page_number=8
  • 14871487 Member Posts: 2,407
    The STSV wont have more than 450hp because that is the maximum hp the new RWD 6 speed auto will be able to take according to what I read. I would expect 450 and 450 for the '06 model year. The vette is getting the same tranny.
  • ppattersonppatterson Member Posts: 22
    I'm concerned about security issues related to the Remote Starter. If I start the engine from within the car and walk away (maybe forgot something in the house), or leave the car running with someone inside the car and walk away, will the car shut itself off if the key fob is not in close proximity to the car? Also, if I start the car remotely how long will it run before shutting off?

    Another question that I have is about the mileage rating. I've noticed that the highway mileage of the V-6 is 2 mpg less than that of the V-8. Why is that.

    Final question: do both engines require premium fuel? Thanks........
  • rayainswrayainsw Member Posts: 3,191
    From the manual:
    "If the vehicle is left running it will automatically shut off
    after 10 minutes unless a time extension has been
    done."
    - Ray
    Thinking I'd not want it to run even that long un-attended . . .
    2022 X3 M40i
  • chavis10chavis10 Member Posts: 166
    I believe the engine will run for up to 20 mins before shutting off automatically if no futher input is made. Don't know if the car will shut off once you leave. I doubt it. I think the transmitter must be inside the vehicle in order to shift out of park.

    You can read about the mileage issues in earlier posts of this thread. The V-6 uses a short 3.42 axle ratio which forces the engine to rev higher in the range thereby increasing fuel consumption. This was done to give the base STS Cadillac appropiate thrust despite the weight of the car. The standard V-8 STS uses a tall ratio of 2.73 which lets the Northstar turn slow. Combined with the extra thrust of the V-8, it can move the car with less effort. AWD uses a 3.23 axle and the Peformance Package uses the same 3.42 as the V-6. I'm assuming the 3.42 teamed with the N-star will get worse mileage than the V-6.

    V-6 needs regular while Northstar needs premium because of 10.5 compression. Northstar will take regular but produce less HP and won't be as efficient. Hope this helps
  • rayainswrayainsw Member Posts: 3,191
    "Peformance Package uses the same 3.42"
    Also - according to GMVIS, 1SF V8 = 3.23.
    - Ray
    Still waiting to see postings of "real world" 2005 STS V8 fuel mileage . . .
    2022 X3 M40i
  • mbukukanyaumbukukanyau Member Posts: 200
    "The STSV wont have more than 450hp because that is the maximum hp the new RWD 6 speed auto will be able to take according to what I read. I would expect 450 and 450 for the '06 model year. The vette is getting the same tranny. "

    The Vette is coming with 500 Horses on the Z06 model, being released around the same time as the STS V and XLR V...
  • sls002sls002 Member Posts: 2,788
    In the past the ZO6 was a 6 speed manual only. Is that going to change? It would make sense to me for the STS-V to have a manual transmission, but then I'm not quite sure where Cadillac is going with this model.
  • derrelhgreenderrelhgreen Member Posts: 234
    Correction to the above regarding V8 engined models:

    The Premium Luxury Performance package RPO code 1SG has 3.42s (GU6)

    The Luxury Performance package RPO code 1SF has 3.23s (GU5)

    The Luxury package RPO code 1SE has 2.73s (GU2)

    How will the vehicles with 3.23s or 3.42s obtain the same or close to fuel economy of the models with 2.73s?

    Wish I could order a loaded car with the 1SG package with the 2.73s.
  • rayainswrayainsw Member Posts: 3,191
    "How will the vehicles with 3.23s or 3.42s obtain the same or close to fuel economy of the models with 2.73s?"

    As discussed above, I share this concern / skepticism.

    My guess is that 2.73 cars could obtain something close to the EPA highway fuel economy - but the 3.23 and 3.42 cars could not.

    Just my 0.02 gallons worth . .
    - Ray
    Interested to see if any owners post actual results . .
    2022 X3 M40i
  • sls002sls002 Member Posts: 2,788
    The STS with the 3.42:1 gearing is nearly the same overall ratio as the Seville's STS 3.71:1 gearing. That model was rated about 2 MPGs less on the highway than the SLS with the 3.11:1 gearing. The AWD STS is rated, and I would guess that the RWD STS will get only a mile per gallon more or so.

