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Last week, while I was still trying to decide, I was offered a brand new 2005 997S Cabriolet with Tiptronic for a boni-fide $9,500 off MSRP of $103,480, down to $93,980. This was not a car my dealer had in stock, but they could have traded for it. I have the actual VIN and option list. There are 47 miles on the odometer. I declined but, to the best of my knowledge the car is still available at a New Jersey dealership (don't know which one). If one is in the market for a Tiptronic, I suggest scouring for inventory now and over the next few months. My dealer has indicated that many of the stock ones out there are being discounted (quietly), including 2006's.
Hi, Piscean,
It's okay to post the name of a dealership and location (we encourage it!), but we draw the line at posting contact information or specific names of salespersons. Hope this helps :-)
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Need help getting around? claires@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.
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Did you hear about the real estate boom?
The salesperson at Riverhead was a straight shooter and asked me what I wanted for the trade-in. I replied. The manager agreed (after inspection of my 350Z). I was then offered 2005 prices for the 2006 Carrera S Coupe that I was ordering. Then it was a done deal. No problem.
Now, I will be waiting.
Regarding oil changes: what do you guys think is the appropriate mileage for the first oil change ( the dealer says one thing and mechanics say another)
What do you think should be the real answer ?
However, now a friend who has owned (3) 911's over the past 5-6 years ( a 993 and two 996's) has forewarned me that the Cabriolet does not handle nearly as well as a Coupe and that he recommends against me making any decision until I test drive the Cabrio. He has taken a couple of performance driving schools and took each of his 911 coupes to the track on several occasions, so I respect his opinion. Nonetheless, it was difficult enough finding an unsold 997 couple to test drive that I am asking for other poster's opinions to help answer this question.
997 Coupe vs. Cabriolet handing??
Try posing your question here:
All things Porsche
There are limited discussions of old Porsches, but if you post there, Mr.Shiftright will see your post, and he is an expert on pricing old Porsches..
A couple of things he'll need more info on:
The stock engine gets 200 hp... what kind of mods on that other engine, and how do they affect driveability? (stock always brings the best money).
How many miles on the car, and it's condition, outside of the rebuilt engine? (condition is everything on an old Porsche).
Seriously... the car could be worth anywhere between $8K and $20K... Are you selling or buying?
Don't forget to post in the other discussion, though..
regards,
kyfdx
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My 06 997S came with Pilot's, and they should wear just like the Pirelli's; melt really fast.
Steebie :shades:
If this has been answered already, kindly forgive me asking it again. I know the 4s for 2006 has the expanded (larger) rear wheel "haunch" above the wheels in the sheet metal to make room for the wider rear tires. Does anyone know if the sheet metal on the 4 (NOT the s) is the same, i.e. also has the wider "haunch". I really like that look and am hoping the 4 "looks the same" there as the 4s.
The Carrera 4 and Carrera 4S both have the wide body--the 4wd implementations generally add the same new features to each. The already existing distinctions between the "straight" Carrera and Carrera S follow through to the "4" models.
Well that's certainly sending out mixed signals in your personal statement, dweiser
In your case, the Honda Element tells us that you're a thrifty, cost conscious person, but you want to let the world know that you're a bit of a non-conformist. Is your Element bright yellow, btw?
In the case of the Porsche, you're telling us that you don't necessarily care about costs, and you're more of a performance vehicle type of person with a sleek looking car.
It seems to me that we have mixed signals here from you. That's not bad, but it's just...different.*LOL*
Yes, I am a thrifty cost conscious person and a bit of a nonconformist; artist, photographer, Philosophy Major.
www.whitesquirrelart.com
You're a tad off on one thing however, my Element is khaki, wouldn't be caught dead in a yellow anything I'm afraid.
Perhaps I'm just a complex highly intelligent (Mensa) type who can value the attributes of two disparate vehicles.
