Toyota Highlander Hybrid

fizban · April 2005

Yep, recouping your money on these hybrids is probably a long stretch. I'm doing it purely for the satisfaction of NOT donating as much money at the gas factory. Other things like ride, safety, and personal preference (from ownership experience) has lead me to the Highlander.

markrsmith83 · April 2005

My problem is that I need to replace my 97 Jeep Grand Cherokee soon. I've got 90K miles on it, and it's starting to have expensive problems.

I have a choice - buy a non-hybrid that will meet my mission requirements (basically, a mid-size SUV with at least a little off-road capability) or buy the Highlander Hybrid. I've test-driven the Ford Escape Hybrid - it's too small and underpowered for me (even though my uncle, cousin and cousin's wife ACTUALLY build them in KC).

If I were looking at only non-hybrids, I'm not sure that the Highlander would be at the top of my list. I'd probably be looking at the Jeep GC, Nissan Pathfinder or something similar. The "utility" side of the Highlander isn't very strong.

On the other hand, if I can't buy the HH right now (due to availability), I have to choose between keeping the Jeep going a little longer or buying something non-hybrid that I'll keep for 7-10 years (that's how long cars/trucks last with me).

It's a tough decision. If gas hits $3.00 or $3.50 this summer, I might even ditch the SUV completely and look at the Escape Hybrid again or even the Prius.

backy · April 2005

Re Prius--I ditched our Grand Caravan last spring for a Prius-sized 5-door (actually ordered a Prius, but that is an off-topic story). I figured for the few times each year I really need more than a 5-door hatchback I could use my 2 compact cars or rent a van. So a question to ask yourself is, how much do you really need the capabilities of an SUV, and if it's a few times a year, could you rent/borrow one? You could buy many rentals for the $10k more that a HH would cost you vs. a Prius--plus there's the gas savings to consider.

OTOH, if you routinely go offroad and need a 6-7 passenger vehicle, a 7-passenger SUV like the Highlander is a great way to go.

tomslyck · April 2005

Maybe someone should change the title of this message board to "2006" Hybrid Toyota Highlander since that's what Toyota's calling the first bunch that come out in June.

tomslyck · April 2005

I couldn't get my wife to go along with the Prius. She's more into style than substance. But she got the car she wants so now it's my turn....as long as it doesn't look too geeky. Oh yeah, the $2.64/gallon that she now spends on gas helped change her mind.

otis1 · April 2005

I'm on my local dealer's list to buy a HH. The dealer called me and asked me to come in and fill out an order sheet. I knew going in this that I would be paying MSRP. But here's the twist. The sales man I bought my other 2 cars from and the one who originally put my name on the waitning list is now gone. So now I've got through random luck of the draw another salesman. (nothing has changed regarding my status on the waiting list). I liked my previous salesguy and I'm sure this guy is fine. But I was thinking that these "pre-orders" are money in the bag for these sales men. You know you have a customer with a firm commitment to buy, the customer is going to pay MSRP, so BIG commision check- so basically like shooting fish in a barrel. If my old salesman was around, I would gladly give him the commision because he's helped me out a lot.

Here's what I'm wondering... I figure every salesman there would want to take my order for the reasons I've stated above. Can I go to each sales men and say something along the lines of "how much of your commision are you willing to give up to take my order?"

Is there some kind of "code" among salesmen that would prevent them from doing this? just wondering....

backy · April 2005

Can you imagine what would happen in a dealership if the sales manager allowed his/her reps to routinely compete with each other for each customer's business? Say a rep works to agree to a deal with you. Goes over the car with you, goes for a test drive, agrees on price, woks on financing,etc. Then when he goes away for a minute, another rep comes over and says, "Hey, buddy, whatever deal Joe gave you--I'll take $100 off it if you give me the deal!"

otis1 · April 2005

I see what you're saying, but my situation is slightly different. The salesguy who I originally worked with is gone. It would be one thing if he was still there and did all the work and didn't get the commision. but he's gone and CAN"T get the commision. So this is equivalent to me stepping into a dealer and saying "who wants to sell me a car?" I've seen the way certain salesguys will try to hover around the door to get that potential customer. maybe one guy gets it because he can "walk faster" than the next guy. what I'm wondering is if seeing who will cut me the best deal can be a different criteria to selecting a sales man compared to who's got the fastest legs.

backy · April 2005

There is a big difference. Selecting the sales rep who has the "fastest legs" is one thing. If you want to work with the rep who gets to you first, shows the most initiative etc., that's great. But then you'll be working with that rep on the deal. Period. (If there's a problem, you can ask the sales manager for another rep.)

