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Comments
Overall, this car is very impressive.
I have their system on my Aurora and I can't say enough good things about it. No, it's not loud. It's the sweetest sound you'll ever hear from a V8 - and it's all strait through - no baffles at all.
Anyway, I e-mailed them about the 300C and the Magnum and they are very interested in providing an aftermarket exhaust for the car in the future. For those that like that sort of stuff you need to check them out at http://www.corsaperf.com
Keep them in mind.
Ebony
Olympic White
Platinum Silver
Aleutian Gray
Bristol Blue
Dresden Blue
York Blue
Nautilus Blue
San Remo Turquoise
Concord Green
Granada Green
Laredo Tan
Tunis Beige
Fontana Rose
Pompeian Red
Jade
Aspen Gold
Topaz
Shell Pearl
Overall I liked it a lot and felt it lived up to its (pretty high) billing. However, I didn't have the urge to put in my order on the spot.
Likes:
* 5.7 Hemi - "A/A-" It was very strong engine, very smooth, had a good (but somewhat muted) power sound to it.
* 5 Speed AutoStick - "A" - This was great - had excellent ratio's this time, 1->2 at just under 40, 2->3 at around 70 - perfect for 0-60 and launch. Autostick action was also very good.
* Handling - "B+" - Seemed very secure and solid, generally good, didn't push it much for the test drive.
* Brakes - "A-", Seem very solid on a quick test.
* Exterior Styling - "B" - Definitely kind of cool and different looking. Its growing on me but is is still boxy/squarish and I don't love its styling like the current 300M styling.
* Interior - "B+" - Very nice overall, not sure I love the tortoise shell on steering wheel, but like that they kept the 300m style gauges (but it still has only the basics). 300C speedometer goes to 160 (see tires).
* Wheels/Tires - "C-/D+" - I'm not at all crazy about the highly spoked 18" chromed wheels (look heavy and busy to me). I'm even less crazy about the "touring tires" as the only choice on the 300c - these are only "H" rated and as I was worried about...It was reported in the Motor Trend review (is this confirmed by the other reviews?) it is speed limited to 126mph! Not that I'm necessarily planning to go above that, but when you buy a car with this much capability (and speedo bumped to 160) it is annoying/silly to have it limited by this poor tire choice.
Also, even with these tires it does very well in specification comparisions with the sports sedans (g35,..) and sports coupes the Pontiac GTO/MB compora's in the same motor trend. Some decent high performance, stickier rubber could only help it be even better on accel., braking, and slalom times.
So I'm still very tempted to get it and to try to remedy the wheel/tires situation as much as possible (anyone of the touring/limited buyers interested in upgrading to 18" 300c wheel/tires?) but its very annoying to not be able to get a better package out of the box.
As stated in some other posts, you have to believe they are holding out for a more aggressive performance package or Dodge platform to better utilize the Hemi - and is it worth the wait?
Performance wise I can only say wow. Auto downshift to 1st at WOT occurs at about 25mph and it really pushes you back. WOT acceleration from 40-45 is not as strong (gearing) but still very impressive and the thrust, although as I said is not neck-snapping, keeps growing and growing. The ride is taut with some thud or slap over sharp bumps or ripply pavement but the sounds seemed subdued. I suspect there is ample insulation in the floor pan. WOT still does not create a ferocious exhaust note, but it is a note that nevertheless is authoritative. There was a slight metallic "fluttering" sound at WOT that I didn't hear on the "C" that I drove previously, but it wasn't really annoying. Steering seemed tight and precise and turning circle was very acceptable. I took a nearly 360 degree onramp at well, above the posted speed, and the car really stuck great! Brakes are great! Strong with a wonderful feel.
Also: the rear windows go all of the way down (those that go only half way really annoy me). The "C" has carpet on the inside of the trunk lid and there is no trunk lock cylinder, you have to use the key/fob combo or inside release button, but this makes for a cleaner appearance from the rear.
On the down side, there can be an issue with vision. Not so much out the sides, but the front side pillars are quite thick and can create a slight blind spot. Also, as someone said previously, because of the windshield configuration you may find yourself craning your head forward a bit to see the traffic light if you pull up too close (easy to learn not to pull up close though). Rear visibility is a guess! Youi see traffic out of the mirror OK, but the window is so high you have no idea where the rear bumper is. An owner would eventually learn - but I compensated by ordering the ultrasonic rear park assist
Another slight annoyance is the 160 mph speedometer. When driving at legal speeds nearly 3/4 of the speedometer graduations aren't used. 80 mph is at 12 o'clock and 60 is around 10 o'clock. It is hard finding the most commonly used speeds like 35 or 40 or 45. Why are they all scrunched together? 160 sounds impressive, but I believe that the car is electronically limited to 126 mph. I think a 140 mph speedo with a better spread of numbers would be more appropriate.