Or maybe there are times when I will have more than one other passenger or have the need to haul something home from Lowes or Home Depot.
Or maybe I owned a Porsche 1600 normal Cabriolet a long time ago, just turned 60, buried my beautiful wife (who owned two Porsches) 10 years ago at the young age of 42, and wanted to own another before it's too late.
The only downside is having to order a couple of months in advance and then, after the pick up, letting go of your new car and waiting another 4+ weeks to get it back in the States.
Thanks!
I have travelled to Europe fairly extensively, so the novelty of a trip to Europe isn't a factor for me. It really is up to you as to whether you want to make an "event" out of getting a new 911. And if you haven't been to Europe, this is a heck of a good excuse.
On the other hand, for anyone considering a BMW 550i (or any non-M BMW), their ED program is almost mandatory. My dealer will give me a $3,000 discount off the already $4,000 discounted ED price, for a total savings of $7,000. The ED cars do not reduce his US allocation, but go towards his sales bonuses. For at least 6 months, he will not be offering anything more than a $1,000 discount off the US MSRP for a stateside delivery. Saving a net $6,000 is a no brainer for crossing the Atlantic.
Good luck whatever you decide, at least you can't go wrong with the car. Really exceptional.
Now, of course, the C4 has been released, and, though I have an order in for a C2 Cab to be delivered in November, I'm reassessing the 4WD question. I've been told that the extra weight in front makes the car less fun to drive and, of course, slower. Also that the 4WD won't really help that much in snow (I'll get snow tires in any case), that it's more a matter of improved stability.
How much safer will the C4 be in snow?
In my opinion, you need to seriously re-think your idea of trying to use the 911 as your only car. I am from the Pittsburgh area and our winters - and roads - are bad enough that I would never consider beating up a $90k sports car sloshing through snow , salt and other crap in February.
Rather than spend $6k+/- more on AWD, another $2k on winter rims and snow tires (which do nothing to raise the ground clearance of the undercarriage), and incur the additional depreciation that will undoubtedly occur through winter use, I suggest you stick with a C2 and buy yourself a secondary winter vehicle. The only reason, IMO, that someone should get the C4 is if they prefer the way it drives and handles on dry roads and occassional rain. Personally, I do not, and prefer the lighter weight C2, especially in a base, 325 horsepower 911.
The C2 will serve you just fine on that lucky day in February where the sun shines and the roads are clear.
I don't think the extra traction supplied by the AWD will make that big of a difference... the tires will be the biggest gain... Plus, you'll have better handling and less weight all year round.....
Just my $0.02..
regards,
kyfdx
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The added traction (which is more for rain and slippery roads than snow) alone is worth it to me--not to mention the additional peace of mind it creates.
Remember: all Turbos are 4-wheel drive . . . so I'd hardly consider it to be a "bad" feature.
Also, the dreaded "extra weight" is only 121 lbs--which is an increase of less than 4%.
Many reviewers agree, including our host site:
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Drives/FirstDrives/articleId=106184?tid=edmunds.h..to- pfeatures.porschecarrera.0.*
Title: All-Wheel Drive Makes the Carrera 4S an Even Better 911
First Impressions: Better-looking and easier to drive than the standard model, the Carrera 4S is as good as a 911 gets — for now.
Quote: "It's not until you lay into it around a tight bend that you begin to appreciate the Carrera 4's extra grip up front. Unlike the standard Carrera, which requires just the right amount of throttle, steering and confidence to get around a corner quickly, the 4S just yanks you around it. You never feel the power shifting between the front and rear wheels, it just goes right where you point it."
Just my $0.02.
I decided to go ahead and order a 997 C2 Cab S, also for November delivery. When I inquired about the C4 instead of the C2, the sales manager discouraged me. He showed me a recent article - by R&T or Motor Trend - in which the reviewers spoke reasonably highly of the 997 C4, but then concluded it was not something they would buy themselves. They claimed that the refinements in the 997 made the C2 a much better handling car than the 996 and that the C4 did not further improve it to the extent of justifying the added cost or weight. My sales manager is an accomplished track driver, so it was hard for me not to heed his advice, especially when I was already over $100k for the Cab S.
