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Honda Odyssey vs. Toyota Sienna

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Comments

  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Similar, then. Thanks.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Much is talked about the confusing packages from Toyota, but with a little homework back in 2007 when I bought mine, you could get rough equivalents:

    I will use ~= to mean "roughly equal to"

    Back then, at least:

    Ody LX ~= CE pkg 2
    Ody EX ~= LE pkg 3
    Ody EX-L ~= XLE pkg 6
    Ody EXL-RES ~= XLE pkg 7
    Ody EXL-RES-Navi ~= XLE pkg 8

    and so on.

    Those are the models I considered, at least. I'm sure Touring ~= some variation of the Limited, etc.

    If anything you actually have more combinations from Toyota, even if it's not exactly what you wanted.

    But I could complain about the Ody - why was VCM only featured on the expensive models? Fuel savings for rich people who don't need the savings? The exact opposite would make more sense, IMHO.

    Where's AWD? (Sienna forces you in to run-flats I did not want, not to mention the 7 passenger model only, so problem for both)

    Why do I have to get leather to get Navi or RES?

    Why does the trip computer only come on the big bucks Touring? I love the avg mpg readout on my el-cheapo Sienna LE.

    I think for economies of scale reasons it makes sense for Honda to make packages simple, but it's hard to get exactly what you want. Even when Toyota doesn't, it's still hard.
  • vanneededvanneeded Member Posts: 9
    Sienna vs. Odyssey seems to be the big debate when it comes to vans - what about a newcomer like the VW Routan? How does it compare in value to the Big 2?
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    The Routan is a mildly reworked Dodge Grand Caravan, just an FYI.
  • loncrayloncray Member Posts: 301
    But I could complain about the Ody - why was VCM only featured on the expensive models? Fuel savings for rich people who don't need the savings? The exact opposite would make more sense, IMHO.

    Because the technology costs money. The VCM engine is more expensive than the non-VCM engine, so it goes into the more expensive van. This technology isn't designed to save poor people on their fuel costs, it's designed to make money for Honda by saving the buyers of the more expensive minivans money on THEIR fuel costs.
  • oddyshopperoddyshopper Member Posts: 8
    We recently went through this drill and choose the Odyssey over the Sienna.

    Reasons:

    Sienna fails rear impact tests on the insurance industries rear impact geometry/dynamic tests.

    Currently when you look at all the tests the Odyssey is in the top 1% of all vehicles and the safest mini van. Check out www.informedforlife.com for a nice look at all the data sources for safety.

    Also, Honda, with $3K+ plus dealer incentives was way-more affordable. Way under invoice. CARMAX was actually trying to get us to pay more for a 2008 Odyssey with 6K models then we where getting quoted for on th e 2009 Odyssey new. The toyota dealer did not seem as motiviated....
  • yatesjoyatesjo Member Posts: 186
    I bought a Toyota last year and found that Toyota had the better incentives and their dealers were willing to negociate a lot more. I had a similar experience with the used van market too- late model used vans were being offered for the same or more than new vans.

    I was blown away when I made an offer on a used van based on a reasonable discount from what new car side of the same dealer offered and was dismissed like I was low balling... he actually wanted more than the offer I had on a new van after all the incentives were included!!! I told him he needed to talk to his friends on the other side of the dealership and he responded that they didn't have any problem selling their used vans. I can only guess that there are some people so convinced that they must be getting it cheaper used they never find out what the new ones cost.

    Human psychology can be a funny thing.
  • jayriderjayrider Member Posts: 3,602
    They stand to make more when a sap comes in with a trade in and gets reamed. You wanted a cash price -- bad for their bottom line.
  • skiiiii664skiiiii664 Member Posts: 16
    speterson1,

    I was sitting in an 09 Odyssey EXL tonight with the sales person and we were talking about the center console/tray.
    In reference to the center console, I think Honday could create a hybrid of sorts where they could add some sort of top to the tray that either slid open or ilifted upward. If it was not too deep, it would still be able to fold. Granted, everything inside would slide around when it was folded down although it would really be nice to have that extra storage.
    Also, they can get rid of the 4 cup holders on the center console tray at the same time.
    I mean, how many drinks can you have at one time? There is one cup holder in each door, two that pull out of the dash and four on the center tray.

