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Frontier vs Ranger
Ok, the battle line has been drawn. Who wants to
start?
start?
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Comments
The kingcab is a joke too, no room at all in the back. And what kind of rearends to they have??
let's please try not to take as much time with this as last time. I'll be brief with the advantages and please do the same,
All Frontiers have some advantages over Ranger regardless of models compared. Better build quality, less cost of ownership, better ride, longer warranty, larger bed, tighter turning circle and lower price.
Styling is subjective, but if I picked a truck based only on looks, it would not be the ranger or frontier, probabaly the tacoma or dakota, I like the looks of my frontier better than any ranger I have seen.
4cylinder trucks;
in addition to the above advantages, the frontier has 143hp DOHC engine VS 119hp SOHC. THe frontier has a timing chain VS a belt on the ranger. 1400lb
payload for frontier VS 1260 ranger, 3500lb towing
for the frontier VS 1380 ranger, bed length 77.4"
frontier VS 72.00" ranger, also 17.1" tall frontier bed
VS 16.4 ranger also 41.7" between wheel wells frontier VS 40.4 ranger, (so basically a much bigger bed). Plus more head, shoulder and hip room.
and 15" wheels VS 14".
V6 4x4 models;
more sophisticated engine with liquid filled engine mounts, 105,000 mile interval on timing belt, higher ground clearance, standard ABS W/ G-sensor, better handling, lower price with more standard features, more standard HP and torque,
even the most expensive ranger V6 has less HP.
And as much as Vince tries to convince us about ford quality, it seems like every month we see a
new report on ford recalling a few million vehicles for something or other, also look in the
news forum here on worst cars I ever owned and count how many fords you see versus Nissans. Nissan also has the first full line of compact trucks, offering the versatilty of the first Compact crew cab in america and the new desert runner V6 4x2.
Nissan has been doing tremendously well on the trucks, the crew cabs and Xterras have recieved fabulous reviews and tremendous demand that is straining production. People are actually paying OVER MSRP for crewcabs and Xterras just to get one, I think that is pretty good. Also the Crew cab has a 4' bed not 3' and the bed extender gives you a 6' bed. Also the other compact crewcabs that are coming out from folks like ford are going to have a smaller bed also, are they being gimmiky too? If so, no problem, people are buying
these gimmikky trucks faster than they can be built.
What is this with 14" wheels? I have 16" wheels on my Ranger??? Also, the Ranger can tow up to 5000 pounds, bud. Because of the 225ft/lbs of torque vs the 200 ft/lbs of torque from the "much more sophisticated" Nissan V6? The 3.0 of the Ranger is more of a match for the Nissan V6. The Ranger also has standard ABS.
10 less HP from the Ranger 4.0? I have already made that up with my K$N air charger!
In the NW people aren't buying your Frontiers. I can count on one hand how many I have seen. I have only seen one in the outdoors on real trails, and thats because I took him there with my Ranger! As far as better handling, better check again, the Ranger is known for its ride and handling with its new front suspension. The skidpad rating for a Nissan is .68 vs .76 for a Ranger! better handling, don't think so. Also, check again, the Ford Ranger has 39.2" for front head room vs 39.3" for Nissan, wow a .1" difference! and the Ranger has more leg room 42.4 for the Ranger vs 41.4 for Nissan. The turning circle for a Ranger is 39.4 vs 39 for Nissan?? a .4 difference, not much advantage there. Also in comparison, the 3.0 Ranger puts out 152hp 195ft/lbs of torque and does 0-60 in 10.4 seconds, vs 170hp 200ft/lbs from the "sophisticated" nissan V6 and does 0-60 in 11.3 seconds??? Wow, that V6 is awesome that Nissan builds isn't it? All that sophistication and technology and they can't build a V6 with torque!!
As far as ground clearance goes, I have 31" tires on my Ranger, no contest, its ground clearance is much more than a Frontier. Also, with the 265 tires Ford offers, GC for the Ranger is closer to 10.3"! Surprise! The Ranger for all its "low technology" still out torques, out accelerates, out handles, plain out does the Frontier! As far as reliability, www.carpoint.msn.com, auto.com, and even consumer reports rates the Ranger very well. The Ranger still outsells the Frontier almost 5 to 1, even after the Frontier has been on the market for 3 years?? Sorry cncman, I will go to the end on this one, the Ranger is the superior truck here.
I agree, I will never convince Vince that the frontier is a better truck, because for him it isn't, just like he won't convince me that the ranger is better, because for me it isn't. My goal is not to win everyone over to Nissan, just want to show the advantages of each.
