Edmunds dealer partner, Bayway Leasing, is now offering transparent lease deals via these forums. Click here to see the latest vehicles!
Most popular vehicles
Popular New Cars
- New Acura MDX
- New Acura RDX
- New Audi Q5
- New BMW 3 Series
- New BMW X3
- New Buick Enclave
- New Cadillac Escalade
- New Chevrolet Equinox
- New Chrysler 300
- New Dodge Challenger
- New Ford Edge
- New Ford Escape
- New Ford Expedition
- New Ford Explorer
- New Ford F-150
- New Ford Focus
- New Ford Mustang
- New Honda Accord
- New Honda Civic
- New Honda CR-V
- New Honda Fit
- New Honda Odyssey
- New Honda Pilot
- New Hyundai Elantra
- New Hyundai Santa Fe
- New Hyundai Sonata
- New Hyundai Tucson
- New Jeep Compass
- New Jeep Grand Cherokee
- New Jeep Wrangler
- New Mazda 3
- New Mazda 6
- New Mazda CX-5
- New Nissan Altima
- New Nissan Maxima
- New Nissan Rogue
- New Porsche Cayenne
- New Ram 1500
- New Subaru Crosstrek
- New Subaru Forester
- New Subaru Impreza
- New Subaru Outback
- New Tesla Model S
- New Tesla Model X
- New Toyota 4Runner
- New Toyota Camry
- New Toyota Corolla
- New Toyota Highlander
- New Toyota Prius
- New Toyota RAV4
- New Toyota Sienna
- New Toyota Tacoma
- New Volkswagen Jetta
- New Volvo XC60
- New Volvo XC90
Popular Used Sedans
- Used BMW 5 Series
- Used Chevrolet Impala
- Used Chevrolet Malibu
- Used Chrysler 200
- Used Dodge Charger
- Used Ford Fusion
- Used Ford Taurus
- Used Honda Accord
- Used Honda Civic
- Used Hyundai Elantra
- Used Hyundai Sonata
- Used Tesla Model S
- Used Toyota Camry
- Used Toyota Corolla
- Used Volkswagen Jetta
Popular Used SUVs
- Used Acura MDX
- Used Acura RDX
- Used Ford Edge
- Used Ford Explorer
- Used Honda CR-V
- Used Honda Pilot
- Used Hyundai Santa Fe
- Used Jeep Compass
- Used Lincoln Navigator
- Used Mazda CX-5
- Used Nissan Rogue
- Used Subaru Crosstrek
- Used Subaru Forester
- Used Tesla Model X
- Used Volvo XC90
Popular Used Pickup Trucks
Popular Used Hatchbacks
Popular Used Minivans
Popular Used Coupes
Popular Used Wagons
Comments
Anyone know if the difference betwen Atkinson and Otto cycle can be software controlled, or does the engine have to be designed for a specific cycle?
2. There is no Bluetooth option which is strange considering it is standard on the Prius.
3. The holders for the third row seat belts are not well engineered.
4. The interface with the Nav System and the radio and climate system is "fancy", but not user friendly
5. The ride is particularly "boomy" when going over bumps. I am hoping this is just the tires and will be fixed with a different type sometime
Having said this, I love this vehicle. We are averaging about 28 mpg. We now have a bit over 20K miles.
For those who may not understand, this means it is a hardware change, not software.
We do this quite a bit on some country roads when we do not use cruise control. Instead of keeping to speed limit when hitting very gentle rolling patches, we do not change pressure on the accelerator and just let the speed drop on the uphill and then pick up again on the downhill. On some quiet roads, a drop in speed of 10-mph is no big deal. We drop from 45 to 35 and back up to 45 again. A nice way to save a gallon or two.
This can probably scare many drivers though.
The other thing that's making me hold off is a few cool tech features I imagine they'll get into the 2008: backup camera, bluetooth, aux jack for the stereo, factory supported XM radio, tire pressure monitor.
The RAV-4 has almost all of those features, but it just doesn't do it for me.
the Pilot) Hybrid that gives EPA mpg >= 40/33 and
does 0-60 under 10 seconds.
This is a family hauler and not a racing car. Slightly
car like design like the CX-7/CX-9 is OK but I donot want
a minivan or station wagon.
Plug-in option and flex fuel would be great but I donot
expect it. Premium over similarly equipped non-hybrid
should be less than $4000.
