Lincoln Zephyr/MKZ

battousai1 · October 2005

Hello everyone,

been reading through all the posts here since I have recently purchased a Zephyr, just awaiting delivery (a few more weeks to go still). Found a lot of interesting info and thank you all for that, both the pro and against folks.

Someone posted a link to the manual for the Zephyr a while back but even though the Ford fleet site had it labeled as the English version it was unfortunately in French, so just wondering if anyone has a link to the actual English manual?

EDIT: I just checked again and now they have the correct English manual linked!

There is no way yet on the lincoln.com site owner section to register 2006 vehicles so can't check there.

Oh BTW this is what I got in my Zephyr:

Tungsten Silver
HIDs
NAV (includes THXII)
Heated/Cooled seats
Standard rims even though I was offered the chromed ones, there's as much chrome as I like already on the car

Now not sure if the handsfree bluetooth kit is available from Ford, neither was my dealer so he told me if not he would install an aftermarket bluetooth kit for me at no charge, sounds good to me

Oh and I guess I am one of those 'young' people Ford wants as I'm a 30 year old IT pro. The more I looked at it the more I began to like the car, and there are some very nice videos and photos available if you sign up for the Ford media page.

I was originally looking at an M45, but then I may be leaving the country (Canada) on work in the near future so wouldn't make sense for me to spend 70K on a car that I may have to get rid off on short notice, the Zephyr was a good compromise as it has many of the features I liked in the M, minus the engine and RWD of course, but at least it is a car that I can pass on to my dad if I had to leave and he could manage the payments on it.

I also didn't want to go to the so cliched BMW camp (there are just waaay too many of them around here). There were no BMWs or Mercs that even offered as much as the M45 did for the money so why would I go and spend more to get even less

. Besides the Ford dealer that we deal with for our other cars has been good to us for the last decade so we know the service quality will be there. The first time I went to look at the M45 the Infinity guys didn't even come out and talk to us for ten minutes!

And to all those arguing over the car.. in the end its just a car.. enjoy life

navigator89 · October 2005

Wow! Congratulations on your purchase!

Hope you post regularly to tell us about the car.

I too like the Zephyr and don't find it to be just a dressed up Fusion. I'm glad you feel the same. Question - how much did you pay for your car?

And FYI, M45's dont cost 70K. 55K is more like it, give or take some.

Did you cross shop any competitors before buying this car? How did you feel they compared.

nvbanker · October 2005

"The Mark LT is the most egregious example. It IS an F150 with more chrome. They didn't even change the front facia--only the grill insert."

Ok, true enough, but the Cadillac Escalanch is so totally different from the Chevy Avalanch? Nope - it's the same truck, with a bigger engine (I think), and a different front end. Actually, the Mark LT has much more in the way of tacky add ons than the Cadillac does.

akirby · October 2005

Just look at the front ends of the Camry/ES330 and the Fusion/Zephyr and decide for yourself how different they are.

The only problem with FWD based AWD is that the engine is transverse which causes a weight shift towards the front. It's hard to get a 50/50 weight balance on a FWD based vehicle. And just like Audi, Lincoln's AWD will be rear biased (more torque sent to the rear than the front). I don't know of any full time AWD systems that allow you to switch completely to 2wd (that would be a part time 4WD system).

[Deleted User] · October 2005

That's right...in the end it is just a car. And I've got into a game of splitting hairs over something I actually couldn't give two farts about.

Note to akirby: I agree that the front ends of the ES330 and Camry resemble one another more than the front ends of Fusion-Zephyr do. However, not only is every front body panel and trim piece completely different between the two Toyotas, every other body part is different, including the sides and greenhouse, and interior dimensions. The ES330 has more hp. The Camry has more room.