It seems the C2 vs. C4 issue will be debated for a long time and ultimately becomes a personal preference. I may still try to drive them both back to back if the opportunity presents itself before my car comes in.
Porsche seems to operate on their own schedule . . . . I do know that I'm getting the first one that that dealership is receiving.
Since I am particularly careful with $50k+ machines that I don't own (out of respect and $$ reasons), I can't truthfully say that my drives were able to discern significant differences between C2 and C4. Also, the weather doesn't always cooperate (i.e., is good when you don't want it to be) . . .
My choice is more based on theory and input from car reviews. The 911 has beautiful but quirky handling . . . . It is scary to some, exhilarating to others. Myself, I am in between.
However, when it comes right down to it, I am more than willing to sacrifice understeer for traction . . . . And as I said before, they put this feature on their top cars (i.e., the Turbos) . . . so its cons can't be all that bad . . . . And you've got to love the wide rear fenders.
Re: dealers. Everyone I talked to tried to dissuade me too (didn't use MT articles, though). I took this as a "set the hook" routine, for what it's worth.
However, your tone is exactly right . . . it ultimately is an issue of personal preference/comfort. Enjoy your car either way.
-BS
But on the subject of dealers--I find mine varying from the lackadaisical (their schedule more important that their customers', fast food containers in the showroom, failure to communicate among themselves, inability to answer or research questions) to pushing abusive (telling me my color choice was a waste of money, denying that options shown in the on-line configurator even exist.) I'm considering walking (assuming I'll get my deposit back) and doing business with a less convenient establishment, but I noted a post earlier about poor service quality among Porsche dealers.Is it really unlikely to find someone who will treat you well when your spending $100k?
I see you are from Boston. Washington DC area Porsche dealers and salespeople are a mixed bag as well. I've ordered from a Pittsburgh, PA dealer (Auto Palace). We have a second home in PA about 130 miles from them. They offered to meet me halfway and provide a loaner whaen I need service. Fortunately, the new service intervals are pretty long (2 years / 20k) and hopefully I wouldn't have too many little items come up.
I do think it is worth shopping around for a decent dealer that you feel comfortable with. I have since found one or two in the DC area. It helps that the excessive hype on the "new 911" has worn off somewhat and inventory is catching up with demand. A dealer with unsold $100k cars on their lot tends to be a little more polite than one with a pre-sold order list covering the next 6 months.
Good luck.
http://www.canadiandriver.com/articles/mlf/06carrera4.htm
Enjoy,
Don
No. Your dealer sucks, plain and simple. IMO sales people from the owner on down rarely know the product as well as they should, so don't depend on them to educate you. However the good ones aren't a-holes and at least know how to accomodate customers.
It takes a lot of interest and research on your part to get to know these cars. Read, read, read and if you have time hang out with enthusiasts, but I'm sure you are aware of this As far as finding a good dealer, go to rennlist.com where you'll get immediate recommendations. My Porsche dealer is nothing like you described. They are gentlemen and the service department treats me like I treat my clients, with respect. From what you describe I would have no problem dumping him, and if he acted that way to me I wouldn't have even gotten as far as you with the order. He has to give your deposit back.
Did Auto Palace give you a better deal than Sewickley Car Store in Pittsburgh? If so, that's great but I am surprised...
Tell me more about your experiences with Auto Palace and Sewickly and any "heads up" I should be aware of.
Also, I can pick up a new 2005 for an even better discount locally. Any thoughts on a 2005 vs. 2006, since there aren't any changes. I'd be saving a total of another $4,000 +/- considering the additional discount and price increase.
Thanks to everyone in this forum for sharing comments, opinions and experiences.
Thanks
PC4S