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Honda Element Prices Paid and Buying Experience

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Comments

  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    Isn't that usually another word for holdback?

    Steve, Host
  • elementboyelementboy Member Posts: 11
    Holdback is different from the flooring charge. Take a look at the site: carbuyingtips.com/car3.htm

    "Dealer Floorplan Assistance" Fees /Wholesale Financial Reserves./Dealer Interest Fee
    Some dealers charge this fee, which is icing on the cake. Have them remove this insult. Dealer Floorplan Interest is the interest that dealers pay for loans to buy the cars on their lot. Usually the factory pays this as part of the holdback, itemized as a separate invoice item. Floorplan interest can cost $150 per month for each car. On an Eclipse invoice I have, the factory gave the dealer $185 in floor plan assistance, and the dealer itemized it to the buyer as a fee, double collecting for $370! The factory gives the dealer 1-2 months of interest. The longer the car sits unsold on the lot, the more $150 interest checks the dealer pays. They want you to "assist" them in "paying it", which is the factory's expense, not yours. Dealers know we are on to them, so some have changed the name to a confusing term called "Wholesale Financial Reserves." or "Dealer Interest Fee".

    Honda includes this on their invoice, not listing it separately like other auto makers. Is User isellhonda a dealer? Hmmm....
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    Still sounds like holdback to me, and no, you shouldn't pay it "twice."

    Steve, Host
  • elementboyelementboy Member Posts: 11
    I guess if you really wanted to, one could think of a floor plan fee as holdback-like, but not really. The reason why it's different is that inorder to get a better idea of the "True" price a dealer is paying for a car, you deducted the 2-3% dealer holdback, and then you also deducted the flooring plan fee and the other rebates (factory to dealership, factory to customer)and fees (destination, "documentation fees", etc.).

    As for mr. isellhondas saying that it is the current "market" that determines the prices on car, boy that sure sounds like a dealer talking. Why should I pay "market" when I know what the dealer is paying. No matter which car or model you look at, dealers will say "This is a hard config to come by", or "Boy did you pick a hot car". When buying a car, I don't care what the market pays; I only care what's the best deal I can get, which better be less than market! People who take the time to read these boards and do research should always pay less than the uninformed buyer's "market" price (aka sucker's price). Knowledge is power!

    On a side note, having an economics and accounting degree, it makes me laugh when dealers throw out terms like "market price", and the finance manager tries to up the price of a car by saying he can lower my monthly payment (paying $10/month for a 5 years is NOT better than paying $20/month for two years).

    Everyone should check out carbuyingtips.com
  • yalsyals Member Posts: 1
    Hi,

    I have a question to all experienced Honda buyers out here. What in your opinion based on previous years of dealing with Honda is the best time to buy Element? Now - when Honda is offering 3.9% (ending 12/5/04) but Element 2004 is not on the dealer’s lot yet. Or wait month or two? How low the price may drop after its arrival? Couple hundreds or thousand?

    The matter is I have to buy one until last day of February 2004. And if it is depends on market I am in Chicago.

    Thanks for you time and opinion.

    Leon.
  • imaveggieimaveggie Member Posts: 3
    Dealer came down to $19,590 on 2003 EX AWD Auto with Side AirBags. Sticker was $21,590, so $2000 off.

    Does this seem like a good price? I am curious to hear some replies to the previous posting... 2003 now or wait a few more months when the 2004s are on the lot.
  • crcoxecrcoxe Member Posts: 72
    The longer you wait for an '03, the less likely it will be that you will get what you want. After all, they aren't making any more of them. The prices people (including myself) are paying for the '03s now seems to be about as low as it's going to go. In my opinion, buyers are in a great position now as dealers are trying to rid themselves of their '03 inventory in order to get a larger allotment of '04s.

    I'd say now is as good a time as ever to get an '03, but not for the price quoted to imaveggie. At very least, you should be able to get them down to invoice (around $19,100). With minimal prodding, you can get under $19,000 (at least I did). Must say, however, that I'm not sure about the Chicago market - I'm in Baltimore. As always, timing is critical. The last couple of days in any given month are the best time to get the deal you deserve.

