Extended Warranties

zueslewis · September 2003

what is Schedule A maintenance for your car? If it says 3,000 mile oil changes (versus 5-6K for Schedule

, they have an out. You have abused the car, in their opinion.

The thing you're not getting is THEY DO NOT HAVE TO ESTABLISH ANY STANDARDS. They wrote the contract. If their adjuster says your situation doesn't meet their standards, you're done.

That's the primary difference, other than legal recourse, between private and factory-backed service contracts.

draknad · September 2003

Who is the adjuster, or what is an adjuster?
Can I contact, or dispute with them?
Is this the inspector who took the pictures?
Please help.
Thank you.

Oil changes were not mentioned as the reason.
Just "normal wear".

-draknad

zueslewis · September 2003

by most private service contract companies. In some cases, if the contract company has dealt with the dealership before, they may not use an adjuster and may rely on the service manager's opinion.

If someone took pictures, he's your adjuster.

A failure is a failure - "normal wear", to me, is ridiculous if it's within the mileage standards of the service contract.

Then again, it's their contract - they can pretty much say and do what they want. This is why I slam private contracts at every opportunity.

rivertown · September 2003

Pull out your contract and see what it says about dispute resolution and your alternatives. It's easy to get side-tracked in anger and frustration, which won't help you at all.

I haven't paid attention, so I don't know what warranty company your contract is with (not that I'd want to). But, it may help you to run a search on your warranty company in this board. Some/one/? of them is/are just flat not paying anybody. If that's the case with your company, it may be time to take your financial beating and cut your losses.

You may be able to find an attorney who can help. Here's a link that may get you somewhere, maybe: http://www.autosafety.org/ Zues may be able to steer you toward other legal referral systems. With $2K at stake, the cost/benefit just may not be worth it.

You may simply be screwed. But you my also be able to make life a little uncomfortable for the warranty company with a series of letters to the BBB, your state's attorney's office, the dealership where you bought the warranty, NADA, and anybody else you can think of.

BTW, it seems like extended warranty holders (3rd party AND manufacturer sponsored) regularly run into crap with significant claims. It doesn't help now, but in future purchases I think it's better to put the bucks you'd spend on the warranty aside and fund your own repairs.

draknad · September 2003

Where I'm going to eat the 2 freaking k.
It would cost me around $800 just to tear it down and put it back together without any repairs, and 2k for complete fix, so I'd be paying half cost for full repair if I just had them put it back together. The dealers asking what I'm going to do.
Now a question is:
If I pay for the repairs, is it basically game over?
I have no chances of fighting this after the repair and getting reinbursed?
Or:
Should I hold out as long as I can until I figure this out?

I'm using their loaner car and they are obviosley wanting to know what my choice is.
I havn't done legwork outside of calling the extended service co. and dealer a million times, and posting in here.
I will check the link you posted earlier rivertown.

But, is it game over once I pay for the repairs?

Please send some direction.
Thank you very much.

-draknad

rivertown · September 2003

I don't know for sure, but I'd be surprised if your claim dies simply because you pay for the repair.

Your contract say anything about disputes?

q45man · September 2003

The best extended service contract company I ever saw sent out inspectors before they accepted new customers, spent hours going over car, testing things. Made the customer use [pay for] Synthetic ATF and flushed all syatems {cost $500] initiation fee.........and charged another $2400 for a 40,000 mile contract.[from 60K>100k]

They [TRW] did it right but got out of the business [in 1998]due to losses! They covered too much on some untested models.

Not sure you ever said what you paid for the contract?

draknad · September 2003

$1800 for the warranty.
I don't have it in front of me.
It's actually in my car.
I cant tell wha tthe process is for disputes yet.
Thanks.

-draknad

rivertown · September 2003

Good Luck!

dtownfb · September 2003

Since they are not coverign the repair, why have the dealership do the work? have the car towed to another garage to have the work done. That could save you a good bit of money.

draknad · September 2003

Great suggestion, but they are already going to charge me for the teardown and assembly of $900, since the warranty didn't cover it.
So I might as well pay for the whole repair of $1800 instead of 900 and then move it somewhere else who might not be able to charge less then $900 to repair it??
Would it possible to repiar for < $900?
I dunno.
Thanks tho.

-draknad

quigonjohn · September 2003

I got a transmission replaced at the dealer, using a third party extended warranty. And the dealer themselves, Dodge, warrantees that repair for 3 years or 36,000 miles. In fact, I had to have it replaced again since, and the dealer warranty covered that.

jhungness · September 2003

Someone suggest checking into Nonbusiness Bad Debt for tax purposes.

Here's the skinny: I talked to my tax person and they said that you can claim this on taxes as a Nonbusiness Bad Debt. You will need: Original contract, proof you paid it and then proof that it is useless.

