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Porsche 911

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Comments

  • ifpskenifpsken Member Posts: 39
    Any comments out there about purchasing the extended warranty on a 997 turbo? I was offered a 7yr 70,000 mi warranty for $6,000. I was told it was a good price because there is no price difference (from Nat'l Underwriter) for turbo vs non-turbo. The dealer is giving me a couple of days to decide. Also, any comments about the different companies and their history of paymenmt?
  • habitat1habitat1 Member Posts: 4,282
    That price sounds very high, if it is ineed the same for a non-turbo. My Porsche dealer recommended Fidelity Warranty Services through JM&A Group. I was quoted around $5,500 for a 7 year, 100,000 mile warranty. However, the clock doesn't start ticking until the warranty is purchased, so if I bought now (1 year after buying the car) it would effectively be an 8 year/100k warranty.

    Warranty Direct recently sent me quotes of $4,200 for a 7 year/75k mile "Luxury care" bumper to bumper and $3,700 for a similar length "SecureCare" Plan with a few more exclusions. Their "MajorCare" plan which covers most big ticket items is only $2,200 for 7/75.

    I am not going to buy an extended warranty until at least a year from now or later. They have little value on resale and if you buy a 7/75 when the car is new, you are effectively only getting 3 additional years and 25k miles over the factory warranty. I'd rather wait until I decide how long I'll keep the car.
  • ifpskenifpsken Member Posts: 39
    Thanks for your response. I have never purchased ANY type of extended warranty, but the finance guy at the dealer gave a superb explanation that had me reaching for my checkbook!! He was an XLNT salesman. I hesitated and told him I would do further checking and now with your info I have a good start. His comment also was, National Underwriter was (in his opinion) the best warranty to purchase. I will check into the names you have mentioned. Thanks again!
  • blckislandguyblckislandguy Member Posts: 1,150
    In general, what a car dealer loses in the sales cubicle with big discounts, he more than makes up in the F&I Room. Heck, how else could a dealer sell a car at invoice and pay his light bill if his F & I guy wasn't making money on mop 'n glo, extended warrantys, finance deals, the hold back, etc. etc. In my limited experience though most Porsche dealers don't play games on F & I.

    Having said all this, my dealer didn't even suggest the invisible film stuff for the front end sheetmetal. I had them put it on my Cayenne for $700 or so and highly recommend it.
  • jeff911sjeff911s Member Posts: 9
    Geico gave me a ffree extension to 7 years and 100,000 miles as part of my regular insurance...Im not sure why but I wont question it , the deductable is 250.00
  • habitat1habitat1 Member Posts: 4,282
    Hey, I have GEICO. Tell me more. I know they have an extended warranty program, but I didn't think it was free.

    Also, for what it's worth, they initially quoted me around $1,100 a year for my 911, and then the first bill came in at around $2,000. Turns out they rated the 911S in the same category as a Carerra GT. Took quite a bit of work to get them to give me the same rate as a base 911, but they finally did.
  • chile96chile96 Member Posts: 330
    Guys - please don't buy these extended warranties! These F&I guys will say whatever it takes to sell you these(they're marking them up 100% BTW) and each dealer will sell usually just one company's warranty and of course say it's the best, most reliable, been around the longest, etc....

    This was all told to me first hand by the F&I guy at the Porsche Dealership who left for the mortgage business.

    He told me that they would absolutely LIE to do whatever it took to sell these warranties and tire coverages. I already knew this but he said most of the time, these company's would declare bankruptcy and all their assets would be in the Bahamas so they would be untouched. They would start the company over again under an adjusted name and not have to honor any previous issued warranties.

    Seriously, for $5-7K, put that money in the bank and collect interest(albeit tiny). Once in a blue moon something big will go out and at most cost the amount of the warranty - but even if it was covered by the warranty(which they'll fight tooth & nail), you'll still have to pay some of it out of pocket because they'll say, "Yeah, we'll cover the clutch but we won't pay for the labor on X(which has to be done) or this or that. And we'll also only pay $40 per hour for labor, not the $110 your porsche dealer charges"

    I know there have been SEVERAL threads on Edmunds about these extended warranty companies and how they're screwing people left and right.