    Anyhow, I am ranting now.

    I will say that I put down a deposit today and I am picking up a dark red (more like burgandy) EXL tomorrow.

    I picked it up for $ 27,250 + 599 dealer fee + sales tax.

    I am pretty sure that I paid more for my 06.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    Also, they can get rid of the 4 cup holders on the center console tray at the same time.
    I mean, how many drinks can you have at one time? There is one cup holder in each door, two that pull out of the dash and four on the center tray.


    Why get rid of them? Extra storage is always nice. My aunt keeps a bottle of lotion in one, her cell phone in another, and uses the two pull-out holders for actual drinks. She has an 05 EX and likes it a lot.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I'd buy the "technology costs money" argument for the first couple of years, but VCM came out in, what, 2004? Half a decade later and it hasn't trickled down?

    When you're comparing the base models, the Sienna CE/LE come out way ahead because you get the full 266hp plus better city mileage compared to the Ody LX.

    Plus, don't all Pilot and Ridgeline models get VCM? Why go cheap on the base Ody models?
  • lavrishevolavrishevo Member Posts: 312
    1: Timing chain is by far superior. Durability, reliability, and longevity. Loose a timing belt while driving can destroy an engine. Plus timing chain, at least on my Sedona, has no replacement interval. Not to mention the total rip off that Honda changes to replace the belt and overall maintenance.

    2: Hopefully not and probably not.

    3: You pretty much are guaranteed to have problems with power sliding doors / tailgate. These motors and electronics have life cycles that will go bad. It is convenience vs future repair cost.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    The Ody has a timing belt? I thought it was a chain...what's the replacement interval?
  • lavrishevolavrishevo Member Posts: 312
    Ody's have belts, 90,000 is the replacement mileage.
  • easternguy2easternguy2 Member Posts: 14
    I came off a 06 Honda EXL lease and was on the fence between another Honda and a Sienna. In the end I bought the Sienna XLE with leather, roof for $27,000 because (1) it was $1k below the Honda EXL, and (2) wanted something different. However, after driving it for a few weeks, I cant wait to see the new Odyssey in the fall. In the end, I think the Honda is a better choice - if your on the fence. Aside from having a much higher resale, here are differences I have noticed. Hopefully this will help you decide, if you are stuck like I was. I can only compare the EXL to the XLE

    1. EXL comes standard with a backup camera. Sienna you have to buy the NAV (which is a huge expense)

    2. Honda uses Michelin Energy tires (which i had and were great) Toyota does on the LE model but for some reason switches to lower cost Bridgestone Turranzas on the XLE. I cant say how they will perform in the winter/rain, but the Energy's were awesome.

    3. Honda has the variable cylinder management on the EXL. Toyota does not I got about 22 mpg all the time on the Honda. Sometimes 23-24. I just got back from a 2000 drive on the Sienna. highest was 23mpg on all highway. Lowest was around 19 combined. VCM is nice, but not a deal breaker.

    4 Engine was considerably quieter in the Odyssey than the Sienna. Which is unusual. My toyotas have always been quiet. But mine sounds like a truck. I remember driving my Honda to the dealer to turn it in and the engine was silent. Hardly ever heard it. If i remember correctly, the EXL has an engine noise suppessor.

    5. You loose the 8th seat in the Sienna. The XLE drops it. You get a center console that can move from the front to the middle section. I moved the center console to the 2nd row and just use the floor storage. It has worked out fine. But I miss having the 8th seat in the Odyssey

    6. Seats seem to be more padded/comfortable in the Honda. My butt hurts faster when sitting in the Sienna

    7. You will loose huge amounts of cool storage areas with the Sienna. Glove box is tiny. And the upper glove box is a joke. Who designed that. It flips up. So when i open it everything slides out. Honda's flip down, and was 2x the size. You also loose the pockets behind the passenger seat back. Not sure why Toyota did that. Its hard plastic. My kids used that area to put their stuff. You also loose the in floor storage that Honda has in the middle section. We used that on vacations to hold more items. The Honda has a slide out tray under the front passenger seat. Sienna does not. In fact the area below Sienna seats is almost closed off so you cant slide anything under them from the front.

