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Why so many 4x4s
I live in the snow belt of upstate New York and
the dealers here hardly ever stock any 4x2 trucks.
I've been driving in this part of the country for
49 years and have never owned a 4x4 and have never
been stuck in the snow in my life. It seems like
the younger generations think the first time they
see a snow flake in the air they have to have a
four wheel drive vehicle to get around. If I were
plowing driveways it would be another matter, but
to just drive on plowed roads, or unplowed roads
with less than a foot of snow the four wheel drive
is just not needed. Go ahead and beat me up on this
guys, I know for my kind of driving I'm right.
the dealers here hardly ever stock any 4x2 trucks.
I've been driving in this part of the country for
49 years and have never owned a 4x4 and have never
been stuck in the snow in my life. It seems like
the younger generations think the first time they
see a snow flake in the air they have to have a
four wheel drive vehicle to get around. If I were
plowing driveways it would be another matter, but
to just drive on plowed roads, or unplowed roads
with less than a foot of snow the four wheel drive
is just not needed. Go ahead and beat me up on this
guys, I know for my kind of driving I'm right.
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Oh, and one more thing,,,,,there COOL!!
Al
hindsite: You may or may not be one of the people who need one but from where I sit more people get into trouble than out of it with their 4x4s. Every time we have a snow storm there are more 4 whell drive vehicles off the road than anything else. The reason for this is that people get a false sense of security when they take off down the road in 4 wheel drive, then they overdrive their abilities and spin out when the going gets slippery. A 4x4 will not stop any quicker or corner any better than a 4x2, and has less control than a front wheel drive in the snow. My own feeling is there are just too many wimps out there that think they are invincable with their new 4x4 truck and get themselves and others in trouble.
I have pulled a 9,000 lb fifth wheel all over the country with my 4x2 and have never found a case where I wished I had more drive wheels.
Such a pity..
- Tim
One story I can relate. A friends truck broke down in a very bad storm. I drove about forty miles to get him(no noone works five miles from thier house here). We towed his truck part way back with six inches of snow on the road,we couldn't leave it because it was in the middle of the road with no shoulder to put it on. We stopped at a house to use the phone and the guy who lived there said we could put the truck in his driveway for the night. As I unhooked my truck the guy backed up behind him in his chevy. I thought the chevy was a 4X4 until the guy started spinning like crazy to slowly inch him back. I told them to wait a minute and I would pull him in. The guy insisted he had the best tires ever made on his truck and he could do it. After an hour of screwing around he did do it.But my point is he beat the crap out of his truck,and wasted alot of time just for foolish pride. I also found out it was the brand loyalty issue,his chevy could do anything my Dodge could do but even better. Yes you can get around in a two-wheel drive,but you could also cut a two foot diameter hickory tree with a hatchet because the chainsaw would cost too much. When I finally made it home that night the snow was 2 1/2 feet deep on the road and no other cars were out. I should not have been,maybe I should of just left him stranded.
The reason that many people have 4x4 is security. A 4x4 is a lot more forgiving than a 4x2 and can make up for deficiencies in driving ability. Now I grant you that too many people think 4x4 can never lose traction and those drivers always end up in the ditch. However in my part of the world people are used to the weather more so than people who usually drive highway / city and for them 4x4 is a sensible investment - for security if nothing else.
In my case I definitely need 4x4 because I frequently go off road in extreme conditions through my involvement in dog sled racing.
Rocles, couldn't agree more, mud is a lot worse for traction than snow. Only thing worse is freezing rain (and then it doesn't matter how many wheels are driving).
Driving in freezing rain - I'd never do it. Not sure where you are, but here that results in a sheet of ice over everything - no traction regardless of tires. Only way to get through is to be heavy enough to break through the ice. We are tlaking the kind of freezing rain that (when combined with wind) blows parked cars across parking lots.
Ice itself isn't too bad if you can gain traction through unevenness - your waterfall for example. The problem with freezing rain on the roads is that the surface is as smooth as glass.
not a fun time.
Ice can be OK at times....and other times it's just plain impossible.
Today was our first snow fall...not a lot..but I expected to see some trucks in the ditch on the highway....not a one. Not even a car.
Come on Generation X and Yuppies!....you are letting me down!
Silverado was under control....like I need to say that...
LOL
- Tim
But the thing is, pickups are built for hauling and towing stuff to places where pavement doesn't always go. Sure you can load up a couple hundred pounds of sand in the back of the bed, but how convenient is that? Heck of a lot better just to have the 4wd and drive as though you don't. Besides, it allows you to go places you wouldn't dare go without it (slippery launch ramps, muddy roads for fishing & hunting, etc.)
