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Mazda - Does it have a good future in US?

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Comments

  • nvbankernvbanker Member Posts: 7,239
    You are a treehumpindog, aren't you? You lost a lot of credibility with me with that selection, but I'm sure that won't keep you up.

    Having only driven an RX-8 so far for 2004, I am unqualified to talk about the rest of the line at this point. I will say though, that the styling on the Rx-8 is just marvelous, IMO, but I wasn't in love with the "way" it drove, and did notice the absence of low end torque. High end performance seems to be where it's at with this car, and that pretty much matches any of the Bavarian products I've driven lately as well.

    Having said all that - how many Rx-8s have been sold so far, and is it on par with their projections? I don't know, too lazy to go looking.....
  • nippononlynippononly Member Posts: 12,555
    I was looking for a car right now...that RX8 would be at the top of my list...I wonder if Toyota will ever get it together and bring back the Supra. I would take an RX8 over a 350Z though...

    2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)

  • graphicguygraphicguy Member Posts: 13,665
    RX8 sales are a little ahead of projections so far.

    Considering Mazda has already announced that they will use the RX8 platform for other vehicles, I'd say Mazda is pleased.

    Plus, Mazda just announced a huge increase in all vehicle sales (and put them in the black), they seem to be on a roll.
    2023 Honda Accord Hybrid Touring
  • treehumpindogtreehumpindog Member Posts: 22
    i'm sorry to say i have to give the thumbs down to the rx8 because it doesn't have enough space in the back to load 4x8 sheets and it don't float too good. what good is a car that won't take you across the river and back on a tank of gas? sheesh!
  • nvbankernvbanker Member Posts: 7,239
    don't forget the cupholders. I refuse to own a car without at least 9 cupholders......
  • guestguest Member Posts: 770
    -History of mediocre resale value on Mazda vehicles.

    -Customer Service needs on improvement.

    -Mazda needs to market its name better. One Honda owner I told I drove a Mazda they act like they don't know what the heck a Mazda is. That needs to be changed. What I mean is every young buyer what the heck a Protege 5 is but the older buyer has no clue.

    -More single car dealers. Mazda is usually aligned with a Toyota dealer or even a Hynudai dealer. Some Mazda dealer's are next door to a Honda dealer which doesn't help matters either. That needs to be changed. Put dealers where Honda and Toyota dealers aren't.
  • nippononlynippononly Member Posts: 12,555
    mazda dealer is a combo with Hyundai/Cadillac/Buick...now that is confusing!

    Not to mention its physical location is between the Acura and Toyota dealers. :-)

    Agree: Mazda needs a MUCH better dealer network. People with knowledge on the models and how to properly service them.

    2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)

  • graphicguygraphicguy Member Posts: 13,665
    I believe one of the biggest problems with Mazda dealers is the fact that Mazda has never demanded their franchises to be stand alone like Acura or Lexus does.

    GM is the same way. I see a lot of Buick/GMC/Pontiac dealerships stuck in the same physical location. Too many competing products to do justice to any one of them.

    That said, my dealership has one of the top rotary techicians in the country. I hope they pay him as such because he's a real "guru" when it comes to anything regarding RX7s and RX8s. As icing on the cake, he's also an RX7 owner and general rotary lover. His only job at the dealership is to work on the rotaries. Until the RX8 came out, he was stuck working on more mundane vehicles as there were fewer and fewer RX7s to maintain. He's now got much more job security.
    2023 Honda Accord Hybrid Touring
  • nvbankernvbanker Member Posts: 7,239
    I thought the Zoom Zoom campaign was pretty good, actually, and was getting some brand recognition out there. Then, it abruptly stopped, it seemed - about the time Nasser scuttled Ford. Shame, I thought they had something really going there.

    There is a loyal Mazda base out there, who are hoping for some support from the company.
  • guestguest Member Posts: 770
    is still a little bit there though Mazda is focusing less on it now. They usually save the "Zoom Zoom Zoom" saying for the end of their commercials for the past year unlike a few years ago where the "Zoom Zoom Zoom" was more apparent throughout their commercials. Mazda has gotten alot better in their marketing lately I think.

