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Porsche 911

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Comments

  • chrmdomechrmdome Member Posts: 107
    Greetings:

    I often read posts which ask what they should expect to pay for a new or used 997. My take on this is that obviously you should do your homework and get what you feel is a good , fair and reasonable price with the understanding that " Buyer beware " is a practical issue to keep in your forebrain. The often missed issue is this: you are also buying history, racing experience, and ownership in the best built sportscar for the money in the world. Does the Corvette offer you history?? Given, the Porsche is a more expensive car, but check out the interior on the new Corvettes... no comparison, I wouldn't shell out $65,000 for a car that comes with blems on the leather and scuffs on the plastic.. My car was delivered in PERFECT condition.. not a single scratch or knick. I will never drive my 997 170 mph, but knowing I can is enough. Every time I turn that ignition key I get a smile on my face....I could care less about the depreciation... I'm keeping this car for a long time. It's comforting to know that a Porsche family member had input into the design of my car, not a board of 100 designers in Detroit who are employees rather than owners. The next time you question whether a Porsche 997 is the car for you, go take a really close look at the lines, design and build quality of the roof on a 997 coupe, flip those little built-in clips for the roof rack and see what you think. Porsche put more thought into those aerodynamic little gizmos than Chevy put into the entire interior on the Corvette... With a Porsche you are investing in a part of the dream that is Porsche..
    I've been dreaming that dream since I was 18..ya, the last 40 years
    Chromedome
  • blckislandguyblckislandguy Member Posts: 1,150
    Chromedome, you and I are of the same generation. I knew a guy back in the 1st Cav with the same nickname. When he was in Pleiku he would tell the girls who worked in the "laundry" to call him Chromedome. Any connection?
  • markgc4smarkgc4s Member Posts: 23
    Oil change ran me about $200. Car running great! Noise gone, hope that it was a one timer thing.
  • spechtbachspechtbach Member Posts: 16
    I have a 2007 C2 and love the car but I would not be so critical of the Corvette. I think the car has wonderful engineering.I purchased a 911 but the Corvette is very close.Have you driven a Corvette?
  • chile96chile96 Member Posts: 330
    i've driven a corvette C6 Z06 and was VERY impressed with the factory power output but that was about it. It's a great bang for the buck but its still got cheap looking plastic parts inside that resort back to its GM heritage.

    But to each their own.....there are some kids who grow up dreaming of a 911 and some that grow up dreaming of a vette. You'll never be able to change their dreams for better or worse so let 'em be ;)
  • ringleader6ringleader6 Member Posts: 43
    Really, I did not know there were any colors other than silver or black. Seriously though, I had a GT Silver 06 and just purchased a Black 07 although thought about white for a few seconds, to be different. Still think the Silver is the best looking car day in and day out. Black is so difficult. I think most Porsche buyers realize the popularity of the basic colors on a resale demand and I believe most Porsche owners tend to be relatively conservative people anyway. The price of the vehicle tends to limit the market to more conservative people.
  • thesnausagethesnausage Member Posts: 10
    I was considering adding the K&N air filter to my 2004 911 Carrera. The price is a bit steep ($291.95) with a posted 23 horsepower gains. Has anyone installed this and if so, have you dyno'd your car before and after. Did you notice a performance difference.

    Thanks
  • habitat1habitat1 Member Posts: 4,282
    Where in the heck are you getting your information?

    According to the K&N web site, the air filter for a 2004 911 runs $81, not $292. And the estimated increase in horsepower is 1 to 4 horsepower, not 23. I have heard positive things regarding K&N air filters, but wherever you are getting your information from is way off.