As I've said too many times, the Fusion and Zephyr share the roof, entire greenhouse, doors, interior dimensions, engine...maybe it is just me, but if I am to pay 10K more, I want a little more effort at differentiation. I also know that this may not matter to the next guy, and that's OK.

akirby · October 2005

But my point is the average consumer would never look at those types of things. Most non car enthusiasts don't even know that the Mountaineer and Aviator are (were) based off the Explorer. The difference in front and rear styling and having a different interior is enough for most people, and it keeps the costs down. Maybe that's why the Zephyr is about $3K cheaper than the ES330?

hairong · October 2005

There was a guy in the Fusion/Milan forum, just like you, argued in vain that Zephyr and Fusion look too much like each other, much more than ES330 and Camry. It wasn't until he himself posted pictures of both camry and es330, did he shut up for good. If you are interested, search the other towhall forum for "es330". I think it's in July/August when those pics showed up.

battousai1 · October 2005

Hi nav89, Yes you are right the M45 is 50-55K I should have clarified I live in Canada so that's 70K (well 71K for the M45 Sport I was looking at) in CAD$.

Yes I will try to keep everyone posted once I get the Zephyr, I did look at the Maxima which while it has a better engine and a few more bells and whistles, just didn't quite do it for me. I like the look of the Zephyr, its not too brash, but its no old timers car either. I didn't even look at any Honda products, though they are fine cars, just the whole 'fanboy' attitude that some of the owners display turns me off them (besides they all look almost the same.. a 70K RL looks like a 30K Accord for all purposes, thanks but no thanks.. oh yeah and that's CAD$

). No Toyotas appealed to me at all, and the lower end Audi's BMWs, Mercs etc just don't seem to give you much for the money. Granted the BMW's have driving performance on their side, but for that I'll look at something a little sportier down the road as a second car.

It is leap of faith I guess since there were no Zephyrs at the dealers when we ordered so there was no chance for me to even see one in person or drive it, but it has a good foundation in the CD3 platform and from all I have read and seen it should be a good car.

I am leasing mine and so all I know is the payments are at most CAD$720/month I'll have to dig up the actual final price of it haven't had much time to even look at it for the time being since the car is still a few weeks away. My dad did much of the negotiating since he knows the salesman for many years and is a regular Ford customer.

Now that I got the manual and specs on the tires I should probably go look for some snow tires and rims for the winter

Cheers.

nvbanker · October 2005

It's not just about platform/shared cars looking different, it's really more about the upscale version BEING different in superior ways. The Lexus is - the Zephyr is.

ANT14 · October 2005

There's a few other vehicles coming from Lincoln that will inundate the showroom in the next few years. Next release will be the Lincoln Aviator Spring of 06, as a 07 model built upon the CD3 platform. (current one had to die since it was on the Explorer platform, and that was just redone). Then you have the more powerful AWD Zephyr joining soon after, then the Lincoln sedan(S) will come in next. Then there's the "people mover" arriving, and that's currently all in planning stages.

Now for the "in the talks" programs, there's a Lincolnized Mustang, poissble convertible that is being talked about, and another small ute....

rcf8000 · October 2005

Is there going to be a Lincoln version of the Freestyle, with a V8? Seems to me like that would be a very desirable vehicle.

navigator89 · October 2005

The Freestyle will be moving to Mercury in 2-3 years. They need products more than Lincoln does to justify their existence.

battousai1 · October 2005

Well I think it was in this discussion thread that the question of a prop rod being used to hold up the hood had come up (if not my mistake I have also been following the threads at the Autoweek forums). Anyhow the manual seems to confirm that indeed the Zephyr uses a prop rod for the hood, step 3 from the 'Opening the hood' section:

3. Lift the hood and support it with the prop rod.

Though its not a big deal my dad's Taurus has self supporting hinges so why can't they put them in the Zephyr?? I'm hoping its just an early version of the manual and perhpas this is not the case when I actualy get the car.. but oh well would have been nice but too late now

Also doesn't seem like I can get those snow tires just yet, the manual doesn't really give much info on tire specifics, so not even sure what exactly we get on the Zephyr.

ANT14 · October 2005

Well sort of, it would fall under the "people mover" vehicle, but NOT as we presently know it. It's "different"....

akirby · October 2005

I'd rather have the prop rod. Struts fail, metal rods generall don't. Had one in my ranger and it wasn't a problem. I just don't see why it's such a big deal.