I told her there's no way WG is going to send anyone a letter saying: so sorry we screwed you and you're now out of luck. She says you don't need that. She says I can use my article that I was in, in the Chicago Tribune (others might be able to use the same article) then get a written statement from your mechanic saying that they called in to make a claim and service was denied because of NWIG being found insolvent.

You won't get back all of your money, but whatever tax bracket you fall into is what you will get back. So if you fall into the 15%, 30% etc. you will get that percentage of the total amount up to $3000 for this year and then next year you can claim the rest if it is more then $3000. Call your tax preparer to confirm this. I use Jackson Hewitt.

jhungness · September 2003

Has anyone been keeping up with the NWIG website. According to a court appearance on 9-4-03 by all companies involved the judge has ordered the reserve accounts do not belong to the debtor (NWIG) therefore funds should be disbursed.
Please read it. I called WG and they are currently in a meeting to discuss what this means. I was also told by my mechanic that they were told to resubmit claims for people who already have a claim #. Wouldn't you know it? Our car broke down too late to get a claim #. They stopped giving them out at that point.

Kirstie_H · September 2003

Don't forget tonight's member-to-member chat -- Our topic tonight is "Warranties: Are they worth it?"

http://www.edmunds.com/townhall/chat/townhallchat.html

6-7pm PT/9-10pm ET. Drop by for live chat with other members. Hope you can join us!

kirstie_h
Roving Host & Future Vehicles Host

Sylvia · September 2003

<moderator_kh> Tonight's topic: Warranties - are they worth it? Are any of you customers of extended service contract companies, or looking into one?

<steve_> did everyone see the CNN link about the Rip Off room?

<Guest 2> Anyone know if you can warranty an Audi thru the dealer after the warranty runs out?

<steve_> here's the CNN link - lots of edmunds editors quotes... not a good article in favor of extended warranties:

<moderator_kh> is it manufacturer's product, or third party?

<carguy1234> Do dealerships get paid the same amount by the manufacturer for warrenty work Vs what an indivudual would pay out of pocket for the same work (not covered by warrenty)?

<steve_> good ? carguy

<moderator_kh> Guest2, it depends on whether the manufacturer offers a program, but it is likely to be very expensive now if you turned it down at purchase.

<steve_> i bet it's less

<moderator_kh> Well, manufacturer's warranty work is done at a set rate, set by the manufacturer.

<carguy1234> I have a friend that is getting hassled (by a Chrysler dealer) for doing a warranty job, because they claim they don't make anything on warrenty work.

<moderator_kh> But extended warranties? I don't know. I would guess they have lower, contracted rates with shops.

<mookie14> I'll never buy a internet warranty again

<moderator_kh> carguy, I bet they don't make as MUCH on warranty work.

<djoller1> True, but $1700 makes you almost want things to go wrong to get $$$ invested back. Does not cover hassle/safety of breakdown. Do you know of any consistent, commonly know issues with Volvo post-50K. God knows I found enough with a GM car I have.

<mookie14> they knew what they were doing - i'm sticking with gm

<moderator_kh> djoller, I've never owned a Volvo so I'm not that familiar. I know that many people recommend that, if you can simply set aside a certain amount of $ per month for auto repairs, you are more likely to do better than buying a third-party warranty.

<moderator_kh> Djoller, do you plan on keeping the car for at least another 3 years?

<carguy1234> Right, so they will try to put out of pocket work ahead of warranty work. You may have to wait longer to get service I mean.

<djoller1> Yes, want to keep car for many years yet...

<moderator_kh> You shouldn't. Chrysler would not be happy if this is the case, and your friend should call Chrysler and let them know which shop is doing this.

<moderator_kh> I have a Chrysler, (2), and have never had a problem like that.

<steve_> I drive mine forever and don't believe in ext. warranties - i just pay as I go, and hope nothing too outrageous happens

<steve_> i do prefer to buy a car with a factory 5/60 drivetrain warranty though

<moderator_kh> steve, I don't drive mine forever, but I also have never purchased and extended warranty...

<Guest 2> I am leasing the car for 39 months & the warranty ran out at 36 months. I would like to purchase it next month but am concerned about dealer repair cost.

<moderator_kh> AND I have never wished in hindsight that I had.

<ghislain> Just bought a 2003 Siveradio wth ext warranty 5year/120000KM which is really 2years 60000 KM because Manufacturer is 3y/60000km.

<steve_> me neither... yet

<moderator_kh> mookie, tonight's discussion is really about warranties, and we're not automotive maintenance & repair experts.

<moderator_kh> ghislain, are you happy with the peace of mind that purchase gives you? Did you get a good price?

