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Nissan Titan vs. Chevrolet Silverado/GMC Sierra 1500

bowke28bowke28 Member Posts: 2,185
edited March 2014 in Chevrolet
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Comments

  • ryanbabryanbab Member Posts: 7,240
    Ill stick with my 2000 Silverado
  • bowke28bowke28 Member Posts: 2,185
  • ryanbabryanbab Member Posts: 7,240
    because it is a great truck. Over 40K miles and couldnt be happier with it. Only other truck id consider would be a 2500HD crewcab (for the room) and the big block or diesel engine
  • bowke28bowke28 Member Posts: 2,185
    im glad for you. the reason i started this thread is so people can have candid discourse about the advantages of their truck. the Titan is due for release in 9 days, and im sure many chevy/gmc buyers will be cross-shopping soon.

    so let me ask you...if you wouldnt consider another truck besides GMC/Chevy...why did you post here?
  • ryanbabryanbab Member Posts: 7,240
    You asked

    "Which one will you drive? why? "

    and I gave an answer

    Ok this is in reply to the ford topic where you said you sell nissans. I am just curious if you or anyone you know get upset when someone doesnt like the product. I found this to be the way at a few toyota dealerships when I was looking at the tundras. The salesman asked my opinion and I said i didnt like it because the backseat was to small. He blew up and got all bent out of shape. He asked my opinion and I gave it. I cant comment on the titan because I have only seen pics and the performance figures.
  • bowke28bowke28 Member Posts: 2,185
    no, i dont. everyone is entitled to their opinion.

    the only thing that gets on my nerves is when people make a buying decision without all the information, or incorrect information. for example, a guy bought a ranger with the ABS option instead of the frontier. he told me that it was because the frontier didnt offer it as an option. i told him thats because its standard.

    if you like the competition, fine...i just want to be able to provide the info. my customer needs to make an educated decision.

    having said that, the titan is a true full size truck with full size capabilities, where the tundra is more of a soccer-mom's truck. ;-)
  • ryanbabryanbab Member Posts: 7,240
    thats good I am glad your an informed salesman. I ran into plenty of sales people who didnt know anything. I was going to buy a work truck this past summer (base model sierra or silverado). Only reason I ended up not buying one was the sales people. Best Lie i got was when I asked if there was an advertising fee added in. The salesman said and I quote I wouldnt be working here if there were hidden fees. He showed me the invoice and sure enough a $270 some dollar ad fee. I pointed it out and boy did his face turn white. He didnt think I could read the invoice I guess. Plus the pressure of buying was unbelievable. 6 times I told him i wasnt buying the truck that day another thing he said well 99% of the people who dont buy the first day they are in dont come back. Well i wonder why they dont come back???
  • bowke28bowke28 Member Posts: 2,185
    the guy you ran into was new in the business, and getting frustrated. ive had months where i dont do well (this is one of them), but i dont take it out on anyone else but myself. ;-)

    now back on topic, you may keep a bowtie around your neck for life, but i would check out the titan on december 1st...you might just end up on the 'shift_' bandwagon! lol
  • kg11kg11 Member Posts: 530
    Full sized truck on the market.Competition is a good thing.

    I've read the stats and it seems that Nissan has done on it's first attempt what Toyota hasn't done in two tries.

    That said,when Nissan (or ANY mfg) comes out with a big block gas powered 3/4 ton I'll check it out.The Ford V10 was a bit anemic and the new Dodge Hemi has 100 lb less torque than my 8.1. I had hoped Dodge would do better with thier now discontinued V10

    Until somebody builds a more comfortable,more powerfull truck,I'll stick with my GMC,questionable quality and all.

    kip
  • ryanbabryanbab Member Posts: 7,240
    The salesman wasnt new. He said he had like 8 yrs in the business.

    As far as the ford V-10 they are thirsty. I drive one around the plant at work (crew cab long bed 2wd) alot of idling starting and stopping and alot of offroading. It averages about 7-8 mpg :(

    Im not in the truck market now bowke. About a month ago put a chunk of change down on some land and I am (contractor not me) building a house in a little over a year
  • dustykdustyk Member Posts: 2,926
    >>I had hoped Dodge would do better with their now discontinued V10<<

    In 2000 there were plans to have the V10 upgraded to a new cylinder head and intake manifold design that would significantly raise both HP and torque. However, since the new Hemi was already on the drawing board it was decided that much more could be done with the new Hemi engine and likely performance improvements would render the V10 as obsolete.