    The AWD V8 is rated 22 highway. The SRX is rated 20 AWD, 21 RWD. The V6 is better but the SRX's V6 axle ratios are not the same as the V8's. The V8 should use more fuel than the V6, which is rated 24 highway.

    In the real world, it will depend on how you drive the car. My SLS gets around 28-29 MPG on the highway when I limit my cruising speed to about 70 MPH on the interstates and the speed limit (usually 65) otherwise. I suspect cruising 75-80 would drop the mileage down to something nearer 25 MPG.
  • joegodjoegod Member Posts: 13
    Well we are now into the initial sales of the
    STS. Does anyone know how the sales are going ?
    It would be interesting to find out if all the
    hype will match sales......
  • sls002sls002 Member Posts: 2,788
    November STS sales were 2771 which compares with 1800 sevilles in 2003. Total for calendar 2004 is 6300. Sales started in September or so. Total 2004 sales for the Seville have been 3300. CTS sales were 4000 in November.
  • 14871487 Member Posts: 2,407
    The Z06 will not have an auto tranny so the six speed will be for the STS, XLR and regular vette. BAsed on info I have seen the new RWD tranny can handle up to 450hp. Preliminary estimates on the power of the STSV were 425hp but I doubt GM would put the car out with less than 450.
  • bigmike5bigmike5 Member Posts: 960
    Finally got a test drive today while the wife's Eldo was in for service. Actually took 3, the STS, the CTS and the C-6 Vette. After doing the 3 one after the other, it was really amazing comparing the drives. We started with the Vette because I got an 04 a few months ago and wanted to see the difference. Well, the cabin was a little quieter but I honestly could not see/feel the difference in the torque off the line. Course on city streets, and a short run on I-65, it would be hard to sense much of a difference, since the C-5 is awesome too. I did chirp the tires once off a light. Nice ride, but I am happy with my C-5. Now, on the STS, which I did second--man, what a ride. Awesome is all I can say. Nimble handling, not heavy, quick as a cat, and seemingly endless power, with a smoother than smooth ride in a whisper quiet cabin. This time, the seats felt fine, not hard, and I just can't say enough about what a slick vehicle it was. The CTS [not a V] was last to drive, and after the STS--well it was probably unfair to have it go third. Seemed fairly peppy, but nowhere like the STS. Thought the dash was rather bland and devoid of useful gauges, etc. On balance I Like the ride of the wife's Eldo a little better, and it is no comparison to the STS. That long wheelbase on the STS just makes it glide over the bumps. Add the Mag. Sel. ride and it is awesome. All 3 are winners.
  • cdllcpmpn420cdllcpmpn420 Member Posts: 1
    Ok, ive been reading everyones responces posted and seems that nobody is really sure what the STSV will be producing. According to caranddriver the STSV and the XLRV are suppose to carry a supercharged version of the 4.6l engine. So far roumors have them between 400-500hp. With the STSV suppose to be in competition with the new 05 bmw m5 and the mercedes e55amg. Both these cars have similar weights of the STS tipping over 4000+lbs and both running mid 12's STOCK! The mercedes takes it in 12.4 and the bmw in 12.6. The CTSV have 400hp with the vetts ls6 motor in it running a quick 13.1 in the quarter. Im not totally sure but I believe the STSV will weight is a slight bit more than the CTSV. Just was thinking that for the STSV to be competitive and to really make any money for Cadillac it would have to definatly be a contender of this class. From these numbers i see the STSV to produce over 450hp as a definate. Also was wondering if anyone heard anything on prices. The CTSV you can get new for nearly 60k. A high class standard STS is at about the same price. The bmw and mercedes are both at about 90k. I dont think they will take the price for the STSV over 70K, and if its as quick and cometitive i can see lots of people really getting into the caddy. Just my .02 all.
  • eaton53eaton53 Member Posts: 356
    It will be the job of the CTS-V to smoke the Germans in outright speed. As seen with tuner CTS-V's in the Car & Driver Supercar Challenge - where they took 1st and 3rd - the chassis is certainly capable... just need to put enough motor in there. The upcoming 500hp (and 500lb/ft, which is huge compared to the new BMW V-10) should be sufficient.
  • cadman777cadman777 Member Posts: 2
    I just took delivery on a new STS V6 with the luxury performance package. 900 miles later the navigation touch screen diplay froze. Brought it to the dealer and said there is a national back order for a replacement. May take a month to get a new system. Nevertheless i am stuck on current settings such as radio, CD and personalazation settings. Also the driver seat squeaks when hitting bumps. Anybody else hear of a national backorder on a new nav system? I hear more and more of the navigation systems are locking up.
  • arby1arby1 Member Posts: 83
    I just got a STS 2005.I want to install HID.THe local shop wants to put in a 8000 lumen bulb.I want what the standard HID would be from the factory.Is the bulb a ds1 with 3200 lumens?
  • sls002sls002 Member Posts: 2,788
    The lastest Motor Trend (Feb) says that the STS-V's supercharged V8 will have 440 hp and a six speed transmission.(automatic)
  • blkcadillacblkcadillac Member Posts: 47
    I've seen the pics of the Vsts...its very nice....It has the body work like the CTS, as well as the intertior...I don't know the speeds of the transmission, but it's an auto...
  • 14871487 Member Posts: 2,407
    Apparently the next issue of R&T will have a cover story about the STSV. It will have 440hp and a 6 speed auto with 18" wheels in front and 19" wheels in back. Go gminsidenews.com to see pics of the exterior.
  • mbukukanyaumbukukanyau Member Posts: 200
    #848 of 866 Re: Remote starting [ppatterson] by rayainsw Nov 19, 2004 (2:28 pm)