Technology goodies as mentioned before will add to the
appeal.
Virtually no energy wasted on driving the SC in normal cruise. Until/unless you put your foot into it and even then NEVER reach overboost and thereby waste SC energy.
Hopefully I won't need to go any further than this public "reminder".
Just because someone disagrees with you, that does NOT give you just cause to start commenting on them personally. Believe it or not, sometimes you're goingto see posts that you 100% disagree with. You can disagree with things all you want, make counter arguements, etc. Where it crosses the line is when you start to comment about each other. If you find that you can't disagree without shooting at the other guy, then I suggest you IGNORE their posts and move on.
Back to discussing the Highlander please.
As for the 2008 HH, I have a sneaky suspision that the new version, either 08 or 09 will be bigger than the current version. The RAV is already bigger and the Honda competing model is bigger than the current HH so Toyota has no choice but to keep up. We are hoping for more room, plug-in and so forth as well.
I also have a gut feel they will not offer just a gas-saver version. They will either offer something "more" than the RAV or two engine versions. Unlike the CAMRY, the HH is inherently bigger and heavier and thus needs a larger engine to do the pulling. With the current unfortunate trend of bigger and beefier engine, I doubt Toyota can afford to ship a lower power I4 for a 2-ton vehicle.
Someone posted earllier that Toyota is embarrased by Ford Escape HEV getting better MPG than the HH, I really doubt it. The HH is in a whole different class while the Escape competes against the likes of the RAV. Even then, the Escape sadly pales in almost all things except the MPG.
We just have to keep checking and wait and see......
http://www.toyotanation.com/forum/showthread.php?t=154046&page=2
2008 Highlander (comming q2 of 2007)
-saw the full size clay model, no engine or interior.
-Will have a V6 with 285 HP
-Sleek lines, looks to have a wider stance.
-Has a hide away middle row seat between the 2nd row capatains chairs.
I then wondered if there was anyway to "jump start" the 12V battery, using the hybrid battery. I realize the hybrid battery is at 288 V. The voltage may increase as high as 650V DC. A transformer would be needed to step down the voltage to 12V.
I ask as I live in a colder climate - Minnesota. Rarely, 12V batteries "die" when the outside temperature is -20 F or lower. With a HH, I have the hybrid battery. This hybrid battery is also inside the car. It may be slightly warmer, if the HH is parked out in sun on these -20 F days (even 0 F is warmer).
Is there any way to temporarily get DC power from the 288V hybrid battery to the 12V battery? Looking at a HH that will not start at -20 F below would be an unpleasant sight, at least for us fools who live in such climates. This especially would be distressing as there is plenty of electric power stored in the hybrid battery.
Getting AC current from the hybrid battery would also be nice. If the above would work, ex. getting 12 V DC from the hybrid battery, this could be converted into AC.
End
1) I would like to see an "efficiency button". This would be a momentary contact button most likely on the steering wheel, that when pressed would activate an "efficiency mode" of operation. What this would do would be to sacrifice acceleration for maximum driving efficiency. In E.M. when you press the pedal down it will attempt to keep running on the battery unless you either a)press the pedal hard (more than usual for acceleration) or b) take you finger of the button. The idea of this is to make it easier for drivers to drive with maximum efficiency rather than riding that gas lightly to avoid the I.C.E. from activating.
2) Removable third seat: OK let's face it - unless you are a small kid the third seat is not very comfortable. Not just because it's cramped (for even 2 people) but the air circulation there isn't so great either and there's no window you can open. While it is nice to have if you have extra kids to drive somewhere or for an extra seat in a pinch, I would prefer to have it like an extra hidden trunk space, or to be able to open it somehow, so I can use it for storage.
3) Ability to shut of driving lights. Sometimes I feel I just don't need them during the day and would like to be able to shut them off to save energy.
4) Computer Message Suppression: OK - I understand a super critical message forcing the display like "your oil pressure is critically low" or "You must service the battery now", but even a message like "windshield washer fluid low" dominates the display until you fill the reservoir. Personally I am much more interested in knowing if the gas motor is running than whether my washer fluid is full. I think maybe this is a Japanese cultural thing - that they expect you will immediately fill the reservoir, or repair whatever instantly - but I would prefer in all cases to have a choice as to whether the display is dominated with an error message.