    As for the advertised 3.9% interest rate, my advice to that is to ignore the TV ads at all cost. I'd also leave any reference to desired interest rate or monthly payment out of negotiations over the price of the car. Check first with your bank / credit union, as they may be able to do better. Honda Credit can also do better if they know there's competition (I got 3.65% at the end of November). Just like the price of the car, the interest rate they "advertise" isn't their bottome line.

    Good luck!
  • purduealum91purduealum91 Member Posts: 285
    Seems like they are the ones to beat. They are in Elmhurst. No local dealer would touch them.

    Tom
  • mreamymreamy Member Posts: 6
    Just purchased an '04 Element off the truck.
    Orange, EX, 4WD, Auto for $20,186 + tax and tag.
    I think it was a reasonably good deal.
    Hope this helps somebody else.
  • bigkahunaflbigkahunafl Member Posts: 128
    OK, your the first that I know of that got an 04. How do you like it?
  • mreamymreamy Member Posts: 6
    Like it fine. Very utilitarian. My kid loves all the leg room and the stadium style seating for his car seat mounted on backseat. Gonna love the room in the rear when I load my paintball equipment in. Biggest complaints after having driven 1.5 hours in it are the lack of a good place to put ones left foot...no foot rest and the door is hard on the knee when leaned on it. Also, the drop down armrest is very close and narrow so not very usefull. If the shallow floor level cupholder area could be replaced with an armrest level center console (like you see in SUV's and pickups) that would be awesome. Anybody here of a 3rd party addon to do that?
    The car doesn't like sprinting much and the highway noise is a bit bothersome but it has pretty good handling around town.
    For what it is and the cost I think it's a good vehicle.
    I think 2004 added keyless entry and passenger armrest but don't notice anything else different form 2003.
  • juliegnhjuliegnh Member Posts: 1
    Blue EX. $20,733. Added All Weather Mats and a Trailer Hitch for $754(takes a while to get the hitch on, I guess). I agree about the arm rest and lack of a place for your left foot. It drives nicely. My 2 dogs should love it. Only bummer I can think of right now (after 1 day) is that when both seats are folded up, it is hard to see when backing up. Otherwise, I think in the EX, there should have been a few more accessories like the fog lamps and roof rack included. Other SUV's do this on their highest end models. Maybe it's a good thing, because I have found the accessories to be far less expensive out on Ebay than from a Honda dealer. Most of the parts on Ebay are genuine Honda parts from actual dealers willing to sell for less. I hope someone comes up with a tall center console that will fit right into the existing one and that it has a padded arm rest....will write more after driving for a month or so.
  • mreamymreamy Member Posts: 6
    Turns out Honda already thought of the armrest issue. Should've been standard.
    Goto
    http://www.handa-accessories.com/elementint.html
    Search for armrest...looks good, gonna order one.
  • lalagimplalagimp Member Posts: 61
    Out here close to DC at Tysons Corner

    Last week we went into the second dealership and I told the sales manager I wanted the 2003EX4WD Auto in satin silver with:
    Seatback bungees
    Shade Screen(for skylight)
    Carpet floor mats
    Ashtray
    Keyless entry
    Cargo net
    Cargo Cover

    Plus taxes, processing, destination, DMV fees-
    EVERYTHING

    For $20000- NOTHING HIDDEN , NO ADDITIONAL INSTALLATION FEES.

    My highest I (silently) felt comforable was $20700.
    He took five minutes and said $20850.
    We got started on the paperwork.

    2/30,000 worth of free oil changes

    Of course my fiance wanted the extended dealership warranty which added another $985 so we have 6/100,000 with an insane amount of things covered including rental cars or hotels away from home til the work is finished.

    No financing.
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    If you are having buyer's remorse about the extended warranty, often they are cancellable. Check the fine print.

    Steve, Host
  • isellhondasisellhondas Member Posts: 20,342
    I've been gone therefore I didn't respond before.