Vince;
you keep coming up with outrageous data that I can't figure out where it comes from, my data comes right from Ford and it shows the 2.5l ranger
having 119 hp not 125, unless there has been a recent change I don't know about. Also I have no idea of which turning radius you are comparing,
the 4x2 4cyl reg cab frontier has 33.4' VS ranger
4x2 XLT reg cab at 36.5', extended cabs are, 36.8'
for the Nissan and 41.6' for the ford. 4x4 x-cab is 39' for Nissan 42.4' for the ranger. So I get a difference of at least three feet up to five feet.
Also the Frontier does tow 5,000 lbs also, you just don't have to spend more money for extra options with the frontier, and yes Vince you can
buy performance items like the K&N and larger tires to make the ranger more competitive with the frontier, but I would rather get that advantage right from the factory. I think it is inappropriate to compare a modified ford to a stock Nissan for performance, although this is the only way it comes close. I guess your argument with the sales figures is that "ford sells more trucks than Nissan, therefore it is a better truck" That is faulty logic, the frontier outsells the mazda truck which is really a ranger, so I guess your conclusion would be that the ranger is better than the frontier and the frontier is better than the mazda? I just don't understand your logic. Also I see alot more Hyundais on the road than escorts so I guess that the hyundai is a better car than the escort, right Vince? Also I am glad that you keep bringing up carpoint, if you look, they rate the nissan higher in reliability than the ranger but I guess you forgot to bring this up right?
also I notice whenever the comparison of four cylinders come up,(which is what most people buy)
you always try to switch it to 4x4 V6's what about
the big differences there? The Nissan tows substantially more, carrys more has more Hp and torque and costs less to own, so please tell us how that is inferior? I am willing to admit that maybe the ford is marginally better than the frontier for offroading, because I don't know much about off roading because I use my frontier as a commuter and workhorse. But according to the data,
even the 4x4 V6 hardly blows the Nissan away. Now
four cylinders, there is a wider gap in the favor of the frontier. BTW even with a small price increase, the frontier gave you more features for the money and still costs less than the ranger.
I am kind of dissapointed Vince, you said you had really done your homework this time.
I totally agree that each pickup has certain advantages, but to sum it up they are both compact pickup trucks.
I test drove a Frontier the other day and found the engine to be quiet and smooth. However, when I jumped into the back of the cab, I found it to be more cramped and less comfy than the Ranger. Does the Ranger have a larger extended cab? I like the styling of both trucks, but find the Ranger to be a little more rugged looking.
I plan to get a V6 wth the auto trans. As far as performance is concerned, this is what I have noted from the brochures. The Ranger 4.0 offers 160 HP. The Frontier V6 offers 170 HP. The Ranger 4.0 offers 225 ft. lbs. torque. The Frontier offers 200, however, 90% of it's torque occurs at much lower RPM's than the Ranger. I'm no expert, but it seems that things may be fairly even in the torque dept. between these two trucks. In addition, both V6 engines can tow 5,000 lbs. when mated to the auto trans.
These are just some things I have noted about these two trucks. Like I said, I'll be in the market for a new pickup in the coming months. I plan to test drive a whole lot more because 1) it's the smart thing to do and 2) it's a heck of a lot of fun! I'll be doing my homework, but I would appreciate any comments, advice, and mechanical expertise from you Ranger/B-series and Frontier owners. Hope this topic grows! I'm enjoying the comments so far, and I'm sure I'll have more questions and comments of my own. I'll be in touch fellas. Until then, take it easy on eachother.
Skip
This is my second Ranger, first went 94K with only regular maintenance and ran fine at trade in.
The Mazda/Ranger are the best all around truck on the market today.
The Frontier is smaller inside when it comes to the kingcab versions.
All I can say is test drive, test drive, test drive.
Also, the price advantage has virtually vanished over the last year for the Nissan Frontier. If you have any Ford/Mazda questions pop on over to the Ranger room there are plenty of us there to answer any questions. Good luck.
Frontier XE Ext cab 4cyl auto w/air MSRP $16K
Ranger Super Cab XLT 4 cyl auto w/air MSRP $18K
Warranty:
Ranger 3/36 bumper to bumper 5/60 corrosion
Nissan 3/36 bumper to bumper 5/60 POWERTRAIN/corrosion
tell me, which is the better deal?
I'm also concerned over several comments I have seen about piston slap/knocking in the Ranger V6's. Is this occuring in the 4.0's or just the 3.0 engines? When I test drove the Nissan, the engine seemed pretty quiet and smooth. Then again, I don't recall hearing any knocking in my friend's 4.0 Ranger V6 and he seems very happy with his truck. Although, I do recall him mentioning that his warranty stinks and he would have liked it to be better.