    A V10 built off of the current Hemi is is being talked about, but it will likely find its way into 3/4 ton and up platforms.

    There is also a displacement and power increase planned for the Hemi V8 as well.

    Dusty
  • kg11kg11 Member Posts: 530
    I have no problem buying a 3/4 ton to get the bigger engine.In fact that's what I did with the GMC.The Hemi V10 or bigger V8 will be worth looking at in spite of the ugly front end.

    kip
  • obyoneobyone Member Posts: 7,841
    Are you talking about the Dodge or the Titan? lmao......

    For me, I like the original version prototype Nissan which came out about two years ago. The Titan looks too similar to the Frontier. Course looks are subjective but I can't see paying for something I don't like looking at.

    Saw the new F150 and the sides of the bed looks like the Ave. Got to be 7'6" to put anything into the bed.....
  • bowke28bowke28 Member Posts: 2,185
    funny you mention the ford bed. at our training, they had a ford. they actually asked is to reach in and touch the bottom of the bed...only one person could do it...he was about 6'6"...lol.

    as far as the looks, nissan wanted SOME brand recognition. in a few years, they will probably redesign the front...but until then, they want people to look at it and go "that looks like a nissan".
  • kg11kg11 Member Posts: 530
    I don't care for the Dodge styling, privious or current,but I could live with it.The Nissan ,Fronteer and Titan,look redicules.
  • saddaddysaddaddy Member Posts: 566
    Having been around trucks my whole life -- I always had a dislike for yuppy import pickups. Then I looked into Toyotas and saw how solid they were. Nissans on the other hand never picked up the ball in my opinion with toughness (with the exception of the hardbodies) and, to me, just carried the image of the truck for taking the garbage can to the end of the driveway. The new Frontiers have just never had the first feature that seemed "truck-like." The ugly useless interior that looks at home in the 350Z, for example. Nissan never made a vehicle with the off-road prowess as Tacomas and their reliability is a smidge less as well. Exterras seem utilitarian, until you ride in one. Nissan brags about a 3.3L supercharged engine that makes a HUGE 210 HP. That really makes them look like they know very little.

    Granted Toyota has nothing to rival the Titan, but the Tundra is the best at what it is (and thats not a truck for soccer moms). I haven't looked at what the Titan has other than a lights out hoss of a motor, so I will keep an open mind. I would never buy one though just from the image Nissan has always carried with their trucks and SUVs.

    I mean now disrespect with this post as similar criticism about Toyotas has made me mad at times as well. If Nissan gets involved with NASCAR, I may change my mind, though. ;)
  • keaneckeanec Member Posts: 349
    Saddaddy, I am not going to comment about wether Toyota trucks are tough, but I will about nissans. I have owned an old King cab and A newer Frontier. Both were alot tougher than they looked. There isn't another small tuck that can pull what the frontier can. I pulled a 5000 lb trailer with the cab full and never had any problems. My old king cab was a work horse. IMO, you are wrong when you say the Nissan Trucks aren't tough. And I am betting the new Titan is goinbg to be Bad [non-permissible content removed] tough!
  • bowke28bowke28 Member Posts: 2,185
    to drive a titan and tundra back-to-back, you will absolutely agree that the toyota falls WAAAAAYY short.
  • dogface5dogface5 Member Posts: 87
    There is no comparison.
  • obyoneobyone Member Posts: 7,841
    Or was that another commercial? I still have that '91 though I put on around 2k miles a year on it now.

    Alpha T was the concept truck....

    http://www.edmunds.com/news/conceptcarspotlight/articles/46354/ar- ticle.html
  • kg11kg11 Member Posts: 530
    But the front is uglier than the Titan
  • obyoneobyone Member Posts: 7,841
    I thought the front end was right up there with the new style rados....
  • kg11kg11 Member Posts: 530
    We're on the same page now. I don't like the AV-style front.

    When I bought the '01 GMC,I chose it over the Chev cuz I hated the high hood on the HDs.

    I like the new F150s looks
  • bowke28bowke28 Member Posts: 2,185
    i like the looks of the f150 better than the titan myself, but its just not as much all-around truck as the nissan.
  • saddaddysaddaddy Member Posts: 566
    its difficult, but I won't say what Im thinkin.