<djoller1> Yes, I plan on keeping the car for MANY years...

<ghislain> yes but at quite a hefty price; $2400 cdn for all inclusive with zero deductible

<carguy1234> Aren't the mfg's warranties priced such that they will make money overall, meaning most people will not some out ahead buying the extended warranty?

<moderator_kh> Welcome to chat. I'm sure your expertise will be helpful to our members tonight.

Sylvia · September 2003

<zueslewis> hey, folks, any room?

<steve_> i read somewhere that only 30% of the ext. warranties sold lose money for the mfg...

<zueslewis> wassup? or is that passe?

<moderator_kh> djoller, then it might end up a worthwhile investment for you. May I ask who is offering the warranty?

<ghislain> had bought an ext warranty on my 99Montana; was a 3year lease so

<zueslewis> That sounds about right -

<moderator_kh> ghislain, that's really expensive for two years!

<djoller1> Only info I have is directly through my Volvo dealer...

<zueslewis> and probably only 5-10 f private contracts lose money

<zueslewis> that's 5-10 sorry

<steve_> don't know about CA but in the States you usually can cancel an ext. warranty and get most of your money back... if you have buyer's remorse you may want to check that out

<moderator_kh> djoller, if that is through the manufacturer, it sounds pretty good if you are at all worried about unexpected costs.

<zueslewis> percent - I'll get this right yet!

<ghislain> well they call it five years but the first 3 are covered anyway; I object to their sales terminology

<steve_> agreed

<ghislain> so I call it a 2year warranty which in fact is what it is

<djoller1> thanks for the input. have a good night....

<moderator_kh> ghislain, I agree. You paid for the 3 year warranty when you paid for the car, period. The additional 2400 CDN is the cost of the additional two years.

<zueslewis> there are coverages in the 5 years that don't exists in the basic warranty, though

<moderator_kh> Oh?

<steve_> like loaner cars?

<zueslewis> rentals, of course, trip reimbursement - most warranties (basic) don't cover either

<moderator_kh> OK, I guess that *is* more, but I wouldn't be that interested unless it covered items not covered by the regular warranty.

<steve_> i guess that's why some people drop AAA when they get an ext. warranty

<steve_> but that's something else I've never bought

<zueslewis> dropping AAA really isn't great, unless you only have one car..

<moderator_kh> Yeah, but I also haven't purchased that

<steve_> lol, ditto

<ghislain> on my 99 Montana I had purchased an extra 12000km to cover me from 60000 to 72000 km for $700. Turned out to be a good investment, hasd to replace th e water pump and a head gasket would have cost $1800. that one turned out to be a lemon thank god it was a lease so I just let it go when the lease was up

<moderator_kh> I guess I'm living on the edge.

<zueslewis> In PA, they just adopted NJ's lease lemon clause - helps a BUNCH more people

<steve_> i just wish every mft would do like hyundai and vw and do a 10/100 or better drivetrain warranty

<moderator_kh> Well, I think sometimes these things are like rolling the dice. Who can know what will go wrong on vehicles?

<zueslewis> I don't have it, either (AAA)

<steve_> busted cd changers are expensive... A./C stuff

<zueslewis> I can't predict it, but I see plenty of it!

<moderator_kh> Zues, what's the lease lemon clause?

<zueslewis> I actually miss selling warranties - on the dark side, they made me lots of money!

<zueslewis> In PA, specifically, leased vehicles were not "owned" and registered solely in the driver's name, so you couldn't file a lemon law suit on one - that is, until the first part of last year.

<steve_> but now you can sleep at night Jim

<moderator_kh> Oh that's good. You shouldn't have to pay for a car, even a lease, that is a lemon.

<moderator_kh> Yeah, I would have a hard time selling warranties - I don't think I'd be very successful.

<zueslewis> in NJ, you always could - it only mattered that you had registered the vehicle in your name (in some way)

<zueslewis> It was easy, after a bit - especially when the desk man gave me some leg in a payment!

<moderator_kh> I would just not be assertive enough, especially since I do not now, nor have I ever, been a member of the extended warranty party.

<zueslewis> There's a better argument FOR it than against it - once the objections come out, you just respond with facts and explain your position.

Sylvia · September 2003

<zueslewis> OK - I got a while if I can help in any way. Wanna buy a GMPP??

<moderator_kh> GMPP?

<moderator_kh> No comprendo.

<zueslewis> General Motors Protection Plan

<moderator_kh> Erm, given that I own a couple o' Chryslers, I don't think it would do me a world of good.

<zueslewis> Like Ford's ESP - Extended Service Plan (factory backed).

<moderator_kh> And I have the super-secret special extended warranty.

<zueslewis> Ahh, DaimlerChrysler Added Care or Maximum Care - I was the warranty king, according to the sales guys.

