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The Accord's a great car, but it's not an Acura. I know how similar they are, but yet they are very very different. We drove both of them. They're miles apart. I don't know, the TL is just special.
carcar
Reality: The best you can expect to pick up a new 2004 TL w/ Nav for is probably $500 to $1,000 over invoice. That's roughly $32,600 to $33,100. Add what appears to be 5% tax in your state and your at $34,230 to $34,760, OTD not including title and registration.
Affordability: You claim $33,000 is it, period. Did you hit a $3,000 lottery ticket winner from one of your previous posts where $28,500 plus taxes was the absolute limit? The difference between what you claim to be able to afford and the best price you could realistically get a new TL w/nav for is in the ballpark of $1,300 to $1,800, or 4-6% on a purchase that would, hopefully, last you 8-10 years and 150,000+ miles. That is, unless you find something else in 2-3 years that you/dad really NEED.
My take on this is that, if in fact, you are on some razor thin edge of affordablility, you/dad should be looking at a Toyota Prius or Honda Accord or other perfectly fine car for about $10k less than the TL and put the savings in a decent mutual fund. Cars depreciate. IMO you shouldn't be flirting with the limits of affordability. Period.
On the other hand, if you are trying using some self imposed limit of "affordability" as a negotiating tool with the dealer, forget it. Might have been useful in the past before the internet, but now everyone knows exactly what the dealer invoice is and, thanks to Edmunds, what people are actually paying across the entire country. We would all congratulate you on finding a desparate dealer willing to sell a new TL w/ nav for invoice, but that doesn't appear likely, and that's still $800 over your "affordability limit".
Sorry if I sound like Suze Orman, but you really need to re-evaluate your priorities if you/dad are torn between a $1,500 +/- difference between reality and maximum affordability and a $2k navigation system. Don't get me wrong, the Nav system is a nice luxury OPTION. But it's not one of life's necessities. And I sure as hell wouldn't endanger my kids college fund buying any car that was over my head.
P.S. Someone visiting one of our neighbors parked a Lamborghini Diablo in front of our house a few days ago. When my 9 year old asked how much it cost and I told her, she came back a few minutes later with "that's 8 times the price of our (former) Honda S2000" followed quickly by "it can't possibly be worth it". I was tempted to explain to her the reasons why it cost so much, but I decided to let her conclusion stand for now.
The words "05's" don't mean much when there is a constant demand, they will either sell it now, or a month from now, but they will sell ... right now, the the pre-owned 04 TL's are stronger than the 101st Airborne in a fire fight they're doing the super strong $28,0 low $29ish figure with 6/9/15k at the auctions, that means dealers will be selling the pre-owned for the $31ish figure, so make yourself happy and buy a new one .. you need to either step up, or step out.
Terry.
It sounds like one of two things, either you really cannot afford this car, or your dad doesn;t want to spend that much out of principle.
If its the first, please listen carefully to the advice given. Overspending on a car is very easy. You might be able to manage to buy this one, but in 2-3 years when you find some other car you HAVE to have, you will be upside down on the loan and in a real world of hurt.
Now, if it is simply a matter of your dad coming to terms with spending this much on a car and you really can afford it, look in a major metro like Chicago. I was really sick of the "We're Acura and the TL is in high demand, so we won't deal" attitude.
Send an email inquiry to all the dealers in Chicago. Also, check their webpages. Many of them offer "points" or discounts that you can get rolled into the vehicle since you will never see them again. For example, I wound up using Ed Napleton, and they have a $100 off coupon on their webpage. Once I got their quote, negotiated a little by email and a little by phone, then I had them take that off.
The result - A 2004 TL w/NAV for $32,776 + accessories + TTL. The plane ticket from MSP to ORD was $150. I saved myself over $1500 from what my local dealer would offer. You can, of course, always have your service done at Brookfield if you choose.
Good luck, and I hope you are successful in finding a car. Keep in mind, though, if you can't afford it, you can't afford it. Buying a less expensive car this time around might let you save some money rather than paying it to the bank and make the TL the next car.
Let us know how it turns out!
The TL is a great car and represents a value buy for the entry luxury segment. The full loaded Accord is an even greater buy for its segment if you don't care about or need the extra luxury items that come with the TL. If your dad is in a financial bind, just buy the Accord and forget about the worries of whether there is extra cash for making the monthly car loan.
Any other info. I should be telling you guys?
I requested a quote for a 2004 TL w/o NAV, 36 month lease, 18.4k/miles per year, zero down. I asked to have tax included...which is 6% in Indiana.
I got quotes for 42 months, 48 months, 1,000 down, 900/down, 1200/down. Only one dealer included the sales tax. The others would offer me a low price and put in small print, + tax. It was ridiculous. Also, the lowest quote I got was 570/mo, zero down. (including the tax). For a 2004 no less...the car is basically a year old.
