BMW Z4 Prices Paid and Buying Experience

ragazzonc · June 2005

With kyfdx's excellent information in hand, I got in touch with the dealership's management about what seemed to me the sneaky way I ended up paying for two things I had insisted during negotiations I didn't want (window etching and and treatment to help keep the car clean). I noted that I had thought of having an alarm installed as well as the CD changer (I haven't gone IPOD/mp3 yet) and suggested that I would be content to leave the terms of the lease as they were if they installed those items in lieu of the two things I really wasn't interested in paying for. The Dealership management was extremely apologetic about the situation, in essence agreeing that the practice of their finance man had been unacceptable (he claimed to give me something for free when it clearly was not--I had been suspicious of the claim of a "freebie" but he'd insisted it was in fact without cost to me). They agreed to install the CD-changer and the alarm for the amount I had been charged for the etching and protective treatment AND to give me the etching and protective treatment (hey, at least it'll amount to a free car wash which I already need). I'll be better informed next time I go in to negotiate for a car but I'm content with this end result. Thanks again kyfdx. If you're ever in the area of Durham, NC I'd be happy to buy you a drink (or a coffee or a juice or a bottled water)!

kyfdx · June 2005

Wow... Good deal.. Anything you can get after the fact, is just a bonus. Enjoy your car..

regards,
kyfdx

kyfdx · June 2005

Your $2500 upfront payment probably looks something like this?

$512 1st payment
$625 acquisition fee
$667 cap cost reduction
$100 tax on CCR and ACQ.fee

That leaves about $600 more dollars for registration, etc.. Seems like that may be about $300 too high... I bet there is some padding in there.. Maybe a little pure profit from a "document fee", or something like that...

It appears that it doesn't include a security deposit, or the money factor would be .0020...

Overall, this looks like a great lease, with maybe only $300 of extras.. but, considering the great purchase price, I wouldn't quibble, but I would structure it a little differently..

$48,545 MSRP
$40,656 selling price
$41,281 Cap cost (selling price + $625 acq.fee)
Residual 58% for 3yr/36K
MF .0020 (base rate with security deposit)
Payment: $504/mo.+tax = $543/mo.

Due at signing: 1st pymt ($543), security deposit ($550), Registration and other fees ($300? or their $600). Total: $1400-$1700. Plus you'll receive the $550 security deposit back at the end of the lease..

Comparison to their structure: $800 less upfront + $550 back at end of lease
36 pymts. X $26/mo.higher.. $1350 minus $936 = $414 (more money in your pocket).

Restructuring the lease that way saves you about $400 over the life of the lease, and gives them the exact same gross profit..

It is a great deal, either way... If you can get a look at the fee breakdown, and pull another $200-$300 out of the deal, so much the better..

regards,
kyfdx

opencars · June 2005

I have been following the last few posts and appreciate the comprehensive info on leasing. I am about to lease a 3.O MSRP $48,545, the same as the last post. The only question I cannot get answered is--- if I trade an owned vehicle ( probable trade value $24,000 ) will it it offset the sales tax. In New Jersey rate is 6% . Total tax due about $1100.00. Any help is appreciated. Paul

james_oc · June 2005

kyfdx,

Thank you for the detail and breakdown, it sheds light on some questions I have been thinking about. I will try to have them adjust the Base MF to include security deposit, wish me luck I am going to go into the dealership hopefully tommorrow!

kyfdx · June 2005

I can't speak specifically for NJ, but in general, you won't get an offset on the sales tax.

The car you are trading is in your name, but the car you are leasing will be purchased by the leasing bank.

Fortunately, tax is fairly low on leases in NJ.. Just 6% of the depreciation portion of the lease. But, I doubt you'll get any offset. You might call your local DMV for clarification, though.

regards,
kyfdx

naderz4 · June 2005

I know that the $4500 incentive on Z4 continues on, or let's say I know it is on till end of June. Anyone has any info. on whether it will continue on or stop after June? And, any info. on when it may turn to $6500?

Thanks,

james_oc · June 2005

Hi again - it apprears that this particular vehicle is the last one on the lot, I originally looked at it 2 weeks ago and it's still there, which I believe resulted in the great purchase price. As you suggested I asked him about the "pad" and getting base MF to .002, here is the response...