    Nasser messed up Ford thank god they got somebody in there who knows what they are doing like Bill Ford. I'm not the biggest Ford fan but Bill Ford seems very focused on getting the job dome right at Ford.
  • nvbankernvbanker Member Posts: 7,239
    At least Bill is invested in the success of the company, financially of course, but also because of the family honor, such as it probably is. You wouldn't want to be the Ford that buried Ford....
  • treehumpindogtreehumpindog Member Posts: 22
    because of their terrible history of recalls, i would not even entertain the thought of buying a ford vehicle right now, except for maybe the f150. pity, because with the upcoming 2005 mustang, ford gt, freestyle, and aforementioned f150, i think ford is putting out some of the freshest-looking vehicles inside and out of any manufacturer. but looks don't mean much if the quality is suspect. too bad. mazda is doing a better job than ford these days of sprucing up their lineup in design AND reliability, which should help mazda address their biggest drawback compared to toyota and honda--mazda's lower resale values.
  • guestguest Member Posts: 770
    Mazda low resale value can be attributed to Mazda discounting cars and giving 2,000 dollars to 4,000 dollars off each vehicle it sells. With the discounts come lower resale value.

    On a side note about Ford their quality isn't bad. The 13 recalls on the Focus and the Firestone Tires a few years ago is what kills their reputation. The Tarus has always been reliable. The Explorer is a top seller. I mean Ford's not bad from a quality aspect. Its just when you put Ford parts into a Mazda car but thats a different saubject all together.
  • nvbankernvbanker Member Posts: 7,239
    Yeah, thd, I'm not sure how you're translating recalls on the Focus as poison for the whole line either. The Focus had 14 recalls, I think? The Escape had some too. But the BMW X-5 is now up to 16 I believe - are you afraid of BMW too? (You should be). How many Recalls have the Crown Victoria had? And the exploding gas tank thing is a farce too - I don't care what you hit with an Impala at 75 MPH, you're going to have a fire, especially if you have welded a tire iron in the trunk pointing at the gas tank shield, like the Texas PD did.

    Recalls on the Taurus, Windstar, Mustang, Explorer, Expedition, Excursion, Ranger, F-150, 250, 350, Econoline? Minimal, nominal and insignificant.

    Now, I'll admit, I have little confidence in the Taurus drive train for a long term performer, which carries over into the Windstar, but the Panther cars (Crown Vic, Grand Marquis, Town Car) are among the finest, long term runners in the world. Check the threads here on them, you won't believe the testimonials they get!

    Not every car Ford makes is a great one. But some of them are amazingly good. Just like everyone else. It isn't Recalls that scare me. It's overall design & quality. Mitsubishi won't ever recall a car, or admit an issue with a car, and they've had some horrible safety issues.
  • wonderwallwonderwall Member Posts: 126
    I just bought a 2003 PR5 and my neighbors assumed it was some sort of a Honda. A teenager came up to me a few days ago and said, "Nice Focus!" My grandfather-in-law when I told him I bought a Mazda was expecting a Miata until I pulled up at their house... and then he asked me if I liked the Wankel engine...
  • treehumpindogtreehumpindog Member Posts: 22
    i see your point. i'm still gunshy because of all the negative press the focus got, but fair is fair, other manufacturers also get a lot of recalls too. i'm aware of the poor ratings mitsubishi, mercedes benz and horror of horrors volkswagen have gotten, but i didn't know bmw was problematic too. as i said before, i think ford is putting out some really nice-looking vehicles of late, especially in the area of interiors, a weak spot for chrysler and GM. the new interiors of the f150 and mustang look great, light years ahead of the last editions, and the lincoln navigator kicks cadillac's butt thru the uprights in terms of rich detailing and overall feeling of tasteful luxury. if the mercury marauder had a luxurious interior like the navigator, ford would be able to move a lot more units, i'm sure. i would probably put it on my short list too, being a muscle car kinda guy at heart, but a refined quiet roomy luxury vehicle kinda guy in the seat of my pants. maybe the chrysler 300c will be a good fit with a hemi powerplant...
  • dinu01dinu01 Member Posts: 2,586
    That's so strange to hear stories like that from the States. Mazda Proteges, Miatas, MPVs and to a certain extent the 6 are sees quite frequently in Canada (Toronto and Montreal have LOTS of Proteges/P5s!).

    Of course all Mazda dealers here are independent and while MOST ppl will always check H/T before Mazda or Nissan, the Pro and MPV sell quite well I think, based on the many I see daily.