    The increase in going from a 997 to a 997S (3.6 liter to 3.8 liter) is "only" 30 horsepower, and that effectively costs about $6,000. Do you honestly think you could get 75% of that benefit from a $90 air filter? If so, I have some "wet" real estate to sell you. ;)

    K&N Homepage
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    No way I'd put that on a 2004 911. Porsche engineers do not leave much HP on the table and I doubt you'd gain anything whatsoever except more noise and more maintenance to do. Drop in "special" filters without modification of intake and exhaust is a waste of money and potentially troublesome IMO.
  • thesnausagethesnausage Member Posts: 10
    http://www.automotion.com/productpage.aspx?pid=103664&name=K%26N+Intake+System

    K&N Intake System

    by K&N

    $291.95

    CARB Certification Pending Add 23hp to your 1999-’04 996 Porsche® With K&N’s® Aircharger Intake Kit
    It’s hard to believe that the Porsche® O.E. intake system is as restrictive as it is, but repeated dyno tests on several 996s have shown that the K&N Aircharger adds 23 horsepower. And the best news is that it uses the O.E. mass-air sensor and requires no custom programming. The installation is simple too – just remove the factory intake and replace it with the K&N Aircharger that fits in the same location. Made out of advanced composites, the HDPE intake tube provides a direct, unrestricted path to your engine for maximum airflow. The K&N high-flow air filter is a 360-degree conical design with carbon fiber lid that provides plenty of clean, cool air. Hot under-hood air is isolated from the filter by black powder-coated sheet metal baffles that incorporate the factory cold air duct. You can plan on the K&N Aircharger performing like new for years to come with its million-mile washable and re-useable air filter, and quality kit components like silicone connecting hoses. Finally, power you can feel from an intake kit! For normally aspirated 996 only and will not fit GT3.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Well that's advertising for you. I'd love to test it on my friend's dyno under close supervision. We did that to a similar system on an Audi and actually lost horsepower on one pull. Best result was about 2 HP which was statistically irrelevant. That was enough for me.

    Problem with dyno testing is that you can dial in any horsepower reading you want to see. Dynos are so easily to fudge. Here's how:

    http://www.turbomagazine.com/tech/0402tur_dyno_tricks_problems/
  • chile96chile96 Member Posts: 330
    also - the ad you refer to is talking about replacing the intake "system", not just an air filter. i'm a pretty active enthusiast with plenty of mods on my porsches and have yet to hear of anybody owning up to utilizing this K&N air intake system. Who knows - maybe you could be the first? ;)

    Also, be weary of using the K&N air filter. Some have had great success, others...not. Problem is that the K&N has some oils in the filter(not uncommon) to help collect particles and prevent "drying out" which is theoretically good but Porsche's MAFs are very sensitive to any changes....so much so that oil residue from these K&N filters have led to mucking up the MAF and causing the car to go into limp mode. Some have intentionally dried out their K&Ns by letting them sit but then the filter loses part of its function and particles get through which again, mucj up the MAF

    The notion of being less restrictive, and increasing air flow is great EXCEPT for Porsche's MAF system. Thus many have chosen alternate routes in order to tack on extra HPs. The most popular and succesful ways have been so far with less restrictive cats and new mufflers ($2500-5,000+) and/or reprogramming the DME (flashing) which will run about $2000. These two methods have the most pronounced effect with turbo cars. It's difficult to do much with NA cars.

    Good luck and enjoy the modding....there is plenty more to do but this is just a start
  • habitat1habitat1 Member Posts: 4,282
    At least that clarifies your previous post - it's the air intake system you are referring to, not the air filter.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Also, don't confuse "CARB pending" with CARB approved. CARB pending means they submitted an application.
  • habitat1habitat1 Member Posts: 4,282
    You appear knowledgeable on the subject, so if I might ask a question.

    I have a 2005 C2S with the "Sport Chrono" and "Porsche Sport Exhaust" options. Neither of which are officially credited with any increase in power. But, when activated together, they sure seem to make the car feel quicker. In addition, the Sport Exhaust is, I believe, the same one that is included in the X51 package that does officially add 25+ horsepower.

    Do you think that either the Sport Chrono or Sport Exhaust add to the standard Carrera S output?

    At one point I had considered selling my 2005 and getting a 2007 in a different color. I would have ordered the sport chrono for $920, but may have foregone the sport exhaust for $2,400. Would I have noticed a difference in the performance?
  • tgenoyertgenoyer Member Posts: 4
    does anyone have any experience with the smartTOP-997 roof control unit?
  • chile96chile96 Member Posts: 330
    all the sport mode does is just make the throttle repsonse quicker - doesn't increase the power at all. the sport exhaust doesn't add any power either, well maybe 1-2 HP by being barely less restrictive. of course there is an increase in the sound that makes you feel more robust and powerful but in the end it does not change any performance numbers unfortunately
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Well said.