<moderator_kh> Nope - my bro-in-law is a dealership relations manager for Chrysler.

<zueslewis> I have a Chrysler product, too

<moderator_kh> Yeah, a PT right?

<moderator_kh> But yours is v. bad.

<moderator_kh> If I remember correctly.

<zueslewis> AND, I just settled my lemon law case for NOT MUCH.

<zueslewis> PT GT (turbo) - run away!

<moderator_kh> That stinks. I would hate having a lemon. Only one I had was way back in the 80's - Mercury Sable - but I didn't know any better.

<moderator_kh> I thought transmissions just usually died at 60K.

<zueslewis> I had a '97 T-bird that had 6 sets of brake rotors, an engine, and a transmission in the first 13K miles. Oregon didn't support consumers very well, and a lawyer wanted a $3K retainer - I dumped it.

<moderator_kh> Bummer. Did you get rid of the PT?

<pandrew> ANY DISCUSSIONS ABOUT 1SOURCE?

<zueslewis> No, still have the PT

<moderator_kh> pandrew, not yet tonight, but go ahead.

<moderator_kh> Are you planning to get rid of it?

<moderator_kh> pandrew, do you have 1Source?

<moderator_kh> Welcome to tonight's chat. Our topic is extended warranties.

<zueslewis> No, I'll keep it - I'll be doing a Stage 1 turbo upgrade, wheels (already did tires) and a two-tone scheme. I'm stuck with it since DCC did nothing and my wife likes the little bugger. I'm getting a truck or a Cobra - haven't decided.

<pandrew> I am not happy.. They have paid one claim, but I have questioned them about exclusions on the TSB . They say that 'manufacturer TSB' are not covered

<zueslewis> That TSB subject really irks me -

<pandrew> They think that 'Ford anoouncing responsibility for a defect' means thay get out of paying. Ie. any TSB is not covered. I find this ridiculous

<zueslewis> EVERY problem out there (at least 90 has a TSB, so does that mean they won't cover much of anything?

<moderator_kh> That's a good way to get customers really unhappy, and almost wishing manufacturers wouldn't issue TSBs.

<zueslewis> I agree, pandrew - just another way to profit from not allowing claims.

<moderator_kh> A TSB is not the same as claiming responsibility!

<pandrew> Thats whats they tell me so far. Seems my contratc taken out 2 years ago is worded differently from the sample I oufnd on the internet

<moderator_kh> I know, I have been reading thru the 1Source discussion, and it's a real shame.

<jfr121> Hi! Just checking out the chatroom. I was one who purchased a warranty gold extended service contracts and have been following the discussion in your forums. It has been an interesting experience to say the least!

<pandrew> seems that this is a ''weasal' clause. How on earth could a customer know what's in a TSB anyway

<moderator_kh> jfr, have you been able to get any money back?

<zueslewis> A TSB is a diagnostic suggestion or a message that "all our cars do that" - either way, it's not any way for a company to get out of paying a claim.

<jfr121> I contacted the Discover Card people and they told me they would credit my account for the amount of the service contract. I have not seen it on the bill yet.

<moderator_kh> or, "how to fix a common problem" that is not necessarily a manufacturer's defect.

<moderator_kh> jfr, I sure hope you're able to get money back out of it. I really think it's horrible that so many people are paying money for nothing.

<zueslewis> Also, I've had problems with manufacturers (in my line of work) thinking a TSB is a get out of jail free card. Hey, guys, if we just call it "normal", we can get away with it!

<pandrew> absolutely. My contract states that Ford would announce responsibility using a TSB. Thats might mean that Ford would pay, if Ford stated they would (t hat to my mind is a recall). Otherwise TSB are simple guidelines and ways to repair failed items. Part do wear out and normally a TSB might help a dealer establish how to repair this item in an apporved way I think

<moderator_kh> Yes - for example, it is normal for my minivan liftgate to lift spontaneously as I'm driving. It's not a defect; it's a feature!

<zueslewis> Here's an excerpt from one of my reports: the manufacturers publishing of a technical service bulletin on the xx issue does not relieve them from having a minority of vehicles that are defective

<jfr121> I hope I get the money back too! I researched many of these companies and thought I did a thorough job. Even checked with the BBB and didn't see any red flags. Oh well, live and learn!

<pandrew> seems that American manufacturers go out of their way to issues TSB 's whereas japanese do not.

<zueslewis> does not relieve them from being liable for a vehicle with uncorrected mechanical problems.

<zueslewis> When looking at potential used car purchases, appraisers may choose between the vehicles with the minority of the vehicles with these issues and the majority of these vehicles without these issues. In that light, there is a huge value difference.