Seats were comfy and they DID have the "Chrysler Wings" imprinted at the top of the seat back. It was very smooth leather, not the pebble type. Between seat adjustment, power peddles, tilt and telescoping steering wheel I am sure anyone can find a comfortable driving position.
Went back to dealer today and ordered. After MUCH debate between Satin Jade and Brilliant Black, I went with the black. My reasons came down to wanting to look more "mean" than "luxurious" - both beautiful though. I ordered HID headlamps, Sirius satellite radio, U-connect, Navigation with sound group II, power pedals, sunroof, and the protection group II. Interestingly, the HID is also supposed to include high pressure headlamp washers. I wonder how they're mounted. Sticker $38285. Dealer estimates 6 weeks - yeah, right. Although after premier night maybe things will speed up.
The wait begins....
Steering 2.8 turns lock to lock, with a turning circle of 38.9ft.
They also said that Dodge WILL get a sedan (Charger? - it is 300 based) Fall of 2005.
The first people to buy are taking quite a risk paying at or near MSRP for something with a question mark for reliability and resale.
Does anyone remember the V-8-6-4 engine from GM?
If you wait a couple years, you will be able to buy for less after discounting (assuming you still want it at that point) plus first year bugs/recalls will have at least had a chance to have been taken care of.
I looked around and was generally impressed on layout and fit-and-finish. Wasn't as nice inside as I'd like, but again, this was a base model and I'm hoping the the added items of the 300c will address that.
At any rate, was just a quick look over, but I did have one issue. I think the salesman was trying to steer me away from the 300c. I told him I was aware of how much it cost (as equipped the way I'd like, it would run 35K MSRP), but he kept going on and on about how expensive it was and how they were going to add an additional dealer markup (excuse me, in salesmen talk an "addendum"). I think it may have been because I'm (relatively) younger and maybe he just didn't think I had the dough for it. I'm 28, but I work in the IT field and pull down a decent living. Enough to easily swing this car. I haven't been treated like that at Lexus or Audi dealers before. Maybe I just got a bad apple of a salesman.
Oh, he mentioned there was the premier night April 22nd, but never invited me or gave me any information about it. Is it just an open house type of event, or should there be an invitation?
At any rate, I was turned off by the dealership and this is part of the negative image that I have had of Chrylser in the past that I'm trying to ignore as I am really interested in the 300c.
Lots of power, great braking. Not as tight and bumpy as I expected from reviews. Smaller inside and out than I imagined. The unit I drove had a sun roof, plenty of head clearance. Nice size opening. Plastic base on front seat looked a little cheap and was large. Overall I'm very pleased.
Middle rear seat has plenty of width for 3 but no room for legs, will be fine for a child but not an adult for any long rides.
I did not spend too much time with it because my salesman told me my 300c would be delivered 4/13-4/15. He said I could pick it up Wednesday if it arrived Tuesday! I do not have to wait to the event on the 22nd.
Having ordered sight unseen, I have no regrets.
I will be pleased to have avoided the initial crush of interest and the salesman said he suspected ordered vehicles would go near sticker and any on the lot would go for at least that.
He also told me I would be the first from their dealership to take delivery. The unit I drove had a notation to hold for the Premiere event on 4/22.
He said mine would arrive with my name on the sticker and no such notation. When I placed my order on 2/16 he told me they had already ordered 2 for customers, those apparently are not scheduled for delivery yet.
Anyway, if anyone has a specific question about the car I would be happy to try to answer it.
Anyway, for those who own a 300M, every aspect of the interior and exterior fit and finish is superior to the outgoing model. I was actually surprised at how much the quality of materials have improved. There are countless little details that were never attempted on the 300M. The knobs have chrome bezeled edges, and the glove box is lined and damped. The air vents are close flat and flush, with tiny chrome accents on switches. The gaps between various surfaces are very tight.
The leather is softer than the M, and the upper dash material is superior.
When I got back in my car to leave, I felt like I was wearing an old suit!
I can't wait to get mine. My only dilemma is the same as another poster; Black or Deep Jade dash. I'm leaning toward the Jade at this point
If so how do I attach?
The Art of Driving will be at Treasure Island on April 17, 18, 2004.
I was in Oakland today and saw a Silver 300C getting prepped for test driving for Monday. I was loaded with nav, protection II,sunroof, pedals, etc. The salesman was stating that he thought $8000 over MSRP was the goal. anyone willing to say how much over MSRP they're paying for per-orders? I know of one HOLD car that is $1400 over MSRP. Available to be drive from lot after premiere night.
2)Do you remember pc's from 20 years ago? 360k floppys and a 10 mega byte hard drive? The GM 8-6-4 was in a different time. It didn't come with an in dash 6CD and Navigation system either.