5) Some vehicles have this little square adapter coming out below the rear bumper that allows for easy towing or attachment of a bicycle rack etc. Actually I haven't checked whether I can get that for the HH yet, but I would like it for a bike rack better than hoisting the bikes onto the roof.
6) A CD player that can play MP3 files and WMA files so I can have a CD with a zillion of my favorite songs - also would like to be able to easily plug in my MP3 player (I know they have this in the Camry)
7) I really like the compass in the mirror thing - but my HH standard doesn't come with it. I believe the wiring isn't there to power it but I sure would like to have it.
8) The ability to run only on battery until the power runs out and then to recharge it by plugging it into an outlet at my house. (I realize this is a b-i-g issue but it sure would be nice...)
Those are my ideas for now.. What do ya think?
SJBob
Please recall that my goal is to get a car started during a cold Minnesota winter day or night (ex. at minus 20F or lower) with when the auxiliary 12V battery is weak or dead.
If and only if 12V of relatively little DC power is need to run the HH computer(s) - to activate the high voltage system to get 12V from the large capacity 288 V HH batteries - then the 12V DC power from one of those small "jump starter battery kits" might have enough power, again to only run the onboard computer; one brand is the Michigan Industrial Jumpstarter; there are many other brands; these contain small 12V lead gel type batteries in the 5 AH to 8 AH range; I have replace the lead acid gel battery in mine.
While these "jumpstarter batter kits" do not have enough power to turn a starter motor, these starter kits should have enough power to run the onboard computers.
In other words, there may a solution to what I am trying to do.
Yes, I bought two of the five Toyota Highlander Hybrid manuals, the first manual on the engine and the electrical wiring diagram manual. In the electrical wiring diagram manual, it is clearly stated that this is a 12 V converter beneath the DC/AC inverter. Then this manual states on how to jump start a HH, using the same method that you use for other cars (find someone else willing to jump start your car from their car). This is really "interesting engineering" or an oversight. There is no mention of the 12V need to activate the onboard computer(s) to activate the 288 V DC high voltage system to activate the 12V converter.
Perhaps, the people who design the HH AND the people who write the HH electrical manual need to experience a car not starting at -20 F, especially with a HH that has plenty of hybrid battery power. :mad: Maybe a good north wind at 20 MPH at -20 F would convince them of making a few minor changes, perhaps just a few more sentences in the owner's manual AND the electrical manual.
BTW, even the Minnesota Toyota dealer did not mention your ideal - when I specifically asked and discussed this scenario.
Or you are quite smart
Oh well . . .
It is a really good well thought out design aspect...!!
How would you feel if leaving the headlights on, etc, etc, resulted in discharging of the 12 volt battery to the point that the DC-DC downconverter started recharging it to the point that the hybrid battery also became discharged?
Goal: Allow HH to start if there is sufficient battery power in the 12V battery OR the 288V hybrid battery. Car should be startable if there is the battery power.
while considering your thought (well, we do not want to discharge the 288V hybrid battery if a foolish driver leaves some accessory on while the car is turned off).
Let's put a little thought into this while trying to keep this as simple as possible, and at least cost and maximum reliability.
Do you think there could be a manual override switch, allowing the converter to allow electricity to flow from 288V battery to the !12V side, thereby energizing the HH 12V system by the hybrid battery. BTW, this is what is done normally by the converter.
The switch would be controlled by yet another ECU (there are plenty of them already in the HH now). After five minutes (or some determined time), this "manual override" would automatically disengage (it is a ECU). This ECU would get its power from the 288V side (yes, this would have to be a special ECU to handle 288V).
Or maybe this is how the ignition would work normally - that is when you turn the key to "start" the hybrid, it gets electricity from the 288V; this 288V ECU is what actually starts the car.
1. Turn key off; only the 12V auxilary battery works.
2. Turn the key to accessory; only the 12V battery works.
3. Turn the key to ignition, the 288V battery starts the car.
There are many more design considerations to be consider. This is just an outline.
But nooooooooooooooooo . . . instead you YotaToy engineers decide we consumers need to enjoy jump starting our YotaToy HH just like everyone else . . . and carry around battery jumper cables . . . just like everyone-else (this is documented in the electrical manual) . . .
or we should freeze to death . . . just like people in regular cars . . . as we cannot start our HH because the itty, bitty 12V battery is too weak and cold . . . meanwhile the 288V mighty hybrid battery is safely warm beneath the passenger seat and will survive . . . unlike us.
