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However, it did not have the easy-care, take it anywhere, reliability that the Corolla has. That's the difference - Corolla is aiming for the no-hassle, basic transportation market.
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Honestly, both great cars and $ well spent whichever one chooses. Maybe by the time I'm ready to buy again, things will have changed. Can't wait to see!
The Sandman
the only vw's that lack reliability are the mkiv's; the new mkV's are doing much better and don't have the advantage of the long history of corolla reliability.
but i will say this; i didn't trade fun for mechanical problems, as i've had none. the future is yet to be seen, but so far so good.
plus i look better driving. :P
Thanks for the plood clarification: I have always detested that stuff.
That about sums it all up.
Corolla is what the computer industry used to call the "IBM decision". A mindless, gutless, no risk, high quality choice. If you're a car enthusiast (like most spending time on a forum like this), a Corolla is too bland or sedate of a choice. But if a car is just transportation to you, Corolla makes a lot of sense.
Civic (except the Si) falls into pretty much the same camp as Corolla, with Honda being more of a driver's car versus Toyota being more of a passenger's car.
Years ago the required maintenance schedule of my Civic was hideous. (I drive 25 - 30,000 miles per year.) I was in the shop every 6 weeks for oil change and every 12 weeks for more, but I understand its better now. My biggest cripe with it was the AC kept leaking refrigerant (that was during the conversion to new refrigerants, so the dealer installed unit was the old style that was designed for the larger refrigerant molecules). Fortunately the owner's nephew was my saleman and I was able to embarass him into replacing it. OTOH my 1997 Camry blew the automatic transmission at 134,000 miles.
As discussed previously, another (more gutfull) option to Corolla is the Elantra. With their extended warrantee, its less of a risk. Fuel economy has improved. And content is higher at a lower out the door price. In my area however, the Hyundai dealership (a former GM shop) is far inferior to the large Toyota dealership. Dealership support in a small market is the deal maker/breaker to me.
No kid in his right mind is going to buy a Corlla and tune it up. They would buy a Civic as it is a tuner.
Also, to Kristie aren't you suppose to be neutal on here? :shades: Driving a car should be an enjoyable experience. I used to teach skiing at Taos,NM and driving up the switch backs in my beetle with my rosary beads in one hand prayng to make line up was something to remember those crazy days.I tipped over and we rolled it upright and kept on going.I'd think about a V Dub again. :)Happy 4th
For most tho driving is a horrible bore or terrifyingly dangerous at 85 mph in rush hour traffic in machines that breakdown and suck up all the extra money in your pocket. When at home the choice to do anything but drive is always a better one. Eliminating some of the stress of driving by having an appliance that would bore the Maytag man and is at least reasonable on the wallet or credit card is a welcome blessing. Having it be affordable and safe are additional benefits. One doesn't mind giving an 18 y.o. a 6 y.o. Corolla to take 250 miles away to school and expect it to last all the way through college and grad school. This part of the market is huge btw.
It has a mix of Yaris, Corolla and Camry in it.
DrFill
If VW is having any success with them, they sure are keeping it quiet.
Keeping up with changing emisssions standards must be a bear as well.
Haven't seen many good quality reviews of VWs. Sales are down on virtually ever model but the new Rabbit, so word-of-mouth can't be too fine either.
Everyone has their cross to bear. :sick:
And VWs foray into the stratosphere in pricing hasn't helped matters much (poor exchange rates are a factor).
DrFill
Nope. Never. Hosts are people rather than robots, and we all have driving/ownership experiences. What we ARE supposed to be is impartial & fair in our host-related decisions
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We need to stick a bit closer to the Corolla here. Let's not turn the future vehicle discussions into "versus" discussions just yet. Thanks!
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I think the Droids that build them would all have to be reprogrammed, and there isn't that much of a mark up on them.
If Corolla is starting to think outside the box,the aero dynamics have to change.In other words new skin styling.
I'll belive it when I see it here in the staes,not Japan,or East Kish. .
The new Corolla seems promising (for what little we know for sure about it), but its sure to cost $2,000+ more than a xD (especially in the early years of the 's production run). Does that make sense (to pay more for a car with less function)? What are you getting for the extra money?
It's the same as someone saying they could buy a lower line Accord for the price of a higher line Civic, so why should anyone buy the Civic?
DrFill
Never liked to beg to buy and wouldn't drive a rattle box. I know they're better now, but I'm way too old to beg to buy (hoping the U.S. never goes totally in the tank).
While I haven't seen the xD, my guess is that it'd be a man versus boy comparison (like an Accord versus Civic) as the new xB is truck/van/SUV like compared to little cars. Don't make the mistake of comparing old and new xB s. (It confuses that Scion kept the same name for a different car, but changed it for xA/xD.) Yes an Accord VP versus Civic LX is probably a better current example of (at least near) pricing overlap. Content value goes to the older Accord while fuel economy goes to the newer Civic. From briefly sitting in each, the amount of useable space is similar with the Accord seating seeming like overstuffed chairs.