    Yopu can have all of the degrees in the world however, it's always the prevaling MARKET that determines pricing. Same thing applies to houses and other things.

    So, it really doesn't matter what the dealer paid for a car. If the dealer won the car in a contest, and got it for free, it's still worth whatever the market is at that time.

    If a dealer's lot is crammed with a slow selling model, of course, they will take a very slim deal just to move the inventory. If it's a hot seller in short supply it'll be a different story.

    This should all seem so simple.

    As far as your "floorplan" advise, your facts are terribly distorted but I won't respond to that. No, we do not list or charge a "floorplan" charge. I have no idea what other dealers selling other brands do.
  • crcoxecrcoxe Member Posts: 72
    There's actually a good reason why they put the small armrest and a floor center console on the Element. Just like the CR-V, Honda wanted to provide the ability to climb through to the backseat easily without getting out of the car. The concept is common among minivans, and seems to be aimed at the parents among us. Odd, however, that the car is not exactly marketed to those in the minivan segment.

    I too thought about springing for the larger armrest, but decided against it when I saw that the installation requires you to cut into the seatback cover with a utility knife. I would think that once the integrity of the fabric is compromised, that little cut can easily become a gaping hole over time. I'll stick with the smaller armrest, thank you.
  • purduealum91purduealum91 Member Posts: 285
    I am poisting this info out of being nice. To those shopping in the Chicagoland area, no one seems to be able to beat Grand Honda in Elmhurst, IL. This was in this Sunday's paper.
  • elby1elby1 Member Posts: 2
    That sounds like an excellent deal, Kayla. For comparison purposes so I can translate to NY $s, may I ask what the VA sales tax and DMV would have cost (or at least what the VA tax rate is)?

    Thanks very much,
    Elby
  • ycyashycyash Member Posts: 1
    I just bought a Honda Element EX 2004, Side airbags, Manual. With 6 Year / 100,000 mile warranty for the total of about $21,200 with tax & tags & a cargo net. The MSRP for the warranty is around 1100, but I was able to get it for 850.
  • lalagimplalagimp Member Posts: 61
    I think the VA tax on cars is 3.5%
     My tax was around $650
    the dmv fees I'm thinking were around $65 but actually all my paperwork is still in the glovebox downstairs and if you want to cross that dmv info, our website is www.dmvnow.com
  • lalagimplalagimp Member Posts: 61
    I think I got the warranty around $9and a half.
    I didn't study on it and I felt I did most of what I did downstairs already.
    She did quote in the office the warranty is generally $1100, but it was my fiance that wanted it
  • lesbaer45lesbaer45 Member Posts: 9
    I've been looking at an Accord there. They seemed friendly enough but I was just looking. Wondering how the negotiations went.

    They are closer/easier to get to than Cary/Raleigh dealers for me.
  • mkline2mkline2 Member Posts: 2
    Does anyone know where I could get an idea how much to pay for a leftover 03 Element? There are several in my local paper avertizing 17,695 for EX 5spd or 19,753 for EX 4X4 auto. Invoice or less?
  • lalagimplalagimp Member Posts: 61
    the 19, 7 IS NOT EVEN INVOICE, that is above. I've not sure what the left over prices should look like but that looks like fall prices. then on top of that is your dealer processing fee, and the destination usually... that's average AT BEST.
    Good luck looking. Don't be afraid to look at the dealers further out of your travelling range to possibly save another thousand dollars and work out a sheet with all your costs you know of and go in and make your own price. if they try to keep you there more than an hour, your best leverage is to walk away because there is always someone somewhere willing to work with you.
  • rex4johnrex4john Member Posts: 17
    The local dealer has 4 '03 Element EX AWD Auto trans...exactly what I am looking for. On 3 of them, they have lowered the price down to around $19,700. The demo with the available roof rack is "discounted" to $21K and change.