<pandrew> My take is that you take a warranty for a vechicle which is average of below average (eg. Ford) and you do not if the vehicle is above (eg. Toyota)

<moderator_kh> jfr, you seem to be taking a pretty healthy attitude. I mean, this is the sort of thing that could eat you up with anger, and take over your life. This ultimately costs you more than the money.

<pandrew> Seems to me,

<pandrew> 1) you can ask directlty for your money back ( I have just done this)

<moderator_kh> zues, so basically, it could be a defect in some cases, but not in all cases.

<pandrew> 2) get a portion back thru ending the contract

<pandrew> 3) go after them using BBB (if that's to be believed)

<zueslewis> "defect" is a word that is defined by a judge, not a manufacturer

<jfr121> What's done is done. Luckily it is not my last dollar so I can still eat and pay the bills, but I am not a happy camper with warranty gold at all.

<pandrew> 4) ask the credit card company for help (since you did not get what you thought you paid for)

<moderator_kh> BBB isn't really a method for "going after" them. That would be your State's Attorney General

<moderator_kh> BBB is more of a monitoring service.

<pandrew> I live in Canada, any ideas for 1source

<moderator_kh> pandrew, wish I could offer more, but unfortunately, I can't.

<zueslewis> Yeah, the BBB doesn't do much, except post complaints for consumers to read

<moderator_kh> I don't know what recourse is offered through Canadian law.

<jfr121> BBB was recommending warranty gold long after their debacle started so I don't know what good they really do for the consumer.

<zueslewis> I've never heard of them ruling in a consumer's favor on a lemon law situation - they also don't have the authority to enforce a ruling on a manufacturer - their authority is limited to local business.

<moderator_kh> jfr, it's based on consumer feedback, so if they weren't getting complaints, they can't post them.

<pandrew> Probably none. Since I have this thru the internet and I did not appear to get what I thought I paid for there may be a chargeback using the credit card company.

ateixeira · September 2003

I know most stories here are negative, but I'll offer at least one positive experience.

My wife took her car in for a recall the other day, and we have a Subaru Gold extended warranty. The warranty gives us the benefit of a loaner, but they really rolled out the red carpet for us.

Last time we got a minivan loaner, this time it was a Mercedes C240 4Matic station wagon! Our car is a wagon and we have two kids, but still, I expected a Cavalier or a Neon, not a Benz!

)

-juice

deanc2000 · October 2003

Hello,
I am a US service member living near a base in Germany. I'm interested in buying an US spec Echo used for the reasons of reliability and and fuel economy. The choices (or choice at this time) is very limited. I'm seriously considering buying used stateside, like from an Ebay auction, and then shipping to Europe. The only problem is that the warranties don't apply in Europe, so I would be driving "naked" so to say. Does anyone know of a European company which I could buy a warranty from? What do people think of my plan? Thanks.

Dean.

chaim3 · October 2003

If anyone has had or knows of First National, "an authorized agent for SecurePro, administered by the Ultimate Warranty Corporation, and insured by Capital Assurance, I would be very interested in their experiences. They are asking $2,410 for my 2000 Mercedes E320 which is now off the factory warranty, which seems high.

timbo41 · October 2003

I have a 2001 Chevy suburban, and I looked into an extended warranty from the dealer. I was given a price list and depending on the amount of deductible/mileage covered it ran upwards of $3500.
I just received a letter from United American Warranty giving me a quote of 100,000 mile coverage for $1350, with a $50 deductible. Does anybody have any info on this company? It says it's insured by Great American Insurance Co. Any info would be greatly appreciated.

quigonjohn · October 2003

Check out their website at:

http://www.greatamericaninsurance.com

After my Warranty Gold coverage became worthless, I took the money I had not yet paid WG and put it into a warranty from aawarranty.com. That coverage is administered by Warrantech but backed by Great American and seems pretty reliable, since GA is into many insurance and financial areas.

gac1yahoo · October 2003

I have recently bought Odyssey-04 and looking for extended warranty. Has anyone in this group bought one from Honda Care and if yes, what is the cost or best price paid...

Thank you in advance

ateixeira · October 2003

Alton Blakley Honda in Somerset, KY used to sell them online at good prices. My cousin got one through them.

I'm not sure if she's still there, or if prices have changed since then, but call, it's 800 264-3275.

Of course I have no affiliation with them or Honda, call at your own risk, blah blah blah.

-juice

jr91harley · October 2003

I am shopping for an extended warranty for my 99 Chev Suburban. Has anyone heard of Continental Warranty and or had any experience with them ? I have been reading the horror stories on aftermarket warranties. Makes me not want to buy one. Is there any current good experience with Warrantybynet? JR

cschindler · October 2003

With all the horror stories about extended warranties has anyone had any experience or knowledge of Continental Warranty (good or bad)? They are not an on line company but they do have a web page and a call center. Any information is appreciated and can be e-mailed to me at schin@telepath.com

2crnot2c · October 2003

I made a mistake of applying over the internet. I got so many calls from their sales people, even after declining them each time.

