Please help me decide between...

qbrozen · February 2008

well, you left off low cost of ownership in your original post. As kyfdx pointed out, maintenance is included for the first 4yr/50k on a new bimmer, so its got that going for it. If you are worried about the period beyond that, find a good independent mechanic who specializes in bimmers and it will save you a bundle over dealership repair costs.

gijoewildbill · February 2008

hmm...

I will have to take a look at it. Any other suggestions???

I am trying to get a few opinions, hopefully based off ownership, so that I can do a comparison, before I go do test drives.

Bill

qbrozen · February 2008

well, sporty RWD car with decent mileage for OTD under $35k is a very specific order. It is exactly the reason I'm considering the 128. Anything else I think of doesn't fit at least one of those criteria.

If I expand to include AWD, I'd suggest the WRX.

Otherwise, I think we're talking slightly used; like a G35.

stickguy · February 2008

G35 is going to be a bit of a gas hog, and a coupe 6 speed is going to be a lot of car to handle. Major change from a jetta.

I thought of the 128 too as the logical option, since it is basically exactly what the psoter described.

If you can live with FWD, a Mazda 3 hatchback would be a nice choice.

I would probably have a deposit down already on a 128i if BMW had been smart enough to bring over the 5 door version. No way I can live with a small 2 door coupe until the kids are out of the mix!

guss · February 2008

New under $35k rwd coupes with manual;

Audi TT,BMW 128(already mentioned),Corvette(bare bones maybe $45k),Chrysler Crossfire\Mercedes SLK, Ford Mustang GT,Nissan 350z,Volkswagen R32.

Throw in convertibles and you add cars like the Miata,Solstice\Sky and Mustang Convertible.

If you are waiting until 2009 the new Camaro may be out by the end of '09 or early '10

qbrozen · February 2008

Ummm... well, you tried. ;b

Like you said, Corvette too expensive. Likewise for TT and SLK (crossfire is dead, ain't it? although you can find new ones sitting on lots with big discounts). R32 ain't RWD. The Mustang is a decent suggestion, but mileage will not be good. Likewise with the 350z (although I used to get 25 mpg combined in mine, which I don't think is bad).

kyfdx · February 2008

Lots of '06 and '07 Crossfires out there... Plus, they all come with the lifetime powertrain warranty..

I think new coupes are about $10K-$12K off MSRP.. You can get a fairly loaded coupe for between $25K-$29K....

I would assume that resale will be crap, and replacing those 18"/19" tires will eat you alive.. But, maintenance at a Chrsyler dealership won't be too bad, considering it has mostly Mercedes parts..

guss · February 2008

well.... The TT coupe starts at $34800 msrp, with discounts he should be in the $35k range.

My local Chrysler dealer still has 2 new '07 Crossfires, go in make them a stupid offer. I am sure they will at least listen to it.

kyfdx · February 2008

That would be front wheel drive, though....

151ranch · February 2008

Well, since you live in Houston, my first thought is how much driving will you be doing in traffic? Are you sure you want a MT? Because if you haven't driven one in traffic, you should try before you buy. Unfortunately, you can't find a MT to rent for a week....maybe you can borrow one.

And unless you buy a real enthusiasts' car, you will have a heck of a time selling a MT if you don't like it....up here in Dallas even the BMW dealers will heavily discount the MTs (unless it's an M :shades: ).

gijoewildbill · February 2008

Thanks for all the input.

When it comes to RWD and Coupe design, those are more of a preference than a necessity. FWD is not bad for me, again, because it will be more of a daily driver. I guess the reason I was looking at the RWD/AWD was to try something different and to allow me to have some fun because there is a track that has a free race day 1 Saturday a month literally 5 to 10 miles from where I am going to college. Some times the track is setup for drag, sometimes an oval, and sometimes, in a twisting/cornering course.

After doing some more looking over the last few days, I found that I like the following vehicles over the others in the price range.

1) Nissan Altima Coupe
2) Nissan 350Z
2) Honda S2000
3) Mitsubishi Lancer RA or Evo GSR
4) Dodge Challenger (the V6 base version that should be coming out)
5) Mazda MX-5 Miata

(was considering the RX-8, but it eats gas like a hog)

As for the reason I want a MT instead of a AT is because I want to learn and become good at driving MT. I know that living in Houston means I will sooner than later get caught in traffic, however, I am only going to be in Houston for another year to year and a half and then I will be living at College in a much smaller college town, so traffic won't be as big of an issue.