    Dinu
  • guestguest Member Posts: 770
    BMW's is ok although I don't care for their current styling direction. THe X5 does have alot of recalls. Mitsubishi I have spoke about many times on this board. They have just have been a poorly run company over the past decade. I know hiding recall notoce's in locker is not acceptable. I am also aware of VW's problems and Mercedes problems with cars. I'm not targeting Ford and saying their bad cars. I did say they were ok reliability wise. Their not the worst cars reliability wise.

    As far as Mazda is concerned they are not popular in the states because of their lack of brand name recognition. You see Twice as many Nissan's as you do Mazda's and 3 times as many Honda's and Toyota's as you do Mazda's. Look at post 420 for for proof of Mazda's lack of brand recognition.
  • nvbankernvbanker Member Posts: 7,239
    they just don't make much of an impression, unless you're a Mazdaphile, because they suffer from Japanitis styling, and resemble everything else. The Miata is unique, and a recognizable car for everybody, but the rest aren't.
  • guestguest Member Posts: 770
    Your an American Car Fan so styling is kinda different from what the Import Car Fan looks at.

    The 6 looks better than the Accord and Camry. The RX-8 is pretty sleek. The MPV is the best looking mini-van money can buy. Mazda's don't resemble Toyota's at all(well the newer Mazda's anyway.) Mazda went through that spell in the mid to late 90's when they tried to make their cars look like Honda's and Toyota's. I'm not going to diss Ford but the Explorer and Tarus don't make much of an impression on me either when I look at them. The Focus and Maustang is pretty disctictive but the rest no. The Ford Contour that really didn't sell well. I would take any Mazda over any Ford in the styling department. Any Mazda is better looking than any Ford, Chevy, or Toyota. Thats just my opinion. To me when hear about bland Japanese styling its like whats so good about the way an Impala or a Tarus looks? Im not dissing anybody who likes Anerican Cars but I just don't get what so great about the way an American Car looks.
  • nvbankernvbanker Member Posts: 7,239
    I'm a FORD fan, really. I just divested myself of a damn good Honda Civic a few months ago. There are Foreign cars I like a lot, though I tend to own more Domestics admittedly, because they often are more attractive to me. But, you'll note I don't have a Taurus, though I confess to have owned some early ones.

    I am a Mazda fan also - I liked the 929 a lot, the 626 for certain features. The Miata is hot, the RX-8 is beautiful. The Millenia is nice, but a tad smallish inside. I would like to see Mazda get some serious backing from Daddy, and make a real impact.
  • nippononlynippononly Member Posts: 12,555
    chat with my non-car-fan friends, I find that to them, all Japanese cars are Hondas or Toyotas, with a smaller recognition that there is a "third brand" - Nissan! :-P

    Seriously, we will pass a Pro5 on the street, and I will say "See, that's a Mazda", and they will give me a blank stare? "What is a Mazda?"

    It didn't help that the sedans had no distinctive styling features in the 90s to differentiate them from the pack of small and midsizers.

    Of course, the one significantly distinctive car they do make, the Miata, is widely recognized, even by my clueless friends! Unfortunately, they are not aware it is a Mazda...

    2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)

  • nvbankernvbanker Member Posts: 7,239
    That is so true, Nippon....non-car-guys (people) can't tell a Park Avenue from a Colony Park can they. To them, it's blue. LOL
  • guestguest Member Posts: 770
    People actually talk about Toyota's? I don't think people in my agre group(I'm 24 now) actually talk about Toyota's unless maybe its the Celica. The RAv 4 I don't mind talking about. The rest of their line-up doesn't strike my interest to much.

    About Mazda's sedans I think the 93-97 626 did differentiate from the pack. The 98 626 was nice looking but it didn't really differentaiate itself from the pack. Remember the Ford tranny destroyed early to mid 90's 626's sales. The Millenia was distinctive looking but its a Mazda and not an Acura or a Lexus.