What I did not like with them was that they refused to send me an email detailing a copy of their contract. Warranty Gold, Warranty Direct and 1Source Auto Warranty all sent me a copy of their contract for me to peruse. I told Continental warranty that after my experience with Warranty Gold, I was not about to fork out my credit card and send them money without taking a look at what I am signing. I mean they could send me a contract that said ... "Thank you for the money, have a great day... now get lost" and I would be screwed.

Continental warranty also said that they did have a 0 deductible warranty. I told them that I was not interested. Some of the sales people were rude. The next day I receive another call regarding the purchase of extended warranty. Today I got my third call. I told the woman that I had only applied once and I had finished speaking with them. She said that she had got another printout of my applications, therefore I had applied again. Even my cat has more brains that her.

jr91harley · October 2003

Has anyone else had any experience with Continental Warranty ? Thanks to 2CRNOT2C for your comments. I ordered the Continental Warranty so I could review the entire package. As much as the phone person kept saying you could take your vehicle anywhere to be repaired. The first thing that is said that all repairs must be preapproved. My brother has an extended warranty on a vehicle, and he said the repairs usually take days because the repair shop can't get anyone on the phone.
I spoke with the Chevy dealer I use and he flat said, he won't deal with any of the warranty companies, except GM. He will want payment first and then let you fight it out with the warranty company. I believe that will be the case with most repair shops. For a couple of hundred more I can get the GM warranty and not go through any of the hassle. Or, I might just try my luck and not get one at all. The most warranty I can get for a reasonable price is 36mos/36K miles. I usually keep a vehicle for 100k.
Now I try to get my down payment back. Wish me luck.

q45man · October 2003

Be very very very careful about purchasing ANY non factory backed Service Insurnce Policy.
We deal with about 8 different ones currently. They have all become resistive [in the last year] to accepting claims and now send out inspectors [sometimes after a week or two] to evaluate [look for any possible way out of paying]. They decline more than 50% of the recent claims we have seen. After approving the work, they then try to nickel and dime the labor rate and want non oem parts.

Personally I won't deal with any of them any longer after this year, suggesting that the customer find another place to have the work done or pay us and recover themselves.

If the factory/dealer wants $3500 assume the real amount less commisions is $2,000.......how can someone offer it for $1350.......they are not going to pay that's how! A contract doesn't mean much if the company goes out of business.

Be very very careful!

brozhnik · November 2003

I'm thinking of buying an extended warranty for my new Passat. Warranty Direct would cost about half as much as the dealer. That's enough to appeal to me, and their marketing addresses my concerns: "Fact: No hassle claims process. Claims authorized in an average of 6 minutes, no
paperwork or billing hassles. Payment made immediately upon completion of repairs to
repair facility via corporate credit card.
"Fact: Over 18,000 repair facilities do business with us.
"Fact: Our Better Business Bureau report shows ZERO complaints in the past 12 months. We processed over 108,000 claims in the past year. When your vehicle breaks down, we
pay!
"Fact: We have over 23 years experience, documented financial stability and the most
solid insurance backing in the warranty industry."

There's more, but these claims address my main concerns-- that they'll try to weasel out of paying if I have an actual claim, or that they're likely to go belly-up. But before I sign up, I thought I'd ask on this board to see if anyone has knowledge, experience, comments (positive, negative, neutral, whatever) about Warranty Direct. Should I go with them, or spend an extra thousand for the dealer's extended warranty? (Or not get an extended warranty at all?)

driftracer · November 2003

I'd like to see the stats for submitted claims versus paid claims and see how many claims they wimped out on - at your expense.

rivertown · November 2003

on the extended warranty.

Think about it. For the extended warranty to be feasible to sell, the cost has to be high enough to cover average claims plus admin costs plus sales commission, plus, plus, plus . . . . .
Unless you have much worse than average luck, an extended warranty costs far more than the repair costs it covers.
From another perspective, an extended warranty hedges your risk - like an insurance policy. Hedging a risk that you can handle easily and paying for the hedge makes no sense at all.
Unless an extended warranty includes some services (loaner car, roadside assistance, extra coverages, etc.) that you can really use, it's better to put the cost aside and pay for repairs yourself (self insure).

q45man · November 2003

What most don't understand is the exclusion list contains the things are are likely to go wrong.
Failed hoses and other rubber isolated components, seal leaks, overheating, wear and tear items.

