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Comments
As for the Brake, reminds me of a BMW roadster, and noted the 300C influenced gun slit windows.
I found an interesting article from the Business Week that talks about Audi's push for better quality. I hope it indicates better things to come.
http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/05_11/b3924003.htm
The A3 surely is more fun to drive than the Accord.
Good business week article, BTW, thanks. Glad to hear Audi is trying, though right now electronics glitches and an archaic dealer network are big headaches. Even in S.California, Audi dealers are few and far between and most seem nothing more than sales kioquses (the one "full size" dealer I've found is owned by an ultra high pressure outfit that proved pure misery to visit).
I really like this car other than the fact that it appears to have greater understeering than, say, a Mazda3. And I'm wondering if better tires would help with the problem.
It turned out to be the most reliable car I ever owned and was only out of service for an unscheduled repair once in the whole five years and 70k miles I had it. That was because some chipmunks had shorted out the wiring for the A/C, hardly the car's fault.
You may not do as well with a new A3 but there's an excellent chance you can do even better since you are buying it new. Don't worry, be happy, drive Audi.
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
Dave in VA
Almost all published reviews I have seen in the US were with the all weather tires, so yes, summer tires (even the ones it comes with if you chose them) definitely help! So does the available sport suspension, which is usually not tested in reviews I have seen, either. Drive it in that combination and come back and let us know if you think it has lower g-forces or more understeer than a Mazda3 - I think, not.
The next step up would be a stiffer rear sway bar, which is a very inexpensive mod.
It has pretty much everything you can think of standard (including DSG automatic, AWD, sport suspension, body kit). Some things are optional (more here). Your dealer should be able to give you all the details.
It's a great toy for someone who doesn't mind spending a lot of money, and prefers the form factor over, say, the TT or a Porsche Boxter or a BMW, or what not.
You can get a lot of it (and have more space) in a $10K or so less Legacy GT wagon. I know it is in a niche by itself, but considering the AWDs drive train loss, you get only marginal more power than the 2.0TFSI. For the money, I'd rather risk chipping the latter, would add a front LSD, and have more power available. Or better, wait until AoA realizes that there are no more than a 1000 buyers a year for this car, and offers the 2.0TFSI with Haldex quattro...
But you also get a lot of worthless garbage on the 3.2 - automatic, heavier enginer (and less powerful than a chipped 2.0), bunch of silly S-line parts. All told the 3.2 seems like a massive rip off. Configured with just a sky roof and xenons the darned thing is more exepensive than a 330i with sport, leather, moon, xenons via euro delivery. I can't fathom paying 35-36k for an A3. That's too much for a car of that caliber. 31-32k is reasonable LOADED.
I can. But we all know about my priorities, eh?
I can see it, though. I want the Quattro, or else I might as well shop Acura or VW, and I'm taking DSG anyway (zoom, zoom), I'm not likely to chip anything, though I like the idea of the petit plant with bigger bang. S-line bits? The appearance package junk you can keep, but I'm opting for a sport suspension anyway. Sky roof yes, HIDs only if they're packaged with something I really want.
They've still got my attention, but if the lease rates from Audi remain as they have been, that could tear the transaction...
I’d prefer the Turbo Quattro as well
I think I would go and buy the AWD Legacy GT 2.5T if I didn't already have a largeish AWD wagon. Subarus are very reliable, but, unfortunately, their real world mileage is often not as great as you would expect from a turbo 4. At any rate, that's just one AWD competitor of the A3 - everyone has their own priorities and as a result, it is at times amazing which cars are cross-shopped. I think I have pretty much given up on the idea of a Forester XT, but for the longest time that one was for example in the running for me.
This is a lot of car for the money. You get 50 more horsepower and more torque out of the 3.2L.
My point was that you don't get all of that because of the added drive train loss of the AWD. Also, numerous dynos have shown that the 2.0TFSI stock produces quite a bit more hp than listed (with the argument that a smaller number helps Audi justify the price difference to the 3.2). The real world difference to the wheels is likely no more than 20hp - for a car that is substantially (nose-) heavier and guzzles a lot more gas.