What are yall thoughts about the 5 vehicles I have listed? The Dodge Challenger with the V6 should bring better gas mileage and use reg octane which makes it favorable assuming the handling is ok.

Bill

bolivar · February 2008

Why take the Corvette out of the picture?

A brand new one with no options can be bought for the low $40,000 range.

Drop back to a 2007 or 2006 and one with few options should be found at $35,000.

gijoewildbill · February 2008

Well, $35,000 was a maximum ceiling. If I can find something in the $20K that I enjoy (remember, any new car I get whether new new or slightly used will be a step up from my put put VW Jetta) I can live with that and any extra money be devoted to tuning (exhaust, headers, intake, etc.). Yall gotta remember that I am a broke college student. So, again, if its fun and cheaper, I will go with that.

What I am really curious on is how people who may own these or have owned these vehicles liked them, how reliable they were, how were they on gas, etc. I am looking for real world experience with them, not just the numbers on paper so I can try to steer clear of problems as well as know what to expect if I choose one over the others.

Bill

kyfdx · February 2008

I know you are coming out of a VW, but I'd rather have a GTI, than most of the cars you listed... Pretty loaded for $27K..

bolivar · February 2008

Wow.

'Broke college student'

'Tuning (headers, exhaust, intake)'

'Reliable'

What a convoluted, contradictary mess.

Tuning - money absolutely thrown down a drain because of zero resale value and most with questionable performance value. This stuff usually conflicts strongly with reliability. And, if you are willing to 'use' any added performance capability, you sure are not worring about reliability.

My opinion - If you want to go fast, buy fast. I especially love the Ford Ranger forums where the kids inquire "Who makes performance things for my 4 cylinder Ranger?"

What you need - that used Civic you don't want to consider.

What you want - buy any car you 'want', but do not mod it at all. Save all that money for repairs, because any used car is going to break, and you are going to be spending money on it.

gijoewildbill · February 2008

Point taken and I do admit I am being a bit greedy and picky. I enjoyed my VW, but the repairs were more expensive than comparable work that would be done on a domestic or a Asian market car, so that is where I am coming from when I talk about reliability/service. As for tuning, I don't mean to buy some car and rice it out. I just mean that I may switch the audio components out and change an intake or exhaust, nothing major.

Bill

bolivar · February 2008

Thank you for your reply.

I was expecting a ball of flame.

Buy a 2005 Corvette at $30,000 that appears to be well cared for. If you can afford the insurance. Checking eBay's completed auctions, there were 6 Sold 2005 Corvettes at $35,000 or less in the last 2 weeks. Not that I am actually recommending you buy an auto off eBay. There are some scary potential problems there.

You will not need to do any performance mods. 400hp is plenty.

Start saving up toward repairs. You are going to have them on any used car.

gijoewildbill · February 2008

Yeah, I hate when you constructively criticise someone when they ask for help, and then they get all pissy about it. That is why I don't do it.

Anywho, I see your thought, but let me throw something else at you Bolivar. What if I were to wait for the 09 Dodge Challenger? Supposedly (and this is to be confirmed at the New York Auto Show in mid March) the 09 will include lesser versions. The SRT is a bit much engine/price wise, but there should be a lesser V8 (R/T) and a base V6 trim as well. I was thinking about maybe the V6 base model that should, in logical estimation, end up pricing somewhere in the $20Ks to be competitive with the Ford Mustang and 09 Camaro coming out. What are your thoughts on that?

Bill

bolivar · February 2008

I really don't keep up with autos enough to give you any kind of answer.

Just thinking, could you get a new Mustang, V8, with low options for well under $30,000?

This gives you a new car warranty, with nothing to repair for 3/30,000....

oregonboy · February 2008

If you can afford the insurance.

Now THERE is a key point. A young male definitely needs an insurance quote before he puts money down on any hi performance ride. Make that any car period. Insurance pricing can be incredibly capricious.

Your insurance bill on a Corvette would probably make those maintenance charges on the Jetta seem like small-change.

As a practical-minded individual, my recommendation would be a nice low-mileage, used Miata. There are a ton of them available, great mpg, bullet-proof reliability, no resale penalty for manual shift, great track car. The only major down-side is they are not great for long distance commutes and have (very) limited hauling capacity.

james :shades:

cccompson · February 2008

You can buy a new Mustang GT for less than $25,000.

gijoewildbill · February 2008

I was looking into the Miata too. Personally, hauling/storage capacity isn't big on my necessity list. I do love to drive though, however, I only rarely go longer than 2 hours per trip at the most. More often than not it is smaller trips. I still haven't had a chance to plant my butt in one, though, so I don't know on the comfort level whether I will like it or not. Guess I can give that a try one of these weekends that I am free.