"Our company policy is to charge $825 for the lease acquisition fee. $625 of it goes to BMW Financial Services. $200 goes to our dealership's finance department for processing the paperwork for you. This is probably where you found the $200-$300 discrepancy in your calculations. This is non-negotiable. If you wish to place a refundable security deposit, then you can waive the rate-adder on the money factor from .00215 to .00200. The security deposit will be $550. So, you add $2500 and $550 and your total drive-off then becomes $3050. This lowers your monthly payment to $500.65 including tax."

* After asking them to lower base MF/add the secuirty deposit, I received this reply...

"With $2500 TOTAL DRIVE-OFF (including refundable security deposit of $550, so really, you're paying $1950 drive-off before security deposit), your monthly payments are $480.31 + tax = $517.53 including tax for 3 year lease at 12000 miles per year on approved credit. This is figured at a money factor of .00200. Cap cost is still at 40655.58. Residual is still at 58% = 28156.10."

What do you think? Thanks again...

- J

kyfdx · June 2005

They seem very upfront..

It is a good selling price.. and they are using the base money factor.. I'm not going to blow a good deal over $200..

If it were me, I'd ask them for $1500 drive off, including a security deposit. It shouldn't matter to them, as they'll just add the $1000 into the cap cost.. That will add almost exactly $32/mo to the payment, including tax..

Result: $1500 drive-off.. Payment of $550/mo..

You have done really well, and you have a dealership that doesn't play with the numbers, every time you ask for something.. IF this is the car you want, I'd jump on it.. That is a lot of car for $550/mo.

regards,
kyfdx

james_oc · June 2005

Thank you so much again kyfdx. I picked up my vehichle today at 9PM, the BMW dealership was closing another deal when I came in and they ended up staying until 11:00 to finish up my lease. Overall a very pleasurable experience as they did what they agreed upon...the information you gave me was very helpful and going in the dealership I felt very well informed.

The deal ended up exactly as you suggested, I planned to put zero down but with the trade (they gave me exactly Blue Book Value) I put $600 of it into the drive off, $550 into the security deposit and the rest ($350) into DMV, Registration Fees for a drive-off of $1500 and payment of $548/month.

It was great - 8k off sticker and then he broke it down on the screen exactly as you described, even to the point that he explained that the dealership loss 900 on the deal...included Z4 mats, hats and Z4 license plate frames.

Thank you so much again for all your help, you rock man - rock!

vizzini · June 2005

I spent a long time talking a deal over with my dealer that I'm not quite happy with yet. In particular, they have hit me with $180 for a training fee and $345 for "MACO", which they characterize as an advertising fee. They say the dealership gets none of this, of course - it comes right out of the gross profit and goes to BMW.

I also heard some brand new lines for the first time -
a) BMW needs them to sell the vehicle for a $2000 profit - it's a BMW-established guideline
b) BMW encourages them to move cars that are already "in inventory" - if they have to order one, they don't get credit from the factory for selling the car, or something like that

They have a "wholesale" price of $37,585 for the car (z4 3.0i), which is below Edmunds's number of $37,765, on the document I was giving, listing invoice prices for everything else correctly (according to edmunds).

Anyway, the deal:
z4 3.0, msrp $44,200
- premium
- heated seats

+ dest of $695 + MACO $345 + Training Service Fee $180 = total MSRP $44,895. They quoted me $38,512 for the car, or $1358 or so off sticker (minus the fees), if my math is right.

Whadayathink? I can get this car somewhere else for $1500 over invoice somewhere else, but I haven't called back to clarify whether or not it includes the $525 of junk fees.

kyfdx · June 2005

Fantastic!!

It sounds like you had a great dealer...

Enjoy your new car..

kyfdx · June 2005

If you'll notice.. their invoice price + the $180 training fee = Edmunds invoice price? So, you aren't paying anything extra there..

MACO is a regional advertising charge.. It is legitimate.. If you are going to negotiate from invoice, that is part of it..

Are you paying $38,512 + other fees? Or is the $38,512 the entire price of the car, plus taxes only?

regards,
kyfdx

vizzini · June 2005

That looks like the whole ball of wax to me. That looks like it explicitly includes destination, MACO, and training. The dealer's invoice seems to be $36,945 (plus 4500 rebate). Looks like a $1567 profit to me.

I'm going to lease, and I forgot to mention that they've bumped me an extra .0003 above the base rate "so the finance manager can make some money".

The sales guy says he is below the minimum commission threshold here and has nothing to hide. He has been a pretty straight shooter in the past; I was just surprised to hear about the extra fees.