    FWIW, I have not had any experience with these companies so I am not bitter - just don't like to see honest people getting screwed over. So if you're a crook, yeah - go ahead and buy one - they're great! :D
  • habitat1habitat1 Member Posts: 4,282
    In general, I would agree with your "caveat emptor".

    However, I would also assume that most people successful enough to buy a 911 are also smart enough not to be easily and imprudently pursueded by the F&I guy. It's relatively easy to shop around and look into the credentials of the various companies offering these warranties. Pricing is negotiable as well.

    It is absolutely true that the probability you will spend more than $5k on repairs on a 911 is less than 50/50. Otherwise, all of these companies would be out of business. Same is true for the collision component of your auto insurance. I am paying $2,000 a year on our three vehicles for that, and haven't had an at fault accident in 15 +/- years. Geico is $30k ahead on me. Should I drop collision on our 911 and save $800 a year? (I have raised the deductable to the maximum $1,000 already).

    Point is, with a 911, an out of warranty engine replacement (rear main seal leak) is $15k+/-. Replacement of the navigation system if the screen dies is $4k +/-. Electrical gremlins at 60k miles - who knows? There are lots of other items that would cost hundreds on a Honda that cost thousands on a 911.

    I am absolutely NOT advocating extended warranties. In fact, I doubt I'll get one because, for me, a $15k engine replacement is a low probability item that, if required, would not bankrupt me. But others may have a different risk profile, to which I would recommend shopping hard and doing lots of research.

    P.S. We probably will get an 8/120 extended warranty on our MDX. It's relatively cheap ($1,500) and I'm not completely convinced that the automatic transmission woes of Acura have been solved. More importantly, it is thoruhg AcuraCare - a factory program that pays 100% of the costs and there is no third party company to deal with. BUT, we have been offered the plan from a midwest dealer for $500 less than the DC dealers were willing to discount. So "caveat emptor" still applies.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Exactly---these are really insurance policies, not warranties; and like insurance companies, they are betting your car will not break and you are betting it will. The higher the insurance policy, the less confident the insurance company who are presumably reading all the repair stats on your model.

    You definitely have to read these "warranties" over and see what the exclusions and deductibles are. They will rarely match a factory warranty.

    they are a product like any other and you can shop around.
  • jeff911sjeff911s Member Posts: 9
    $1100! Im paying $2400! 39 years old great driving record and in NYC am I missing something? 2,000,000 coverage though.

    As far as I know, thats all there is to it, that on Brand new cars they offer the program automaticly, call them for more info? what is everyone paying for insurance?
  • designmandesignman Member Posts: 2,129
    Im paying $2400! 39 years old great driving record and in NYC am I missing something?

    You're missing the green grass and arbor canyons of the suburbs. NYC insurance is expensive. ;-)
  • obsessed4obsessed4 Member Posts: 1
    I am interested in finally joining the Porsche family. I am researching everything Porsche to learn as much as possible. I want to purchase a 911TT. Where can I get the annual production quantities?
  • ifpskenifpsken Member Posts: 39
    Thanks all for the responses to my Extended Warranty question. At least I now know I have plenty of time to make a decision to purchase one or not.

    When I gave the 997 Turbo info to my auto insurance broker, the insurance quote was $1,000 PER MONTH!!!!! As it turned out, my company, Mercury, simply did not want the business. He searched the market and directed me to State Farm. I paid $473.23 for 6 months (Orange County, Calif)! I found that it is best to search your local area market for the best rates.

