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  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,131
    It was up because nobody (but Enterprise Holdings) was buying the aging soon to be replaced model last year. See Lexus GS.

    I can actually deal with the Odyssey most out of that list, for some reason. It's a van, so it can get away with some ugly/weird more than something with sporty pretenses.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,131
    I don't know if that explains the ugly dual grille, but it might explain some of the dopey anime styling out there. A tough generation to catch in the west, seeing as for the most part, they are worse off than their boomer predecessors.

    No doubt wooing well-connected Chinese embezzlers and similar coddled crowds will be profitable.
  • berriberri Member Posts: 10,165
    Looks are definitely a personal thing. But I saw a new Avalon up close a few weeks ago while getting an oil change. To me at least, it looked better than the pictures appeared. I didn't find it gorgeous, but it wasn't outright ugly either. It also gives a buyer a lot for the money, so I can understand it's initial success.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,131
    It's perfectly inoffensive and pleasant enough, so long as you don't look at the front below the windshield :shades:
  • berriberri Member Posts: 10,165
    In all fairness, the big mouth bass look seems to becoming the standard front end on many new vehicles. As I said before, cars are being influenced by designer craziness like in 1958!
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Generally I haven't liked that large mouth bass look - Audi, then the EVO, then VW (strange), then seemingly everyone.

    The market seems to like it, though.

    Never poll enthusiasts to find out what car would sell. If they asked us, you'd build a diesel-only station wagon that only came with a manual transmission. Then they would proceed to sell 2 of them, to you and me.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    First saw an Altima, and at first I thought it was a Maxima. Good job with the family resemblance, IMHO.

    Then a saw a new Sentra, first out on the roads, and it fits in too. It does look like a car from a higher price class.

    Nissan has done well with its new sedans, I think.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,131
    At least MB and BMW haven't really done it yet, I guess.

    Just more to prove how designers are copycat sycophants, maybe not unlike 1958 when the solution for almost everyone was simply to add gingerbread.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,131
    The new Accord and Altima both look more expensive than they are - and look a notch fancier than Camry, too.

    Sentra had to be an improvement, old one was a fun combination of ancient and cheap.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    The old Sentra was so dated. My wife had a loaner and she preferred the Kia Rio loaner she had previously. The old Kia Rio. At least the Rio was light and tossable.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,131
    I think in the last year or two, it must have sold only to fleets. Outclassed by pretty much all of the competition. It's funny that on a cheap or mainstream car, a little chrome can do a lot.

    Oh, saw a Buick Verano, which has a profile somewhat similar to a Sentra.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    The redesign likely got more than chrome, but I have to see one in person before my final verdict.

    DC Auto show is 2 weeks away!
  • Sandman6472Sandman6472 Member Posts: 6,966
    I sat in a few at he dealership and was quite impressed...it's a nice little driver! So nice that I would consider buying another after the lemon '03 that I had and sold right before the 3/36k was up...gremlins the dealers couldn't fix. But the new one is so much better and comfortable to boot..fits in well with the family siblings.

    Saw a pic of the new Forte and it looked a lot like a small Ford Fusion as I recall...prefer the current model except the horrid dash layout...with all the hard plastics it just is not something I'd want to face year after year personally. I do like the 5 door concept though and since our great luck with my kid's Hyundai Accent, I'd have no problem going with a Kia. As I've mentioned in another forum, the only domestic brand I'd buy right now is the Buick Verano. Except for the poor vision out the rear with the headrests in place, I was extremely impressed without even taking a test drive. Comfortable seating with great ergonomics and controls right where they should be...I just felt so comfortable and at home in that car that if things were different, I'd sigh the papers today and trade my beloved Civic! It's that good!

    The Sandman :) :sick: :shades:

    2023 Hyundai Kona Limited AWD (wife) / 2015 Golf TSI (me) / 2019 Chevrolet Cruze Premier RS (daughter #1) / 2020 Hyundai Accent SE (daughter #2) / 2023 Subaru Impreza Base (son)

  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I'm more of a hatch guy. The Versa Note looks better than the Versa sedan, but the latter is so cheapened and I'm afraid to check out the Note.

    Should be dirt cheap, though.
  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 50,486
    Philly show is tomorrow! Even expanded it again this year (after expanding it last year, up 100K SF since 2011).

    Even better, scored 2 free tickets thanks to friends in high places at SOA.

    first time in about 5 years too that my son is going with me. If he can manage to find a job in May when he graduates college, that will be the next sales story from my clan.

    he is already online looking. I try to point out that maybe he should be job looking first, but that has not seem to sunk in yet. Chip off the old block!

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I worked the day after my graduation.