ANT14 · October 2005

It's going to turn into one of those, "Ewww, that's a money saving way of doing things, if they are going cheap there, imagine where else they are going cheap"...or the infamous, "Well car "A" only has gas struts, and this one doesn't, that's IT...I will not consider this vehicle"....

nvbanker · October 2005

Egggxactly, ANT! It seems cheap, feels cheap, because most cheap cars have a prop rod. Luxury cars just don't, and it would be a real negative to me, to have my Lincoln have a prop rod. I'm sure it's because the
Mazda 6 has a prop rod - but it's unacceptable. It may not be a deal breaker, but it could come damn close for me.... They need to wise up and ask a GUY in their focus groups. I'm sure the gals in the focus group don't care, as they peruse the color pallet, but I do. And I don't want, when I'm showing it to my friends in the cul-de-sac, that comment about EWWWWW, my Cadillac has struts. I would probably never open the hood for anyone again.

bobgwtw · October 2005

Stopped to look at a Milan yesterday; and all they had was a 4 cy 5 speed. Sat in it but didn't drive it. The seat was too short & uncomfortable. It was parked next to a Zephyr. Drove the Zephyr & found it to be alround a very nice car; but I was a little put off by a $31,000 plus sticker.

Went home, pulled up Edmunds on the net & did some comparisons between the Fusion & the Zeyphy. A loaded Fusion SEL has a dealer cost of about $23,800, and the comparable Zeyphr has a dealer cost of about $28,400. A $4600 dollar difference is a heck of a lot to pay for a little nicer interior and a few whistles and bells; especially when its associated with a brand with a depreciation history like Lincoln Also noticed that sticker price on a sunroof for the Fusion is $895. and $1200 for the Zeyphr.

Nice car? definitely. Good value? No way!. I like the car & I'm going to buy the first of the year; but they're going to have to come up $2000 - $3000 in rebates/discounts before I'll put it on my short list. .

nvbanker · October 2005

I likewise looked over the Milan & Zephyr today. I do not feel the price is outrageous - actually, I thought it very favorable for a Lincoln. There is more stuff in there than you see, that makes it much quieter and rides much different and better than the Milan, it's worth most of the premium, IM0. I liked the design of the dash, and it was pretty comfy. I did not like the ultra high cowl level. I hate a car where I feel like I have to strain to look over the cowl, but that high beltline will call for a high cowl - a design mistake from my driver's position. Visibility is more important to me. Loved the Air Conditioned seats though :P

Secondly, would it have killed Lincoln to change the design a smidge? This is the ultimate badge engineering to me - as the Milan and the Zephyr were parked right side to side - making it painfully obvious that this is the very same car - the doors are identical, the trunklid is identical, the tailights are a little bigger on the Zephyr, but very similar really. Both have dual pipes. The hood is a little different and the grille is more Lincolnish, but under that, the fascia is just about the same. I mean, from the side, I could mistake them for each other easily. All the glass is interchangeable. Very disappointing. Would it kill them to give the Zephyr a little different roofline? Reminds me of the Oldsmobuick days..... Disappointing.

I'm a Lincoln fan - but this one won't attract me, sad to say. If I'm going to buy a Lincoln, though I think the price is fair, I want a different car than the Mercury. Like the Town Car is to the Grand Marquis. They are identical underneath, but no panels are shared between them whatsoever......like it should be.

deanvit · October 2005

I like most on this list too would like to see more separation between the Zephyr and Milan. However, badge engineering did not prevent me from purchasing an I30 which for all purposes is Maxima. What sold me on the I30 was features per dollar as I purchased it at invoice. Is a fully loaded Zephyr worth 35K, not IMO. However, Lincoln probably doesn't expect to sell it at sticker. Fully loaded around 30-32K with nav, ventilated seats and THX may make me forget about it being a GT or Super Sport variation of the Milan.

The real question for me which is obviously too early to answer would be long term durability. Though it appears that Lincoln has recently made large strides in that area.