    I recently had a Clear Bra installed, $625. Any pro or con comments?
  • ifpskenifpsken Member Posts: 39
    Anyone have sources for replacement of the front bumper spoiler? It seems that I am not being careful enough entering/exiting driveways and I would like to have one ready to install. Porsche parts quote $200 which seems reasonable, but I may as well check other suppliers.
  • jeff911sjeff911s Member Posts: 9
    Had it put on for the entire nose and 1/3 the hood, the mirrors, and the wells behind the doors, $700, saw some very light bubbling that can only be seen from an angle, the istaller said that it will settle down in time, not sure how true this is, but thats what he said, as I said its slight. Was told to have it done before thae car left the dealership, as to avaid trapping dirt under the film.
  • blckislandguyblckislandguy Member Posts: 1,150
    Habitat1, what about Porsche's CPO program? How good is that? Jags, LR, and BMW offer good CPO programs that give you much better (i.e., longer) protection than buying a new car. Unlike Jag or LR though, Porsche's don't depreciate much so a used 997 is still going to be close to the new price.

    Speaking of prices (you all know that this is one of my favorite topics), I think that Porsche resale should get even better as they trot out ever more expensive variants on the 911. There has to be a halo effect that would extend down to a "lowly" base 997. I mean, even an upper middle class guy should be able to catch some spillover effects from the truly high end people (entertainment lawyers, trust funders, Silicon Valley types, hedge fund managers, joint MD/JD's, etc.) buying GT-3 RSs, now-used GT Carreras, 997 Turbos, 997 Targas, 997s with Aero kits, etc.

    I think that the rear main seal (or RMS as the car mags say) is confined to early 996s. Speaking of 996s, I get the impresssion that you are adamant that a 996 is far inferior to a 997 and you wouldn't even consider one. Is it just the interior and the RMS leak?
  • ifpskenifpsken Member Posts: 39
    Porsche had quoted me $1,000. You received a decent price from the dealer. My installer was very intent on my being pleased with his work and came out again 4 days later to replace the one wide bumper piece. He had also stated that the bubbles would settle down and sure enough, two little ones are now gone. I have noticed orange peel differences between the manufacturers. 3m which I have seen on the Lotus' have an excess amount of orange peel, VentureTape is what was installed on mine and it has less orange peel.

    The install can be done anytime, your dealer must have made that comment so he would recive the sale. My installer clayed the surfaces before installing.
  • habitat1habitat1 Member Posts: 4,282
    I didn't consider a used Porsche, but you're right, their CPO extended warranty is pretty impressive. My friend with the 2001 Turbo actually considered turning it in off of lease and then repurchasing it with the CPO warranty. Until he drove a 997 S. His 2001 Turbo was turned in with less than 12,000 miles in 5 years. His 2006 997 S coupe has 2,500 miles in 3 months. That should tell you something.

    I am not "adamant" that the 996 is "far inferior" to the 997. It's just that the 997 appeals more to me as an daily driver and I appreciate the performance improvements as well as the aesthetic ones. But, if you can get a good deal on a CPO 996, you aren't going to get a "say what?" from me.

    P.S. It appears the RMS leak has occured on some 997's. None that my dealer is aware of, but check out the "Rennlist" forums. That is why I was religious about following break in recommendations and post them monthly.
  • designmandesignman Member Posts: 2,129
    I’ve read the break-in procedure that you posted in the past and follow it religiously myself despite the camp that believes you should "drive it like you stole it." However I don’t recall reading anything that associates the RMS issue with break-in. From what I understand, the problem stems from the seal and engine design in addition to exceeded tolerances. In any event, definitive explanations for the issue seem quite elusive. Personally, my intuition tells me it is possible for break-in affect the RMS just as it affects the rest of the engine, but it seems nothing about it has really been fingered.
  • svinaiksvinaik Member Posts: 84
    I have recently purchased slightly used 2005 C2 and getting it financed through my credit union. They have offered me a 5 Yr / 75000 mile extended warranty @ $ 1700 (with $ 250 deductible) or $ 2700 (no deductible).

