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Comments
I recommend Reuters, since the British don't have so many axes to grind on US issues, and their coverage is pretty balanced - they have thier own reporters, so they aren't tied to AP or UPI.
--P.O.ed in Pasadena
Sorry to hear of your lengthy wait. I can understand your frustration. I DID, however, buy a Prius with only the rear wiper and side/curtain air bags (pkg #3) and mats for $21,524. You can get the car with lesser packages, but I think most people are wanting the #9 with everything so that is probably the one they are making the most of. Hope yours comes soon.
Too much goofy distracting techno crap in an insubstantial vehicle at a substantial price.
Of course it’s a media darling and anyone knocking it is pegged anti-green or anti-progressive, but I have little doubt that once sufficient numbers of them come into harm’s way we will see the Unsafe At Any Speed - Prius admonitions.
It's not worth your life to be a hip, early adopter - wait for the Hybrid Highlander - Be Safe!
My 2¢
srp
Isn't it a bit early to complain about poor crash test results when they haven't been published yet?
What does your MIL think of her car?
BTW... how well do you get along with your MIL? ;-)
I drive a Subaru Forester - but rarely. I bicycle commute (14+ years - rain or shine) to work. The handling, ride, etc of the Prius is not the Forester's equal (all but sports car handling + 5 Star Crash rating). 04 Prius still feels unsafe and insubstantial.
Isn't it a bit early to complain about poor crash test results when they haven't been published yet?
not complaining - simply stating ( partly based on the poor crash results of the 03 ) that I am dubious...
MIL loves the thing! - obviously - she bought a new one with less than 15K on the first! She'd love it if the frame was made of papier måché... ;-)
BTW... how well do you get along with your MIL? ;-)
Well enough to think about her safety out on the SoCal highways alongside Screaming Hummers and kids on X racing F-150s like they were MGs...
Hey - just my 2¢ - if you feel differently so be it.
No hard feelings.
!Vaya con Dios!
srp
Being dubious is fine; it's the inflammatory statements like "just can't be safe" that are premature IMO.
The only basis of comparison you clue us in to is that you don't like sedans, the entire class disappoints... not just Prius.
Adjectives like "insubstantial" and "unsafe" are just personal opinions.
Quanitative values are required to be helpful.
JOHN
1. The cost of a small 2 bdrm 1 bath home has passed the 250K mark in some neighborhoods.
2. The price of regular gas has been $2.10 on the average for a month now.
3. Local Toyota dealers are taking advantage of the tight Prius supply that they are now asking 3-5k on top of MSRP. I met 3 people who just put off ordering a Prius because of dealer markups.
The only basis of comparison you clue us in to is that you don't like sedans, the entire class disappoints... not just Prius.
come from? I never said anything remotely anti-sedan.
Quanitative values are required to be helpful.
Are you kidding? Cars are all about one's subjective (qualified not quantified) feelings...how does one quantify what one likes - the enjoy-o-meter?
...are just personal opinions
agree, as noted "my 2¢"
peace out
srp
The Prius is unsafe but a bicycle commute is??? Do you wear a helmet?!
Interesting. I just checked the NHTSA website for their 2003 crash data. They use a five star system with 1 being "poor". I didn't see any one star categories for the Prius. In fact, they were all 3 or 4 stars. I think the inaccurate use of the word "poor" is what John is referring to when he uses the term vague.
I checked another site too: www.fueleconomy.gov. I compared the 2004 Prius with the 2004 premium AWD Subaru Forester and here's what I found:
MPG combined: Prius 55, Forester 21
Annual Greenhouse gas emissions: Prius 3.5 Tons, Forester 9.2 Tons
EPA air pollution score: Prius 10, Forester 6 (10 is best)
And the most surprising thing (to me): Passenger volume: Prius 96 cubic feet, Forester 95 cubic feet.
Is that the refrain of Roberta Flack I hear? Killing us slowly with his right foot...
As for the "ride", I agree that this is subjective and I think it is great. The turning radius is fantastic if you have an appreciation for exactly where the front and rear ends of your car are. Perhaps you haven't mastered this yet. Sounds like your MIL may not let you, seeing as how she loves the car.
MY 2 cents (with 5000 miles on my 2004 Prius)
Obviously Prius gets great mileage - tangentially throwing that in my face I guess is deserved payback for my ‘inflammation’ albeit IMO obvious and has nothing to do with my disappointment in the vehicle.
FWIW, I was not initially comparing Prius to Forester - I was asked what car I drive. I am aware the Prius is greener than any non-hybrid.
Yes, I was referring to the NHTSA 3 stars as poor - my mistake - not Quantitative/ Ranked ‘Poor’ but Subjective as in 3 is less than 5 or 4, lowercase ‘P’, poor.
I formally apologize to all - I should not have been so over-the-top, but my first impression when getting out of the Prius was that if felt insubstantial and (for reasons noted including driver inattention thanks to techo-overload - do not recommend to VCR-Impaired elders!) unsafe - I was surprised I felt that way about it.
I hope time and NHTSA prove me wrong.