    8. 3rd row seats are difficult to fold down on the Toyota. I still have not figured it out. Honda is easy. No brainner. Even when i get it fold down in the toyota is not totally flat. Its 2" higher than the rest of the floor. Hard to explain.

    9. You get a lovely antenna mast on the XLE. LOL. Who in the heck has those anymore! Especially on higher end models. Toyota better drop that one! Honda did not have this on the EXL

    10. Slightly less foot room for the front two seats. I noticed why. The Sienna angles the sides, where the Honda doesnt. It gives you a few extra inches in the Honda.

    11. 3rd row has less leg room in the Sienna. I never noticed until I had it a week, Who sits in the back row before buying a car? Try it out if you use it. I have to move the 2nd row seats forward if an adult needs to sit in the 3rd row. In the Honda, I never had to do that.

    12. Sienna 2nd row seats flip up. This is really nice. Especially to clean under the seat. Honda does not have this feature

    13. As someone mentioned in an earlier posting, Toyota switches are not illuminated at night. At night I have to fumble around if rolling down the windows.

    14. Ride - I find the Sienna a little smoother.

    15. This is not by design, but if you have DVD players that strap onto the headrests, the Honda has plastic handles towards the top of the seat backs in the 2nd row. It works great to also hold up DVD players that are strapped to the headrests.

    16. You get a rear spoiler with the EXL. Sienna its a $500 option.

    Thats about all I have noticed between the two models. You wont go wrong with either model. But dollar for dollar, I think the Honda is a better buy in the long run.
    Hope this was useful.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I'll comment on a couple of those items..

    #4 - the new 3.5l V6 in the Sienna has a timing chain, which is a bit noisier than a belt, but doesn't need to be replaced, either.

    Overall noise levels are lower, so the engine may just stand out more to you.

    #7 - my Sienna LE has a slide out tray under the passenger seat also, you may want to double-check that one.

    Also, the space for the lazy susan in the Ody is used by the spare tire in the Sienna, but that's why the cargo area is about 4" wider (53" vs. about 49"), a useful advantage.

    # 8 - there is a video that shows you how to use the seats, they will fold flat once you figure them out. It's not hard, IMO. Plus remember you can get power folding seats in the Sienna and that's N/A on the Ody.

    #9 - I'm not sure about now but the JBL sound replaced the mast antennae with the one in the window. Oddly enough my LE came without the mast, they forgot to put it on, because most Siennas simply don't need them.

    Just my $0.02.
  • killmeisterkillmeister Member Posts: 1
    I have had two Odysseys so far and they are great for highway driving especially.e were turned off a lot by the 14+packages that Toyota Sienna wants to force you to choose. Some free advice, albeit too late to help you. If you want things like Navigation, DVD player. do what we did and buy aftermarket devices. E.g., garmin Nuvi 260W for $200 or Panasonic DVD player for about $500. Honda wants 2-3 times what we paid. I hate it when they make you have leather seats (we don't like leather) in order to get cruise control......what a joke! Conversely, it's my belief that vehicles as big as the vans are should be required to include a backup device. Instead they all like to tell you how many cup holders they have. Only a moron would make cup holders a deciding factor in their purchase.
    :mad:
  • olavanmanolavanman Member Posts: 12
    Hello Thegraduate!
    Have you or anyone out there struggled with the fact that the Odyssey comes with only 3 LATCH connections? 2 in the 2nd row and 1 in the 3rd row.
    We have two kids right now and when relatives come over, we are concerned this might be a problem.

    The Sienna LE 8 Seater has 5 LATCH connections, 3 in the 2nd row and 2 in the 3rd row.

    Any thoughts, opinions on this? any help would be much appreicated.

    Cheers!
    Ola Van Man
  • olavanmanolavanman Member Posts: 12
    Hello Familyman!
    Having fun with the new Ody?

    Have you or anyone out there struggled with the fact that the Odyssey comes with only 3 LATCH connections? 2 in the 2nd row and 1 in the 3rd row.
    We have two kids right now and when relatives come over, we are concerned this might be a problem.

    The Sienna LE 8 Seater has 5 LATCH connections, 3 in the 2nd row and 2 in the 3rd row.