Oh, and for what it's worth, he says he had a factory rep in recently (last week?) that says that due to production cuts in the z4, they won't have to go to $6500 for the rebate, and that last year the highest the rebate ever got was $4500, so he thinks the chances are low of an increase. He didn't comment (partly because I didn't ask him) about the probability of the $4500 extending into July.

zoozeek · June 2005

Is the $4,500 rebate only for 3.0 or for 2.5 as well?

Also, any idea what the absolute lowest price for absolute base, with zero options, of the 2.5 is? And, what's the best way to buy one?

vizzini · June 2005

the 2.5 has a $2500 incentive, and the 3.0 has a $4500 incentive.

If you join Costco, their auto program will let you get a z4 for $1500 over invoice, minus the $2500 incentive, from any dealer in their network. That's $1000 under invoice, plus destination of $695 and a $345 MACO fee, as quoted by my dealer, or $31,435. The 3.0 would be $35,805, but will have more equipment on it. I'd use these numbers as an absolute top end when negotiating, unless getting to the closest costco-affiliated dealership doesn't work out for you. People are doing better than $1500 over invoice (adjusted for the incentives); look at other recent deals on this forum.

Be careful with totally base, though; it may be hard to re-sell. Every BMW i've ever looked at has had at least the premium package. And the 2.5 has fewer standard features than the 3.0, so options cost out a bit differently. Either way, totally base means manual (not smg) transmission and manual top, among other things.

juannok · June 2005

Hello all,

I've been reading all of the posts in this forum for a few days now. I'm really impressed with the information sharing and the great advice from contributors such as kyfdx. I am now in need of some advice and look forward to reading any feedback :-)

My wife and I are getting ready to buy our first car together (2.5i Z4). This will also be the first car I've ever been responsible for negotiating the price for. So I've been doing my homework to help ensure we get the best price possible.

We have narrowed the field down to three options below. With the $2500 incentives, should I be able to get one of these for $1000 OR LESS dealer profit (Invoice - $2500 +$1000)? I've seen other posts that say as much, but wasn't sure since we are now in summer months and incentives have been going on for a while. I will trade-in a Ford Ranger I expect to get $6K for based on discussions/appraisals with dealers.

Car 1:
Z4 2.5i Automatic
Toledo Blue/Beige Leather/Wood Trim
Options: Automatic, Premium Package, Heated Seats, Xenon, Leather Seats
MSRP: $42,295
Invoice: $38,755

Car 2:
Z4 2.5i Automatic
Black/Beige Leather/Wood Trim
Options: Automatic, Premium Pack, Sport Pack, Heated Seats, Xenon, Leather
MSRP: $42,895
Invoice: $39,305

Car 3: (Preferred as would be less expensive and don't care much a/b Sport Pkg)
4 2.5i Automatic
Toledo Blue/Beige Leather/Aluminum Trim
Options: Automatic, Premium Pack, Heated Seats, Leather
MSRP: $41,595
Invoice: $38,120

Also, one dealer told me they could have a car sent to their lot from Illinois (I'm in Ohio) but it would be an additional $800. Is this negotiable?

I appreciate any and all feedback I get and WILL BE SURE TO SHARE the results of our negotiation with the forum.

Thanks,
Jon K.
aka
juannok

kyfdx · June 2005

You have a good handle. on it.. Invoice minus incentive plus $1000 would be a good deal..

Z4s don't really get much of a summer premium, because they obviously aren't selling that well.. (ergo, the incentives).

I'd try to find a car that is already at the dealer, rather than have them swap.. You can almost always get a better deal on what is in stock..

I like the sport package, but it does give you bigger, more expensive tires, etc.. So, if you don't need it, pick one without it... You'll save money in the long and short run.. Is this going to be a 4-season car? You'll need winter tires to drive it in Ohio all year round..

Don't be surprised if you get low-balled on your trade.. Can't say that a BMW dealer will be excited about taking a Ranger.. If you are really looking at $6K, and they won't come close, then sell it yourself.. Small pickups sell fast privately, if they are priced right..

Also, make sure that all but tax and license is included in any price they offer.. They can easily hit you with $500 of bogus crap after the fact.. (floor mats?).