Seeing who will cut you the best deal is an entirely different thing. That means you need to approach multiple reps in the same dealership and work with all of them, in effect getting a "bid" from each rep and then selecting whomever gives you the lowest price. If you don't see how that would make a real mess out of the business relationships within the dealership, then I can't help you. Just think about this: if you were in sales, is that the kind of working environment you'd like to be in every day? Where any rep from your same company, your same office, can undercut your relationship with a customer just by offering a lower price?

If you want to play the "lowest price" game, try it with multiple dealerships--not with the reps in the same dealership.

otis1 · April 2005

"If you want to work with the rep who gets to you first, shows the most initiative etc., that's great."

What better way to show the most initiative by offering the best deal?

"If you want to play the "lowest price" game, try it with multiple dealerships--not with the reps in the same dealership."

The priniciple is the same-- is it "meaner" because I'm "screwing over" a person rather than a "greedy nasty company?" And let me clarify that I don't feel I'm being mean or screwing anyone over by price shopping.

"if you were in sales, is that the kind of working environment you'd like to be in every day?"

I'm not in sales, but if I were (and were good at it), I'd want to be in an enviroment that would benefit me. If I had creative ways of bringing in more customers and making more sales, I would use it. This brings me back to my FIRST question, is there a code or unwritten rule among salesmen that prevents this?

backy · April 2005

No. There are WRITTEN rules that prevent it. A sales manager would never allow this kind of behavior--reps bringing in multiple offers for the same customer.

Kirstie_H · April 2005

This conversation about salespeople, negotiation and pricing belongs on the Smart Shopper board. Please focus exclusively on the hybrid Highlander in this topic.

Kirstie_H · April 2005

Some of you might be interested in editor Karl Brauer's opinion of the hybrid Highlander after his test drive:
editor_karl, "Karl's Daily Log Book" #126, 6 Apr 2005 7:12 pm

gparker · April 2005

I ordered several weeks ago the HH, with everything but NAV. Stopped at the Dealership today, and simply passing on the info that the owner told me. He attended yesterday, April 6, a regional Toyota meeting regarding the HH orders.
He informed me that HH production of the Limited was to be 70% with NAV, and 30% without. So, for those wanting to order, your odds are much better to order one with NAV. Next, limited to 5 colors. Next, FWD and AWD were not one before the other, they would be simultaneous. Next, allow 35 to 50 days "on the water" from Japan. The dealers at this meeting were also instructed to PLACE their existing orders TODAY, April 7, in the Toyota computer system. This dealer had held orders, not placed them, until today. Fortunately I was their, and moved from number 2 to #1 on their list. Also, the soon to arrive "demos" might be based on what was ordered today. No intention for a demo at this dealer...it comes in, it is sold! Also, allotments were not only based on Prius sales. They would be alloted by thier previous volume of Highlander sales. Hope this info helps some of you.

cdptrap · April 2005

Dear Arand,
In case you have not found additional information. I did a lot of research and contacted Toyota directly and got a cryptic one-line almost useless response. The following is what I found badgering local dealers. I was focusing on the explicit statement in TOYOTA specification that says the 2WD and 4WDi "...are not designed for off-road" which is contrary to the regular Highlander specification.

4WDi is part time only, not full time. It comes on only when the VDIM system decides there is a need or when the drive system needs more power. This is different than normal 4WD which is either full time or selectable/lockable (on-demand 4WD).

So Highlander is really a 2-WD car that changes to 4WD on its own when it needs to ensure safety and provides power. This is why Toyota explicitly says to not use it for off-road driving.

Off road, full time 4WD provides torque and traction allowing better control of vehicle. With 4WDi, there is no full time 4WD, no constant 4WD torque and no constant traction so it is best to not use the hybrid for off road. The dealer and a reviewer say flat dirt track and snowy roads are fine but do not attempt steep gravely tracks.

We still will get this car because we need to replace an aging van and we want a hybrid with gas prices hitting $2.85 in CA. We will then wait for a hybrid 4Runner.

Hope this helps.

cdptrap · April 2005

Has anyone looked into electromagnetic field strength in hybrid vehicles? There have been 2 well known (confirmed?) studies about brain cell damage when exposed to high EMF.

It will be sad to reduce emission, reduce dependence on gas but expose one to harmful effects of EMF especially those of us who will drive our young children in these hybrids.

Thanks.