    And anyone who compares the Tundra to the Titan is dumber than a snow-mobile in Canton, MS (hehe, Titans manufacturing place). Apples and oranges! I say this after bowke has tried to bring it up about 4 times. Its not saying much for this truck hes trying so desperately to sell, when he pitches it against a vehicle that is tons smaller in every way. Are you trying to tell me that Toyota tried to build a truck the same size as the silverado/ram/f-150 with a 5+L engine and everything magically shrank on the assembly line. Don't sound so clueless, they knew exactly what they were building and are selling exactly as many as they want. Just for the record I don't really like em, but you talk about uneducated comments -- bowke, you are just one in a million blurting out that very thing when you continually push that debate.
  • bowke28bowke28 Member Posts: 2,185
    i drive them almost every day. i can say, quite honestly and objectively, that the titan is just a smidge better all-around.
  • obyoneobyone Member Posts: 7,841
    This topic compares full sized trucks and not wannabes...lmao
  • hogboyhogboy Member Posts: 84
    Obyone, that was a dirty job, but someone had to do it.
    Thanks.
  • bowke28bowke28 Member Posts: 2,185
    wayta go obyone
  • saddaddysaddaddy Member Posts: 566
    cuz mister bowke was pushing his sales just a little too hard.

    I was just making the point that this fella is complaining about the very thing he has done the most of. Dunno if I said it, but the Silverados my faves by far -- but I just felt like this guy needed to realize some of the ways he was defying his own advice, thats all. Happy turkey day!
  • oldharryoldharry Member Posts: 413
    bowke28 wrote:

    "i like the looks of the f150 better than the titan myself, but its just not as much all-around truck as the nissan. "

    What is your deffinition of an 'all around truck'? I like longbed extended cab myself, others have other needs. Does your Nissan meet them?

    That V-8 ? What is it's history? The Triton and the Vortex have been in service long enough to know how they will work, but I hesitate to buy the first year of anything. Is the auto tranny a proven unit in heavy duty service, or is it brand new?

    The Nissan may be a good truck, but to say it is a better "all around truck" than the F-150 is premature.

    Harry
  • obyoneobyone Member Posts: 7,841
    has a knocker like both GM and Ford. Ford took care of theirs....GM? Head in the sand from what I've seen.
  • boaz47boaz47 Member Posts: 2,747
    is for the imports to realize that to a truck buyer a full sized truck comes with a long bed. It also has more than one engine option. If you don't need a full sized bed it might be perfectly acceptable to order a short bed but the long bed has to be offered to be a real full sized truck. Right now Nissan is closer to a full sized truck than Toyota but like someone pointed out earlier till they offer real truck beds and options they are pretenders. While this is just my opinion I think from other truck forums there are many truck buyers that feel the same way.
  • keaneckeanec Member Posts: 349
    I might partially agree with you but I wouldn't go sofar as to say Nissan is a pretender. The vast majority of trucks being sold today do not have a 8' box. The vast majority of trucks being sold do not have 6 cylinder engines. Because one or two options are not available doesn't make it a pretender. Nissan will add the option of a 8' box eventually, but it just doesn't make sense to start when they can reach the majority of the market without it.

    They will eventually add other things like 3/4 and 1 tons with a diesel option but to even suggest they do that the first year is a little much. One of the biggest differences between Japanese managed and NA managed car companies is the way they market their vehicles. The Japanese have been very successful with keeping there costs down by limiting options available. They find out what the majority of consumers want in each particular segment and they package their vehicles to match.

    It has been very successful because they are not trying to be all things to all people. For example, The "pretender" Tundra is actually a very profitable vehicle that sells very well for Toyota. It might not reach the numbers of the F150 but it makes Toyota money and that is what counts. It's number have been steadily climbing each year.

    There are many people who feel just like you, but there are also many people who don't feel that way.

    So, although I understand where you are coming from, I think the pretender label is a little harsh. I slao, tend to agree with Nissan's strategy! After all, Nissan and Toyota are making a s--tload of money and the domestics aren't.
  • dustykdustyk Member Posts: 2,926
    >>The "pretender" Tundra is actually a very profitable vehicle that sells very well for Toyota. It might not reach the numbers of the F150 but it makes Toyota money and that is what counts. It's number have been steadily climbing each year.<<

    [http://www.autosite.com/editoria/asmr/svtruck.asp]

    Don't think so. Tundra sales have never met Toyota's expectations. At 76,537 units in 2002, it has a long way to go to beat the F150s 620,197 from the same year. It only beat the Avalanche by a little over 6000 units, and the Tundra is a heck of lot more "real truck" and aesthetically appealing. Dakota, S10, and even Tacoma (117,443) outsell it.