End
For others' consideration, would a freeze frame from the OBD II indicate which computer failed? Yes, a computer would have to be connected to the OBD II. Would something like a ScanGauge II, which can capture this data, work?
Note: I would buy this car and drive - after I identified which onboard computer(s) failed and replaced the malfunctioning computer.
End
The codes will identify various devices and systems that generate error codes. From there, diagnosis will be necessary to identify the true cause. The Feds has a set of pre-defined codes that everyone uses. Each manufacturer then also has a custom set. You can probably find that list somewhere on-line and see if they say anything about "computer" failures.
As for drive-by-wire, I believe the mechanical "back-Up" will work up to a point. Steering and brakes are likely still operable though they may demand more physical strength to execute. There is no power so the only option is to coast to a stop safely and hopefully, traffic allows this to happen.
Upon further investigation before departing with the $$, I find that this expensive vehicle and techno advanced vehicle was still in the dark ages. Blue Tooth technology is not available in the 2007 Highlander. However, it is offered in many of Toyota's lesser vehicles. What in the world are they thinking????? If you visit Toyota's website, they offer an extensive education on their navigation system as found in the Prius but only offer a piece of junk nav system in the Highlander as a $2,000 option. HELLO
I am still in shock and awe. I voiced my thoughts with the dealer, put my checkbook back in my pocket and left. Sorry Toyota but you lost my business.
Another example of how this could be done.
(no additional ECUs, no fancy switches, no way to discharge the 288V battery by accident): Put in a cable (yes, one of those orange cables) from the 288V system to a 12 V transformer. Put this 12 V transformer next to the 12 V battery. Put 12 V output on this transformer, perhaps special Toyota connectors that require a special $$ Toyota cable - something). Put short jumper cables with these special Toyota $$ cables in the rear well (where the jack is).
Charge extra for this. Call it an cold climate option pack. $$ Charge customers far more than this costs to install. Make additional $$.
Require the customer to know how to jump this. Put directions in the owner's manual. If the customer does not read this manual, he will not know how to use this.
Dangerous? No more dangerous than jump starting a HH from another car. But you have to disconnect the 12 V transformer after the HH is started. Hmmm, this is just like after jumpstarting in the regular way. And with this new method, Toyota could stop the electricity to the 288V to 12V transformer, as the 288V to 12V converter is now running. All onboard computers are running. Car running, shut off the electricity to the 288V transformer. The electricity can only be shut off once the onboard computers are running. This means the car is started. Dangerous to have 12V live when the car is off. This is what is always present with the 12V battery. What if the 288V to 12 V transform shorts. Use something called a fuse to blow, just like in the 12 V battery.
What to do with the current situation. (besides rant on bulletin boards).
Put on good, insulated rubber gloves
Connect one of those small "jumper starter" kits (gel lead acid battery) to the 12 V positive battery pole and ground. The onboard computer may be able to receive enough necessary 12V DC power to start the HH. The 288 V to 12 V converter now works. Disconnect the "jumper starter kit".
Note: The discharged 12V battery may draw too much power from this "jumper start kit" . Then the procedure could get really interesting. The positive pole of the 12 V battery may have to be removed and re-attached. As this can be quite dangerous for anyone who is not careful, I not writing this procedure here.
Why might this work in a HH, but not regular car? The 288 V battery is available to turn the generator/starter. This does not exist in a regular car.
Despite this unusual procedure, if you have certain religious beliefs (I do), do not curse the YotaToy engineers (after all, you bought this car with this design feature). Some religions (mine) consider this cursing a sin (or even the thought of this cursing).
Garage . . yes I have a garage for my HH. There are times when I actually park this HH outside during winter for many hours, like when I go to work - to make $$ to pay for this HH. There are days when the HH is outside at -10F or -20 F below for many hours. As I live here in Minnesota, I actually drive the HH on weekends for winter recreational activities. Again, the HH is parked outside for hours or days.
This is just like the HH oil filter location. Workaround . . remove the splash guard . . as this is the only way to get the HH oil filter . . this summer when it is warmer here in Minnesota . . remove the splash guard (again; it must be removed each oil change) cut a door (cut plastic, put hinges on it) on this splash guard. Bolt splash guard back on with the door. I can then now get the oil filter without unbolting the splash guard each time . . BTW, this feature is already built in in many other SUVs . . Look if you wish.