    The years and miles are after the original warranty expires. This means that along with 2 years of original warranty + 5 more yeras, I will have 5 years warranty.

    I am sure I will be signing this up (opting for $ 250 deductible options) and on checking with the credit union folks, they personally had very good experiences with this.

    I feel somehow more confident about warranties offered by Credit Union folks than the dealers promoted companies.

    Anyone with additional perspective. Thanks
  • habitat1habitat1 Member Posts: 4,282
    Regarding RMS and break in, I can only tell you that my sales manager (who formerly worked at Porsche headquarters and seems to have a lot of technical/engineering knowledge) gave me that advice. He indicated that a high percentage of the RMS issues they had on 996's (and Boxsters) could be traced to a lot of short hop driving during break in. The typical story is Dr. X. buys a new 911, lives 5 minutes from Johns Hopkins but just can't resist driving the car back and forth from work, day after day, during what should be the break-in period. The engine, oil and seals never get a chance to fully warm up and expand, then cool down and seal/seat. A year or two later, bingo, RMS leak.

    The RMS leak issue has not, to my knowledge, been fully explained in any "official" Porsche customer communications. I couldn't even confirm that there really was a change from the 996 to the 997 in the RMS design. Shame on them. It's one of the few smudges on Porsche's integrity that I am aware of.
  • blckislandguyblckislandguy Member Posts: 1,150
    I wonder (it's Sunday PM and no parts departments are open) if the part number for the RMS for the early 996 is the same as for the late 996? Same as for the 997? What was the fix that Porsche did to the 996s? This might help to tell us if the problem has persisted into the 997s.
  • jeff911sjeff911s Member Posts: 9
    What do you mean Clayed the surfaces?
  • ifpskenifpsken Member Posts: 39
    Hello Jeff, Clay is a method of cleaning the paint surface. Visit this internet site:

    http://www.griotsgarage.com/catalog.jsp?&SKU=11153

    It will describe how clay is used. I use Clay Magic instead of the Griot's product but I use a lot of other Griot's products.

    I picked up my Turbo on a Friday night and clayed it Saturday after I had wiped it down and discovered quite a bit of either paint overspray or some other type of contaminate on the surface. Now it shines like a new car should!!
  • jeff911sjeff911s Member Posts: 9
  • dweiserdweiser Member Posts: 288
    On Speed TV later this week and here:
    http://www.mpt.org/motorweek/reviews/rt2602a.shtml
  • slickokoslickoko Member Posts: 8
    Habitat,
    Did you get a chance to talk to your local dealer about a Turbo 911 (Tip) at MSRP? I had one lined up at my local dealer and they sold it out from under me. Thanks!
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    For those who have asked about the rear main seal leak in the 996 models, I've inquired through a major Porsche engine rebuilder in the San Fran Bay Area and here's what he says:

    He says the problem lies in the new engine case designed for the 996, which uses 6 main bearings in stead of the old 8 mains in the 993. For this reason, he presumes, the crankshaft is not adequately supported and may....may...caused movement of the seal and leakage.

    The current remedy is to use an improved seal, which is installed in a very non-intuitive manner, that is....DRY, and with the crankshaft area DEGREASED and with no one even TOUCHING the seal surface prior to installation.

    As to what % of 996s leak or how likely yours is, he really can't say....but he does see this problem and it is well-known in Porsche circles. Yours is probably fine but it's a good thing to watch out for.

    Another thing he suggests is that if any 996 owner is having difficulties with heating system components, such as blown out heater cores or radiator overfill jars, this indicates excessive cooling system pressure possibly caused by a bad head gasket. So if you see these symptoms have the engine tested immediately.

    Hope this helps. If the 997 case is the same engine case, then we may see the same problem...if it has been re-designed to improve this situation, then okay I guess.