    Dusty
  • dustykdustyk Member Posts: 2,926
    >>After all, Nissan and Toyota are making a s--tload of money and the domestics aren't.<<

    Well, just a few years ago Nissan wasn't doing all that well. But, a point well taken. Most Asian nameplates build more on demand philosophy, the domestics build more on speculation. But that too is minor in this case.

    The real problem in the past years is the informally declared war GM is waging against Ford. GM has continued heavy rebates, even on their most popular models just to keep market share away from Ford. Ford was destined to become the largest automobile manufacturer based on its market growth of the last decade and the ego-empire just won't sit idly by and let that happen.

    GM has forsaken profit to keep its market share. Ford is still reeling from the disasterous Ford Explorer tire issue. Chrysler is colateral damage. It doesn't have the market depth to be isolated from the GM-Ford price war. With a compressed schedule of new product on the horizon, it takes Chrysler longer to recoup investments with smaller market share.

    Asian companies have the luxury at the moment if higher customer loyalty. This allows shallow or no discount scenarios and holding on to a greater portion of their market segments. If the GM-inspired price war continues into next year, the outlook for Nissan, Toyota, Honda and others could become more tentative as well.

    Regards,
    Dusty
  • keaneckeanec Member Posts: 349
    Based on those figures it seems Nissan just wants to match Toyota for the first year. Even if the Tundra only sells 100,000 in the states it is still making good money; but I accept your correction of my over eager exageration. :-)

    Your explantation of the demise of the profits for the American companies is interesting. You don't think the fact Ford's quality is/was crap; all the American car companies have high pension obligations, they all also have over capacity (maybe caused by trying to be everything to everybody), has anything to do with it? Just a thought.
  • saddaddysaddaddy Member Posts: 566
    sounds like one import is enough for the folks in this thread!

    Just to add to the current convo: hasn't Ford laid off a bunch of workers at least two different times over the last couple of years?

    Some of my thoughts on tundra sales stem from the fact that EVERY year where I live Silverados and F-150s that retail for $32k-$35k can be had for $10k less than that. I have yet to see a rebate/mark down of more than $2500 on a tundra yet. At least down here, they are not having any trouble moving the ones they get and obviously the dealers don't have enough to go around. Now, these observations are simply that -- not good or bad toward any make.
  • dustykdustyk Member Posts: 2,926
    Well, the perverbial response from Chevrolet owners use to be that if they weren't the "best" and most "reliable" nameplate on the planet then they wouldn't be selling so well. That response is and always was as superfluous and filled with juvenile superiority as it was incorrect. However, that being said I think to state that "Ford's quality is/was crap" is an exaggeration as well.

    There are a number of factors involved with the current state of the North American automobile market. But your previous comments were directed specifically towards profit, and that answer is directly related to the current price war. Ford still maintains a commanding lead in light duty pick-ups, and does well in big trucks, too. While the entire market is depressed at the moment Ford still has roughly the same share of the market lead over GM and Chrysler as they did four years ago.

    Toyota had been in the full size LDPU market now long enough to establish a market percentage, and they have...albeit very, very small. They don't have to rely on rebates because they have never overestimated the market for their Tundra, and customer loyalty keeps their small market share stable.

    To their credit, Nissan has taken a bold step in entering the fiercely competitive fullsize LDPU segment, especially at a time of downturn in the North American market. I think Nissan will be very successful, mainly because of Toyota's arrogance. The market be damned, Toyota builds vehicles their way because they can rely heavily on loyal customers, a large percentage of them willing to accept things the Toyota way just for the privilege of owning another Toyota. Toyota has become the GM of 20-30 years ago and someday they might suffer the same fate.

    Nissan has taken a much more serious evaluation of what will sell and to do that they have made their LDPU entry very appealling to a broader range of PU buyer. They realize they are the new guys on the street with LDPU sheet metal. They realize the PU market has become very competitive, is filled with some of the best product from all of it's competition, and will have to compete on proof instead of hype.