    Something everyone should keep in mind, especially with any high performance car like a Porsche:

    From the air cleaner on one end, through the engine, and to the exhaust tips on the other end--- is basically one long tube...and if you don't address the entire length of the tube, then what you do on just one end or just the other end, isn't going to amount to very much in isolation of the entire system.

    So, more air needs more induction needs more fuel needs more cylinder breathing, needs more compression needs more fuel charge cooling needs more exhaust needs more $$$!!

    Mr. S
    visiting Host
  • chrmdomechrmdome Member Posts: 107
    Greetings:

    No , sir, I am not that individual. I have been fortunate that the present style allows me to complete shave my head, baldness hidden! At 57 years old and 35 years of marrage, I am totally at easy with myself . All I can say is that at this time in my life I am completely enjoying myself and the Porsche is a big part of that..

    Good luck and enjoy your car

    Chromedome
  • chrmdomechrmdome Member Posts: 107
    Sir:

    I have been in a few Corvettes and have driven my brothers' 2006. The angle at which you sit is a problem for me, the materials are common to Chevrolet. ( I own a 2007 Silverado, Crew Cab, so I like Chevys ) For the buck , I do not enjoy the conotation (sp ? ) of being one who wears silk shirts, gold chains , fake chest hair and spandex pants. Barbie dolls with blond hair sticking outside the windows smoking Camels is not my idea of a cool car. Okay HP!! Lots of it, but I don't want to spin the tires. With a Porsche you buy exceptional build quaility, materials and history. I will stick with that and leave my retired military brother to the Corvette.

    Oh well....
    Chromedome
  • chile96chile96 Member Posts: 330
    This is one of the few forums where I cannot be traced so I have a anonymous question that I would appreciate honest feedback.

    'A gentleman recently saw a car of mine (older ferrari) at a car show and told me he;s interested in buying my car. This car took me 18mos to find(very meticulous and wanted the best of the best). I've never thought about selling the car and always planned to just have it "forever" but he's offering 40% more than I paid for it just 6mos ago. And yes I paid fair market value and it has gone up but not nearly that much!

    Am I crazy passing this up? Yeah the money would be great but some things just aren't about the money. I can't ask my wife because I know what she would say ;)
  • chrmdomechrmdome Member Posts: 107
    Sir:

    I went nuts when I sold my 1976 914 2.0. It had 36k miles afeter 4 years and was in perfect condition. I was always sorry I sold that car because I loved it. The fastest car in 1st and 2nd I have owned. If you actually love the car, don't do it, if it's a step up to a car you will love, do it!

    Chromedome
  • chile96chile96 Member Posts: 330
    i've decided it's staying. none of the "fun" cars are planning to be sold, just added on to so by the time i'm 50 i should have a pretty good size garage ;)

    and i definitely don't want to be one of those guys who kick themselves for selling a certain car - not gonna be me ;)
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Don't forget you'll owe capital gains tax, too. :cry:
  • spiritintheskyspiritinthesky Member Posts: 207
    Back in 1979, as a 27 year old single guy with a good corporate finance job, I purchased one of 455 original BMW M1's. I sold it about 3.5 years later after getting married and my wife was pregnant with our first child. I had paid $60,000 new and sold it for slightly more to a collector w/ 25,000 miles on the odometer.

    My decision to sell was not as much motivated by financial need as it was time and interest. I knew that I wouldn't get to drive the car as much with a young family and I also knew that any exotic car of that day required a fair amount of routine maintenance and care. I had a great mother and father who spent all their free time with us as kids, and I didn't want to be tinkering with a car when I could be coaching baseball.

    After the sale, I put $50,000 of the proceeds into an investment account and my wife agreed that, if we didn't use it up to fund the kids college tuition, I could splurge as an old man on another sports car. Well, here we are. I'm an old man (funny how your perspective on being 55 changes when you actually hit that age). We got the kids through college (almost) via other means. I coached baseball. My kids want to vacation as a family, even when they are in their 20's. I've even snuck in a sports car or two in the intervening years, thanks to other good investments. And we never touched the "M1 Investment Account".