Even with an extended service insurance contract maintenance and repairs are like to exceed 8 cents per mile from the end of warranty to 100,000 miles........the question is out of the $5,000 how much is covered.

Factory backed policies usually have fewer exclusions and the dealer can usually talk their way around them with factory.

Unless the non factory company is in trouble a properly compensated technican/shop owner can usually at least get your initial money back before the resistance starts.

ateixeira · November 2003

A rep from Subaru, whom I know well, claims Subaru actually loses money on their Gold warranty. Dealers have a small margin, sure, but shop it around and it's not much.

But yeah, my wife got 7 years of roadside assistance, which by itself would cost $497. Then factor in the improved resale value if you sell just before it expires, plus you are getting OE replacement parts for anything that fails.

You really think a non-manufacturer warranty is going to buy you OE parts? Hah!

Then consider that the dealer gives her the red carpet treatment, loaners for service, VIP treatment overall. Last service visit she had our loaner was a Mercedes Benz C240 4Matic wagon. Her car is a Legacy wagon and she asked for an AWD wagon loaner, and got one!

OK, I'm sure she's not getting a Benz every time, but you get the point. It's hard to quantify exactly the "value" of that vs. just getting a Cavalier, but it's worth something to me.

Someone who bought an Outback paid $700 for a 7/70 with no deductible. Assuming he does not drive more than 70k miles in the first year, that's a killer bargain. Do the math - if you subtract the roadside assistance (which we were paying for) that is $203 for an extra 4 years of bumper-to-bumper coverage, or about $51 per year!

-juice

subarusaleshou · November 2003

For those who would normally be a AAA customer the roadside assistance component of the extended warranty can offset a large amount of the cost. I don't know what AAA charges however at least in the case of a Subaru there is up to 7 years of RA depending on mileage driven and extended term selected. If the cost of 7 years of AAA is deducted from the cost of the warranty it makes the annual cost very reasonable.

q45man · November 2003

Road side assistance? What's that. I use ultra premium tires and change them frequently [at least every 2 years-25k] in 20 years never had to use a spare in over 440,000 miles of driving. Always carry a charged jump box to help others. Had to use it once on mine back in 1994..[after the car sat at airport for 27 days]....change batteries every 3 years. Even change bulbs when it is easy ---they all have a listed hourly life.

Preventative maintenance......change things before they fail! Hate the thought of some failure in the rain between exits.

Sure it cost more than road side assistance but so what.......unscheduled time is more valuable.

nortsr1 · November 2003

I just received a promotional brochure from AAA and the charge is 51.00/year but they were offering $10.00 off of that price...so it would be $41.00 the first year and evidently, $51.00/year after that. Incidently, if you purchase their plan, your membership entitles you to use the Roadside assistance no matter what car you are in and it doesn't matter if you are the driver or the passenger. That's a pretty good option.
I do not work for AAA.

jimbres · November 2003

Good post, rivertown. I'm in complete agreement. Self insurance is the way to go unless you lack financial discipline. Big corporations do it, & you can, too.

A basic principle of casualty insurance is not to pay a third party to assume a risk that you can handle yourself. I carry homeowner's insurance because I can't pay the 6-figure cost of rebuilding my house if it burns down. But I can certainly absorb a 2 or 3 thousand dollar car repair bill. I'll be cranky as hell that week, but I won't have to postpone retirement or do without a vacation. (Incidentally, the largest repair bill that I've had to cover during the past 30 years was $1,300.)

For real peace of mind, a fat savings account (or money market fund) with your name on it beats any extended warranty. No need to wait for an adjuster to OK your claim - you're the plan administrator & you write the checks.

One more thing to remember: the cost of keeping an out-of-warranty car running is in most cases more than offset by lower depreciation expense. Your new $25K car will shed at least $5,000 in value during its 1st year on the road, while my comparable 4-year-old car won't give up much more than a thousand. That's $4K in my favor, & that will more than cover the expensive tranny repair that seems to terrify some of you.

ateixeira · November 2003

OK, add up the extra cost of those tires, batteries, etc, and you pay for a good portion of that warranty, though. Plus, you've just been lucky.

My wife has already had a flat (on a new tire). Point being there's still no guarantee that new equipment won't fail.

Or you might run out of gas, or lock yourself out. To err is human.