Enjoy your Prii!
Time to fire up the bike and go make some money...
Helmeted-Zero Emission-srp
> adopter - wait for the Hybrid Highlander
So then... What was meant by that?
JOHN
Average around 48 mpg for 40 mile roundtrip to work which includes both interstate and city driving.
Only thing that makes me wonder about the design is the antenna. Removing it when going through the car wash is somewhat inconvenient...especially when other cars have antenna built into the glass.
At least nothing you want to hear.
Any/ all dissenting views unwelcome, huh? Pity.
srp out
Also troublesome is that, according to the Toyota Prius brochure and website, package #9 is suppose to come with a self-dimming rear view mirror and the homelink security system. Yet when I go to the dealer's inventory web site (which seems to be no longer available as of last week), which is actually the inventory of the Southeast distributor, there have been several Prius' listed with package #9 plus a $200 or $300 option for the self-dimming mirror and Homelink system. Is this not double charging? Has anyone been charged extra for this feature with package #9? Thanks.
Spring is getting mighty close now. All the snow we got last night is melted already. The same thing is suppose to happen tonight.
When the snow finally leaves for good and the temperature stays in the 40's (or higher!), MPG will finally climb into the 50's and stay there.
I can't wait! (Only having winter efficiency to report is really a pain.)
JOHN
On the first day that the new Prius was officially available last October, we made the rounds of three Toyota dealerships in the Gaithersburg, Maryland area. Not only did we learn that none of the dealers had a Prius on the lot, but in each case, they had been taking deposits since July. Even though the deposit was refundable, we were not interested in making a deposit on a car sight unseen.
The following week, two of the dealers called to tell us that they had a new Prius on the lot for customers to inspect and drive. We returned to the dealership whose salesman we had been the most comfortable with and took the Prius for a spin. We then decided we wanted a super white Prius with gray interior package #9 and floor mats. They wrote up the sales order which came out $64 below list because they only charged us $120 for the floor mats. They did NOT try to force any addons upon us.
The dealer warned us to expect a four month wait due to the huge backlog. It turned out to be only 3 months and 28 days before we could take delivery of a new 2004 super white Prius with gray interior package #9 and floor mats. We have had it for a month now and are very happy with it. (I would be a bit happier if I got to drive it more often but then, it isn't my car. )
When we took delivery in mid February, we were told that the same car ordered that day would most likely have a six to eight month wait for delivery. We are glad that we had the patience to wait.
P.S. My wife really likes the styling of the new Prius. I think that she thinks of it as her personal spaceship.
Today, when I ordered my Highlander Hybrid, they told me the wait at this particular Toyota dealership for the Prius was 2 years! Actually the wait is "definitely over a year, and who knows, could be two years by now. The list is really long."
IIHS gave it even better side impact scores, Best Pick, in fact the highest score the agency has awarded so far.
5 stars/5 starts NHTSA frontal crash test, and IIHS Best Pick in frontal offset crash test.
Straight As. Best possible score in 4 different tests.
I like the Prius, and see no need to attack Subaru's incredibly safe Forester to defend the Prius. Prius can stand on its own merit.
-juice
Back to Prius, I visited a Lexus dealer and inquired about the RX400H, mostly out of curiosity. Indeed, in MD you get up to $2000 state tax credit, basically it offsets the 5% MD sales tax.
With Prius, that's a $1250 credit on a $25k car. But with the RX, it's the full $2000 credit. The hybrid option is supposed to cost $3000 more, but you only pay 1/3rd of that. Not bad.
Something to think about if you live in MD. What other states have similar incentives for hybrids? VA offers HOV lane access.
-juice
Would a door ajar condition make the car think someone was entering the vehicle and this a START condition activate???? You stated you heard ONE beep not TWO...should you here TWO beeps during lock condition...would ONE beep indicate door ajar??
ANYWAY - Toyota now has "Leather Faced Seats" as an accessory item. ($1,295) That is great! On the other hand, it says they can't be had with the Option 9 package but I'm sure that is just a glitch. On that point, why is it Toyota is so far behind the game when it comes to their website interface? I've never used it to "build" a car (Toyota or Lexus) when I haven't run into instances where it doesn't offer certain options or packages that are available. UGGH
Anyway, has anyone seen the factory leather?
Do I need to wait for another coupla tankfuls to get accurate readings? The driving was at 60 mph w/air cond on. One more question, does the "B" gear position assist in going uphill or just downhill?
Thanks,
Rich
Have fun at the auto show!
To both you and John, we are expecting full reports AND photos.
My insurer offers a discount for DRL, and I would have liked to get that.
I remember you mentioned in the past that you have flyers/handouts made up to give to people. I have been invited to two events coming up in April and June that will cover environmetal and clean air issues in North Texas. I was asked to talk about my 04 Prius. Would you mind sending me a copy of your handout so I can get them duplicated to give to people at these two events? Please let me know as soon as you can if you don't mind doing this. You can e-mail me directly at tonyhan @ juno . com
Thank You,
Tony.
'04 Salsa Red