Obviously, there are more Ranger owners than Frontier owners out there which is probably why we hear more complaints about Ford engine problems. Let's face it, no matter what make you decide to buy, they are all going to have lemons here and there. The question is, who keeps these lemons to a minimum? what we need here is to see more comments from some Frontier owners, especially those with the V6. I understand that the 3.3 V6 in the Frontier is the same engine they use in the Nissan Pathfinder. What has the track record been for this engine?
I mentioned in my previous post that both engines (Nissan 3.3 and Ford 4.0) are very close in horsepower and tourque and both engines have similar towing capacities when mated to the automatic, which I plan to get. With this in mind, lets talk about reliability a bit......shall we? Lets hear the hard facts....not opinions. Anybody done the research?
Skip
Good idea, yes the 3.3l V6 in the frontier has been used for awhile in the pathfinder with great success and also in the Infiniti QX4, I have a four cylinder myself so I can't give my ownership opinion of the six, but it is a proven engine,
105,000 interval on the timing chain, the engine also has it's roots in the old Nissan 3.0 V6 that was used in the old pathfinder and old V6 trucks,
which even a die hard Ford fan like LWF will tell was extrememly reliable, he had one that gave him great service.
Type in Ranger on your internet browser and read on!
I am, however, considering an F-150 XL V6 5sp reg cab which I can buy for a little over $13K, roughly same as a Frontier ext cab 4cyl 5sp. The final choice will be based on whether I need a work truck more or a commuter. My $0.02.
Glad that you are okay, but sorry about loss of your vehicle.
Also looked at the Ranger/B-series. Curiously, all the Ford dealers in town also sell Mazdas. I know Ford owns a good chunk of Mazda, but seeing the two trucks side-by-side on the same lot is a little strange. They didn't have a 5sp B3000. I'll find and test drive one to give it the benefit of the doubt. So far on paper, I still like Nissan's use of timing chain and DOHC designs better. Actually, I don't mind a pushrod engine, but the cost savings has to go right back into adding more value to the truck (i.e. better content or lower price). Unfortunately, I didn't see either with the Ford twin.
Nissan also has better powertrain warranty. Oh well, more test driving to go.
since this is frontier VS ranger I guess you could also say noone is buying rangers either, also somehow you never mentioned the fact that Nissans
truck sales were up 45% last month and ford was down .2% Hmmmm. Somebody's buying them!
skip, it depends on which model you look at, the XE has a basic interior, the SE is more suped up.
Here are the standings in truck sales from Jan 1 1998 to present. This represents the top 20 from auto stats.com. If you want the link I will give it to you.
1. Ford F-series
2. Chevy Silverodo
3. Ford Explorer (Where is the pathfinder)?
4. Dodge Ram
5. FORD RANGER
I will skip some, don't feel like listing them all.
7. Chevy S-10
12 Toyota Tacoma
13 Dodge Dakota
19. NISSAN FRONTIER
So, you tell me where is the so called 45% increase??? and the 2% decrease??? The Frontier ranks almost last! The Ranger has been the number one seller for 12 years in its class. I believe after 12 years if the Nissan was so much better the tide would have turned by now don't you think?
And if the demand was there for the Frontier Nissan now has the cash to ramp up due to its being owned by Renault.
skip, the kingcab version of the Ranger is larger than the Frontier. There is more space behind the seats for someone to actually sit for a short ride across town. Take a look for yourself.
Sorry i couldn't resist....(smile)
-wsn
First, your info (i guess) correct, so is cncman's. Nissan's truck sales ARE up 45% and Ford's are down 2%. They are up that month this year vs. that month last year. I guess you forgot to look that one up. Also that includes Xterra, Pathfinder, Frontier, and (MAYBE) Quest. The same rule applies for Ford: Ranger, F-SERIES, Explorer, Expedition, and (MAYBE) Windstar. So, Nissan may not sale half as much as ford, but their sales are UP. And Ford, may sale double that of Nissan, but their truck sales were down (for now).
Also, I heard, the reason for Ford's decline in sales is because it was the same time LAST year that there was that big GM strike. That could be why.
I have to admit that I was wrong about those numbers, I went back to autochannel.com and realized my mistake. Ford truck sales down 4.2%
Nissan truck sales up 53%! Both for the month of July VS 1 year ago. I sincerely apologize for any misunderstandings my error has caused. I can't believe you have the nerve to question me about numbers, have you found that 125hp 4cylinder ranger yet?
You keep trying to make the argument that since the ranger sells more than the frontier it is a better truck, but noone is buying your argument.