-juice

lib4 · November 2003

Thanks to all for their comments on extended warranties. It has helped me better understand this risky investment, however, I'm troubled with the ownership of a high maint. intensive vehichle (Land Rover) and would like any advice on the best company out there. I've received quotes from Auto Advantage who deals with Milenia PEAK 2000, as well as from warranty for wheels. Any comments on pros and cons from either of these companies would be greatly appreciated.

nortsr1 · November 2003

I am not a supporter of non factory backed leases. I do not know about a factory warranty for a LandRover. Have you tried the AAA warranty? I don't belong to Triple A {AAA}, however; it seems to me that a company that large would back their warranty program. You can always call your local AAA and get more details. It would also be wise to check with whomever does your repairs to see what extended warranties they will or will not accept. That is VERY IMPORTANT!

mrrichc · November 2003

Well the extended warr I had with Warranty Gold is now worthless. I have been searching for a replacement and found Continental, they are hard sell but that would be ok if they will be arround. Been unable to get a financial rating. Anybody have any experience with them or recommend another company? I have a 2000 dodge caravan 38k miles.

akangl · November 2003

We recently purchased a used 99 Dodge Ram at a Ford dealer, they sold us a 24 mo/24k warranty (backed by Ford) with the truck. We had thoughts of cancelling it and going with Warranty Direct (could get a longer warranty for the same amount of money), asked at a couple dealers (Chrysler and Ford) they all said don't go with any aftermarket company, nothing but trouble. Just food for thought.

ateixeira · November 2003

Actually, ask your mechanic. They'll know which companies honor claims, and how much one is needed in the first place.

-juice

bsauerman · November 2003

Just found out that my extended warranty policy purchased 17 months ago with 20 months left is not worth the paper it's written on. Warranty Gold blames the Cayman Island based company they hired for claims processing and administration, Seems National Warranty, who just took out a huge chunk of money to cover insurance to cover their executives two weeks before,is insolvent. Warranty Gold is still selling policies now with a different insurance company and administrator. They just tell you to file a claim with the bankruptcy court and maybe in a year or two you might get a pro ration of your remaining policy back after the lawyers get done draining the account. Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me. I've learned my lesson on extended warranty contracts-they are the only ones that come out ahead.

geoffdgti · November 2003

I've learned my lesson on extended warranty contracts-they are the only ones that come out ahead.

If you buy a factory extended warranty from a car dealer instead of a fly-by-night warranty, you're getting something backed by a real company. I look at OEM extended warranties as relatively cheap insurance against mechanical failure. In all my years of owning cars with OEM extended warranties, I've made far more claims than I've paid in premiums. I can't say that about any of the other kinds of insurance I buy.

The lesson you should learn is to investigate the financial stability of an insurance company before you do business with them. You can get just as screwed with life insurance or homeowners insurance as you can with extended warranties.

ateixeira · November 2003

Look at the other perks, too. Roadside Assistance, for instance. If you are paying for that anyway, you recover half the costs.

An example. My cousin got a 7/100 for her Ody for $700. She cancelled AAA and saved $497 right there. So the warranty cost her $202 more than she would have paid anyway.

For that she got 4 years more warranty, or $50.50 per year.

Folks, that $4.21 per month! And I'm talking only those extra months when she's fully covered, bumper to bumper. FOUR BUCKS!

Automakers sometimes lose money. Dealers profit on their commission, sure, but manufacturers are out to establish a good will with the customer, even if it means not making a profit.

-juice

PS Note: warranty prices have come up lately, proving that Honda probably was taking big losses on those

dinesh622 · November 2003

Last month I purchased Sienna LE 04. I spent lot of time reading and understanding warranties offered by third party. In California limited warranty companies are offering their product. I read and compared terms and conditions of WarrantyDirect and 1Sourceautowarranty with Toyota Platinum warranty.
Finally, I decided to buy extended warranty Platinum 7/100K (zero deductible) for $ 1100 from Toyota dealer (after negotiations).
The price quoted by above two companies are not cheaper than that of dealer's quote. The main advantage I could find was none of those third party insurance company covers emission system. This Platinum extended warranty is exclusionary and minimum # of the items are excluded. Chances of belly up of Toyota vs third party insurance company is pretty obvious. Original parts would be installed for the failure and would honor their reputation for the warranty.

brozhnik · December 2003

I've pretty much decided to get an extended warranty (7 years, 100K miles) for my new Passat, so I'm here to ask not whether, but which. Here are my options:
(1) THe local (semi-rural) Volkswagen dealer who sold the car to me wants $2000 for a warranty provided by "Equis"
(2) A Volkswagen dealer 300 miles away (in a big metropolitan area) will sell me a similar-sounding extended warranty from "First Automotive" for much less-- $1295
(3) Warranty Direct will sell me one directly for $1150.
Option 2 seems like a clear winner (from a dealer, but almost as low as Warranty Direct). But... are there caveats? Has anyone heard of "First Automotive"? Will it, or Warranty Direct, or for that matter Equis, turn out to be one of those warranties that doesn't actually pay up? Or is the lower price of Option 2 just reflecting the economies of scale of the larger dealer? Or what?
Thanks! Any advice appreciated.

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