Bill

guss · February 2008

While you are there you should try the RX-8, gas mileage is terrible but alot of fun for under $30k.. You will need to be average height or less though because they are a little cramped.

gijoewildbill · February 2008

I was looking at that. I like the RX-7, and now the RX-8, but premium fuel with piss poor MPG is a big drawback...

Bill

plekto · February 2008

When you consider that it handles and drives a tiny bit worse(we're talking 5% or so) than a Porsche Cayman, that price difference of $20K buys an awful lot of gas.

kyfdx · February 2008

Warning: If you aren't into BMWs, this may be a little boring..

1) '04 330i sedan.. Manual tranny, Performance package, Xenons, Cold weather pkg.. all the toys.. White w/black Alcantara (synthetic suede) interior.. 26K miles.. Includes set of winter tires/wheels, and extension of BMW maintenance until July, 2010.. Under warranty until July, 2008.. Asking price $25,500

2) '04 X3 3.0 litre.. Manual tranny, Premium package, big moonroof, Black w/TerraCotta leather, all the toys, except NO xenons.. No Sport (not a big deal on an X3). 38K miles.. No warranty..
Asking price $23,500

Both from private sellers..

Whaddaya think?

stickguy · February 2008

I think I want one. The X3 sounds tasty, although I honestly think that I would rather go with the steptronic.

The 330 is probably a lot of fun though.

kyfdx · February 2008

Yeah... I actually want a stick... The only sticking point with the X3, is that is the vehicle my wife would like to have next... and she doesn't drive a stick.. So, it might stick in her craw, every time she saw me in it..

I might be able to make this a little tougher on you.... Both of the vehicles are located closer to you, than me..

oregonboy · February 2008

I've heard that the X3 has an really stiff ride with the Sport Suspension. I wouldn't be a bit disappointed by missing out on that.

stickguy · February 2008

OK, how close?

Not that I need one. Actully, might be able to get a real good buy on it, since an X3 stick must be a tough sell. I can see why, since I do think that anything "trucky" or trying to be an SUV makes more sense with an AT. It would also serve duty as the family primary transport, so more of the family could deal with it, and it would spend more time in situations where the manual wouldn't be of much use.

I'm getting lazy in my old age I guess!

qbrozen · February 2008

The ZHP is the obvious winner.

kyfdx · February 2008

The X3 is in a Philly suburb, and the ZHP is in northern Maryland..

The only thing that worries me about the ZHP... possible boy racer type might own it.. plus, not wild about alcantara interior... it starts looking fuzzy and worn pretty quickly..

Big plus for the X3? I love that Terra Cotta leather!!

stickguy · February 2008

Hey, I am in one of them too! On the Jersey side. Got a link to this baby?

qbrozen · February 2008

there is an "M" badge underneath the 330i on the trunk lid

hmmm... yeah ... that would give me pause, too. I'd have to check it out in person to look for any other telltale signs.

qbrozen · February 2008

Ya know, maybe I've got a narrow view of the universe, but I find it hard to believe a boy racer would have (1) been able to afford a new 330 ZHP and/or (2) put so few miles on it. I think only now, as preowned vehicles, would "boy racers" be able to get into such a car. So 3rd owners need beware.

kyfdx · February 2008

Well.. I've seen pics, and there is an "M" badge underneath the 330i on the trunk lid....

That alone, scares me... :surprise:

Anyway, that one is sold... it was in Hagerstown..

The X3 is in West Chester...

Can't link it.. it's on another forum... I'm a stickler for the rules, you know..

stickguy · February 2008

OK, far enough away that I couldn't figure out a lame excuse to be "in the neighborhood"!

boxycass · February 2008

I was told that maybe I could ask my question here.

I'm in the process of looking to replace my '97 2 door GrandAm with almost 125,000 miles on it. I've been looking seriously at the Saturn Aura, Saturn VUE and the Chevrolet Malibu. Anyone have any pros and/or cons of each of these?

We also have a 2003 TrailBlazer that I LOVE. So I do already have a SUV so not sure I really need another one even though the VUE is smaller & more fuel efficient. I've also been struggling to determine the differences between the Aura & the Malibu. I will admit to liking the sales approach at the Saturn dealership better than our local Chevrolet dealership. BUT I can use GM card earnings on a Chevrolet & I can't on the Saturn.