Ford sells thousands and thousands of these trucks to government agencies and utility companies etc.
All of these "fleet sales" go into the figures. This was the only way ford could keep the taurus
#1 for so long. Nissan frontier outsells the mazda Bseries, so either admit the frontier is a better truck than the mazda by your own argument or stop expecting us to buy that malarkee!
Skip sorry you are having trouble getting alot of input on the V6 truck, try the crewcab topic and Xterra topic, they have the same powertrain and are getting alot more attention now. I didn't reply because I have a four cylinder.
If Nissan were the better truck they have had over 40 years to prove it! Isn't this enough time???
As far as the fleet sales thing... I keep hearing this but still see tons of new Rangers on the road here in the N.W. compared to the hand full of new Frontiers I have seen.
About the Ford 4cyl, yes I made a mistake it is 120HP and 146ft/lbs of torque, in relation to the Nissan 4cyl of 143hp/ 154ft/lbs of torque. There is a 23hp difference and a 11 ft/lbs of torque difference in Nissans.
Although, Nissan makes 2 engines. A 2.4 4cyl 143hp/154ftlbs torque and a 3.3 V6 170hp/200ft/lbs of torque. Ford makes 3 engines a 2.5 4cyl 120hp/146ft/lbs of torque, a 3.0 V6 192ft/lbs of torque, and a 4.0 225ft/lbs of torque.
What cncman fails to mention is the difference in price between the 3.0 and the 2.5 is very small. I have seen as low as $500 in some deals. Like I have said, I know the Ford 4cyl is a joke. They build this engine only for one reason, mpg and for the light hauler. This engine is only for economy.
If you want to talk V6 vs V6, thats another story.
WS, as far as recalls, I have been down this road. Anyone who actually takes the time to read these will see half are duplicates, anther bunch don't affect the way the truck runs or its safety. And yes, I have been to the dealer to fix any recalls. Other wise my Ranger has performed flawlessly.
Even though I had owned a Tacoma and now a Frontier, I still don't feel I have a dog in this Tacoma/Frontier vs. Ranger fight. For one thing, I don't follow the herd. The pickup that gets driven home with me is one that suits my needs and wants the best, not what suits 1.2 million other people. More people buy Ranger? More power to them.
I chose the Frontier mostly because I wanted to stay with a frugal 4 cyl. (this is gonna be my commuter/worktruck) and Toyota/Nissan's 2.4L are the only ones with the power and DOHC design that I like. Nissan's better warranty was a plus.
The Ranger/B-series was considered briefly only because of the available 4 drs. In the end, the mechanical engr in me deemed the added convenience not worth the questionable structural integrity.
try again, it is 119hp not 120, sheesh, I even gave you the answer! I am glad you admit the four cylinder ford is a dog, but since most rangers are sold with the four cylinder, I guess we can conclude that most rangers are dogs, well, thanks for the info Vince, I guess we can end this topic.
As to the sales figures, how am I twisting this?
at least I have verifiable info. The point is, ford is loosing truck sales and Nissan is gaining,
I personally don't care about these figures, but
I thought you might like to see them as what you buy depends on what everyone else is buying.
recalls;
well I guess it doesn't bother you to have to bring your truck into the shop to have recalls done as long as there is little risk of you being killed! Personally I prefer to only do routine maintenance instead of having the dealer fix the problems the factory made, but then again, that's just me. And that's why I bought the frontier.
By the way I won't mention what my 4.0 will do to your high tech 3.3. :-)
that is not the measure of quality, it is the result of bad management decisions just as in the early 60's when ford was nearly going under accept for the mustang they would have gone under. ford has outsold simply because they are perceived as an american company. not necessarily because of their quality. they sell junk with manny problems.
you just won't admit it.
for someone that doesn't like Nissan you sure follow them alot, this is just what I expected, you can't hold your own comparing the trucks so you talk about the company, I guess in all of your reading, you somehow missed the $540 million turn around for the year Nissan posted on the bottom line and that was before the Xterra, crew cab and 2000 maxima came out, you also missed that sales are way up and incentives are down 40%, and Nissan
inventory is way down too, Hmmm, mighty convenient. BTW, I think they sell more yugos in yugoslavia than they do fords, so I guess by your argument the yugo is better than ford, I think it is a toss up!
I am done comparing the inferior V6 of Nissan to Fords V6.
Which I don't know why you don't have to back up anything you say, (like the incredible shrinking ranger four cylinder 125hp, then 120, then 119)
Mine come from automotive news and the car channel.com, neither of these have anything to do with Nissan. And here we see the last act of a desperate man, take your ball and go home, come back when you can play with the big boys!