    I called and asked about the E's with the $19,700 price. The lady, who does business with our company, called me back 2 hours later to inform me that the dealer is "really pushing to get rid of these" and was able to knock the price down $100 to $19,600. Are they serious? Or am I just being cheap? I believe it's still above invoice...way above invoice, but I can't tell cos the 2003s are off Edmunds' website.

    I'd appreciate any feedback.
  • lalagimplalagimp Member Posts: 61
    I think the invoice for 03 EX4wd WITHOUT the side airbags was appx. $19262
    I actually have those around here but I have to find them.
  • laborradalaborrada Member Posts: 1
    Greetings all. Would really appreciate some help. Fernandez Honda (brand new dealership) in San Antonio, Tx is offering me a black 2003 certified (3300 miles) Element EX 4WD for $20,363. The previous owners added tinted windows, fog lights, roof shade, trim on side, chrome muffler tip. I am super cheap and would like to pay less than 20K TOTAL, with some goodies thrown in like cargo net, cargo organizer, and keyless entry. I am concerned that 4WD is not necessary for me and I want a car that gets good gas mileage. Ideally I would love the extra airbags for safety. Any opinions? Should I attempt to negotiate more? Should I just go for a new 2003 and add airbags but settle for 2WD. My salesman (who is a relative of a coworker) asked what I thought about 20K as a drive out price but couldn't guarantee it. When I didn't look thrilled he asked me what I thought about 18K. I am totally unwilling to commit to anything though. I need help! I would love your opinions. Needless to say I am not that experienced with car buying and am not that great at negotiating.
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    Sometimes a first baseman helps. That's someone (friend, relative, co-worker) who likes showrooms and is willing to accompany you, and can make the appropriate noises like these when needed.

    "I'm bored"
    "Let's go back to the Toyota dealer"
    "LOLOL" (when a price is floated)
    "Did you see this big scratch?"
    "The color is, um, sort of slimy"
    "This is a waste of time"

    Alternatively, you can go out into the parking lot every ten minutes and get on your cell phone. You can call Dial A Prayer and pretend you're getting car advice while you're trying to sort through the stuff the salespeople are telling you. Or even call a live friend.

    Check out the buying articles under Tips & Advice here, and most accessories (esp. chrome exhaust tips) add zero value to the price of a used car.