    RV banker:

    About the Tarus its not a bad car but I just don't find anything flashy about it. It lacks pizzaz in the styling department. The Altima, Passat, and 6 have pizzaz to them. Of course I liked the pre-2001 Honda Accords so I guess I am one that shouldn't talk about "pizzaz".
  • nvbankernvbanker Member Posts: 7,239
    What Ford tranny did the 626 have in it?
  • guestguest Member Posts: 770
    That happened in the 94 model year. Ford put their tranny into the 626 4 cyl models and that tranny was a nightmare for 626 owners. Consumer reports does not reccomened a 94 626 in their best bets for used cars. The 5 speed manual tranny and 6 cyl auto trannys in 626's were reliable. I think(if I'm correct, somebody can correct me if I'm wrong) but Mazda did re-work the Ford Tranny for the 96 model year to reduce tranny failure's in the 4 cyl auto 626's. Consumer Reports lists 626's from model years 1996-2002 from average reliability to above average reliability even with the Ford Tranny. The reliability rating also includes the 5 speed manuals and 6 cyl auto tranny's as well. I'm not sure where Consumer Reports rated the 95 626's reliability at. I do believe the 95 626 with the Ford Tranny was problematic as well. The Ford Trany was also in the 94-97 Mazda MX-6 coupe. 93 626 and 93 MX-6 did not use a Ford Tranny despite being new bodystyles for the 93 model year. Lastly, Thats why I made that remark before: "Ford's reliability is not that bad but putting Ford Parts in Mazda cars is a totally different subject." To sum up the post Ford Tranny in the 94-95 626 and 94-95 MX-6 were very problematic.

    The Ford Tranny in the 626 was the same one used in the Ford Contour I think.
  • nvbankernvbanker Member Posts: 7,239
    Yeah, that makes sense then.
  • nippononlynippononly Member Posts: 12,555
    I wasn't talking so much about what people talk about, just what so-called "laypeople" know about cars, which aint that much. However, they do know of Toyota and can spot one, same for Honda, but are pretty clueless on other Japanese brands. Funny that Honda has more recognition despite being a much smaller company than Nissan. This is, of course, my own personal experience ONLY. No nationwide survey here! :-)

    2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)

  • nvbankernvbanker Member Posts: 7,239
    Honda doesn't make that many models, so their sales are concentrated into recognizable product, mainly accord & civic. Also, helps them to focus their energies into quality for each model, which GM is too damn big to do.
  • guestguest Member Posts: 770
    Nissan is bigger than Honda? You have to explain that one to me. When I was in High School I used to talk about Honda all the time. When the new Accord came out in 1997-1998 I couldn't stop talking about it. Anyways I know Nissan is the second most profitable automaker next to Porcshe but they are bigger than Honda? I don't know about that. Nissan from what I understand as far back as the early 90's used to outsell Honda than Nissan had a string of styling duds which allowed Honda to pass Nissan in sales. What year did Honda pass Nissan in sales anyway? To me Honda is bigger than Nissan because Honda never went bankrupt and Honda is the more established brand of the 2. Its not a diss against Nissan at all. Carl Ghosn has done a good job over at Nissan and and Nissan/Infinti has the most disctinctive styled vehicles of any automaker today. Its just I would pick a Mazda 6 over a Nissan Altima or a Mazda 3 over a Nissan Sentra. The 02-03 Nissan Sentra SE-R's are pretty nice looking but I don't know how to drive a stick and the interior theme in the Sentra as Motor Trend pointed out once looks kinda dated. The interior looks nicer than a Civic but not nicer than a Protege ot the new 3. I might have picked up a 99 Nissan Altima had I not needed a car urgently 4-5 years ago. Thats when I discovered Mazda when I needed a car urgently.
  • guestguest Member Posts: 770
    I don't think you have to worry about quality issue's with GM anymore. They don't make them like they used to(1980's quality style) which is a good thing. The 92 Grand Am my family had was the worst car ever though. That and the old Plymouth Duster. Those 2 cars were bad. We also had a 1988 Pontiac Grand Prix(first year model) and had the engine shut on a and off at times(still a good car though.) Also had a 1987 or 1988 Buick Stylark for 3 years. No quality issue's there. Have also had a 99 Grand Prix and 02 Grand Prix: no issues there. If you want to talk to somebody abou GM and quality I'm your man too talk too. My family has also had Chevy Corsica and other domestics. I think the tiniest car I ever sat in was the late 80's/early 90's Toyota Corolla. That thing was tiny. It wasn't a bad car it just felt like you were sitting in a sub-compact car.
  • windowphobe6windowphobe6 Member Posts: 765
    The dates as given are pretty accurate. The '94, being the first year we got this tranny - it first appeared in Europe in the '93 Ford Mondeo, which eventually mutated into the Contour/Mystique twins - was troublesome as only a 1.0 product can be. Most of the glaring design defects were fixed over the next two or three years, though it took a while for the failure rate to come down.