Financing? Get that arranged before negotiating.. then, if they can beat your rate, take it..

regards,
kyfdx

zoozeek · June 2005

thanks much... i'll look at costco...

z4girl · June 2005

I bought my Z4 2.5 in October 2004, and the incentive was $5,000 (in California). I am quite sure that the incentive for a 3.0 was $6,500 at the time (in any case it was larger than $5,000). So the incentive was definitely more than $4,500 last year. There might be differences in this by area, though... (BTW, I LOVE that car; it still makes me happy every time I see it in the garage or on the parking lot, let alone driving it...)

vizzini · June 2005

Sigh.... this is such a frustrating experience...

I had negotiated a reasonable deal and then got hit with an $825 "bank fee" and another $375 documentation fee, plus $85 for floor mats. So the deal is $38,500 plus junk = $39,785, with only the first month's payment for drive-off. This is on a 3.0 with a MSRP of about $45k.

kyfdx · June 2005

The "bank fee" is the acquisition fee.. All leases have them..

However, the base fee from BMWFS is $625.. they are bumping it $200 for extra profit..

And, as you've found, it doesn't matter what price you negotiate, if it doesn't include all fees and options...

$375 doc fee is indeed "junk".. floormats aren't standard.. funny how they didn't mention that, huh?

jcraft · June 2005

I am also in the process of buying/leasing a Z4 2.5 and I am getting over $2000 off invoice. I am in So Cal. This is before any negotiation on financing. I am going for 0 down (only security deposit and first month + tax + licensing, roughly $800). Is .0020 the lowest MF I can get?

kyfdx · June 2005

Yes... .0020 is the base rate..

naderz4 · June 2005

Any Inputs?

------------------
I know that the $4500 incentive on Z4 continues on, or let's say I know it is on till end of June. Anyone has any info. on whether it will continue on or stop after June? And, any info. on when it may turn to $6500?

Thanks,

kyfdx · June 2005

They don't announce changes in incentives ahead of time.. It is possible that they don't even make that decision until a few days before... after they see sales reports...

canes04 · June 2005

okay, here's what I got. 2005 z4 3.0 6 sp maldives blue with black top.
only options are heated seats. MSRP 43,045.00 INVOICE $39,615.00

NET INVOICE WITH DEALER INCENTIVE $35,115.00

best I've been able to get so far on a cash deal is $36,915.00

dealer says that they have to make $1800 over invoice. I think there is still some room considering that the car is kind of odd.....no options except heated seats....and I don't think maldives blue metallic is the most desirable color (some feedback on that would be nice too)

should I hold out for $36k or less or is this the best it will get?

jynx · June 2005

1st, thanks to kyfdx for your all help! i've been reading this forum and it's time for me to lease my new car.

By BMW:
Special Lease Offer
Build Your BMW Z4 2.5i Roadster
$359 First months payment
$2,500 Down payment
$400 Security Deposit
$3,259 Cash due at signing

Dealer's stock:
MSRP: $38,220
Stock: 051125
Color: JET BLACK
Interior: BLACK LEATHERETT
OPTIONS
Automatic transmission, fully automatic soft top, heated front seats, xenon headlights

you think the dealer will let me lease it for the same price? only differences are auto top, heated seats and xenon headlights.!!

any advise will greatly appreciated.

kyfdx · June 2005

Who knows what this dealer will take.... but, I think my target would be $36K also..

kyfdx · June 2005

The advertised BMW leases assume a discount from MSRP of about $1000, in addition to any incentives or cap cost reductions.. That leaves them some room to come down more..

The MSRP on the unit you are considering is about $2K more than the advertised example.. To get the same payment as the advertised unit, they would need to discount it $2000 from MSRP, in addition to the $2500 incentive and the $2500 cap cost reduction.. That seems reasonable..

Remember.. this only allows 10K mi./yr.

If you don't make the $2500 cap cost reduction (and, I wouldn't), the lease price changes to $425/mo.

regards,
kyfdx

k2xx · June 2005

I am interested in buying for cash (no trade-ins) a new 3.0 liter Z-4 with the following options: SMG, power top, sports package, premium package, extended leather and sports seats. (BTW, I am also willing to take a vehicle already on the lot, if it comes close to my specs.)

Edmunds shows this package typically going for $44,535. After the $4500 incentive is applied, the final price should be around $40,000. Does this sound about right? Anyone have a recent experience with a similar package.

Thanks for your help.

Best regards,

Joe

pepito · June 2005

Test drove the Z4 2.5 and fell in love with it...now the main question, can i afford it?