Kirstie_H · April 2005

This would be a good conversation for our Advanced Course in Hybrid Engineering topic. That's a good place to find members who have interest and expertise in this area.

kirstie_h
Roving Host
Host, Future Vehicles & Smart Shopper discussions

dmbflorida · April 2005

I contacted most of the Florida central and southern area dealership Internet Depts regarding buying a Hybrid Highlander (HH). I am now on a Wait List, with $500 deposit, for a Hybrid Highlander.
I found a great range in costs:
Fees called "dealer prep, dealer administration, dealer docs" ranged from $399 to $699.50.
Premiums over MSRP ranged from none to $5,000. Most of the premiums were in the 0 to $1,500 range..
In the SE District of Toyota, the majority of these cars come with ToyoGuard, a $699 cost and something I hope to avoid.
Deposits which are refundable ranged from $500 to $1,000 with maybe one higher than that but I already deleted that contact..
Some dealers would not take a Wait List deposit... one said it would be "first come, first served". One said he already had a two year Wait List and would not take any more deposits.
Almost all the others took a Wait List reservation with a refundable deposit.
I chose a dealership with a higher dealer prep fee because it had a short WaitList.
The fee was $659 with no premium. My deposit was $500 refundable.
I also choked on the high prices but after I went through the list of included/standard features in the base model and the Limited Edition, the price differential from a non-hybrid Highlander did not seem too high to consider. Someone who drives a lot in the city might not be paying too high a surcharge for the hybrid version (as compared to the non-hybrid).
The big cost problem for buyers, apparently, is that they are forced to buy many features they don't want in an already specified base model or a 'loaded" Limited Edition model.

rfruth · April 2005

HH = PriuSUV ? - snip - When Toyota put the Prius hybrid on sale in August 2000, the
big question wasn't would it work, but rather, would people buy it.

http://www.siliconvalley.com/mld/mercurynews/classifieds/automotive/11284548.htm

nsxwes · April 2005

There has been a great deal of speculation regarding the body style of the 2006 versus the 2007 Highlander Hybrid. We all know now that the 2006 HH will look essentially the same as the existing Highlanders. It is reasonable to speculate that the body style will change for the following model year. I have read some accounts that it will be made larger to accomodate a bit more room for the third row seat - perhaps similar in size to the Honda Pilot. Others have suggested a tilt toward the look of the Lexus RX (not too much of a tilt I hope). Of course all of this is arm chair speculation, but it is also a reasonable speculation. This brings me to a question. Is it reasonable to spend $40K+ for a 2006 HH and then in 12 months have a brand new body style?

gagrice · April 2005

Is it reasonable to spend $40K+ for a 2006 HH and then in 12 months have a brand new body style?

The Highlander is a nice looking vehicle. The new one could be ugly. There are more ugly SUVs than good looking ones. Take a gamble.

dmbflorida · April 2005

In addition to the changes in appearance of the front and rear of the Hybrid Highlander, I attempted to compare the specs on the Hybrid Highlander and Non-Hybrid Highlander models but it was slightly difficult because of the varying models (base and Limited versions).
If you are interested in any of the specs listed below, you might want to check the specs yourself in case I made an error.

Minor differences (fractions of inch) in
Height, track, head room, shoulder room, hip room, leg room, curb weight, GVWR,
?Payload,
Passenger Volume (Hybrid is 131.8, Non-hybrid is 133.9 depending on model)

More significant differences
Fuel capacity (Hybrid is 17.2, Non-Hybrid is 19.1),
Tires (Hybrid is P225/65R17, Non-Hybrid is 16 inch),
Dash (Hybrid does not have multi-function display unless the Navigation package is added)

Additional standard features of Hybrid (depending on model)
4-Wheel Drive with intelligence (4WD-I)
LED for tail and stop lamps
Towing Prep Package
Privacy glass in rear

Additional standard features of Hybrid Limited Edition :
Leather seats
Power Passenger Seat
SRS fuel pump cut-off
Collision sensors to deactivate High Voltage Battery

Some differences between Hybrid and Non-hybrid depending on model :
Fog lamps
Heated mirrors and windshield wiper de-icer grid
Color-keyed rear spoiler
Power tilt/slide moonroof
?Mudguards
Different JBL cassette/cd/radio systems
Steering wheel and controls
Sun visor illumination
Auto-dimming rearview mirror with compass (NOT on navigation option)
Engine immobilizer
HomeLink

Additional option to Hybrid Limited is DVD Navigation system

toycash · April 2005

The fuel pump and hybrid battery shut-off are standard on both, not just the Limited.