    Porsches GT and racing motors are, curiously, 993 engine cases modified for water cooling.
  • hotrod88hotrod88 Member Posts: 17
    Hi all --
    Perhaps others have similair observations - please let me know, because I am worried that perhaps I have a bum transmission in my 2006 Carrera S. Shifting into higher gears is sometimes silky smooth, and other times feels "tight" or "stiff". I always push clutch in all the way before shifting. Also, sometimes I'll be sitting at a stoplight, and it will not go into 1st. Releasing clutch and then repressing solves this. Lastly, sometimes it feels like you can feel a gear mesh when shifting - is this what people refer to as knotchy? Thansks.
  • habitat1habitat1 Member Posts: 4,282
    I haven't experienced any of what you describe. My 2005 shifted great from day one and continues to do so. The only slight stiffness is when it is cold, but that is mild and goes away quickly.

    I suggest you try driving other 911's at your dealership for comparison. If your's still seems tight, stiff, notchy or whatever, then you can grab the service manager and have him check it out.

    P.S. Was the car brand new when you bought it, without demo miles? A friend went to try out a "new" 911 several weeks ago at one of the local dealerships. As it turned out, it had over 900 miles on it and he also claimed it didn't shift as smoothly as mine. Perhaps coincidence, perhaps not.
  • habitat1habitat1 Member Posts: 4,282
    Slickoko,

    the sales manager was out for two weeks, back Monday. But the assistant SM indicated their next unsold allocation is for a December build, Jan/Feb delivery. They have had all Turbo allocations pushed back 1+ month and the next 3-4 incoming are sold. But its a relatively small dealership, so keep checking around from your end.

    Also, he indicated Tiptronic was considered an "option" and could be specified on any 911 allocation 4+ weeks prior to the (starting) build date. That sounds different than what you heard. However, the assistant sales manager is a glorified sales person, whereas the manager is much more knowledgeable about the vehicles. I'll let you know if I hear anything different on Monday.
  • mafitchmafitch Member Posts: 15
    I have had this exact problem in my 2006 C2 Cab. The not being able to get into 1st gear has happened to me on more than one ocassion. So far I have been able to resolve it by holding the clutch in and pulling down into 2nd and then up into 1st but I don't feel like I should be having to do this. The clunkiness I experience is in the lower gears and typically goes away as the car warms up. Before anyone asks, the car was new in April and has 2K miles on it now. This is my second Porsche. The only other problem I am having is an error message saying the top is not completely down when it is. This tends to be on humid NC days so I am wondering if there is a short or something.
  • hotrod88hotrod88 Member Posts: 17
    Thanks for answering habitat1.
    I ordered the car, and waited the 4 months for delivery; it had 10.7 miles on it when I got it, and now has 2900 miles.
    I have followed all the break in recommendations.
    I will try to go there Monday and see if I can drive
    another. thx...
  • hotrod88hotrod88 Member Posts: 17
    I will be talking to service manager, but am afraid that they may not be objective. Well see what he says...
  • slickokoslickoko Member Posts: 8
    Wow, Habitat, you are getting different info. My sales guy showed me the "allocations" and which ones were 6 speed, which ones Tip. Further, he said March was the next Tip allocation for his dealership (though there are 6 speeds coming through every month). Regardless, if there's a December build, that's better than what I've been offered. I'll be interested to hear what the manager says. And thanks for checking it out for me!
  • jes1967jes1967 Member Posts: 1
    Can someone answer questions about computer faults in a 997? The manual is lacking.

    My new 997's battery discharged overnight. I'm not sure why but when I left the garage the engine fan was running. In the morning the battery was dead. The rear stabilizer was raised as well. I had left the key in the ignition; maybe that was what drained the battery. The key, of course, was stuck and couldn't be removed. And I couldn't open the front hood without battery power, and had to use jumper cables to the auxiliary electrode by the clutch pedal. (This a catch-22: if you're on the road and carry jumper cables in your luggage compartment, you can't get to the cables without a jump!)
    After recharging the battery with a trickle charger, the window wouldn't reset to fully closed upon shutting the door. According to the manual, after restoring battery power the window position can be re-stored in the computer by raising the window *once* and then raising the switch again. Having opened and closed the window out of this sequence, I wanted to repeat the process, so I disconnected the battery and re-connected it a few seconds later. This didn't help. I re-connected the battery two more times without success.