    Any thoughts, opinions on this? any help would be much appreicated.

    Cheers!
    Ola Van Man
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I did that, too.

    We got a 12" DVD player from Circuit City before they closed, it was $900 installed, plus it came with 2 wireless headsets.

    Plus we got a Nuvi like you did, except ours is a Nuvi 200W. It was $200 at the time.

    I'm sure from a manufacturer the two combined would cost a good $3-4 grand!
  • cimbrianocimbriano Member Posts: 6
    Can anyone tell me what Sienna model/options would be the one to compare to the Odyssey EX-L with no nav, no dvd. I want to make sure that when I go dollar to dollar I am doing so with very similar vehicles. Thanks!
  • pray4allpray4all Member Posts: 15
    Several ppl comments on using aftre market DVD player.

    But if you are getting Ody now, the price difference between EX-L and EX-L w/RES is just over $1000, and it's facotry installed with wrty..
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    For the 2007 models it was closest to an XLE with package 6.

    They shuffled the packages (EVP 2 is close to the old pkg 3 on the LE models) but grab a Sienna brochure and it shouldn't be too hard to find it.

    I bet it's a XLE-5 or XLE-6 now as well.
  • easternguy2easternguy2 Member Posts: 14
    Cimbriano,

    Check out my posting a few above. I listed a lot of the differences between the models. You are comparing a Sienna XLE w/leather, roof, alloys, (option pkg 2 or 3 - cant remember - there are so many packages with Toyota) to the EXL. You might want to print off a comparison on line between the two models to see the exact differences. You wont go wrong with either model. I have owned both. Dollar for dollar I think the Honda is a better choice in the long run - considering residual, and the strong incentives Honda offers. I also think you should be able to get the Hondas for less. Their lots have been full around me. Overflowing. Toyota scaled back production, and it seems their lots are thinner. Both are coming out with new models in the fall if you can wait.
  • oddyshopperoddyshopper Member Posts: 8
    "Also, they can get rid of the 4 cup holders on the center console tray at the same time. "

    I've had the Odyssey for a week or two now and while I had the same thought on the test drives, now that I'm using it I love those little center console cup holders.

    Once in a while I use them for a soda but for the most part they make great holders for our two cell phones and other small odds and ends.

    I wish that pop out cup holder in the front dash was something more functional. I'd love to have another compartment to thow some stuff in like the portable GPS.

    > Are there any "after market" replacements for that center dash cup holder? With the door and center console cup holders I never use it and would love to have another compartment.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I use the similar tray in my Sienna all the time as well. In fact I wish it had 6 cup holders instead of just 4.

    I put my BlackBerry, the wife's, plus a coin dispenser so loose change becomes organized change.

    That's 3, so to be honest gimme 7 total so I can still hold 4 cups!
  • minivansoonminivansoon Member Posts: 1
    I am the mother of two children 1 and 3 both in car seats. My concern is over car seat placement between the two cars. For now most of the time I will be driving with just two children in the car but I was planning on placing at least a one permanent extra car seat for car pool which could easily turn into 2 extra car seat if we have 2 additional kids in the car. In addition, we also could have a third child in the near future which means daily getting to the back row for child placement. It seems that getting to the back row to physically place a child in the car seat is a bit of a hassle in the Sienna.
    I really want leather as fabric stains which nixes that optional 3rd second row seat in the Sienna. Leather means Captains Chairs. So if two children are in car seats in the captains chairs how much room do you have to haul a third child to the back row?

    So if people were to plan on having 4 car seats which van would they choose? Do people think the ability to place the two big seats net to each other with a side passthrough in the Odysesy makes it much easier to access the back row with little ones. It seems like it would.

    I currently drive a Subaru Outback and would have the tendency to go Toyota Sienna for the AWD option-- I hate to give that up as I LOVE my Subaru but it seems that the interior of the Odyssey is more functional. Any thoughts?

    Thanks
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    The bigger kids can buckle themselves, so I would not worry about having to climb in to buckle up kids in the 3rd row. Just put the big kids back there.

    Or...put the bigger kids in booster seats in the 2nd row. Booster seats are easy to remove, so you can flip and fold the 2nd row captain's chairs (I don't believe you can do that in the Ody) and have wide open access.