    A short break isn't bad...but get the job first!
  • lemkolemko Member Posts: 15,261
    ...dark blue Cadillac XTS travelling west on Napfle Street near Verree in NE Philly.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,131
    I took about 6 weeks off, didn't start looking til about a month before. Of course, the Y2K malaise economy was like a 1950s boom compared to now.
  • andys120andys120 Member Posts: 23,386
    edited January 2013
    This is old car week in Arizona when the big name car auctions come to town to show off the collectibles. T5here's plenty of new metal to be seen as well, either driven by well-heeled prospective buyers or being shown at the auctions.

    So far I've seen:

    -Jag XJ, these are really big especially if you look at their size compared to the big Jags of yore. Looked great in dark green, not so much in snow white.

    -Audi A7, same deal, the white one I saw didn't look that good for a new Audi but then I saw a metallic grey one, niiice!

    -Porsche (981) Boxster S, looks even nicer than in photos, it actually looks smaller than older models by a little but lines are more agressive. Me want!

    -McLaren MP-4 Something, Something-C. I saw one last year and wasn't that impressed but this year they were showing off a copper colored coupe and a dark grey Spider. Both looked (and sounded) great.

    No new Corvettes so far but everywhere you go you see new Pony Cars- Camaros, Mustangs and Challengers all seem equally popular.

    2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93

  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,131
    New Escape has turned up in my parking garage at home. Also saw a late model Maserati Quattroporte going ~35 with the windows down (temperature per my car's readout was 34F).
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Lemme guess, smoking a cigar?
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,131
    I couldn't see very well. Either someone was trying to air out something, or Italian electronics were having fun :shades:

    Last night, saw a late model Lexus IS (host of LEDs), not an F, but it had some kind of big exhaust on it, and frankly, didn't sound the best. I don't understand.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    edited January 2013
    Gotta be careful opening windows, you never know if they'll go back up! :D

    IS oddball: so they pay for refinement and isolation, then pay more to take those away?
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,131
    edited January 2013
    I worry in my cars, as rear window regulators in MB seem to be a problem issue going back decades. I remember back when I was in school, riding in a friend's 83 Monte Carlo, and joking "this window isn't going to roll up" when I rolled down the huge passenger door window. 10 minutes later - it failed to respond. I swear I didn't actually break it.

    I think the IS might be one of the 3% who buy them who see it as sporty. Different world.

    Visited an out of town MB dealer today - much larger selection than the one nearest me. Notable was an S400 hybrid, loaded 86K C63, and a couple of E wagons that were pretty loaded (P2, pano) - but no leather. A 68K car with vinyl interior, love it. There's a new silver color for the C that I like, almost a bluish hint to it. Also saw a couple new Fusions.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Vinyl wouldn't bother me, but I'm not in the 68k budget range.

    Love the panos. Hyundai has a nice one on the Elantra GT.

    Which S class sells best? Bet it's a mid level V8.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,131
    edited January 2013
    If I am blowing 70K, I want leather. Although to be honest, if I didn't know it was tex to begin with, I could probably be fooled, and so could 95% of the population, I'd wager.

    Pano is something we can thank MB for - the W211 really got that fad rolling.

    No doubt S550 sells best - more availability. And the typical S buyer is traditional - the hybrid will be too weird, and the diesel too unconventional. For me, the diesel would be a no-brainer.
  • bhill2bhill2 Member Posts: 2,471
    And the typical S buyer is traditional - the hybrid will be too weird, and the diesel too unconventional.

    Jeez, I am old enough to remember the '70s and early '80s when most of the Mercedes sold here were diesel.

    2009 BMW 335i, 2003 Corvette cnv. (RIP 2001 Jaguar XK8 cnv and 1985 MB 380SE [the best of the lot])

  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,131
    I think that ideal ended in the US for the 1986 model year, when MB finally gained really competent V8s for the S/SEC/SL, and the then excellent I6 in the new W124 E-class.
  • bhill2bhill2 Member Posts: 2,471
    I think that ideal ended in the US for the 1986 model year, when MB finally gained really competent V8s for the S/SEC/SL

    I beg your pardon, sir, I own a '85 380SE that I feel is quite competent. OK, I'm having sport with you. But the engine has gone 260K miles with no major mishaps so I accord it some respect.

    2009 BMW 335i, 2003 Corvette cnv. (RIP 2001 Jaguar XK8 cnv and 1985 MB 380SE [the best of the lot])

  • lemkolemko Member Posts: 15,261
    ...black Chrysler 200 at Hellerman and Bingham in NE Philly this morning.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    With the rims and the grounded to the ground style.

    Around here very few Camrys are the SE model. I see a lot more hybrids, for instance.
  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 50,486
    I do like the seats on those. Must be the 2-tone look.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I also like 2 tone seats, haven't checked out an SE, though. Sedan = no care.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,131
    Your car is just fine, but in terms of output, the 86+ V8s were better, closer to Euro spec cars. The 86+ cars killed the private import business too, by finally giving US consumers what they wanted.