    After that a number of things went wrong. The PSM failure warning came on and went off about 12 hours later. The car alarm came on at 6:00 a.m. without anyone touching the car.

    I took it into the dealer and they found something wrong with the window motor, which they will replace. They also found 59 computer "faults" that they attributed to disconnecting the battery. They suggested I not disconnect the battery and also buy a battery conditioner.

    I found nothing in the manual about computer problems from loss of electric power. My questions: 1)Doesn't the computer have protection built in to protect against transients, and shouldn't it restore to a default state when powered up again? 2)If the Porsche tech needs to work a couple of hours to reset the computer when power fails, how do you deal with a dead battery out in the field? What is the local service guy supposed to do? 3) Does it sound reasonable that I caused the "faults" by reconnecting the battery, or is it possible that the car's computer (7 weeks old) has a problem itself?

    Thanks...
  • dweiserdweiser Member Posts: 288
    http://www.nytimes.com/2006/09/24/automobiles/autoreviews/24AUTO.html
  • drlomandrloman Member Posts: 4
    i'm hoping someone might be able to help me out. i was sold a 2001 Porsche 911 Turbo with 5K miles as a CPO car in Jan 2006. the car has had several mechanical issues that date back to the purchase date, including a shimmy in the rear, malfunction gauges, and alignment issues. these were essentially disregarded on repeat service calls (blame was placed on tire PSI, road crown, etc) until this July when the dealership began to take me seriously. 4 alignments later and replacement of upper struts, verification that the frame is intact by an independent body shop, etc, and now the car apparently drives straight (i have been without the car for about 6 weeks and refuse to even touch it since the most recent work so i don't get blamed for any 'new problems'...all this while i pay $55/day to finance it and pay for a rental car myself in the meantime!). in the process of going thru this service mess, my disappointment led me to pry into the files at the selling dealership where it turns out that no CPO checklist was performed on the car before selling it to me. despite this, the dealership still stands by its commmitment that this is a CPO car and will not take the car back and refund my money. Porsche corporate customer commitment (anything but) has failed to answer my fundamental questions:
    1. is the dealership OBLIGATED to submit the checklist to Porsche before Porsche grants a CPO warranty (which this car has per the Porsche computers)?
    2. is the dealership OBLIGATED to reveal this list to the customer and have the customer (me) sign at the bottom of the form where it says "Customer Signature and DAte" thus verifying that i purchased a car with either no mechanical faults or with faults that have been repaired as documented within the checklist (i was never shown the checklist and to this day the dealership "cannot find it")?
    3. what recourse does a customer have when multiple repairs are to be done on the CPO vehicle if the dealership continues to do the work without submitting warranty claims to Porsche (this is, apparently, why i cannot pursue this case as a lemon law case against the manufacturer, or so i have been told by the lemon law attorneys that have been following this for me)?

    i am at the end of my rope. i cannot tolerate anymore the non-answers and run around i get from porsche corporate asking who is somehow unable to tell me the answers to these questions. they have no one, apparently, that is in charge of verifying that the CPO checklists have been done before they grant CPO warranties, a fact that i have a hard time getting my mind around.

    what i know is that i purchased a car with so many problems that indicate that no one did a CPO check on it before they sold me it and now i seem to have no other recourse but to sue the dealership over fraud, for selling me a multi-owner car (yet another issue that i won't go into hear..that the car fax they gave me was from 2004!) that was never CPO'd.

    PLEASE. ANY HELP WOULD BE A BLESSING.

    david
  • habitat1habitat1 Member Posts: 4,282
    Boy, it's almost against my religion to recommend this, but I suggest you get an attorney involved.