Also, the part -time nature of 4WDi is not that different from many other vehicles that also only send power to the second set of wheels based on the slippage of the primary set.

larsb · April 2005

COOL !!!

"Here's the scary part: The gas-electric Highlander is rated at 33 miles per gallon in city driving and 28 mpg on the highway (when the gas engine does the hard work), but my combined average for the week came in at 34 mpg."

http://www.sacbee.com/content/business/wheels/story/12729170p-13581066c.html

wwest · April 2005

Battery was FULL at the beginning of the week but EMPTY at the end of the week.

dewey · April 2005

"This brings me to a question. Is it reasonable to spend $40K+ for a 2006 HH and then in 12 months have a brand new body style?"

Good point! If you assume 12 months.

BUT I read in the May Automobile Magazine that a brand new Highlander will be out in 24-36 months. Waiting lists are so long that many who are waiting today will end up with a new model, 36 months hence!

Patience is a virtue. Unfortunately I am not that virtuous! :surprise:

larsb · April 2005

I drive an HCH and I can lower my battery to one bar in one driving session if I choose to.....the driver obviously was not letting "regen" do it's work......or, it could have been a problem with the "pre-production" version of the car....maybe the engineers are doing the last second tweaks....

tomslyck · April 2005

Is it likely that someone will make an after-market means to charge the batteries at home (without being an electrical engineering PhD)?

sunbyrne · April 2005

I called my local dealer on Monday to ask about the HLH, and the guy said they couldn't take orders yet. He then called me back about three hours later and said that actually they could, they received the codes to place the orders that day.

So, I went in and plunked down my $500 (refundable) deposit on one, first order for this dealership (Ron Carter Toyota in Alvin, TX, which is a "President's Award" dealership). He said Toyota was being very tight-lipped on when these would actually be arriving and estimated August for the base 4WD model with option package. I didn't think to ask about dates for other models, though. No price haggling, just straight MSRP, take or leave it, which is what I expected.

So, we'll see how it goes in terms of timing. It's interesting because when we first went to this dealership a couple months ago to get on the list, there WAS no list. But now they've got a folder full of names. Word is getting out.

larsb · April 2005

Press release after press release lately has put the arrival in USA date in June. I think Toyota has too much riding on that date to miss it......

And with reporters already getting to drive them, I'd bet they are virtually ready. Two months ladies and gents.........:)

(eternal Optimist and Toyota fan Larry S.S.)

icerider · April 2005

I'm number 6 on the list at my local dealership in Colorado. They are only ordering Limited 4WD editions. Sounds fine with me as long as I get my white one with DVD navigation! I've never driven a hybrid, never even been in one, but I love the idea.

I personally can't wait until August when mine should show up. They're getting 2 a month.

And if I don't like it, I'm sure some eBay junkie will pay top-dollar to buy it from me!

[Forever dreaming of my new Highlander Hybrid...] :-)

otis1 · April 2005

Is it reasonable to spend $40K+ for a 2006 HH and then in 12 months have a brand new body style?

I think I understand what you're getting at. you spend this money on a car and then they improve it on you and you're left with a "deficient" car. I'm thinking of the Prius example where in 03 or 04 (i forget), toyota improved the car. But this is the price of being an "early adopter."

There's NO solid information out there on when the HH will be redesigned. there's no information that shows what it looks like, what new features, what kind of MPG, and what the PRICE is going to be (at least none that I know of). So basically there's no way of making an informed decision.

I think you have to answer the first part of your question first, "is it reasonable to spend $40k on a HH?" Cars go through redesigns and improvements constantly. if you're always waiting, you'll never buy a car.

nsxwes · April 2005

Just wanted to make sure that everyone knew that I was just asking the question and not making a statement. I have ordered a silver, 4WD, limited with Navigation. I have been on my local dealers wait list for 18 months and I was the first to place a order for the HH at that dealership. While I will be surprised if this body style lasts more than the 2007 model year, so be it. From the articles that I have been reading, the bottom line is that it is an incredible automobile. The Sacramento Bee had an article on the HH in the paper today. It was reported that they got 34 mpg on average. That's about 10 more than I both expect and truthfully, believe. If it turns out that 34 mpg is real, Toyota must have sprinkled some magic dust on it :-)

tomslyck · April 2005

From what I've heard, it costs a bundle to redesign a car. If they're selling all they can make without redesigning it, why would they change the design?

dmbflorida · April 2005

Here is the latest info from the Miami-area dealership where I have a deposit on the WaitList:
"We will be getting 1 limited edition on June 1st. We dont have a say in how our first vehicle comes equipped, but since you are second on the list, if the person in front of you doesnt want that one, you will have the option of taking it. After that, the real allocation begins. I expect these vehicles will arrive sometime in late-June and we will try to find a model to suit your request:
Our dealership will not know what our mid-June allocation will look like until late May, so until then, I wont be able to give you a better idea. "

* thanks to "toycash" for the message:
The fuel pump and hybrid battery shut-off are standard on both, not just the Limited.