And it will be a while before we see a 2.0T in quattro.
If you are right, and many people buy the 3.2, that could very well be. And vice versa.
Too close of a price gap between the 3.2 and 2.0T. Only about 4k different and you get quattro and a better engine and DSG that is a no brainer.
If my math is right there is a $6000.00 difference between the base 3.2 and the 2.0TSFI with DSG and sports package (which includes leather and other things). The street price difference is likely even more, since the 2.0TFSI can be bought at least $1000 below MSRP, and it will be a while before the same is true for the 3.2. $7K for AWD (a $1500-$2000 value), the marginally better V6, and some little doodads I don't need...
What I am asking is better understood if I explain. I know that in my area, the Bluetooth A3s have not yet arrived. Soon, but I have a chance to get one at a fair price that is already on a lot and marked a little down. I have decided not to wait. I really would not mind having a *nice* *integrated* cradle for my phone if it gave me many of the same features as the wireless, cradle-less Bluetooth would.
So, does it? If I get an Audi phone cradle, will my nav and my dash display tell me it's the phone? Etc?
Thank you for your responses. Quite frankly, my dealer(s) do not know if it will or if it will not.
Regards,
AudiAble3
Dave in VA
Side question... what city are you in where your dealer had an RS4? I understand that it was preproduction... I'm still curious to know what city.
Audi has a few pics of the new 3.2 DSG on their website right now. Considering the 3.2 DSG model will have the upgraded S Line package as standard equiptment (which is a $2750 - $3000 option on the A4 and A6's) that makes the 3.2 DSG quattro a pretty good value in my book.
The Edmuds crowd is full of nitpickers who analyze prices to death. Cars are getting more expensive every day as front wheel drive V6 hondas and toyotas are pushing 30 grand. A loaded up 2WD 150hp Jetta can hit 27 grand. You people need to get real on prices and production costs.
Me no get it. :confuse:
Right now, Audi is going full out towards shoppers who like to max out their cars --- engine, AWD, DSG, looks, features --- with the 3.2 A3.
I am more a guy who looks at the specs, performance, and what I get for the money. If the 2.0TFSI A3 does not receive quattro within the next 9 months or so, I may not buy the A3 but go for the 4-door GTI instead, or buy an entirely different make.
Time will tell which way Audi can sell more cars, and whether the entire 3.2 thing was worth the effort on this model. Sure, if you don't offer the 2.0quattro initially, you can sell a few more 3.2s initially. In the long run, playing with customers like that leaves nothing but bad taste and may not bring in a penny more to Audi.
The California emissions questions is interesting in the context that no one has confirmed or denied at this point whether the 3.2 will be FSI - to my knowledge. The new 3.2 in the European Passat (which is also transversely mounted) is FSI.
Room, style, a great engine, a good drive system, 4 year warranty...the complete package.
And totally unattainable in the USA. Yet Australia, a nation with rampant unemployment, a horrid economy and fewer than 25 million people gets this car?! Something is definitely screwy at Audi's HQ.
I would appreciate any experience based comments. Bill H.
Dave in VA :confuse:
Quattro would make the car cost 27-28k. That's a far cry from the 34k of the 3.2. Add in sport and you're still under 30k. xenons and it's 31k.
And I see people talking about add weight, well no matter what car you add quattro to you are going to be adding weight.
The quattro system adds 150-200 lbs. A hit no doubt but the benefits are immediately obvious...the car will no longer suffer from FWD.
he 2.0T is not going to be here any time within the next year. I work for a dealer and we have a whole years worth of productions dates and releases and the 2.0T quattro is not one of them. So don't hold your bearth but do give the 3.2 a fair try, I know you will love the engine especially fitted with the DSG. To any of you who have question out there let me know and I will see what I can do to get answers for you.