    Steve, Host
  • lalagimplalagimp Member Posts: 61
    you can always negotiate a price on a car. They may not feel like negotiating with you though, and you need to know your prices and homework before hand so they can either A, not throw you off or B, you don't sound extremely unreasonable.
    Remember that the higher the mileage , your warranty is being eatten into.
    The fact that the car already has what it does is a great thing, but they were already installed so all you can count is the real value.
    I think there was a 25 cents per mile rule or something like that on higher milage what you can negotiate.
    I didn't want to spend more than $20k total either, but I went with $20,950. That was titles, fees, tags, installation, and my cargo net/shadescreen/air deflector/bungees/keyless/carpet mats/ Mine is a 4WD EX AUTO that came with 183 miles from test drives that I went ahead and overlooked.
  • candystorecandystore Member Posts: 1
    I have been made an offer over the internet from the dealer for a 2004 ex awd 4x4 for 22,199.97 out the door. He is quoting a 20,269.00 plus tax,tags, and fees. I live in a 7% tax state. Is this a good deal or should I look elsewhere? Any suggestions?
  • elemintelemint Member Posts: 79
    I would move on. Tell them you will take it for $20k after taxes and fees, and be prepared to walk. Find out what invoice is and dont go for more than $500 above that. DO NOT go for any "OPTIONS" thrown in. I hear of people getting the top of the line EX's for the $19k range all the time. Good luck.
  • lzelementlzelement Member Posts: 2
    I am interested in how people are finding prices now with the '04s. I'm in NY and have been quoted from 20,019 to nearly 22k for the EX 4wd auto w/side airbags. This is before tax and dmv fees. The dealers that still have '03s left are not really discounting them - about 20k is what i've found. Does anyone have info about negotiating greater amounts allowed to be put on a credit card (in order to get rewards)? It seems like $2000 is usually all that's allowed. Thanks much.
  • elemintelemint Member Posts: 79
    They are not going to give you the true price. YOu have to TAKE IT FROM THEM. You think they will discount it for you? That is your job. Tell them you will give them $500 below invoice for an 03 and are ready to close the deal that day. Be nice, and be FIRM!
  • lzelementlzelement Member Posts: 2
    Do I say that "i'll give you $500 below invoice" or research invoice price and deduct $500 and offer that? Thanks for the help.
  • lalagimplalagimp Member Posts: 61
    MSRP is $20850
    I found my invoice(19,262), researched my fees including the standard dealers processing(299), destination(460), state business tax(3.5%)- all that.
    Then I picked out options and left off the installation because I didn't know or , nor did I care.
    I said I wanted everything for $20000 on an 03 4WD EX AUTO
    The first dealership told me my offer was too aggressive and was trying to make them play santa, and didn't even want to go near $20500 at all. My highest comfortable I'd be ready to walk with was $20,750...
    ... and we walked. I didn't like his attitude, and this was my first dealership car.
    So I went to the next place. Walked right in and asked for a sales manager- Gave him my list of things I wanted and showed all the prices I knew and said again $20000, the day before christmas eve. (they do have year end to consider then)
    He came back to me twice within 5 minutes and said $20,900.My goal was to stay away under $21000.
    That's $20900 for tax, processing, destination, DMV Title and tags for 2 years. Sunshade, carpet mats, bungees, cargo net, ashtray(they didn't have the part and i have the voucher but never went back to install; It wasn't for me anyway), hood deflector, splash guards, keyless entry.
    I made it all up myself and my fiance checked and said it sounded good but I can't crunch the numbers that well without my notepad; I can't figure out where it went
  • elemintelemint Member Posts: 79
    no dont just say it. Educate yourself and then say it. Below invoice for an 03 on the lot is a good deal. Dont let them "sweeten the deal" with options, unless they truly are amost free. Most options can be bought for less than half what the deal will charge and that is not counting the insallation. Bottom line, if you can pay near invoice you will not be getting ripped off and the dealer will still make $, even though they may tell you they are not.
  • mkline2mkline2 Member Posts: 2
    I just bought a 04 ex element! I love it but wish it had side air bags...can they still be installed? I didn't purchase the extended warrenty....was that a good move? Also when I was researching the Element on the web, I found a site with great accessories like speaker phones, curtains,etc....now I can't find it. The Honda site only has some accessories. I really want the speaker phone.
  • lalagimplalagimp Member Posts: 61
    I'm not sure that it would be worth going and getting them and then the installation , if I'm not mistaken they only raised the invoice of the vehicle by $200.
    I'm sure it would run over that.
    I passed mine up because I read that side airbags ended up assisting less than 20% in injuries.
    I'm just glad the safety features on todays cars are better than even 10 years ago.
    I had my femur snapped last fall in a 91 mazda truck- no impact beams; might have saved my leg from the repairs
  • vocevoce Member Posts: 1
    A local dealer is the only one in this area that preps and paints the composite panels on the Element the same color as the car--makes it look like a different vehicle. Combine that with them putting 18" alloys and slick Toyos for tires, and this 03 AWD Auto EX Element is a head-turner. It has around 180 test drive miles on it.

    The sticker before options was around 20,500. Their options jack it to around $27k ($3k for the wheels and tires, $3k for the paint job, plus window tint). They would basically be willing to forego all their options and give it to me for $20k plus tax, title, license, or $22,500 out the door. It's good that they'll do this, because I'm not sure what these options are worth at the end of the day.