    As I understand it, the dealership is not dismissing it's responsibilities to repair the car under the CPO warranty. Your concern is that the CPO warranty was issued on a car that had known problems and/or was never fully inspected properly. Given the history of the problems you have had and length of time the car has been out of service, I would think you should be entitled to some additional compensation. And if there was either fraud or convenient neglect on the part of the dealership, perhaps a buyback is justified.

    As a side note, this is another reason I am skeptical of suspiciously low mileage vehicles. While this kind of incident could happen with any used car, for whatever reason or coincidence, I have heard of more very low mileage cars with "issues" than ones that have been driven regularly and have a well documented service history. A 5+ year old car with only 5,000 miles would have sent my red flags all the way up to the point I would have wanted complete documentation before buying. A little late for that now, but good luck in getting your problems resolved.
  • dweiserdweiser Member Posts: 288
    You could go here and check on the state you live in.
    http://123car.com/lemon/lemonbystate.html
  • blckislandguyblckislandguy Member Posts: 1,150
    As usual Habitat1's post was right on the money. But let me add my two cents. I suspect that you have no "standing" in attempting to uncover whether or not the selling dealer pulled a fast one on Porsche in the CPO process. Clearly, these are internal procedures. (It does seem interesting that the dealer is doing all the repairs out of his pocket on this CPO car!).

    Someone should compensate you for the loss of use of the car due in large part to the pre-existing conditions. What is that worth? If you would be happy with the cost of the rental car, simply sue the dealer in small claims court. However, do bring a lawyer. The dealer already has one on retainer and their incremental cost to have him appear against you in court is zero. If you do go to small claims court and you are an MD (as I suspect by your screen name) work hard at trying to be humble that morning. Arrogance won't cut it.

    At the same time, ask Porsche for an additional year on the CPO given the "irregularities" in the CPO. This extension might be very easily obtained (no money would be coming out of anyone's pocket) and would definetely be much more valuable to you on a now six year old turbo than reimbursement for a rental.

    Good luck.
  • redsoxgirlredsoxgirl Member Posts: 67
    Well I have an interesting dilemma to resolve in the next few days, and could use help.

    My 2007 C2S is arriving in about 7-10 days. I have been called by the dealer asking if I'd be interested in "trading up" to a 911 Turbo. It seems that a gentleman who has a Turbo coming in late October has decided he doesn't want to spend that much and wants a C2S instead. My C2S, to be exact, so that he doesn't have to wait another 2-3 months.

    The deal would be that I could trade my C2S, which I had negotiated at $7,500 off MSRP, for a Turbo at $2,500 off MSRP. I'd lose $5k of my discount, but according to the dealer, I'd be the only person to buy a Turbo at any discount in the country. The Turbo is colored and configured the way I would like and will run about $40k more than the C2S. However, I am due for a one time bonus shortly that would make that additional amount pretty painless at this time.

    Any 911 Turbo owners out there that can comment on the car? I have driven the 911S extensively and an old 996 Turbo a few times. I would not trade the additional power of the 996TT for the better interior, handling (IMO) and overall refinement of the 997S. Unfortunately, I have not found a 997 Turbo to test drive first, and I can't wait to decide until this one comes in.

    All comments welcome.
  • designmandesignman Member Posts: 2,129
    I can't judge how badly you would want the TT vs the C2S but I can tell you this. In that situation I would be asking for more of a discount regardless of what I was willing to pay. It should be a knee jerk response... dealer making first offer means it could be had for less. I know new Turbos are getting MSRP and slightly under but demand could have softened. I'd offer him same discount, $7500 off. If you decide you have to have it you could always change your mind. Also, I would never buy a car without first driving it but that's just me... 2 cents here... good luck.
  • dweiserdweiser Member Posts: 288
    I wouldn't "ask", I'd "demand" the same $7,500 discount on the TT and I might even ask for more of a discount than your present $7,500 since the TT costs more. If you'd be happy with the C2S (and who wouldn't be), play around with the dealer, see just how bad he wants to do the deal. Worst case, you get the car you ordered, sooner, and cheaper.
    My 2 cents.
  • w210w210 Member Posts: 188
    I have owned the 997TT for a month and it's really nice.