The 3.2 is added weight and it's less powerful than a chipped 2.0 so it's a lose, lose. You now have a snout that's more unbalanced, plus the car has less power and worse handling than a 2.0T Quattro. This reminds me of the old VR6/1.8T issue. Drive the cars back to back and you feel that bigger engine as if someone were sitting on the hood. mix a chip into the mix and the V6 becomes just an albatross.
If I lived in Denver the only reason I would go for the 3.2 is perhaps it would be more refined (stretching here).
2018 430i Gran Coupe
But the main problems here is that Audi wants to have a Sub 30k in their line up that will bring a new segment to the market that they have never had, and the 2.0T does that right now. If you Add quattro 1500-2000 to the car it puts it over that and puts it to close to the 3.2 quattro.
A 2.0TSI quattro would be well below 30K even with sports suspension, which includes leather. If I understand correctly, market placement in Germany and Australia is such that if you choose quattro on this model, you'll have to take the manual. This may also be related to the first generation DSG, which may not like the added AWD traction. At any rate, it's almost an even exchange: about the same price, whether you chose quattro or DSG. This is likely the best explanation why the US is not seeing this, at the moment - better than fuel tank re-alignment and certification issues, or cost issues. It was deemed that the triple-niche market {hatchback:manual:AWD} was too small in the US.
And I see people talking about add weight, well no matter what car you add quattro to you are going to be adding weight.
The weight difference between the DSG FWD and manual AWD is ~130lbs --- and most of that is in the center and over the rear axle, giving the car a better front/rear weight distribution. This is less than 5% and clearly not enough to take away from the cars performance. Add another 60lbs or so for DSG (although currently not available, in this combination).
The 2.0T is not going to be here any time within the next year. I work for a dealer and we have a whole years worth of productions dates and releases and the 2.0T quattro is not one of them.
Unfortunately, I have been around long enough to hear that many times. All VW dealers I knew claimed until a few weeks before arrival that the 1.8T Passat 4Motion would never come... Once the 3.2 bombs and the 4-door GTI even as much as threatens to take away sales from the A3, it will come unless sales numbers for the 2.0TSFI drop significantly below expectations. At any rate, as I have said before, this whole thing is a self-fulfilling prophecy that does not look too good for AoA, at the moment.
So don't hold your bearth but do give the 3.2 a fair try, I know you will love the engine especially fitted with the DSG.
But almost everyone I know does not want this car with a 3.2. Trying it is not going to make me dish out an extra $6-7K that I don't want to pay, not even speaking about its weight and fuel consumption. I'd rather buy a 170hp Diesel or 1.4l twin-charged TFSI than that engine. I used to be in the minority, but times have changed in the US even for buyers of "upscale" cars. It's time AoA get with the program.
Last not least, what if I don't want the DSG? How much is AoA trying to shove into my ... mouth?
For a lot of people I think, much of the equipment on the 3.2Q will be superfluous; some of it will be for me. I like the bulk of what I see though, and as I said before, a $36K-$38K tag won't scare me off. The arguments about an A4's pricing for comparison doesn't wash for me: I'd prefer the smaller package handsomely fitted out. Small = good. Bigger = not-as-good. For me.
If I'm going to accept a bigger car, then I'm going the full Monty and popping for the S4 Avant.
What I don't understand is buying a FWD Audi...
Although Tahoe could be tempting.
Folks Wagon.
TT is on a different platform. and the 3.2 is heavier than the 2.0 by a long shot. You're not getting how nose weight is anything but positive. Putting the premium and winter package on the A3 3.2 does not endear many of us to the car as many of us are 2.0T Q people with the sport package. In my eyes the 34-5k is WAY too close to the cost of a e90 330i with sport, leather, comfort, moon, xenons (41k msrp, 35k euro delivery). 30k I can put up with an audi that's a wagon, 34k or higher, there is no way for me to reconcile getting a little wagon over a solid performing sedan.
think its a great car, not that it wouldn't be great to have a 2.0t with quattro. Car would sell like hot cakes! But we have to be real with ourselves, we are lucky to have what we have in our market. The US has not done very well with hatchback type vechiles or wagons at all. So for us to have the A3 here to being with is great.