3) I bought a 94 New Yorker the first year the model was available. I bought the 100k warranty and now have 183.000 miles on it. I had a reasonable number of problems but, the car still looks and runs great. I love it but its time has come. The 300c is a bargain if it meets your needs. If not, pay an additional $10 G for a Lincoln or Caddy or $10-50 G for a Lexus BMW or MB.
You can also buy a demo, rental or leased car from someone planing on turning the vehicle in after a period of abuse. I prefer to buy a new car, maintain it and drive it for 10 years. My wife and four children put 150k on a 1987 Camry 100k on a 94 Honda accord, 90k on a 1998 Saturn and 52k so far on a 99 Camry. If you can afford it, the extra money spent for the depreciation driving off the lot is more than offset by the value of proper maintenance.
Finally the features on todays cars blow away cars from a few years ago. I paid $14k in Nov 87 for 88 Camry LE it had manual windows, air and an am/fm radio, 12 years later I spent $19k in cheaper 1999 dollars and got air bags, cd, anti lock brakes, power windows and seats and locks, bigger engine, etc> etc.
Same story with the 94 NYer. Paid $26k in Nov 93. Ten years later with cheaper dollars paid $35k for the 300C with additional features,side curtain air bags, 6cd stereo, HID lamps, moonroof, V8 vs V6, back-up radar, 5sp vs 4sp auto t, 18 vs 16 wheels, heated seats, dual front climate and rear, rain sensing wipers, satellite radio, etc. etc.
$26k inflated at 3% per year from 1993 to 2004 is $36k.
What a deal.
It would not surprise me to see the sticker get adjusted later this year.
Also, the car will "depreciate" a whole lot more if you pay MSRP or MSRP plus extra dealer profit addendums as one of the first buyers compared to if you paid invoice many months later.
It will be worth a certain value after two or three years. If you overpay when you buy it new, that's more money you're losing at resale time.
Low interest rate promotions on new cars have hurt resale values as well. Financing on a used car at higher rates can make the monthly payments the same as a new car.
Did you see the car in Black? I'm sure it will look great. I went with the Satin Jade, partly because the road salt here won't show as bad.
Good luck with your order, I skipped the Nav and U connect otherwise the same. I think the U connect can be added later?
You mentioned the sticker price, do you mind if I ask what you paid?
As far as cost, I had a trade-in and that often muddies the waters a bit but I feel that I am $250-$300 above dealer cost. To get real invoice though you have to remember to add regional ad fees that dealers must pay. In the case of my selling dealer these amounted to $510 on top of the invoice you would calculate from Edmunds. These are legit fees and they are in the FWP column on the invoice.
I know you will like the satin jade. I drove one and as I said before I really liked it. It will definitely be lower maintenance than the black. The "C" that I spent the most time with was the black, so yes I've seen it. Obviously I thought it was beautiful too. Last time I had a black car was about 20 years ago and I didn't have a garage. Now that I have garaged storage and another car I can drive in the winter, I hope I can keep up with maintaining the black the way it should be.
JOECANUK: Have you seen a car equipped with the HID system. You say the nozzels are on the bumper fascia, would that put them mounted on the "chrome" horizontal pieces on top of the bumper? Also, do the headlights themselves look like the regular lights (I mean when not lit) or is there a difference in their appearance?
Thanks....
http://www.chrysler.com/artofdriving/
I don't think you need to add for regional advertising fees to the invoice if you're not also subtracting for the dealer holdback. I think it turns out to be a wash.
http://www.chrysler.com/artofdriving/
find there schedule and register to the event.
They should just call their local dealer.
stephen
And yes, Stephen, the cars use a regular key. The silver coin is just incentive to go to Premier Night...
Dave
http://superdave369.home.comcast.net/300C/300C.html
Watching the Chrysler test drive made me *very* happy, as with the electronic skid stuff switched 'off', it seemed to welcome oversteer, and plenty of it.
Personally, I like oversteer, in moderation, but it freaks many people out.
I am still salivating over a machine with this kinda power which has four seats and four doors. I *was* trying to figure out how to get a supercharger on the 3.5L Intrepid, but one isn't made specifically for it, and if I did go this route, I'd likely lunch the transmission the third time I stomped on it.
To start depreciating, the vehicle doesn't even need to be sat in, only the official owner has to change. Sad, but that's the way it goes.
(I imagine the edict from the management saying, "You vill not allow zem to defeat zee dynamic stability system. Those who fail to obey vill be shot on sight...")
By the way, everyone should see SuperDave's 300C web page, including the smoky burnout video. Hilarious!
Does anybody know if this is so? If yes, what was in the car that was test driven in some of the magazine articles mentioned?