    From the manual:

    "If the vehicle is left running it will automatically shut off

    after 10 minutes unless a time extension has been

    done."

    - Ray

    Thinking I'd not want it to run even that long un-attended . . .


     

    I was told at the San Diego Auto show that it will not leave without the Fob.. so if some thief gets in, you can lock him in and let the cops come for their dude

    ...

    I do not know whether its true or the sales guy was just pitching to impress us
  • goodmangoodman Member Posts: 6
    Any bagaining chips out there?

    It seems that it's a pretty popular car.

    I'm looking @ the 6 cyl, Lux Perf Pkg....

    MSRP of $49,950 or thereabouts. Got one dealer to price it at 200 over invoice, at 46,500.....

     

    I've never leased a car before, and am considering doing so this time around. Where's the negotiation price in the lease, or do work to get the total purchase price down, that will ultimately trickle down to the residual.....

     

    thank you!
  • barry5barry5 Member Posts: 49
    Has anyone driven an AWD STS, if so what was your opinion.
  • rayainswrayainsw Member Posts: 3,191
    Anyone seen recently arrived 1SF-s or 1SG-s and noticed if the sticker still shows 26 MPG HWY?

     

    I thought I remembered a situation similar to the STS V8 w/multiple final drive ratios and different EPA HWY ratings.

     

    I was near my local Pontiac dealer on Sunday, so stopped in for a few minutes.

     

    The Grand Prix GTP has the exact same mechanical drivetrain with or without the Competition Group Option Package (WS6). S/C V6 4-speed automatic.

     

    The only drivetrain difference is a final drive ratio of 3.29 vs. 2.93 without the CompG. And very little additional equipment that would potentially add weight.

     

    The EPA HWY number is lowered by 1. (28 to 27 / CompG)

     

    This is approx. a 12% final drive change.

     

    The difference between the 1SE (and I believe the 26 MPG rating here may be reasonable) and the 1SG is approx. 25%. 1SE to 1SF (I have driven both of these) is approx. 18%.

     

    I don’t see how it is possible for the V8 STS with that difference in final drive ratio (plus additional equipment = additional weight) can still achieve 26 MPG.

     

    So – are 1SF and 1SG stickers still showing Hwy = 26??????