I have been looking at all the features* of the base and Limited edition models and have not decided which model I would buy. The main things I like about the Limited edition are the leather seats and the additional safety features. Actually, I feel that the extra features on the Limited version are basically worth the price differential but it is hard to choose such an expensive model (Limited) because of the difficulty of paying such a price. This will be my daughter's SUV and she will pay for most of the cost.

notsofast · April 2005

We're in Northern California and are reasonably high on the waiting list for a 2WD Highlander Hybrid. We've been struggling to figure out what options package to choose -- with the following main principles in mind. First, we'd prefer to get the cost down below the fully equipped Limited, even if it means skipping some things. Second: there are three options we'd really like: leather seats; moonroof; better sound system. Everything else is marginal. (We'll take it if it's cheap; we aren't eager to pay up for it.)

Someone suggested buying the base model with its $1,700 (or so) options package and then having the dealer add leather seats for another $2,400. That gets us all of our options and saves $600 or so vs. the Limited price. We don't get heated seats and maybe we don't get wood-burl trim, but those seem skippable to us.

Anyone else finding other dealers willing to do this sort of mix-and-match? Any sense of generally how good the leather installation will be if it's done by the dealer rather than the factory?

shibashake · April 2005

If you don't mind my asking, which Miami-area dealer told you that? I am 1st on the wait list at Toyota of Homestead and they told me the first one they get in would be the one I ordered. I'm just curious if they are just telling customers what they want to hear to get the deposit.

pcrit · April 2005

Since the base model has side/head curtain airbags and the SRS fuel pump cut-off and
collision sensors to deactivate High Voltage Battery, what "additional safety features" does the Limited have over the base model? I'm #1 on a list for a base, AWD, Gold, model with option Pkg #1.

larsb · April 2005

Here is a recent review of the HH 4x2 and 4x4

http://www.evworld.com/view.cfm?section=article&storyid=839

dmbflorida · April 2005

It is HeadquarterToyota in Miami. My impression is that the first car was sent to the Dealership as specified by Toyota and not by any purchase order from a dealer for a Buyer. I bet this Limited model is fully loaded even with the$2,000 navigation so I am not sure I would want that. My impression is that when cars arrive, the Buyers on the Waitlist will accept or reject the car in accordance to the WaitList priority and their request. I do not know how many are on the Waitlist there now.
Note about the other message with a question re: comparing safety features :The Toyota.com online brochure on the 2006 Hybrid Highlander compares the features between the base and the Limited models.

pcrit · April 2005

As I suspected, there is no difference in the safety features between the base and limited models. The only difference is that the base does not have the anti-theft engine immobilizer (not really a safety feature, at least to me). This info is from the Toyota online brochure. Thanks for pointing me in the right direction.

dmbflorida · April 2005

My "Comparison" which I submitted previously was for the Non-Hybrid and Hybrid models of the Highlander. So, when I made the comment about some "additional safety measures" being different, it was from that perspective.
I just looked at the Hybrid Brochure which lists the base model compared to the Limited model and saw that the Limited had an "anti-theft" feature which the base model does not. Also, the "payload" is different between the 2WD and the 4WD if this feature is considered related to safety.
I was really happy to make this notation about similar safety features because safety is extremely important to me. I am, therefore, more in favor of getting the base model 2WD rather than the Limited.
Have you found any cost estimate on package # 1 for the base model?
Does anyone have an estimate on having the seats covered in leather after purchase? This is the big desire of my daughter who is the buyer/driver. Plus, she would like the moon-roof , enhanced stereo system and the fancier dash offered by the Limited model...So, that means that we might end up with a Limited model anyway to meet HER "needs". Personally, I really don't want to spend the extra money, though, to upgrade from the base model. This is an expensive vehicle.
Why are you buying the AWD? for safety? I have the VSC in my Prius 2004 and I feel safer with it although I have never had it in use. btw, I upgraded the 14 inch OEM tires to 15 inch Michelin Hydroedge tires... I live in a rainy area.

http://geocities.com/businessExim/toyota_highlander_hybrid_2006.htm
is a link to an article on the HH if anyone wants to read it.

tomslyck · April 2005

I just talked to the dealer in Manhattan Beach, CA. They're adding $2,000 for "Market Value" to the HH Limited AWD. In addition, they said that 100% of the Limiteds are coming with the navigation system, which was a fun novelty on our last car but wasn't something we were planning to get on this one.

larsb · April 2005

I doubt very seriously it is possible for the dealer to know that "100% of the Limiteds are coming with NAV."