[Deleted User] · October 2005

No, it's not a big deal. It's just an indication of quality (or lack thereof) that makes a difference to some of us.

My VW Golf has struts on the hood, and my Mazda Millenia has a prop rod. It is akin to the difference between manual and power windows. Every time I raise the hood on the Mazda and carefully insert the prop rod (so as to not scratch the paint), I think how cheap for a car that otherwise exudes quality.

bobgwtw · October 2005

Hi ANT 14.

A suggestion: Combine the Zeyphr forum with the Fusion/Milan forum.

They are essentially the same car

Lincoln is not even listed in your index of forums

Not - for whatever reason - a lot of traffic on the zeyphr forum

I'm sure this suggestion will bring protests from the diehard Lincoln members; but it should provide a platform for a thorough discussion and comparison of the 3 cars,

cdnpinhead · October 2005

Diehard Lincoln members?

Having a convention in a phone booth comes to mind.

brucelinc · October 2005

I took a look at a Zephyr and a Milan today. I think the Zephyr interior is excellent considering the price. The manual tilt/telescope wheel is a bit crude and awkward compared to the LS power adjustment, but overall, I think the interior is the best feature of the car - maybe the best of any Lincoln. As for the exterior, I pretty much agree with nvbanker. Actually, from a styling standpoint, the Fusion is my favorite of the 3.

As for the prop rod: Ford missed a golden opportunity here. If they had made the rod removable from under the hood, they could have used the same rod to hold open the trunk and save money by eliminating the struts back there. For just a few bucks, they could have put a series of hinges in the rod so it would fold and could be used to prop open the sunroof, thus saving even more money. It could even be stored in the console and used as a weapon against car jackers. They could have a name for it like "multi-function econo-stalk" and the focus group folks would have loved it.

Seriously, ANT, please don't let the prop-rod plague spread to the upcoming Volvo based Lincolns. I won't bore everyone by restating the reasons.

Kirstie_H · October 2005

This issue has already been raised and at this time, we're keeping the discussions separate.

hairong · October 2005

Isn't it time to ship both threads out of Future Vehicles Forum to the Sedan Forum, since they have arrived, kirstie_h HOST?

nvbanker · October 2005

Thank you, kirstie - that was a dumb suggestion. :confuse:

Kirstie_H · October 2005

Yeah, we'll be doing that in the next couple of days. I kinda like to keep ahold of the enjoyable discussions as long as I can before passing them off to Pat

howard11 · October 2005

Remember look at the back of the Zephyr...then close your eyes...imagine a Lexus emblem on the back...keep your eyes closed and open your mind...now what do you think.

The new Lexus IS30...hope it does not drive like a rock like the last IS30.

I'm not brainwashed by the media and the corporate money power craze...how about you?

nvbanker · October 2005

Excellent observation, howard...... You have a point.

scrapz · October 2005

Has any of you purchased a Zephyr using the Ford X-Plan? I am currently car shopping and I'm interested to know the approximate discount I can expect.

akirby · October 2005

Lincoln's should be 0.4% over dealer invoice. Good luck finding a dealer willing to accept it. They're in short supply right now. You might be able to order one via X plan even if they won't give it to you off the lot.

scrapz · October 2005

Is that 0.4% or 4%? Either way it's not much of a discount. I read that someone got about $4K off a Ford Five Hundred using the X-Plan. But that was in about July '05, and the car was an '05. They may be been trying to get rid of the '05's.

Thanks for the info.

akirby · October 2005

That was 0.4% or roughly $125 over invoice. That $4K included incentives. Right now the Zephyr has a $500 rebate plus another $500 if you finance with Ford. That would come off the invoice price. And with X plan the dealer cannot charge a doc fee - that's worth another $300-$400 right there. Given the high demand and short supply X plan would be an excellent price right now. You won't come close to invoice on one otherwise until the supply builds up and demand weakens.

crock22 · October 2005

I just got a Zephyr a couple of days ago using the A-plan discount. I was also able to get $1,000 in rebates, and they are waiving security deposit on the Zephyr this month. I am leasing the car for 2 years and have a very reasonable note because I was able to get the car under invoice price. I have the silver frost color (by far and away the best color to go with, IMHO). Its loaded w/everything except for the nav system. It really looks classy and distinguished. Its definetly been turning alot of heads.

battousai1 · October 2005

Congradulations, lucky you, I still have two weeks to go (at least) to get mine, I just want to see it in person now this waiting is killing me, I hope it gets here before its too cold to do a good detail job on it. Need to claybar out all that rail dust for sure and maybe a few coats of zaino should keep it protected through the winter.