One more story. A couple years ago my dad and I took his 4wd '89 dodge/cummins with a 9' camper out to a hillside for some Chukar (partridge) hunting. During the night before hunting, we got about 9" of snow. While hunting the next day the snow melted and turned the ground a little soppy. The snow melting off the camper turned the ground around and under the truck very muddy. We didn't think too much of it because we had driven through a lot worse, as long as it was in 4wd. Well, the hubs did not engage, and we were stuck in 2wd. Guess, what, after about 5 hours of digging, jacking, ripping fence posts out of the ground and using them as improvised planks, we finally got to some firmer ground. Moral of the story, we NEED 4wd, even if not planning to use it.
Oh yeah, that road to where we were camping is normally OK for 2wd, so you can't just trust going places where 2wd can usually go, either.
Talk about an ice story when I was nineteen I bought my very first 4X4,a shiny new Jeep Commanche. We had an ice storm and my Dad's Dodge Dakota(Two wheel drive) slid down the hill it was parked on into the side of my truck. The Dakota had studded tires and about 300 pounds in the back but would not go back up the hill. We had to push it by hand up the hill off the side of my Jeep. After it was a few inches away from the Jeep my Mom had to jump in the Jeep and pull it up into the grass while we held the Dak',the Jeep did not even slip one tire.I then had to tow the Dakota up to a level spot in the lawn.
I suspect that freezing rain here is somewhat worse than you are used to. I have been caught by freezing rain in the middle of my journey home from work. There was no way I was driving, I pulled off the road onto the gravel shoulder, parked up and spent the night in the vehicle. I was in good company. If the freezing rain is bad then there is no choice in my opinion.
I didn't say that 4x4 was no better than 4x2 in adverse conditions, I said that in freezing rain it makes no difference. I stand by that. If you are driving on what is essentially a sheet of perfectly smooth ice you cannot get traction, period. If you can't break through the ice then your only option is to try and make what little friction there is your friend. In that scenario it makes no difference how many wheels are driving.
On a particularly rainy day back in the spring, I was on my normal drive to work. For reasons I can't remember, I'd driven my old 73 Scout to work. Well.......
there's this one low section of road that, after a hard rain, will "flood". Not too much, just a couple of inches of water that takes a little longer to dissipate. I was in the outside lane, and this "late model" 4-door, 4-wheel-drive Tahoe passes me at a pretty good clip. (45-50)
I was less than 50 yards behind him when he "found the excess water in the road"! I see brake lights, then, headlights, taillights, headlights, tailights, and so on. This genius spins 2 or 3 times, and winds up on the curb! Well, to try to be a good samaritan, I stopped to see if he needed any help. He actually thought that "my suv can go throught this, no problem!"
Some people just lack COMMON SENSE.
Sorry for such a long post!
keith24
I am sorry Moparmad, but the more I read of your various posts on a number of topics the less respect I have for your opinions.
Your physics lesson in the previous post ignores one basic fact - inertia.
Incidentally my first post on this subject noted that I was referring to freezing rain conditions where parked cars were being blown across parking lots.
We are obviously not going to agree so you can go back to driving your detuned viper engined truck or physically pushing your truck back up a hill slick with ice. I, on the other hand will hope we don't get too much freezing rain this winter, but will be prepared to pull over and wait it out if it does.
It makes you feel like God and nothing can touch you!!
Hhahahahahahahahha!!!
I'm invincible!!!!
- LOL
- Tim
Andy, we have freezing rain like you are talking about with glassy sheet ice on everything (I've seen cars blown across the parking lot), and I was stupid enough to drive on it (I was coming home from a long trip and just couldn't resist the urge to get home with my Subaru clad with studs). I made it, but would not like to try it again (there were cars piled up in the median and on the shoulder every 100 feet). So it can be done (it's just stupid to try).
Mopar, Andy is just saying that it's stupid to try to drive in freezing rain, no matter if you have 4wd or not. He's not saying 4wd isn't better. Obviously, since he has 4wd in his new Dakota (at least I think he does).
Now boys, lets not start insulting each other and try to LISTEN to what the other is saying, which is that whoever said 4wd isn't better in slippery conditions is an IDIOT. You shouldn't have to have a Doctorate's degree in quantum mechanics or even have to know much about inertia, friction or other physics terms to realize the more drive wheels, the more GO. But 4wd does not provide anymore STOP. That's where the bafoons end up in the ditch.