    The transmission in question is Ford's CD4E, which in Mazda applications is designated LA4A-EL. The only vehicles currently using it, to my knowledge, are the Escape/Tribute siblings, and it had to be substantially reworked to handle 4WD; it's not doing too badly.

    In the CR 2004 Buying Guide, which just came out, the '95 and '96 trans have dropped to below average, though it's still only the half-black dot, as opposed to the solid black dot earned by the '94 every year.
  • nippononlynippononly Member Posts: 12,555
    is a full-line manufacturer, Honda isn't. Not to mention Nissan is a WAY bigger seller in the home market than Honda is. Honda is actually not such a big company, a fact that makes me fear for its independent existence every once in a while.

    I mean, look at Mazda. Small, and got swallowed up. There are only two independent Japanese manufacturers left today: Toyota and Honda. And even Mazda competes in more segments of the market than Honda does, albeit in some cases with rebadged Fords (Tribute, B-series truck).

    2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)

  • nvbankernvbanker Member Posts: 7,239
    I fully expect Toyota to buy either GM or Ford at some point.
  • newcar31newcar31 Member Posts: 3,711
    "I fully expect Toyota to buy either GM or Ford at some point."

    Dang, that would be strange. Toyota in control of Mazda, Aston Martin, Jaguar, Ford, Mercury, Volvo, Lincoln, and Land Rover. I wonder if they'd keep all of the brands? Platform sharing?

    How about Lincoln Town Car based on the LS430? What about a FWD Camry based 4 door entry level Aston Martin? A small Lincoln based on the Corolla? The possibilities are endless!!
  • guestguest Member Posts: 770
    that Ford owning 34% of Mazda means nothing to me unless its a rebadged Ford. Ford has owned part of Mazda since the 70's.

    I think GM is straightening itself out and it knows what it customers want now. I mean I was reading in an article today about GM's new Design Chief. I mean in the early to mid 90's GM was doing exterior designs by different comitee's. You can't do that. GM made alot error's in product decions in the 80's/early 90's. I think having Bob Lutz in there will improve things. Beyond his tenure at GM I'm not so sure what the future of GM will be. Lutz has alot of authority whenever he's at different automotive companies. I'm not the biigest GM Fan but what they are doing with Cadillac currently I have to some faith in GM.
  • nvbankernvbanker Member Posts: 7,239
    methinks you are overly optimistic about GM. I see they are possibly straigtening out one division, CAdillac. The rest continue to be managed from the office of monotony & mediocre.
  • guestguest Member Posts: 770
    is to fix Buick the way they did Cadillac which isn't impossible but I admit it will be a pretty hard task. The new design cheif for GM said he will work on fixing Buick's exterior design's. He said even the younger stylists who work at GM's styling studio's say: "I'm going to be buying a Buick". Let me put it this away: when I see Buick's exterior styling getting better in person I'll actually believe Buick is on the road to recovery.
  • chevytruck_fanchevytruck_fan Member Posts: 432
    yeah and the same people 2 years ago said Cadillac won't be able to turn around with new designs, yep looked like all you anti-GM fanatics were right, everyone hates theCTS and really hates the CTS-V what a piece, the Escalade was a bomb like everyone thought, the SRX well what a hunk of junk, and the XLR what bad reviews it has gotten.
  • nippononlynippononly Member Posts: 12,555
    speculation in this week's AutoWeek that Ford may need to sell Volvo and Land Rover soon just to stay in the game...but of course, the hypothetical Toyota purchase of Ford would still put it in control of Aston martin and Jaguar...you are right, that would be a strange mix.

    Toyota already runs another Japanese company - Daihatsu. I think it would do a good job with Mazda if it owned it. Similar to what Ford has already done with it, only no rebadged Toyotas sold as Mazdas! :-)

    2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)

  • graphicguygraphicguy Member Posts: 13,665
    In all reality, GM, Ford and Toyota are just too big to be buying each other. Plus, none of that would make any sense.

    If anything, I would think Honda is the most vulnerable to be bought by either GM or Ford. I doubt Honda would be of interest to Toyota because of the overlap in products and the fact that Honda doesn't have anything Toyota needs.