     

    - Ray

    Still confused . . .
    2022 X3 M40i
  • bad2thebonebad2thebone Member Posts: 5
    The new STS has 440 HP @ 6400 RPM and 430 lb. ft torque. 0-60 mid 4 range. It appears Cadillac is going after the 7 series BMW the 760 V12 is rated a 438 HP and starts at $109,900. The S55 AMG starts at a $112,000. 0-60 4.6 per Mercedes dot com. The E55 has 469 HP not 493 as the editor reported in detroit auto show article on the STS, and starts @ $80,000. I would like for the editors to show some objectivity, by first waiting to drive the STSV and waiting to see what Cadillac is going to ask for it. I would think it has to be under the price tag of the XLR. I would be very surprised if it is doesn't start at $69,9900. and with opitions going up to maybe $74,000. When most auto magizines were suggesting the car would have as low as 380 HP, I applaud Cadillac for 440 HP. There is enough difference between the RWD V8 and the STSV I would pay the extra bucks for the STSV. This car was made for the super charged engine. This is a no excuse Caddy!
  • rayainswrayainsw Member Posts: 3,191
    With a STS 1SG (Premium Luxury Performance) with Performance Handling Package ($795) currently shown on Caddy’s Web Site listing at $62,800+, I would be amazed if the MSRP of the STS-V was under $75K.

     

    The additional 100 + HP added to the motor would not have been cheap. Adding the supercharger was accompanied by intercoolers and various internal changes, such as reduced bore and compression ratio.

     

    The upgrade to the 6-speed automatic – again, not cheap. (But may prevent a Gas Guzzler Tax - as the AWD V8 faces???)

     

    The Sport Buckets with adjustable bolstering are likely more expensive.

     

    The larger wheel and tire package clearly is more expensive.

     

    The Brembos are quite expensive. (As aftermarket, I have seen $4K+ for 4 wheel upgrade ‘kits’ – plus installation . . .)

     

    The suspension ‘tweaks’ require developing (and stocking) another set of part numbers.

     

    All this adds up.

     

    I would personally prefer to be able purchase a 1SF or 1SG STS and / or a STS-V withOUT the Nav system, for instance, as it is just not worth $2K + / - for my use.

     

    But that seems v. unlikely.

     

    Setting that issue aside, and presuming that the STS 1SG is indeed ‘worth’ almost $63K, I see the STS-V (based on specs – and having driven 2 ‘lesser’ STS-s) as worth $75K - ish.

     

    But then, I am not quite in the target market for this version – today.

     

    - Ray

    Not likely to be able to ‘swing’ $75K for a vehicle – today . . .
    2022 X3 M40i
  • bad2thebonebad2thebone Member Posts: 5
    I would agree the items you mentioned are not cheap, but since Cadillac is doing this all house that should help. Knowing GM there is going be a lot of sharing of parts, from the CTSV and Z06. I also think Cadillac learned a lesson from the SRX when the loaded it up with the $8,900 option pkg, just to get awd. In looking at recent cadillac options they do things like the $2500. cruse control. That is option I would delete,also I agreed I would not want to pay for a navigation system, when this car is made for the track or autobahn. I certainly won't be using the cruse control, or a navigational system to tell me where I am going at 160 MPH. Because of the type of car this is I hope they make the navigational system, and distance cruse control optional, those two things are $4500, subtract that from the $75,000. and you there. There are two other reasons I believe they will try to keep the base price down, because they do not want to compete head to price wise with a E55 at $80,000., and I don't think they want the STSV costing more than the flagship XLR. I will keep checking the GM media, but it will probably be several months, before they decide on the price. Hopefully the read our posts.
  • 14871487 Member Posts: 2,407
    I would estimate that this car will base for $70K with a few option available. You were right about Edmunds having incorrect figures regarding the E55's power. They were so quick to discredit the STS-V that they had the wrong information posted. 30hp isn't really that significant when you are talking about cars this fast. Besides, the E55 isnt much of a track car, it's more like the ulitmate muscle car. I don't think anyone ever said the E55 could match the M5 on the track. I think the STS-V will be slower than both, but more tuned to the track than the E55.
  • rayainswrayainsw Member Posts: 3,191
    "There are two other reasons I believe they will try to keep the base price down, because they do not want to compete head to price wise with a E55 at $80,000., and I don't think they want the STSV costing more than the flagship XLR."

     

    Before I saw the actual pricing of the STS and the Option Groups, I'd have agreed with you.

     

    Caddy now however seems to be committed to some sort of "premium pricing" strategy.

     

    I do not believe that they have earned it - yet.

    But that may just be me . . .

    We'll see.