If you have a legitimate need for a 4x4 then by all means get one. If you just want to be able to blow everyone else off at the lights when the going is slick I'd rather see you stay home and let the rest of us get there safely.
If you think you might need 4wd, you should get it, otherwise you will not be comfortable going places you wouldn't think twice about going to with 4wd (however infrequently). If you run into those situations, you will definitely not be as happy with your purchase.
I'm happy to say I use 4wd very frequently, I'll be using it this weekend travelling through snow to my bird hunting fields.
Who cares...??
Once more....not I!
- Tim
Drove my Dad's '69 Ford pu 4x2 15-20 years ago, and went just about anywhere I wanted in 4" to 24" of snow on the road, but got into trouble when I foolishly went off road, even in dry conditions. Vowed then that when I was able to buy a truck, it would be 4x4. Did not want to be embarassed again by having to have someone come pull my foolish a!#*$@ out of trouble.
Why so many 4x4's? I think way over half of the people who buy 4x4's do it just for the status factor. I'm not trying to say thats good, bad, or indifferent, just somewhat frivolous. How many of you out there have been to the mall, or the grocery store, or Wal-Mart, and witnessed countless people trying to park their new full-size 4x4 suv. These trucks and suv's, I'd venture to say, probably NEVER get put into 4wd. Now, GENERALLY SPEAKING, it is women that you see in these behemoth trucks, with a couple of kids, (or more).
ATTENTION ALL WOMEN: That last statement was NOT an attempt to say "women can't drive!". I've seen just as many men trying to park a land barge suv with the same results.
We have become such a materialistic society, that we feel that to be accepted, we must drive the newest, biggest, most optioned, prettiest suv or truck on the market.
Whatever happened to being practical?
keith24
I've been stopped in rushhour traffic going slightly up hill with a icy road and had great fun putting my jeep into low 4WD and inching along without a slip whereas the rear or front drives next to me would slip a tire and slide sideways.
However, I do plan on getting a 4wd for my wife in her next vehicle. Personally, I want her to be as safe as possible. I don't want to worry about her having to put chains on if she drives over the mountains without me to see her family. I want to know that she will have the most traction possible when making a left turn onto a busy road when its icey. I know she has never pushed the limits with driving in the past, unlike me and 99% of the teenage male population, so she does not know the limits and how to recover. Therefore, the more I can do to keep her from losing control in the first place, the better. Further, I know she won't get a big head because she has 4wd and push it. Finally, they are much safer (being larger and higher) concerning accidents where others crash into her. So I don't have any problem paying a little more for 4wd, regardless of how little she might use it, and have my wife in the safest vehicle possible. Besides, I get to drive it also.
people around here buy duallies and crew cab powerstrokes just to have them, they dont use them for there ability one bit
me not being one of them, obviously, but i do have a 4X4, and do live in the country so often i do count on it
So, I know my wife drives conservatively, making the roll-over less of a factor than implications of someone piling into her.
No thanks for hugging the ground.
- Tim
That being said I told my wife to buy the car or SUV she wanted and try not to worry too much about if you think it might be safer than another. I told her there is no sense in driving a huge vehicle you hate and can't handle just because of what might happen someday.But I also must admit I was hoping she would decide she wanted an International dumptruck.She finally settled on a Chrysler 300M,which I was happy to find out is all of 3/4 of a ton heavier than her Neon.She is happy,it is a beautiful car,and I'm glad she got something out of this ordeal, which will leave her physically,and worse emotionally scared for the rest of her life.
PS PLEASE.....DONT DRINK AND DRIVE!!!!!
I agree with you on 41. It's almost as bad as 222. I can't stand turning left into the Harley shop with my bike at Willow Street as whizzing trucks go by as I wait!
Course I've driven a low rider as well...Wife still does..Mustang GT convert.
hmmmmm
Honey!....you need a truck!
- Tim
We got to get you a bike!
So.Cal has about 8 million of the world's worst drivers and you need every advantage available to assist you with sharing the roads with these domestic and multi-national chuckle-heads.
Personally I have always loved and owned four wheel drive trucks and will never drive anything less. Unlike many others I do use my 4WD as I go four wheelin as much as possilble. Mountains in the summer and deserts in the winter.( I don't function well in snow) There are many reasons folks drive four by fours and out here in La-la Land and alot of them are wierd, but no matter. It's all for the love or anticpating need of having four wheel drive. Plus the resale value and lease residuals are huge!!!!!!
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