Until that is shown to be true, or you can find that on the web in some of Toyota's press releases on the HH, I would not take that at full value.

The "market value" markup is also something that NOT ALL DEALERS will do. Were I shopping for this vehicle, I guarantee you I could locate a dealer that is not trying to hack me for an extra two grand.

cdptrap · April 2005

A Sacramento Bee reporter tested the 2WD model (pre-production) and received mixed mileage of 34 MPG after 1 week. To access this article, you need to register with Sac Bee.

http://www.sacbee.com/content/business/wheels/story/12729170p-13581066c.html

Another reporter took a 4WDi model to Death Valley and crawled through some dirt roads. After 1022 miles, he reported 34.5 MPG. The 4WDi will handle dirt trails OK just not serious boulder crawling. This is great news for those of us who need to cut through some dirt tracks to get to a trail head.

http://www.death-valley.us/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=1243

ssachnoff · April 2005

I have been bugging a salesman (now finance manager) at a Chicago-area Toyota dealer about the HH for almost 18 months. He says I am first on the "list" for a 2WD with the options package. He claims to have submitted my sales order sheet however I have yet to receive a faxed copy from him. He told me that the dealer policy was not to create a waiting list but "because he's a man of his word" he put me at the top since I''ve talked to him every couple of months since the HH's creation became a rumor/then reality. He says that he expects to get about a dozen of the vehicles with fewer Limiteds than base models. He also says he has one other person on the "list" who said they will take any model, any color, any price (why isn't this guy buying the Lexus hybrid?) He says they will not charge any premium or "market value" type markup but says I am stuck with a $94.00 extra teflon coating charge. If this is all he sticks me with, I'll consider myself lucky. He has no idea when they'll come in other than "sometime in June." I'll believe all this when he faxes me something, hits my credit card with the $500.00 deposit or calls to say come out and pick one out. Call me a cynic; call me a realist. Just call me an HH driver by sometime this summer. I hope my 1994 Voyager holds out a few more months.

harris5 · April 2005

Check out the web site for California Cars Initiative. They are working on a plug-in version of the Prius. It will likely be usable in some form for the other Toyota hybrids. They are non-profit. Check energyCS for their electric car. There is a chance they will be offering a kit in the future. The goal for both of them is to double or triple the mileage and extend the "electric only" range to cover most commutes.

pcrit · April 2005

I'm in the Atlanta area and the 2 dealers I've talked too are asking MSRP $34,430 for the AWD + $1770 for Pkg #1 + $565 destinaiton, total of $36,765 in my zip according to Edmunds. The Pkg #1 has all you want, except the leather seats (Package #1
Includes front fog lamps, rear spoiler, 4-spoke steering wheel with cruise and audio controls, JBL AM/FM stereo, cassette player, 6-disc in-dash CD player, 8 JBL speakers and tilt/slide power glass sunroof). I put 17" Michelins on my HL-Limited which I bought in Feb as well (the limited has 17" wheels). I bought the limited because it was the only HL I could find with side airbags, as Toyota doesn't ship many of these to the SE region. At least the side airbags are standard on the base Hybrid. I like the AWD model because the mpg is almost the same and I travel north in the winter (IL) and almost always run into snow, so I like to have the traction and extra safety of the AWD. The AWD is also very nice for rain slicked streets here in Atlanta.

electrictroy · April 2005

"He says they will not charge any premium or "market value" type markup but says I am stuck with a $94.00 extra teflon coating charge."

.

What a joke. Taflon consists of microscopic particles. The only way to make those particles adhere to metal is via baking at >500 degrees, else the Teflon particles would just wash off the car when it rains. I have my doubts the dealer baked your car at >500 degrees.

I'd refuse to pay. It's a worthless service.

troy

Kirstie_H · April 2005

Thanks for that info, Troy - it makes perfect sense, as Teflon is used on a lot of cookware, but knowing that as a fact, I will never pay for Teflon coating again unless I can see photos of the giant oven in the manufacturing facility.

Toyota Highlander Hybrid

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