Do these numbers look accurate to anyone:
The 2.5 with automatic transmission, heated seats, automatic power soft top & destination charge for $34,240. Is that doable???

Now, since i plan to lease it for 36 mths:
MF: .0020
Residual: 59%
NJ Tax: 6%
Term: 36
No down payment....equal mthly payment of $414.51

Am i missing anything? Did i do everything correct? Will a dealer have a problem with these numbers? And finally...how much am i suppost to come up with when closing the deal?

BTW, for anyone in the north east coast, have you had problems driving the Z4 in the winter (snow,etc.)?

Thank you all for any help!

@.

jlettie1 · June 2005

Be carefull when buy any sports Car BMW,Crossfire,350Z etc all come with Run-Flats. I checked most all manufactures and none will offer a warranty on the Run-Flat tires. Some of the tires are very expensive. As an Example for the Crossfire your talking a set of four tires $800.00. No garage in my area will properly repair Run-Flats. They wear faster and make a lot of road noise. Wish the Auto producers would wake up and switch back to the regular tires. Nissan customer service is receiving so many complaints from angry customers they are dropping the 2006 350Z and the Crossfire is not far behind. I have not received or read how bad the complaints are from BMW. I would be intersted in being informed on this message center.

kyfdx · June 2005

You don't mention the MSRP of the car you are interested in...

pepito · June 2005

The MSRP with options is 37,520.

Thanks.

kyfdx · June 2005

Not sure how you got that payment.. At $34,240, I get $449/mo. plus tax..

However, considering the $2500 dealer cash incentive on the Z4 2.5 (and even if it has expired, the dealer probably received it), you should be able to get a selling price of around $33K..

At $33K, I get a payment of $412/mo. plus tax..

That is with 1st payment, security deposit and acquisition fee upfront...

regards,
kyfdx

k2xx · June 2005

I am interested in buying for cash (no trade-ins) a new 3.0 liter Z-4 with the following options: SMG, sports package, premium package, extended leather and sports seats. (BTW, I am also willing to take a vehicle already on the lot, if it comes close to my specs.)

Edmunds shows this package typically going for $44,535. After the $4500 incentive is applied, the final price should be around $40,000. Does this sound about right? Anyone have a recent experience with a similar package.

Thanks for your help.

Best regards,

Joe

kyfdx · June 2005

What is the MSRP of a car with those options? Edmunds TMV pricing is usually higher than what I want to pay..

pepito · June 2005

Thanks Kyfdx!

I use some lease Excel spreadsheet that i got from the internet. $424.89 includes the tax. I guess something is off on that spreadsheet. Tried it with two different spreadsheets.

Cost of Car $34,240.00
Money Factor 0.0200%
Residual 59.000%
Tax 6.000%
Term 36.00
Actual Lease $14,038.40
Residual Value $20,201.60

Down Payment Mthly DepFee Fin.Charg Tax Total
$0.00 $389.96 $10.89 $24.05 $424.89
$1,500.00 $348.29 $10.89 $21.55 $380.73
$5,000.00 $251.07 $10.89 $15.72 $277.67
$7,500.00 $181.62 $10.89 $11.55 $204.06
$10,000.00 $112.18 $10.89 $7.38 $130.45

Thanks for your help.

kyfdx · June 2005

Your spreadsheet has some problems... it might just be formatted incorrectly, or require more manual inputs..

1) Residual % is figured on MSRP.. 59% of $37520 is $22136.80

2) The finance charge portion of the lease payment runs about $100/mo..

You can refer back to my earlier post for a rough estimate on what the payments should be..

regards,
kyfdx

k2xx · June 2005

Thanks for your reply.

Well, I just got the Consumers' Union pricing info this morning, and it coincides pretty well with Edmund's.

It looks like the dealer's costs run like this:

Base 3.0L vehicle (includes $4500 incentive)...................$33,960
SMG...............................................................................1,425
Premium Pckg.................................................................2,185
Sport Pckg.......................................................................1090
Sport seats........................................................................410
Metallic paint......................................................................430

Total.............................................................................$39,500

I've got an initial offer now for a titanium/black with all of the above (except the sports seats) plus xenon lights ($635) and heated front seats ($455), which I really don't want, for $42,300.

What do you think?

Best regards,

Joe

kyfdx · June 2005

I think you want to be within $1500 of the dealer's cost... They have big incentives for a reason...

Anything more than that seems to be too much...