This is in response to one of your earlier posts about truck interior. I've lived with a Tacoma for 3 years, didn't like it - too spartan and the cupholder blocks HVAC controls. I've sat in coworkers' S-10 - good supportive seats but I personally didn't like the typical GM switchgear. Ranger, only brief test drives so take this accordingly - very functional interior but somewhat dated look. As for the Frontier, well, I obviously like it the best cus I bought the thing. :-) The only complaint I have is about the soft foam seat cushions in the optional bucket seats I got. I actually liked the 60/40 split bench better. I weight a moderate 155lbs and I can see a heavier person bottoming out the bucket seat cushion. Just FYI.
The dinky jump seats in the Frontier ext cab are next to useless to me (as is the case with all other compact ext cabs). I plan on removing them soon. The huge cavities they leave behind, though, are ferfect for installing a custom subwoofer enclosure on one side and the electronics (amps. Xover, etc.) on the other side. This will leave the ext cab space free and clear of cargo and toolboxes.
The ext cab area of the Tacoma is too occupied by the forward facing jump seats and not flat floored. The ranger/B-series ext cab is very nice and look bigger probably because of the 4dr. Not being able to do the above described car audio install is another reason I didn't go with the 4dr.
Sorry, I can't comment on the S-10 as it was ruled out early in my selection process and didn't go check it out.
I have been in both a Ranger and a Frontier at this point. I think the Ranger has a very handsome interior and you are correct in saying that it is very functional. When I got myself a Frontier brochure, I was kind of turned off by the interior at first, particularly the dashboard. It looked cheap to me. But when I took a short test drive in one, I found I liked the interior much better in person. To be honest, I think all trucks, interior and exterior look better in person. The frontier dash has a very solid feel to it and it's very functional as well. I feel the same way about thew ranger dash, but I'm surprised you think the ranger dash looks more dated than the Frontier dash. I kinda thought it was the other way around. The ranger dash kind of flows, and the frontier dash is more boxy. It would be good to hear your reasoning behind this opinion.
I do think the Ranger has a larger extended cab. I got into the back of both of them and the Frontier was very cramped back there. Now, many people would argue that there is no room in the back of the extended cab of any compact pickup. However, when I crawled into the back of my friends Ranger one day I was pretty surprised at how much room I had when the passenger up front pulled their seat up a little bit. I mean I wasn't lounging around or anything back there, but I wasn't real uncomfortable either. But keep this in perspective. I'm not the biggest guy in the world.
By the way, I beleive you can have the jump seats deleted with the Ranger if you order it and save a little money from it. I don't plan on getting a four door so I would get the jump seats if I got a Ranger, they fold away nicely. This is not so with the four door. I probably won't have people in the back of the cab too much, but it would be nice to know i could get a third person back there If I really had to. That is, if my stuff doesn't get in the way.
Looking forward to further comments from you,
Skip
but it wasn't that bad, I did like sitting sideways better than straight forward, because my legs could stretch out, but that goes away if you have two people there, In my frontier, I only had
someone back there once, he got nauseus and swore off jumpseats forever! It's mostly me in the truck anyway as it is just a commuter, I probably only got the extended cab because of the bucket seats and the storage space, also I have my CD changer on the floor behind the driver's seat and I leave that jumpseat down to keep it hidden.
Glad to hear my comments were of some help. BTW, I'm 5'7" on a good day.
First, I've always tried to qualify my personal opinion appropriately so I don't tick people off. My Ranger interior remark was just that. I think it was the trim color coordination of the test drive truck that did it in for me. It had a beige cloth seating surface with black vinyl trim elsewhere. Plus I've never been much of a fan of Ford's round and ovalesque theme, which Ford itself is abandoning in favor of the New Edge look (e.g., Ford Focus, Mercury Cougar, etc.). I prefer the "square" looks of the Frontier. Again, purely personal.
Second, the jump seats. After being rear-ended twice in 1 year, the second of which totaled my Tacoma, I won't let anybody sit in the ext. cab of my truck. I'm convinced if that Tacoma were an ext. cab and someone was sitting in it at the time of the accident, that someone would either be dead or seriously injured. The impact shattered the rear windows and showered both my wife and I with glass fragments. Comfortable or not, the ext. cab is not place for passengers. Even on short trips. Our accident happened on my way back home from work, and I have a 3-1/2 mile commute!
Also the 4dr thing. No thanks. I'd rather have 4 limbs and 2 drs than the other way around.
I apologize for sounding so grim about it all, but I've been in enough accidents and witness the consequences of yet more to realize the absolute importance of safety over convenience, or anything else for that matter.
Buckle up, gang.