Any thoughts? Thanks!

jipster · February 2008

Quite a buzz over the new Malibu. I haven't driven one, but from what I've read it challenges the class leaders in quality and performance.

stickguy · February 2008

saw it at the car show, and it was very impressive, especailly the interior. The Aura is basically the same car, maybe a little "sportier", so that would qualify as get whichever one you like best!

The Vue is going to suck more gas, and if you don't need another SUV I wouldn't bother.

boxycass · February 2008

Thanks for your thoughts jipster & stickguy!

tifighter · March 2008

Malibu for sure. I had to do a double take when I saw one on the street recently; nice looking car. The 4cyl LT looks like the pick of the lineup; it gets good mileage, and the reviews say its very quiet too. The fact that you already have a SUV and that you can use your card earnings versus the Saturns make it a no brainer, IMHO.

eggsnbacongrl · April 2008

I think the toyotas are the easiest to repair. You should also check which one has the best gas mileage also!

ken1496 · April 2008

Our 2005 VW Passat 4motion wagon lease will expire in July. I have few options that I am entertaining. Please help. FYI: I am generally not a big fan of used car unless they are super reliable. I am looking at a 3-year outlook.
1) Use 15k to buyout the current VW. The trade-in value for a similar car is not much different from the buyout value so I am not gaining much from this transaction. I will own this vehicle with no more payments but I will own an older car (6 year old in 2011) with possible maintenance hassles.
2) Lease a new car. Say $3k for a down payment and invest the rest. I will have monthly payments andI will not own the car in 2011.
3) Buy a new car. Use 15k for a down payment and finance the rest. I will have a higher mothly payment than what I am used to but I'd rather keep my monthly payments at a similar range ($400).
4) Buy a reliable used car. I personally think I can purchase a more reliable used car than VW. Say toyota or honda. 2007 Lexus Rx goes for $36k so I can use 15k for down paymt and finance the rest. My monthly payment will be similar to the current amount.

qbrozen · April 2008

Well, when talking Passants and Camrys, there shouldn't be any reason to put $15k down and have $400/mo payments on anything ... unless you set your sights MUCH higher (like the aforemention '07 RX).

It would help to know what you want in a vehicle. A Camry and RX are quite far apart on the spectrum.

Anyway, since you seem to be adverse to owning a 6-year-old vehicle, it seems to me that leasing is really your cup of tea, so that's where I would focus my attention.

cccompson · April 2008

Actually, you would be gaining several things by keeping the Passat:

1) You'd have no monthly payments;

2) You'd be "buying" the car for cheaper than you could buy one on the open market:

3) You'd be "buying" one whose use, service, and maintenance history is known; and

4) You're already through the big depreciation hit.

However, it sounds as though you want something new. The deals on '08 Pilots give them tremendous bang for the buck.

plekto · April 2008

5) less insurance as collision isn't technically required.

6) less registration

7) better credit

8) not having to pay sales tax.

ken1496 · April 2008

Thanks everyone. I personally would like a new car. My wife doesn't so I am trying to come up with some reasons.... We both have not-so-great experience with used cars so I have one reason to work with... so far.

exb0 · April 2008

If you are afraid of a six year old car, here is what you can do.

Buy 08 Acura TL. You can get the base model at invoice or below of $31706 and it comes with .9% APR, or, you can squeeze the dealer for the $2500 marketing support and finance it yourself. In addition, you can get factory warranty for 8 years 120K miles for about $1300 (unless you live in FL). The warranty will help you keep this car for 8 years, and then you will be able to sell it for 6-8k. However, to make financial sense, you have to keep this car for 8 years.

aredfield · April 2008

Truth be told, I am not much of a car guy. So, I am approaching some car mavens asking for some help to narrow my search.

I have two issues that loom larger than all others:

1) Driving in ice and snow. I want to get a vehicle that can resist skids even on steep slopes and in bad conditions.
2) I like to be able to SEE. Blind spots are my enemy.

Those are the top priorities. Of course, other issues matter. I can't drive a stick shift. I will be doing all of the driving and will seldom have passengers, so I don't need anything big but don't rule it out either if it is the best way to get the top priorities. I want to buy it new. I am willing to think about going over $30K but if I can get what I am looking for for less, that is all to the good.

Ideas? And thank you.

Adam

Please help me decide between...

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