    Doubtful, but if Honda was bought out by GM or Ford, they could use Honda's car expertise and Honda could use GM's/Ford's truck expertise.

    Mazda is currently the shining star for Ford, currently. And that's because Ford is allowing them to "do their own thing".

    I never could understand Land Rover's place in the world given the high end SUVs currently offered by the likes of Lexus, Lincoln, Caddy and Infiniti....all of them offering better iterations of the SUV than Land Rover offers.
    2023 Honda Accord Hybrid Touring
  • nippononlynippononly Member Posts: 12,555
    just like Toyota Land Cruiser, made its rep in being one of the last REAL off-road trucks with the Disco and the Range Rover.

    Of course, both of these trucks have been super-luxed up, and in the case of the Range Rover, heavily modified to provide the fast sporty car-like ride that buyers of luxury SUVs now expect. The result is you might be in trouble taking either truck off the road nowadays, at least in stock form.

    Agree that no-one among GM, Ford, and Toyota is buying any of the others. Mazda has its brightest future in years. If Ford had to pick only one of the foreign divisions it could keep, I would think they would be smart to pick Mazda.

    2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)

  • nvbankernvbanker Member Posts: 7,239
    Ford is leveraging at least 5 of their new cars off Mazda platforms in the next 4 years. The new Ford sedans will essentially be Mazda under the skin. Not a bad strategy for lots of reasons. I'm thinking Mazda has more to contribute to the success of Ford than most people give them credit for.
  • nippononlynippononly Member Posts: 12,555
    better engineering!

    2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)

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  • chevytruck_fanchevytruck_fan Member Posts: 432
    It really bums me out personally, I used to like Ford they were doing good coming out with good vehicles in the mid 90's, good trucks, taurus, contour, etc etc

    then they got that arab guy (was he libyan ?) running the company and everything went crashing down. Ford was doing good here so they thought they could waste money on extremely stupid purchases like land rover, aston martin, jaguar etc. So instead of spending money on Lincoln to make an awesome luxury division (what Cadillac is doing now) and mercury a different brand than Ford and continuing to improve the Ford models they blew all their money. Now instead of gaining market share they are loosing it rapidly and not updating products like the should. If Ford stayed on its course it would be closer to GM's market share and with GM's turnaround they could have togather fought off the japanese invasion that has occured in full force. Nope instead they blew their money on useless brands nobody cares about. Plus Ford was really making big improvements on the quality front, now they are one of the worst mfg.

    The one exception is Mazda, that turned out to be a good investment, thought it may not be different enough to not steal sales from Ford. They serve different markets really, but there is so good overlap. But they have captured the youth market good with Mazda with attractive products.

    It really is a shame what they did to Ford.
  • ashutoshsmashutoshsm Member Posts: 1,007
    ... Mazda will soon take over Ford ... Mua Ha Ha hA!

    That bit of humor aside, I just wanted to point out that unless you meant the insinuation, noting the previous Ford heads country of origin would be considered a no no. But I won't be judegemental.

    I'll re-assert that I feel Ford is continually shooting itself in the foot with the whole ridiculous pressure on suppliers to drop prices on parts, and the bottom line, resulting in absolutely crappy quality pretty much across the line, and precipitating their own decline. I don't see them making any real attempt to rein in quality and take control. Sad, but true.
  • nippononlynippononly Member Posts: 12,555
    since Mazda will now provide most of the engineering for the sedans for itself, Ford, and Volvo, it will probably end up being the best investment Ford ever made.

    And if you mean Jac Nasser, wasn't he Australian or something?

    2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)

  • chevytruck_fanchevytruck_fan Member Posts: 432
    he was from some other country but I'm fairly shure he had libyan

    anyway Ford's engineering in the mid 90's far surpassed Mazda if you asked me. The only car Ford had designed by mazda (is there more?) was the probe and that wasn't a very good car.
  • nippononlynippononly Member Posts: 12,555
    The Probe was a Mazda? I thought the MX-6 was a Ford! At least, the V-6. And you're right, it wasn't very good.

    The Escort was basically a Protege, one of the reasons for it being one of the better cars Ford has produced in the last fifty years.

    The Ranger's perennial success is based on the foundation of its "launch years" in the 80s, when it was a rebadged Mazda.

    2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)

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