    Many of the same comments about the Titan have been said about the new Dodge RAM: it was "butt-*** ugly." In the case of the RAM, it was the rear seating was too small, but they gave you two regular length bed sizes, something Ford didn't do. On the Titan it's the bed is too small. The RAM has established a niche in an already crowded and competitive LDPU market. Yes, Dodge's unit sales are behind that of the F150 and Silverado/Sierra, but still almost five times better than Tundra. Without expansion, the RAM facility couldn't make numbers as large as GM and Ford anyway. Even with huge rebates, Dodge at least has made profit on the RAM where GM and Ford are barely doing so.

    All of the negative comments heard so far about the Titan, just like the RAM, are predictably from people who already don't like Nissan and wouldn't be buying one if in a landslide of proof it could be proven to be the best product on the planet. That being said, statements about the Titan's prowess as a truck, real or otherwise, is just as likely to be driven by blind allegiance and tribalism as well.

    The truth is that the Titan will likely appeal to some and not others whether based on rational evaluations or plain bias. The Titan will establish it's own market share based on the degree of customer acceptance, whatever that turns out to be.

    Regards,
    Dusty
  • oldharryoldharry Member Posts: 413
    Truck market share may be irrellevent to some extent. The shift from passenger cars to class II vehicles has slowed, but is continuing. Nissan may carve out their niche, while sales of the domestics increases at the expense of sedans (mostly domestic).

    I do not think the F-Series and the Silverado/Sierra sales will decline as a percentage of total vehicle sales in 2004. If the Titan is VERY succesful, it will motivate the domestics to improve their products, and we (customers) will all win.

    Harry
  • kg11kg11 Member Posts: 530
    If the Titan is VERY succesful, it will motivate the domestics...and we will all win.

    Some say the Tundra is very succesful for Toyota, and Toyota may be satisfied, but they haven't motivated the domestics much.

    Hopefully, this new genuine full sized entry from Nissan will change that and as you said, "we all win"

    kip
  • bowke28bowke28 Member Posts: 2,185
    nissan salespeople will win! ;-)
  • kg11kg11 Member Posts: 530
    We ALL win
  • saddaddysaddaddy Member Posts: 566
  • admastersadmasters Member Posts: 17
    I currently own a Nissan PU (the older hardbody style), and though I have been comtemplating a full size truck for somewhile, I intentionally waited for the Titan to come out before deciding. And now the decision is even harder. I do like the Titan, as far as stying (interior and exterior), but I really still like the Z71 as far as interior room and some small features (dual climate control, turn signals in mirrors, etc..). But the one that I cannot let go is the interior space issue. I was hoping the Titan King Cab would have as much rear leg room as the Chevy or GMC extended cabs, but that is not the case. The GM's have about 6 inches more leg room in the back seat to keep your knees out of the back of the front seat or force the driver or front seat passenger to be uncomfortably close to the dashboard. The dimensions are compared on Edmunds, and sitting in them you can really feel it too.

    So, the head scratching will have to continue for awhile until I decide, or the price is cut so low for the Titan that I just can't pass it up.
  • keaneckeanec Member Posts: 349
    If that is the case then Either GM is listing their rear legroom at less than what it is, or Nissan is listed as too much.

    The actual Specs form GM Canada website:

    Rear leg room 856/33.7 (mm/in.)(extended cab)

    Nissan Specs

    Rear Leg room 33.0 in. (king Cab)

    The CC specs are, GM 39.1 in.
                      Nissan 40.4 in.

    I wonder which one is posted wrong?
  • keaneckeanec Member Posts: 349
    I compared the Titan KC and GMC Extended Cab on Edmunds and they have them listed as above; esentially the same size. Are you sure you weren't comparing the CC GM and the KC Titan. There is approx. 6 in difference there.
  • bowke28bowke28 Member Posts: 2,185
    what i think happened.
  • motownusamotownusa Member Posts: 836
    Isn't Toyota coming out with a new engine for the 05 Tundra. I read somewhere that it displaces somewhere between 5.4 and 5.6 Liters and will produce 300+ Hp.
  • bowke28bowke28 Member Posts: 2,185
    thats the rumor, but every time toyota boasts about something upcoming, especially in the HP dept, they always disappoint.
This discussion has been closed.