    Your car also avoids the issues of earlier 3.8 cars - timing chains esp. It will probably last forever, nobody builds cars like the W126 anymore. You've had that car for eons, right?
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,131
    Many Hertz rentals in my area are SEs.

    Saw a new style SL this morning, a Lexus GS being test driven by a tech, 2x new Accords, new Altima.
  • odie6lodie6l Member Posts: 1,173
    edited January 2013
    I'm not going to list any of the ones I saw down and around the Philly Auto Show on MLK Day.

    We've had a ton of new Accords running all over the place. I've seen a couple Darts and at least 2 Raptors. The one that shocked me was seeing a MB G550 today while driving into work. Since it looks like an older Land Rover anyway I couldn't tell it was a newer one or not. It's just odd seeing it. The other is I've been seeing the new Subaru XV's popping up everywhere. Very nice looking.

    Odie
  • bhill2bhill2 Member Posts: 2,471
    You've had that car for eons, right?

    Indeed I have. I bought it in 1991 with 70K miles on it and have never looked back. Your point about the output is well taken. I believe that the 300SE was actually faster. But what can I say; at this point it is a beloved pet, not to mention a powerful nostalgia machine, what with all of the memories.

    2009 BMW 335i, 2003 Corvette cnv. (RIP 2001 Jaguar XK8 cnv and 1985 MB 380SE [the best of the lot])

  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,131
    Cared for, that car will outlive everyone here. I know what you mean by the nostalgia, I have had the fintail just a few years less than you've had your beast. Sometimes it seems silly to keep it - but I can't think to part with it.
  • bhill2bhill2 Member Posts: 2,471
    Sometimes it seems silly to keep it - but I can't think to part with it.

    I hear you Fin.

    2009 BMW 335i, 2003 Corvette cnv. (RIP 2001 Jaguar XK8 cnv and 1985 MB 380SE [the best of the lot])

  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I regret selling my 93 Miata. It would never have lost much more value anyway.
  • bhill2bhill2 Member Posts: 2,471
    Yes indeed, my 380SE is all done depreciating. It's even relatively cheap to license at this point. I do keep getting gentle reminders that the California DMV offers rewards to people who junk older cars, but that ain't going to happen.

    2009 BMW 335i, 2003 Corvette cnv. (RIP 2001 Jaguar XK8 cnv and 1985 MB 380SE [the best of the lot])

  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,131
    My car probably hit its depreciation floor around the time I was born. Of course, it hasn't appreciated much - but that's not the point. And with year of manufacture plates and classic insurance, those costs are nothing.

    Cash for Clunkers claimed numerous W126, I just hope they were heaps.
  • berriberri Member Posts: 10,165
    Both of you guys need to not worry about anything being silly. It's about what you like when it comes to hobbies and fun, not a cost benefit analysis. If a time comes to part with it, your gut will know. So just enjoy what you have now and keep us all posted on your experiences. Trust me, when you get into my age range you get a much broader understanding and appreciation of what really matters in life!
  • bhill2bhill2 Member Posts: 2,471
    Cash for Clunkers claimed numerous W126, I just hope they were heaps.

    When a car was turned in under the Cash for Clunkers program they put a silica concoction into the crankcase and ran the engine until it seized. I wouldn't do something that messed up to the worst of cars, much less a Mercedes, and much much less my Mercedes.

    2009 BMW 335i, 2003 Corvette cnv. (RIP 2001 Jaguar XK8 cnv and 1985 MB 380SE [the best of the lot])

  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,131
    I like to think the old MB claimed in that experiment were at least stripped of useful parts and went on to keep other cars going. But knowing the feds...
  • lemkolemko Member Posts: 15,261
    Knowing the feds, it was probably a pristine W126 that would put cars in the Concours d'Elegance to shame. Good God, killing a car like that is like euthanizing a beloved and perfectly healthy pet. I've had bad dreams about something happening to my 1989 Cadillac Brougham and waking up with tears in my eyes. Deliberately murdering a beautiful car with that concoction would probably give me a heart attack.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Nah, remember the incentives weren't that big. Would have to be less than the (perceived) value of the car.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,131
    edited January 2013
    I think the credit would be like $3500 or $4500. Those values for the guzzlers that would have qualified would keep out the best cars - although maybe some fairly decent ones would have been included, esp if trade in values were used. It's a shame to lose old quality material like that, but at the same time, those turning in the cars probably hadn't cared for them in a long time, and deferred maintenance can easily exceed the value of the car. I still see plenty on the road, anyway - so not all was lost.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Killed a lot of donor/parts cars.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,131
    I was thinking there was a period when parts could be harvested before sent to scrap. So maybe the good stuff got saved anyway.
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