    - Ray

    Thinking that at $70K less typical US luxury nameplate negotiations could = a reasonable price for the STS-v . . .
    2022 X3 M40i
  • sls002sls002 Member Posts: 2,788
    Road & Track is estimating $75000 for the STS_v. There will be an XLR_v.
  • rayainswrayainsw Member Posts: 3,191
    "Road & Track is estimating $75000 for the STS_v. "

     

    Hence the discussion here, I presume.

     

    OTOH, production is scheduled for several months from now - and final pricing will not likely be set / published for a while . . .

     

    Many things that affect pricing could change.

     

    - Ray

    Glad that, at any price, Caddy is producing such a cool vehicle . .
    2022 X3 M40i
  • 14871487 Member Posts: 2,407
    They dont know how much this car will be. I have seen estimates from $65K to $75K, same goes for the Z06. We wont know until the official numbers are released.
  • bad2thebonebad2thebone Member Posts: 5
    The STS Premium luxury model is listed at $60,835, it still has a $1800. Navigational unit in it, and a sunroof which Cadillac usually charges about $1500. for. The Performance package car is listed at about $58,300, this is a well equipped car. It appears they have about four models in the V8 section now, so the biggest item would be the Super charged engine, looking at the Jaguar site it appears they charge about 3000, to 4000. dollars for the super charged engine. The way GM operates I would expect probably three versions of the STS V range from the high sixties to just under Seventy-Five thousand if you add radar cruise control $2300., $995. Special paint. This car is still has to compete with the BMW 745I at $69,900., and the M5 whatever BMW decides to charge for it, I think Car & Driver estimated $90,000. that seems high to me. That is SL 500 price range. Until Cadillac re establishes itself as the standard of the World, they are going to have to price there cars accordingly. The STS V same as the XLR has to appear to be a bargain compared to the German cars. That strategy has worked pretty well for Lexus. The STS is not the car to reestablish themselves as the standard of the World they need to build the Sixteen, and a V12 Escalade ESV with five hundred plus horses. Cadillac was always known for being outrageous in its hay day.
  • patpat Member Posts: 10,421
    You were right about Edmunds having incorrect figures regarding the E55's power. They were so quick to discredit the STS-V that they had the wrong information posted.

     

    Would you click ont the "Feedback" link at the top of the page and report this with all the details you can think of? That would be very helpful, thanks!
  • sls002sls002 Member Posts: 2,788
    Road and Track was making a guess. But, DVD nav is standard. The instrument panel is covered in leather and there are other upgrades. Expect a significant premium over the AWD model.
  • rayainswrayainsw Member Posts: 3,191
    Couple of things regarding your pricing comment: “looking at the Jaguar site it appears they charge about 3000, to 4000. dollars for the super charged engine.” – bad2thebone

     

    The Jag S-Type R includes some rather expensive items over the “regular” S-Type 4.2 – Active Suspension and Brembo brakes.

     

    Here is my analysis:

     

    Jag S-Type R MSRP = $58,995 (including dest.)

    Jag S-Type 4.2 – MSRP = $51,330

    Plus Sport Package,

    Heated Seats

    and Xenons (each standard on S-Type R) + dest. =

    MSRP = $54,370

     

    Thus the supercharged motor PLUS the CATS adaptive suspension PLUS the big Brembo brakes cost an additional $4,625 - installed (so to speak). (My understanding is that neither CATS nor the Brembos are available on the “regular” 4.2.)

     

    So – assuming that the brakes and the CATS would only retail for $1,000 each (HA!) the supercharged 4.2 costs (at MSRP) $2,625 more. . .

     

    [In fact, I believe that given the development and manufacturing costs of such a suspension – in limited numbers – and the costs of a set of Brembo brakes - this really indicates that they are almost GIVING AWAY the upgrade to the supercharged motor.]

     

    The S-Type R MSRP was reduced over $4K for 2005 – with no ‘de-contenting’.

     

    The STS-v clearly also includes other (some quite expensive) things besides the supercharged motor. And Caddy has apparently chosen not to market it as a stand-alone option. Much as the S/C motor is not available as a stand-alone option on the S-Type Jag.

     

    If I could arrange my finances to afford one . . .

     

    - Ray

    Not in this market, today – or likely this year. . .
    2022 X3 M40i
This discussion has been closed.