    With 3 kids I would seriously consider getting a cloth LE model, though. The mess usually ends up on the child safety seat or booster, not on the chairs. Our booster seats get filthy but the seats below are pristine - brand spanking new.

    With that model, you can seat 5 people and never need the 3rd row, so you'll use it seldom, only when carrying 4 or more kids.

    We have a nanny and 2 kids, and the 3rd row is folded and we enjoy 98 cubic feet of cargo space. Sweet.

    I like the idea of being able to move a captain's chair towards the center, but frankly Mazda had a much more elegant solution - you could slide the chair sideways. In the Ody you have to tilt it up, so you can't do that with a child sitting there.

    I bet you do not need more than 5 seats most of the time. That's what we find.
  • chuquechuque Member Posts: 6
    Or (to minivansoon) if leather really is important to you (like it is to me) you can get aftermarket leather on a Sienna LE. I got quotes from the $1200-$1500 range. And I think most people would say aftermarket leather is better than the factory leather.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I may get some for my Miata. I've seen some beautiful back/blue two-tone seats, and I could add seat heaters. :shades:
  • decondecon Member Posts: 56
    Is it me or does the Sienna accelerate smoother than the Odyssey. The Odyssey has a little "jolt" before accelerating.
  • hause7hause7 Member Posts: 153
    We noticed the same thing when we were looking for a replacement for our 04 Sienna we test drove an odyssey and it felt sluggish and when you take your foot off the gas it feels like it slows down way too fast. So we ended up with our 07 Sienna which is a rocket.
  • decondecon Member Posts: 56
    I really liked the interior of the Odyssey, the Sienna felt like a boat. It's a toss up for me still. The rear view mirror on the Odyssey and viewing angles from the driver seat were better.

    I don't think I could stand the acceleration not being smooth.
  • fillykonkfillykonk Member Posts: 17
    We don't notice any acceleration problem in our 09 EX-L at all. There may have been a difference with the 07 model a previous poster seems to have driven (assuming an 07 Ody was compared to the 07 Sienna purchased). I would test drive a couple if you haven't already and take it from there.
  • westk1westk1 Member Posts: 9
    I just purchased a 2009 Odyssey EX. I was very close to getting a Sienna LE when I took a close look at interior seating space. The Odyssey definitely has more leg room in the 2nd and third row for passengers. Also a bit more head room in the third row seat. Since I have three full sized teenagers, this was the deciding factor. The rear cargo area also seems to be slightly bigger. If you look at the Toyota comparison tool which lists the passenger dimensions, you would not think there is much of a difference, but from a practical viewpoint, there really is. I would say that if you are going to used the third row seats for full sized passengers on longer trips, the Odyssey definitely is more comfortable.
  • berriberri Member Posts: 10,165
    Maybe the Ody is a taller cabin? Seemed to me that the Ody was more like a conventional minivan while the Sienna was kind of like a crossover. Our Ody got prettty noisey from weak door seals and a lack of sound insulation. I was definitely not impressed by the workmanship of the Alabama factory that made it. However, mechanically its been good.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
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    I don't see one being more "crossover" than the other. The Odyssey does definitely drive more like a car than a van/truck though.
  • berriberri Member Posts: 10,165
    I meant that more form the perspective of driving position,etc. For example, the Ody seat seemed to have more up and down travel so it may be taller inside from floor to roof?
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    Ah... the only thing I've noticed is that the Odyssey has a more carlike feel when navigating around town. Sorry I misunderstood the "crossover" part! :shades:
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    The rear cargo area also seems to be slightly bigger

    How are you measuring?

    The Ody has the spare tire on the side, so it's more narrow back there.

    Cargo width is about 49" in the Ody, which is good, but the Sienna clears a full 53". Length is about the same (both fit a 96" sheet of plywood on the floor with the gate closed).

    If you go by EPA measures, Sienna had more cargo space behind the 3rd row, behind the 2nd row, and max with all seats removed. You can also fold the front passenger seat flat, for long items, which I don't think the Ody can do. I brought home my deck planks that way and that really came in handy.