Again, do not curse the YotaToy engineers (yep, a sin)
End.
My feature that I would like to see: Have the engine's computer interpret these engine error codes and write a human understandable interpretation on one of the two displays of the Highlander. It does this for other simple problems. Why not the engine errors? And make the reset time faster.
http://sev.prnewswire.com/auto/20070119/LAF02719012007-1.html
Even if the car lets us drive on battery power only, it depends on how much energy it has and how far and how fast it needs to go. The battery can deplete itself well before the car can reach a gas station.
It is safest to just pump some gas.
Now I'm not so certain. The powertrains are still good as gold well in excess of 100000 mi in just about every vehicle now. It's all the rest of the new electronic stuff that might go wrong that's a ticking bomb for all the vehicle makers. It used to be power window motors ( rarely a problem now ) or HVAC ( almost never a problem ) or.....
But now it's the electronic controls of all of these mechanical items that might need replacement/repair. Your laptop or desktop cost what? $300? $800? $1400? There are about 10-20 of these in every vehicle these days.
I just had a vehicle with an electronically controlled transmission that was balky and throwing an error code. The solution: replace two controllers ~ $4800 + labor. These were not part of the transmission they were controllers for it and only covered under the 3/36 Basic Warranty.... and I work at a Toyota store and sold it to myself!!! I traded it in on another vehicle.
Moral: Get the Extended Service Contract which will cover everything for 100,000 mi and rest easy.
Has anyone hooked up a trailer hitch? Any suggestion on best price? (I want mine for a bike rack as well, therefore the cheaper/lighter the better)
Thanks
Our SIenna had a check-engine light ON a while back too and error code matched that of gas cap problem. So I bought a $15 gas cap to replace the old gas cap and reset the light. The light never came on again. That saved us a day at the dealership and a minimum charge of $85.
Related to this, what if its 98 degrees out and you are only driving around town. Does the electric power the AC well enough?
If we use hot air for the cabin, the engine will run more often to heat the air for the cabin. Mileage will suffer a bit but it beats getting frost-bites. We have heated seats so we turn those on.
When it is hot, the initial 30-sec burn is still the same. A/C gets the cabin cool relatively fast. We have driven in 110-F weather (southern CA desert) and the car was comfortably at 70-F.
You should be comfortable in this car.
Using a 12 V battery, like in one of those "auto jump starter" devices sold at auto stores and other stores, I unintentionally proved that a HH can quickly be started with just a small amount of 12 V DC electricity at - 10F (Minnesota, 2/5/2007).
My "jump starter" device has a small 8 Amp hour lead acid gel battery.
I can easily pick and hold this small battery in one hand. It weighs less than 10 pounds.
1. Attach small battery to the battery under the hood.
2. Put in key, this is now 12 V to the HH hybrid ECU (computer).
3. Start and go (no waiting); no jump starting with another car and no jump starter cables.
Plugging this "jump starter" into the cigarette adapter in the HH may work.
1. This small battery supplies 12 V DC to the Hybrid ECU.
2. Turn key; hybrid ECU turns on the converter (288 V DC to 650 V AC inverter AND the 288 V DC to 12 V DC converter)
3. Start HH and go, using the 288 V HH battery.
So I found a way to what I listed at
#3394 of 3401 Jump starting a HH, just wonderful by sebemismnusa Jan 11, 2007 (3:12 pm)
Keywords: jumpstart dead battery
End
The first technique involves dramatically reducing the level of regenerative braking as the OAT declines toward freezing and below. The second technique involves disabling regenerative braking entirely the instant ABS activates.
In freezing climates the potential for encountering a slippery roadbed increases and the first technique will help to alleviate the number of accidents from loss of control due to inadvertently braking (like engine braking for non-hybrids) of the front wheels in those climates.
Obviously with ABS activation there is the potential for regenerative braking (or engine braking for non-hybrids) to interfere and not allow the wheels to rotate even with no braking.
Soon coming, undoubtedly, to a hybrid Toyota near you.
http://www.leftlanenews.com/2007/02/07/2008-toyota-highlander/
Wes
I can't speak to Ford, but the problem with the Prius (with a similar hybrid system) was that the CPU was not allowing the wheels to spin. I don't know if it was the central computer or the traction control that was to blame, but they were trying to keep the electric motors from over heating.
At 500 extra lbs, unless they up the electric HP, that thing is going to get worse (real world) MPG than the current model.