I have offers on G35 from 3 dealers between 490-517 per month...w/tax included..same spec as TL. The TL cost less than the G35...what's the deal?
I can't really stand these Acura dealers...the car is fantastic..but Acura sales people need some training.
As an update, we're now full speed ahead at a TL!!! We're now down to negotiating price with the dealer. As someone mentioned before, we emailed 8 dealers in Chicago looking for the best price, and are negotiating with them. Once we get them down to where we want, we'll go to Acura of Brookfield with the Chicago dealer price and use the competition factor. And if Brookfield doesn't want to come down, we won't hesitate to go down to Chicago to buy the car!
So it's looking good. In regards to this vehicle, my parents plan on keeping it for 10-12 years, so over the life of the car, the price difference between buying an Accord and buying a TL is very slim.
I'm excited and I hope we get a good price! Any advice on negotiating would be appreciated!
carcar
Continental Acura of Chicago is offering us $32,200 on an Anthracite/Ebony 5AT w/ Navigation. How does that sound? The price was gotten fairly easily, no negotiating, just named a price!!
So, we're trying to get our closest dealer, Acura of Brookfield, to come down, using competition on our side. We really want to give them the sale, however, we're not going to if it means a $1000 difference, which it is. I'll tell you how things go!!!
Wish us luck. We could have one fairly soon!!!!
carcar
Anyway, take a look at Continental's web page. They have a VIP points program. Basically they give 1000 points when you buy a car which equals $50 to spend at the dealership. Since I was not planning to ever see tham again, they agreed to forgoe the points, and give me the $50 off the car. It's not much, but it might cover the gas to get home.
That is a very good price, congrats.
Sounds like a dumb question but are the taxes in FL normal 7% sales tax? Also how much were the tags & liscence (OTD price?) For that price I might be willing to make a trip across the state!! That is if they don't fly away in the hurricane ;o) I hope everything turns out okay!
Please send your brief thoughts and daytime contact info to jfallon@edmunds.com by September 20, 2004.
Thanks,
Jeannine Fallon
PR Director
Edmunds.com
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But in test-driving I noticed the car has 248 miles on it. That just sounds like a lot. Plus the 2005's are out in a few weeks.
I'm just wondering is $750 over invoice that great a deal for a 2004 with 248 miles on it? I've reread back over the forum and some seem to say that it is. I know the 2004 cars will sell, but still -- I feel like I am buying a used year old car with no discount (according to one post the used 2004's are selling at 28k-29k).
Thanks for any input. I'd like to buy this weekend, and I have to say that the dealers I've worked with have been great (I heard bad things about Acura dealers and it just ain't so).
As for the navigation system, Acura's is the best in the industry, but only you can determine if it would be worth it for you. We have used it to avoid traffic jams on road trips, find specific addresses locally, etc. We are in the process of new house shopping and it's been a real time saver in that process. I use it a bit more than I would have expected in the greater Washington DC area.
Good luck.
Thanks for this input. Any other thoughts on buying the 04 TL's as we go into their final month before the 05's come out would be much appreciated.
i'm in Phoenix, AZ so I'm going to Edmunds right now to check TMV for this area.
I think the $31.4k price is "fair" at best, but please don't buy the car thinking someone else took an $8k bath. Those plastic body clad ad-ons aren't worth much of anything to anybody at trade in time. As far as "factory performance wheels and tires", that's also suspect. The 6-speed manual TL has a stiffer suspension than the automatic. As such, the factory "HPT" package is only available on a 6-speed. Whatever they have put on an automatic should similarly be understood not to be worth a whole lot, either in trade in or actual "performance".
I picked up a brand new 6-speed with navigation and HPT in May for $33,308 ($1,000 over invoice). You should be able to do that or better now. Use that as your benchmark. But in my book, I'd rather own new for only $1,500 to $2,000 more than used, especially in a $30k+ car.
I was wondering how much bargaining room I have at this time of the year. In 2003, for those who had to order their 2004, how much did you have to pay with regards to the MSRP?
I would think $1,000 over invoice, which I got on 6-speed w/ nav that was special ordered in May, would be possible for a 2005.
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Anyone do any better than that? If so, when and where?
Thanks
Did you buy it from Bridgewater,NJ? Can you give me the name of the salesperson you worked with? Thanks.
I picked up my TL (Anthracite/Camel/AT/Navi) today and paid $33,700 not including taxes and fees. Try to sharpen up your bargaining skills and you may be able to match it.
"I loved the post about using Nav to avoid congested traffic."
Are you sure this is avail. on TL?
I was told price increase for 2005 is 1.5%, which would be $600. I'm probably saving $1000-$2000 over a 2005 or so I would guess. That's enough for me, there's virtually no change in equipment.