    For cargo the Sienna wins hands down.
  • toyojunktoyojunk Member Posts: 19
    Not true almost 5 years later. The Honda Odyssey retains resale value much better than the Toyota Sienna, Chrysler Town & Country, etc.
  • toyojunktoyojunk Member Posts: 19
    The Odyssey definitely has better leg room and more comfortable seats for ALL passengers but the Sienna has the most cargo room and the Sienna cargo room is more efficiently used by having the air intake for rear air/heater located high on the right side of the cargo area. It is easier to get into 3rd row seats of the Sienna than the Odyssey.

    With a Sienna, you choose between 7 or 8 passengers at time of purchase but with the Odyssey, you can have 7 or 8 any time you want. The 8 passenger Sienna does NOT have fold down armrests in the middle row but in the Odyssey, there are fold down armrests for both outer seats. When the Odyssey 2nd row armrests are folded down, the middle passenger in the 3rd row has to be quite small to fit between the 2 folded down armrests. Our 6 year old grand daughter thinks the middle seat fits her just right when the armrests are folded down.

    I like the Odyssey spare tire location much better than the Sienna location (which is the same difficult place to access as the Chrysler Town & Country).
  • yatesjoyatesjo Member Posts: 186
    Hansienna is that you?

    Per Edmunds True Cost to Own, a Sienna XLE loses 51.4% of its value versus 49.4% loss of value on the Odyssey EX-L. That's not a big difference if you ask me. I didn't bother to look up the T&C, but forget 5 years... 2008 T&Cs already have a 50% discount around here.
  • ronjackronjack Member Posts: 2
    Hello,

    Does any one have experience with the 2006 Odyssey VCM engine.? Does it really save much gas?

    Also, looking at Sienna versus Odyssey 2006 re: passenger power seat. Toyota has one. Does Honda, at all?

    Thanks.

    Ron
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Another source, ALG, gives both vans the same rating:

    https://www.alg.com/deprratings.aspx

    An average or so rating of 3 stars for the Sienna, but guess what? Ody does no better, also 3 stars.

    Having said that, this is one reason why both vans are discounted more nowadays.

    My cousin actually paid full MSRP for her Ody (back in 2002 IIRC). $25 grand for an LX, so I'm sure if she goes to trade it in today she'd complain just like hansienna has been (of course that's him).

    As for Dodge, they also get 3 stars per that same chart but note that ALG dropped residual values on Chrysler products by 6% as of May 8, 2009, and that's probably not reflected yet.
  • jimbob1jimbob1 Member Posts: 70
    Does any one have experience with the 2006 Odyssey VCM engine.? Does it really save much gas?


    On a trip last May from the Philly area to Orlando, I was getting 27+ on most tanks. The flat terrain helped a bunch. (5 adults, 1 kid, luggage for a week.)

    On a trip about 3 weeks ago to western Virginia - 300 miles, I got 26+ there and back. Not so flat terrain, but only 3 adults, overnight bags, and several briefcases.

    The VCM does help IMHO, but getting and staying in VCM is the trick- speed and terrain. Although the Orlando trip included a lot of miles with my son driving 75 -85 because I was too tired to hit him with a tire iron. I'm still surprised that loaded up behemoth of a van got that kind of mpg.

    I'm more in the 18 - 20 mpg range in normal mixed driving.
  • ronjackronjack Member Posts: 2
    Thanks for the info. Do you notice any difference in sluggishness when it drops down in cylinders? hen you bought the Odyssey, wre you looking specifically for the VCM option.?
  • decondecon Member Posts: 56
    I test drove the Odyssey EX (no VCM) and the Odyssey EX-L (VCM). The EX seemed more uncomfortable (not as smooth) accelerating. I can detect the VCM cylinder changes in the accelerator going from ECO to regular.
  • jimbob1jimbob1 Member Posts: 70
    I wasn't looking for VCM, but I figured if anyone could engineer it well, it would be Honda or Toyota. I did want leather, so the VCM came along for the ride, so to speak.

    Most of the time, I can't detect when it goes in or out of VCM. Occasionally, I think I can, but I'm not really sure.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    FWIW, our friends in Tucson own an Ody with VCM and let me drive it for a day, and I could not tell when VCM was active besides the "ECO" light in the dash.

    My complaints were more related to road noise, but the VCM was just fine. Didn't seem to go on very often, though.
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