    Every once in awhile, when I see an old BMW M1 at a car show or even see a picture of one, I get nostalgic. But I never regretted my decision to sell - it was the right one at the right time. My advice is that if owning a Ferrari is your dream and you feel you deserve it, by all means, enjoy it. But do not think of any car as an investment, think of it as an expenditure.

    P.S. That investment account? It now has a $1,924,000 balance (about 16.5% average annual after tax return over 24 years). If I really get nostalgic, I could buy 15-20 M1's. ;)
  • chile96chile96 Member Posts: 330
    wow - that's quite a little stash for a rainy day ;) kudos!

    i haven't looked at this car as an investment, rather as one of the cars on my list of "Cars I want to own". It came true and never really planned on selling it unless a financial crunch dictated so. So when I was approached I saw I could look at it one of two ways:

    1. Look at it as if someone just decided to give you an extra $X and not taking this is costing me $X to keep it

    OR

    2. Does this extra $X (if I sold it) have any sort of financial impact on me now? The answer is no but then spiritinthesky's post about $2M - that does have a financial impact on me ;)

    Enough of this, the car is going to grow old with me (Knock on wood) so let's get back to talking about wasting $$$ on Porsches
  • chile96chile96 Member Posts: 330
    and by the way - thanks for responding to this question non-judgmentally (I am very down to earth but realize how this could come across to some the wrong way)....and sorry for the off topic nature
  • chrmdomechrmdome Member Posts: 107
    Hey:

    Everybody with a brain for Porsches and fine cars understands. If you are a " car guy" you just are... I have lived and dreamed Porsches for 40 years. There is not a day that goes by that I don't look at my 2006 C2S and say " this car is way cool ". I will have it for a long time... one of my ( lucky ) kids will get this one . I have only 2238 miles on it..after 19 months of ownership, okay a garage queen... but it's in absolutely PERFECT condition.

    Chromedome
  • habitat1habitat1 Member Posts: 4,282
    "I have only 2238 miles on it..after 19 months of ownership, okay a garage queen... but it's in absolutely PERFECT condition."

    ..After 19 months of ownership of my 2005 C2S Cab, 13,600 miles and it's in PERFECT condition. I think my daughters have logged twice as many miles in the back seat than you have on your car. But if you are happy that's all that matters.

    Part of the beauty I see in the 997 is that it CAN be driven daily. If I had a bit more disposable income and wanted a pure garage queen, I might have been tempted by the Ferrari 430 that I could have picked up for MSRP in September 2005 (unique circumstances). But even though that $190k would now be worth $250k +/-, I wouldn't have had a fraction of the fun I've had with our "family car". ;)
  • tomtomtomtomtomtom Member Posts: 491
    I have it over a year now and love it. Took less than 15 mins to install.
  • chrmdomechrmdome Member Posts: 107
    Greetings:

    Yes a " Garage Queen " and then we step over to the area of discussing your or my definition of " Perfect " . My description includes: no dents , dings , stone dents , pings, stone chips, scratches , smuges, swirls ( either straight or circular, ) lint on the carpet, stains, water marks, inside window scum buildup, excess crap in the trunk.. back seat or glove compartments, any brake dust on wheels, or brake calipers, or on back of wheels. unwaxed surfaces or unwashed surfaces. Yep I'm nuts about Porsche.. but I have known people worse than me. Here in Southern California there are many car crazy epople. The weather allows you to keep cars really clean and rust free for years..and when you add German anal retentive qualities to ones heritage you get me. My wife knows i'm nuts. Thank God
    I have other cool cars to drive

    Chromedome
  • redsoxgirlredsoxgirl Member Posts: 67
    We have a couple of generations of "Porsche nuts" in my family. Starting with my uncle who raced for Porsche for over 20 years and my brother who continues to serve as an engineering consultant for Porsche's recing team.

    But I must admit that I would side more with habitat in that Porsches are designed and meant to be driven. The Wall Street Journal had an interesting cover story on Ferrari this week, talking about the 2-3 year wait list on most of theri models. They broke their promise to limit production to 5,000 vehicles a year worldwide and pumped out 5,500 last year. Porsche produces a little over 100,000.