So anything new to share now that you have one ( other than what's been discussed to death already here

)

I really like it in Black but with our winters here it would be a pain to keep clean so I went for the tungsten silver which was my second choice in colour.

Well enjoy the car

nvbanker · October 2005

Hey, congratulations crock! You're our first owner here in the forum! Keep us posted on your satisfaction, etc.....

navigator89 · October 2005

"Hey, congratulations crock! You're our first owner here in the forum! Keep us posted on your satisfaction, etc..... "

Actually, battousai is the first owner. Read messages 514 and 521.

Anyway do keep us informed if you can crock.

battousai1 · October 2005

LOL Well I may have bought first but he did get his first, so I'm willing to concede

jtford · November 2005

Copy of my post in Fusion/Milan/Zephyr thread:

We're in the market for a mid-sized sedan and I test drove a V-6 Fusion SEL a few weeks ago. Well, at lunch on Friday I had the opportunity to drive a couple of different Lincoln Zephyrs at a local Lincoln dealer in the Philly area.

I'm 33 years old, the owner of a '98 SVT Contour that I still enjoy flailing, and a recent graduate of Bob Bondurant's Grand Prix Road Racing class this spring, and I can say never imagined I'd find myself in a Lincoln dealer. But based on the good impressions I got from the Fusion test drive, I wanted to see how the Lincoln offering stacked up. To summarize, I walked away VERY impressed with this car.

First the exterior styling is nice though conservative and generally inoffensive. Exterior styling didn't wow me in an emotional way, but generally it looks fine.

Interiorwise, I loved the interior with the chrome and light maple wood finish. I questioned the look in the brochure and pictures, but in person, the look of the light maple, chrome and tan interior palette is fantastic. I saw a car with the darker interior with the dark walnut wood, and in my opinion, the light maple is such a better and classier look. The leather on the seats is a high-quality soft leather and has a rich feel to it, and the center stack has a nice look to it.

If you get nothing else from this review, take my word that this car must be driven before you can judge it. It has one of the best balances of comfort and handling I have ever driven in a car in this price segment. The ride is quiet, smooth, and soaks up bumps, but unlike say a Lexus ES330, the handling is still sharp and well controlled. There is always some trade off in comfort vs. handling, but in this case I think Lincoln nailed it. The roads around Philly are generally chewed up, and the comfort was appreciated, all the while, the handling was very satisfying.

I took two cars out on two test drives (one without nav and one with nav), and I have to say the more I drove this car, the more I loved it. The accelleration is generally strong and the 6-speed auto behaved itself nicely. Also notable was how quiet and solid the cabin felt. After about 10 minutes behind the wheel, I found myself smiling and nodding my head in approval. It satisfied in a way that the Fusion didn't.

Also, I have to say that the A/C fed through the perforated leather in the seats is quite possibly the greatest luxury item introduced in the past 50 years. I never even considered the merits of such a thing, but after experiencing it, it is phenominal.

So in summary, I'm right with that Edmunds review. I walked away very impressed with this car. In the segment I'm looking in, namely mid-size entry-lux sedan keeping the price close to $30k, this is a winner to me, certainly a strong contender. The RWD Caddy CTS is nice too, though I found the Lincoln interior more satisfying, and the ever more slightly comfort-biased ride and serenity to be more appreciated in the real-world commutes we all live in. The handling on the Lexus ES completely failed to satisfy. The Acura TL is another contender, but again, I liked the look, feel, ride, and handling of the Zephyr better. As an aside, I appreciated the RWD handling of the CTS over the TL.