    Not too many cars can provide such power with the amazing traction to go with it. I suppose the TT is a stick? The tiptronics apparently are very hot right now as Porsche has under-estimated the demand.

    The dealer is correct it is very rare to get a discount on a 997TT. I say go for the TT, if it has the options and color combination you like.
  • habitat1habitat1 Member Posts: 4,282
    On the price/discount side, from what I can tell a $2,500 discount on a Turbo might be a better deal than a $7,500 discount on a C2S. There are no dealers in the DC area that have unsold Turbos for at least 2-3 months. There are a fair number of 911's in stock, including some 2007's that could be negotiated hard on.

    On the $40k upgrade or not question, I think that depends a lot on how much you would actually use the extra power. In my opinion, the new 997 Turbo is the best truly supercar value out there. If I'm not mistaken, it is essentially the same price or cheaper than a 996 Turbo S, with far better performance. But even if I had the extra money burning a hole in my pocket, I personally couldn't justify giving up a C2S Cab for the 911 Turbo. I press a button and the top is down, my kids are happy. I don't need advanced Skip Barber classes for that. If I was single, I might go the other way and get the 911TT (and Skip Barber).

    P.S. Regarding Tip vs. 6-speed, I just read yet another review this month (R&T or Motor Trend) that tested both, side by side. Although the Tip was 0.1 seconds faster to 60 (3.3 vs. 3.4, I believe), the editors all preferred the 6-speed. Better downshifts, etc. This is consistent with the opinions of the lucky few I know that have driven both.
  • bmuirbmuir Member Posts: 3
    With 2007s coming into showrooms( and my local dealer talking about how short a supply of 911s there is) what discount can you expect on a 102k 2006? Is there any disadvantage in buying out of state? Is a 911s worth the 30k more over a 2007 Boxster S being 500/hp. I am selling my 2000 Boxster and it has been a great car.
  • habitat1habitat1 Member Posts: 4,282
    Discounts can vary substantially by dealer and geographic area. Last year at this time, I couldn't have gotten more than a $5k discount on a 2005 911S Cab in the immediate DC area. I went to Baltimore and got nearly double that on a car that had a few more options than I would have ordered.

    The only disadvantage of buying out of state or out of your area is the slight loss of goodwill you might have gained if and when you need service. But the local dealer I have taken my car to for a warranty repair seemed to treat me very well, in spite of not getting the initial sale.

    "Is a 911s worth the 30k more over a 2007 Boxster S being 500/hp. I am selling my 2000 Boxster and it has been a great car."

    I was seriously considering a Boxster S last fall. But I have a wife and two kids that all fit in the 911S. Instead of being just my personal fun car, the 911S is our "family car" with 9,700 miles as of its one year anniversary. Hard to put a price on that. Not sure what the 500 hp is referring to, other than a 911 Turbo, which is another $35k+ on top of a 911S Cab.
  • designmandesignman Member Posts: 2,129
    But the local dealer I have taken my car to for a warranty repair seemed to treat me very well, in spite of not getting the initial sale.

    Does he give you a loaner?
  • bmuirbmuir Member Posts: 3
    The 500/hp referred to was 60 more hp over the Boxster S with the car being 30,000 more. The family is all grown so no need for the rear seats. My wife thought the rear seats a negative. I guess the Carrera is always the model my heart says yes to but the Boxster is the choice of the logical side of my brain.

    I bought the Boxster in Florida, moved to Chicago and didn't notice any difference in service. With service at 20,000 miles there aren't many services to be performed unless you have a problem.
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