If the dealer cost is $39,500, I want to be at $41K or less....

regards,
kyfdx

k2xx · June 2005

Thanks for your advice.

Interestingly, I just got another initial offer but w/o SMG and w/o xenon of $39,300, which is $1,610 above dealer's cost. $41,000 does sound about right for the first vehicle.

Best regards,

Joe

k2xx · July 2005

I just wanted to let you know that I did buy the 3.0L Z4 with SMG. Apparently, it was the only SMG available in the northeast. The car has all the usual schmalz (xenon, heated seats, sport and premium packages, BMW assist, metallic paint and hardtop prep). The dealer's cost according to Consumers' Union was $40,915 (includes $4,500 incentive). I paid $40,851. It was the last day of the month, and I suspect they might have been in a cash flow bind.

Here's some additional advice to those who live in the southeast. Dealers there are consistently high. One dealership in Roanoke, VA quoted me the MSRP: $48,500. Another in Winston-Salem, NC quoted $45,949 (included sports seats and driver's fee for bringing it up from Florida). I had precisely the same experience when buying two brand new Toyotas in 2003. The local VA dealer was $5,000 high on each car. I saved $10,000 by merely buying the cars in NJ! Competition is a consumer's best friend.

Again, thanks for your help and advice.

Best regards,

Joe

kyfdx · July 2005

Congratulations..!!

I'm sure you'll enjoy your new car.. The hard part is over... now you get to drive it..

regards,
kyfdx

zedfour · July 2005

I am thinking of buying a used z4 and would like to get some opinions on pricing. The car is a 2003 three liter model with sport, premium, convenience packages, auto transmission, and xenon headlights. It has about 12k miles on it. Not a CPO but has remaining original warranty. Edmunds private party TMV price is about 32600. What would you pay for such a car?

kyfdx, please advise. Thank you all for you help.

kyfdx · July 2005

It is hard to price used Z4s, with all the dealer money they drop on new ones.. Sometimes the deals on the used ones are fair, but don't make much sense, when you consider what you can buy a new one for...

For example... a new '05 Z4 3.0 that has an MSRP of $48K, can be bought for under $41K... (I'm just guessing that would be a comparable price to the one you are looking at).

So... I'm going to direct you to this thread.. Real World Trade-In Values

List as much detail as you can about the car.... Follow the template at the bottom of the thread.. Be sure to tell them that you are considering buying the car from a private party, and give them your city/state.. It might take a couple of days, but at least you'll get a "real" number... based on what dealers are buying the car for at auction..

Then, you'll have to decide if the car is a good value, compared to what else you can buy for the low $30Ks...

regards,
kyfdx

zedfour · July 2005

Thank you for your thoughts, kyfdx. I will post in the other thread you mentioned.

I priced the car using Edmunds TMV and Kelley Blue Book - there seems to be ~1k difference in price, so you are right in that a good value can be tricky to determine.

madabushi · July 2005

Hi,
I was wondering if kyfdx or someone else could tell me if
(1) its worth using these brokers that claim to get your car at wholesale prices? Have people got any good deals using their services? Any loopholes?
I am looking to buy a used Z4 (2.5 would do for me with atleast the convenience package) and am located in SF, CA. I see reasonably optioned 2003 Z4 2.5's with low miles (15-20K) going for between 26K-30K.
(2) Also, since 2003 was the first year of the model would it be recommended to go for the 2004 instead which probably has the tweaks to remove annoying features in the 2003 year model? The problem I see with the 2004 models as kyfdx pointed out earlier is that will all these rebates its worth shelling out 4K more for a brand new car. Any opinions?
Thanks in advance for your advice.

flycaster · July 2005

Was just checking out a Merlo 2.5 Z4 with Premium, automatic and tan leather, wood trim and tan top. Told the GM (Braman at West Palm Beach) that I wanted the $2500 dealer incentive and that I'd pay $1000 over invoice. He said that when I was ready to buy, he'd do it (had to get to another appointment and couldn't wait for the final pricing). So, a this point although I don't know how much they they will cost out the invoice, Edmund's calculations bring me to an invoice of approximately $37,685, and I figure that the car should cost about $36,185 (37,685-2500+1000) before taxes. Is this a good buying price? As the GM took my offer rather quickly, I'm beginning to think that I could have done better (ie, offered less than $1000 over invoice after the $2500). What do you think?

BMW Z4 Prices Paid and Buying Experience

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