Anyway-- please, don't judge this car until you drive it! I think everyone that does will walk away impressed. When you put it all together-- mid-sized room, price, luxury, ride, handling, solid/quiet interior, luxury touches in the cabin, A/C in the seats (try it out on a warm day before you laugh!), it's a compelling choice.

wt4000 · November 2005

Thanks for the detailed summary of the test drive.

Did you get to listen to the THX?

rambo5 · November 2005

I had a quick walk around a Zephyr at the local dealer today.
The styling IMHO rings all the right bells. My two reservations are the lack of satellite radio even with the fancy THX system, and possibly the demographics of the car. I know this is shallow of me but when I was looking at the car a
gentleman with memories of the Battle of the Somme was going for a test drive.

buckwheat · November 2005

Whatever his memories he'll drive/own it for his reasons the bells you heard ringing are the future demographics for this car which will inevitably change the perspective of many when they think Lincoln. So I don't think you were shallow Sly, I mean Jon.

dardson1 · November 2005

without a doubt, Lincoln has made a very interesting car with a ton of stuff for the money. I just cross-shopped it with an 06 ES330, and I wanted to love the Zypher because (on paper) it has a $3k advantage over the ES option for option. The exterior is handsome, and I really liked how it rode and drove; but, the interior ruined it for me. For some reason it feels small (bound to be an optical illusion as I'm sure it's as big as the Lexus). It looks a little like something made in a very good high school shop class, as though it were all fashioned with a radial-arm saw. It's too square. There are a confusing array of buttons that are difficult to read (for those of us old enough to afford a Zypher). IMHO this car works except for the interior. Less is more, sometimes (the Town Car does it well). Bought the ES. Too bad Ford didn't finish this car. I'm inclined to buy American if it measures up.

johnclineii · November 2005

Inclined to buy American if it measures up, you say?

The Zephyr has many positive attributes, but it is assembled in Mexico.

akirby · November 2005

Talk about double standards. Honda gets ripped because it builds cars in the U.S. but the profits go back to Japan because it's where the profits go that count. Now Ford is bad because it's assembling the cars in Mexico - but the profits still come back to Detroit. Funny we never hear griping about the Canadian plants. What's the difference other than the union?

ANT14 · November 2005

I think the emphansize stated was that there were other items in the vehicle that bothered them.

I know someone who gave up a BMW after 6 months of use received on their 16th bday, because the interior instrumentation was red, which made them feel hot, uncomfortable, sticky, icky, and yucky. Sometimes it's the smaller things that will kill it for some.

Oh wait...that was me...

savetheland · November 2005

I thought Lexus ES and Zephyr to be different animals. Is it possible to have them both on one shopping list? It is like choosing between Mercedes and BMW - do you like drive limousine or sport sedan?

akirby · November 2005

The Lexus ES is exactly the target. We're talking about a 221 hp FWD mid size luxury sedan - what else would it compare with?

And there's no reason not to cross shop MB and BMW - they are much more alike than they are different.

starman98 · November 2005

I just test drive on today not much of a selection only 3 on the lot but overall I am very disappointed.

I know Ford is not the most reliable brand around but when I found out the car was made in Mexico my stomach turned. Nothing against Mexico it is just that they pay the people over there lousy money and harsh working conditons. AS a result they do poor work keep in mind you are driving a car assembled by people making one dollar an hour if that.

Car was very fast either sadly slower than a V6 Accord. The road noice was pretty loud, the engine I could easily hear, and the handling average at best.

There were a lot of features for the money I will give it that and the styling is nice.

Overall, Lincoln tries but doesn't hit the mark. I would rather have a CTS, TL, ES330, G35, Grand Prix, Bmw 325i, over the lincoln.

The low inventory, questionable reliability, probably terrible resale value, average engine, and kinda weird dash were turnoffs for me.

As far as Lincoln goes...you can get a 2006 LS v8 loaded with bargining power for around the same price.

Lincoln Zephyr/MKZ

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