    I just feel like I should be getting a better deal, and was hoping to be $20k out the door. After all, this is an 03 that's still sitting around. Any opinions?
  • lalagimplalagimp Member Posts: 61
    $20k out the door maybe without all that stuff.
    that's alot of package maybe they'd go flat 22 or 21,8-
    the other thing if you get something like that and they are doing things that honda isn't offering to everyone; at this dealership- make sure that the tires size difference wouldn't void the warranty
  • stheodd1stheodd1 Member Posts: 18
    Received a quote on an 03 EX AWD leftover on the lot in Easter PA. Quote was 19700 without any arguing at all. Left and told them I would think about it and I'm looking at some other cars. Salesman then offered that starting Friday for the President's Weekend they are offering 3.9% financing from 36 - 60 months.

    I am also curious about anyones experience with after market tuners to increase the HP. Exhaust, manifolds anything else.
    Thanks
  • imaveggieimaveggie Member Posts: 3
    I live on Long Island in NY. I was in a dealership today. He wouldn't allow an overnight.

    I read on this board that some people have been able to keep it a day. Hmmm... I just thought that maybe I could keep it for a few hours.

    Does anyone know how common extended test drives are? Any experience?

    Also... For a 2004 AWD EX Auto, privately financed, no trade-in, would $19800 be a decent price? The Sales Guy stated $20,500. Sticker is 21,600.

    Thanks in Advance.
  • tcostcos Member Posts: 1
    I have a price of 17,408 for left over DX 03 Element with air, auto, 4wd and radio / cd. I want to pull the trigger but is that price sound right for left over DX. I heard the 04 LX models will be in next month, should I wait? Can anyone help with DX pricing? thanks tc
  • hdowdyhdowdy Member Posts: 2
    I was quoted $19895 including destination charge, for a '04 Sunset AWD Manual EX.

    How much lower can I expect to haggle for.
  • bigandtallbigandtall Member Posts: 6
    After months of researching American cars and negotiating like a hawk, I walked into a Honda Dealer cold and think I walked out paying too much. Would anyone like to confirm this for me even though it is too late? I'm in Indianapolis, IN. I just purchased a Metallic Green 2004 Element 4WD Auto EX with no add-ons. MSRP was $21590 and I paid $21200. There were no additional fees, but it did not include taxes(6%) or bureau of motor vehicle fees(to be determined). I sold my used vehicle myself(for $3500 over what any dealer would offer) and was in a tight bind with a family of 4 and only one car.

    The crazy thing is that the Edmunds.com "True Market Value" Pricing on this website says I hit the mark, but the deals I see on here make me think otherwise. Especially since I'm $1200 over invoice. Is the Edmunds "TMV" Pricing a farce? Am I in the wrong part of the country for supply and demand? I had used the "TMV" pricing to make sure I was getting a good deal, but now it sounds like a total joke.
  • srs45srs45 Member Posts: 3
    Is $17,390.00 a good deal for a 2004 LX automatic Fwd?
  • tidestertidester Member Posts: 10,059
    TMV varies from region to region. Look at Edmunds.com Learn More About TMV to find out how TMV is determined.

    tidester, host
  • meinradmeinrad Member Posts: 820
    No you didn't pay too much.

    Could you have paid less? Probably, but at what cost to your time and sanity. You could have been victim of supply and demand, a good salesman, your own lack of preparation.

    Bottom line is the time to ask that question was before you bought it. Why beat yourself up over it now when you can't change it. Of course someone is going to say you paid too much and tell you about their great deal.

    All of that doesn't change the fact you bought a great car and paid a fair price.
  • bigandtallbigandtall Member Posts: 6
    "meinrad" - Thanks for the comments. I guess I should consider myself lucky that I was not shopping for a large american SUV where the difference between MSRP and invoice is much much more than an Element.

    It's also hard to tell if posted prices are real because not all of the data is posted. For example: Are people including destination charge? Are they including documentation fees(if any)? Are some of them a typo? Some are listed as an Element EX AWD but do not state auto or manual transmission. My price of $21200 included the destination charge and no fees of any kind. It was also fresh off the truck that morning with only one mile on the odometer, and it was their only green one, so I'm sure I paid for that combination as well. (There are only about 5 green Elements for sale right now in all of Indianapolis).

    As long as it runs for over 200,000 city driving miles I'll be quite happy.
This discussion has been closed.