    If you "garage queen" a $95,000 911S for 5 years and 10,000 miles, each one of those miles will have cost you about $4 just in depreciation. If you hang in there for a $190,000 Ferrari 430, garage queen it for 5 years and 10,000 miles, you will MAKE $4-5+ on every one. Yet, if you drive a 911 for 40,000 miles over those same 5 years, the depreciation will not be significantly worse. On a Ferrari 430, you will get creamed.

    Maybe it's because I come from a family of racing enthusiasts that I see no point in admiring, but not DRIVING a Porsche 911. I am fortunate enough to have inherited some original Gustov Stickley furniture pieces and a couple of Picasso's and Dali's (small). They make for a nice appreciating "view" in my condo. But I can't wait to get my 911 C2S to the Porsche track events and, if the end result is a stone chip on the fender, I won't shed any tears. A wreck into the wall would be another matter.

    As far as your definition of "Perfect", you obviously have high standards. What is your definition of "Cool" as in your other cars? Mine is such that there are only a handful that qualify, all more expensive than the C2S.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Not only are Porsche not "fussy" like other exotic cars, and usable as everyday cars, but the resale value is not as adversely affected by high miles. Whereas a Ferrari buyer would cringe at a Ferrari with 60,000 miles on it, a used Porsche buyer will still seriously consider a 150K--200K Porsche if it looks good and has service records.
  • chrmdomechrmdome Member Posts: 107
    Greetings:

    Everyone has a different station in life, obviously yours is elevated from mine. My top car is a 2006 C2S. Other cool cars by my definition are a new 2007 Chevy Silverado CrewCab and a 2004 BMW 5 series. " Cool " and "Perfect " are on a sliding scale for everyone. What I enjoy, you may not. Your day at the tract may be my day at the beach , I surf so a good day of slids at the local reef keeps me happy. Keeping my Porsche in perfect condition by my definition fullfills my dream...enjoy life and no worries..I'll never have a Ferrari or a Picaso.. don't want them or a Rolex.. but I am really happy. Don't need the bling, and I didn't buy my Porsche for anyone but me.
    Chromedome
  • woody1173woody1173 Member Posts: 5
    Hello - I've been following this board for a while (THANKS to everyone for all the helpful posts!) and getting close to pulling the trigger on a 911. I've decided on the C2S Cab. The main options I want are nav, bose, chrono, & heated/pwr seats. Not much else matters. This will be my daily driver, commuting car (except on the worst winter days I'll use the SUV). MSRP/invoice around $101/88k. What would be a good discount, considering the season? Some dealers don't have many or any in stock. I'm thinking maybe $8k?
    My preferred colors are meteor/atlas grey, basalt black or midnight blue. But I also like the Carmona red. What is the general view on resale value for Carmona red?
    For those of you with cabs with black interior: when you leave the top down in the sun, don't the seats get unbearably hot? I don't like the beige interior, but I don't want to have something that is unpleasant to use.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Leaving the top down with the sun beating on leather is a no-no. :cry:
  • marinedocmarinedoc Member Posts: 8
    My last two Porsche's were both C4S models. Maybe overkill for routine driving, but I did do several track days with my 2002. As for price, Porsche' does not manufacture as many of these models as they do the C4 and CS, so the dealers are usually a little more reluctant to "deal" on the C4S. Black upholstery will be hot top up or down (one of mine was black exterior and interior) and the current is silver (coupe) with black interior. It is much cooler when left in the sun than the all black.
  • tomtomtomtomtomtom Member Posts: 491
    If you really want to enjoy YOUR car, don't worry about the resale value and get the color and options you want. If you are going to leave the top down under the sun, it doesn't matter what color your interior is, it's going to burn you. I have a SY C2 Cab with black interior. I always close the top when parked and it doesn't take long for the interior to cool off with AC on and top down.
  • ringleader6ringleader6 Member Posts: 43
    Carmona red with beige is a nice choice, better than the red with black. About 6-7% is the going discount. If you found a red one, you should make a move, or you may be looking at an 08 with higher prices and less discount. I personally did not think much of the chrono, especially considering the potential use. For some reason nav is not on many of these cars, and terribly expensive to dealer add.
    You are correct, there are not many of these out there, and appears there will be less for the US market.
  • habitat1habitat1 Member Posts: 4,282
    A few comments:

    On price, I would think the best deal you will get will be on an in-stock 2007. But you may need to take a color combination that isn't your first choice or some additional options you don't want. The closer you get to the release of the 2008's the better your negotiating power should be. I got a 10% discount on my 2005 in September 2005. 7-8% should be achievable now in my area, but pricing seems to vary by geography. On the other hand, if you want to order the car exactly as you want it in your preferred color combo, you will likely get slightly less of a discount but will save on unwanted options. At this point in the model year, if I were to order, I'd probably wait and go with a 2008. The price increase probably won't be that significant, and made up in resale value.

    On options, no disrespect to ringleader, but the $920 sport chrono is well worth it, IMO. The increased throttle and braking response in sport mode is enticing. And, given that you are going for an "S", with PASM standard, it makes for a very sporty combination. The chrono part is a bit of a gimmick, but the sport part isn't, IMO. If I was cutting out an option on your list, it would probably be the Bose. I haven't heard the base system, but the Bose upgrade is not very impressive. And driving around with the top down, I doubt you could tell a huge difference. I have the Nav and it's a pain to use compared to our Acura's, but it still is valuable enough in my travels.

    On the color, I have Seal Grey / Black and have not had a problem with the interior getting too hot. I do leave the top down on occasion, but not at high noon on a sunny day. I think the Carmona Red is a great color for the 911 and think it looks best with a black interior, although that's obviously highly subjective. I'm also a big fan of tomtomtom's Speed Yellow/Black, but the Carmona Red is a bit more conservative, while still being different than the mainstream silver/grey/black.

    Good luck.
  • tomtomtomtomtomtom Member Posts: 491
    image

    image

    Same Carmona Red under different lights

    More colors here:

    http://www.porschepassion.com/colours997.htm
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 235,217
    Now.. someone is going to think that car is purple!!!

    I agree about buying what you want.. but, if they are cutting you a deal on that color, they have a reason... It will be a tough re-sell..

    Edmunds Price Checker
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    Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!

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  • tomtomtomtomtomtom Member Posts: 491
    you got two colors for the price of one lol
  • habitat1habitat1 Member Posts: 4,282
    "It will be a tough re-sell.."

    Not in my opinion. I've seen the color in person and it looks like a deep rich ruby pearl / maroon, not Barney purple. Photo's can be deceptive. Take a look at the samples in the above post. The "Seal Grey" bears no resemblence to my car. It looks more like BMW's "Steel Blue".

    But hey, colors are subjective. I actually thought the "Phoenix Yellow" on the BMW M3 looked great in low light / dusk when I first saw it. My wife saw it in bright sunlight, and relabeled it "Regurgitated Green"
  • woody1173woody1173 Member Posts: 5
    Thanks to everyone for the very helful comments. I am close to making a decision. The price is a bit more than I wanted, but I may go for it anyway. One more question: any thoughts on the "wheel spacers"? What and why?
  • ringleader6ringleader6 Member Posts: 43
    Yes, the wheel spacers get the wheels and tires out flush with the wheel openings of the body. Makes a nice smooth line look. If you select either the turbo or carrera sport option wheels they are wider and come with larger tires to give the same effect. In fact the spacers are not compatible with these two options. When I came down to making my purchase the two finalist were one with the turbo wheels and one with the sport option wheels with the spacers factory installed. On further investigation, I learned the turbos came with larger tires. When you compare the spacer cost against the larger tire cost, it made more sense to me to go with the larger tire and footprint option and not the spacer. You get the flush look either way. This info does not appear on the Porsche website, I learned from my knowledgeable sales person at Brumos........when I inquired as to why there were two "sport" wheel options. I went with the turbo.......
  • habitat1habitat1 Member Posts: 4,282
    Woody,

    Even though everything about ordering a 911 is subjective, let me make this one easy for you. Forget the $500 5mm wheel spacers. According to my dealer (a former Porsche factory engineer), they put that one on the list just to see how stupid some buyers (Americans) might be. And although he was half kidding with that comment, he was half serious.