I don't buy the hatchback argument at all. Mazda's moving 7-8k Mazda3s a month. VW sells the golf/GTI and the R32 sold out totally. Not sure of the WRX numbers but i know they move hatches too. There is a market for high performance near-luxury hatches. VW knows this from experience with the R32.
Totally agree.
Subaru sells about 3000 a month in the Impreza line. Four different models, at that, three different engines (Impreza, Impreza Outback, WRX, STi). Add another 4000 units or so for the Forester (two engines). All of them AWD and competitively priced. What was that again about the high cost of certification?
If you widen the scope, don't forget about all the Matrices and Scions and Elements and whatnot. That is, there are lots of people out there who don't think there is anything wrong with owning hatchbacks or small wagons. Audi just seems to think none of those owners wants to move up...
Thanks for your comments, but I don't think you can honestly say that I am shopping for a base car. The 2.0TFSI with sports package (17" alloys, leather, sports suspension, front fogs, sport seats), cold weather package, and convenience package (not that I have decided on the latter) is $28,635 when I use the Audi configurator. $675 less without the convenience package. Again, considering the fact that the 2.0 can be had $1K under MSRP, a $6-7K difference in street prices, in my books.
I think what could generate excitement and would truly distinguish the 6cyl. A3 would be the 280 hp, 265 lb-ft 3.6 from the Passat. Seems that in this case, VW knew better where the competition is --- at times when every family car seems to have a version that carries 250+hp --- and how much more you have to offer with the next engine to make it appear like a worthwhile step up.
I too think that once you start getting in the 30’s, other things catch my eye 325i; 3 liter inline six nice.
3.6L VW/Audi should take Nissan’s lead with their VQ engine and shove their 3.6L in everything they can; even if the majority doesn’t option it with the bigger engine.
A WRX unlimited lists at 28K+. A Forester XT starts at 28k also. GTIs start in the lows 20s while the R32 sold for over 30k.
I would think, just conjecture here, that the A3 is a higher $ selling vehicle.
Nice conjecture but only the Matrix/Vibe/Mazda3 consistently sell for much less than the A3/Forester/WRX/R32s. A 25-30k A3 is right in the mix with the others...
I can’t imaging going for a Subaru if I could go for an Audi at a comparable price.
WRX is also quite a bit faster and with 2.5 turbo lag is now about same as on Audi (i.e. close to none). Granted A3 is nicer inside (just gorgeous), but just take a test-drive in WRX and you may not be so sure anymore.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
Uh, no it's not. The WRX is a mid 6 second car. The A3 is continually tested to run 6.3-6.5 0-60 runs. And the WRX, while fun, is totally boy racer and lacking in any refinement or polish (ditto the Legacy GT 2.5).
The A3 you can take when you go somewhere nice or stay at a ritz carlton and not feel like you're the schlub. A WRX stands out as a cartoony boy racer car in those places.
I just can't live with the outside. Subie's still in the love it or hate it column in my book when it comes to packaging. On the inside, well, OMG; hello Audi!
I think my yen for aesthetics (which I will never again deny) would drive me to Audi in an either/or scenario.
Specs certainly seem impressive just can’t bring myself to drive one. The looks just don’t do it for me (actually turn me off).
Performance is one of my top requirements, but the looks/styling has to come up to a certain level...otherwise it vetos the whole car (Sub B9, Tribeca is the only Subie that I think looks good)
So in essence I’d rather go slower and look good; how much slower is debatable..
I drive my old one ('03) wagon (comparable size and room) every day and got used to the turbo lag (again not present in 06), but it is not the best "feature" admittedly. Noise and cheap interior (esp. before '05) are undeniable. But I paid $23.5K for mine (plus accessories), not $28K+ and got AWD in it :P .
Must admit though - today would probably run back and forth between dealerships and test it back to back.
By the way - street boy racer - just not fair (STI - perhaps, but not wagon version). And Legacy GT - that's plain malice.
2018 430i Gran Coupe