    5mm is about 1/5 of an inch. If you can actually see the difference, it will only be after a bit of eye strain. And, by the way, if you are getting a C2S with the standard 295mm width rear tires, those wheels will accept the 305mm width tires that come on the C4S and Turbo. Havign just replaced mine at 12,500 miles, the cost increase to go to 305's vs. 295's would have been $20-25 per tire on the Pirellis or Michelins. The 10mm wider tires will have 5mm of width added to each side of the wheel, essentially producing the same effect as the spacers. At less than 10% of the cost. (And if you do get the spacers, you have to remove them if you decide to go with the wider tires).

    Porsche gets away with charging insane prices for some of their options. I now try to abstain from calling someone "nuts" for spending hundreds or thousands of dollars for color coordinated seat belts and rear center consoles with speed yellow instrument guages. After all, it's their money. But even my dealer jokes about the $500 5mm wheel spacers. Apparantly, it was Porsche's "official" answer after hearing of some owners who achieved the same effect by purchasing ten 5mm washers for a grand total of $2.00 to slip over the lug bolts before mounting the tires.

    Next time you are in a dealership, look at a C2 (without PASM) next to a C2S and post what you notice is the difference in appearance. Hint: I'm not referring to the wheels and tires, and it's more than 5mm. If you are sharp enough to identify the difference, then maybe you would actually notice the 5mm wheel spacers. But even then, I'd strongly recommend getting 305 series tires in a year or buying $2 worth of washers today. But please don't waste $500. There are better ways to spend that money in a 911. I'd even put my somewhat frivolous $1,990 sport exhaust as way, way above the wheel spacers in financial prudence and bang (or boom) for the buck. ;)
  • 07997turbo07997turbo Member Posts: 31
    I have been a "Porsche Nut" for over 30 yrs now, having finally purchased what I believed to be the pinnacle of Porsche last fall with my latest acquisition of my 997 turbo for roughly 127K. My next purchase will be one of the new RS models (Still investigating and comparing performance data at this point) I started my life long passion with a used 914/2.4L and have never let go of the Porsche tradition since. As for "Cool" or "Impressive", I dont really buy them for that aspect. I buy and drive them because it brings me great inner peace and happiness. Granted, I am NOT one of those people who ALWAYS obeys the speed limit and some here will say I am dangerous to other drivers... I contend that such is not the case.

    In any event, if you are going to purchase a high end car, be it a lotus, ferrari or Porsche.. make sure it makes you happy when you drive it. To hell with what others think. Personally, looking at a Picasso hanging on a wall doesn't bring me to that "Place"... that is what stocks an ETF's are for :-)

    T from NH
  • redsoxgirlredsoxgirl Member Posts: 67
    Not sure why you addressed your post to me, unless it was to agree with my point that modern Porsches are best appreciated when they are actually driven.

    I must say, though, this "great inner peace" and "bring me to that Place" talk is a little creepy, even for someone with multiple family members on Porsche's payroll. I'm getting visions of Gene Wilder bent over working on the engine bay of a 997 and suddenly proclaiming "It's ALIVE!". ;)

    Seriously, please enjoy your 911TT as you see fit - on the road, in your garage, or even in your living room. As far as "comparing performance data" with the RS, that's a tough one. The high revving, high strung, RWD, lightweight GT3 might not seem that much different on paper than the 911TT, but is a very different driving experience in person.
  • woody1173woody1173 Member Posts: 5
    Thanks Habitat & Ringleader. That is basically what I assumed. I was hoping someone could come up with some vague notion of performance enhancement, but alas, no. I honestly don't believe I can see the difference, at least not in pictures. In any case, I have located the car I want, and will likely pull the trigger soon. It has a few more options than I want (including full leather, which is nice, but I'd rather not pay for it). However, for various practical reasons related to my unique financial situation, I can save money by buying the car now (as opposed to ordering it), and this car (which includes the wheel spacers) is the closest to the one I want.
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