Toyota doesn't have this pricing dilemma between Camry and Corolla, but I see a pricing skew between Scion and Toyota, in particular with Yaris, xB, xD, and Corolla. Most here believe that the xD pricing will run about $1,000 below the new xB, so I’ll use that for the following comparisons:
TMV for a 4A Yaris hatch is $14,700 when equipped similarly to an xD that is estimated to cost $16,000 with about the same fuel economy. IME $1,300 is minimal to cover poor acceleration, two less doors, less room, goofy center speedometer, and price haggling.
TMV for a 4A Yaris sedan is $16,600 when equipped similarly to an xD that is estimated to cost $16,000 with about the same fuel economy. IME $600 for a sedan body style versus the utility of a hatch and giving up better acceleration on top of needing to price haggle makes even less sense to me.
TMV for the current Corolla LE 4A is $16,300 when equipped similarly to an xD that is estimated to cost $16,000 with about the same fuel economy. IME $300 for a sedan body style versus the utility of a hatch and needing to price haggle makes little sense to me. The new Corolla will probably only increase the price spread.
OTOH the old xB listed for $1100 more than the xA, so the gap between new xB and xD aught to be greater with the difference in engines. If the difference is indeed greater, it will only increase this Scion versus Toyota pricing dilemma IMO.
Once the xD is released all this speculation of content and pricing will be over.
Thankfully diesels have come a long way since the old rattle boxes. It's good that they have as diesel technology has advantages over the gasoline engine. Europe has already discovered this. Rumor has it that Toyota will be bringing their diesels to the USA... hopefully to the Corolla, too. I'll then glady trade my new Tacoma for a diesel version.
Now maybe the next Corolla will be a different story vs. the xD in fuel economy. But I sure hope not!
Doc,
take a closer look and I mean a real closer look. Now can you see any traces of a Yaris or Camry? I guess not! In fact this new generation Corolla model looks purely like a current Jetta.
Now whose copying who? VW or Toyota? :confuse:
If only the next generation Corolla could have a TDI diesel engine then it would be almost as good as a Jetta :P
but aside from amazing mileage, why not? you could answer your own question by thiking of the (now very few) times that customers have asked you what the 'deal' was with the prius and how they 'just didn't get it'. at least the jetta is A LOT less polarizing.
It does reseemble the current gen corolla a little...like how the current gen corolla could be made to look awesome instead of how it does. (most people dont miss the older jetta after driving the new one; it handles much better has more space and power, the list goes on.)
i def think that the next gen corolla is a nice looking car, and much better looking than current gen...and while economy will probably be better than average, it looks like there is going to be some weight gains.
It takes the Yaris' grille, and the Camry has the hoodline set well behind the grille.
This is a spot-on hybrid of the two front ends!
DrFill
IMO a 1.5L turbo, tuned for economy at lower engine speeds and greater power at higher speeds would make more sense to me. Saab has been offering such a 2.0L engine for 30+ years and with Toyota's economy of scale they could keep the costs well below a hybrid. The added complexity couldn't be any more so than a hybrid, with no battery related drawbacks (carbon footprint, weight, lifespan, unknowns).
To me hybrids are a fad that will pass, fuel cells are the final answer and I wish we'd focus more that versus wasting energy, time, and public interest in -end, interim solutions.
Toyota better not forget why people buy the Corolla for economy, engineering and reliability.
Why is everyone apologising for discussing the competetion,they all are trying to out do each other.
Now, watch her jump on me like white on rice.I'd like to know what makes a Corolla special compared to pocket rockets,but a Corrolla can't be in that class with out upping the price and the big H will out sell them. :shades:
If you look back, you'll find that the members of this forum (like most) have a hard time staying on topic. Of course, it'd help if Toyota would release more information.
Corolla is perhaps the quinesential sensible sedan. It boasts the following attributes: relatively cheap to buy, reliable, economical to operate, and low depreciation rates. This is the ideal basic transportation for practical people who don't have to worry or think about it. All this put together makes it really, really dull.
There has always been other cars that are cheaper, better equipped, more fun to drive, etc. But the long history of the above attributes has created a mountain of loyality. As fuel prices only go up with time and the standard of living for working Americans continues to go down, the Corolla concept makes sense to more and more people.
i don't think they lost the 'fun factor' the new jetta handles worlds better;i.e. no torsion beam suspension. did it lose some 'coolness'. a little.
i agree with mcmamus; no need for a corolla hybrid.
This is somewhat subjective, and it may be because I'm comparing my Golfs to the new Jetta. (Should be comparing old to new Jetta.) I almost bought a new Jetta but I found I could toss my Golf around much easier... seemed more responsive to me, and it's TDI engine moves the Golf around more quickly because it weighs less. So, to me, I gave the Jetta a lower 'fun factor' and then searched long and hard for used low mileage Golf.
http://www.edmunds.com/apps/vdpcontainers/do/vdp/articleId=105254/pageNumber=1?synpartner=edmunds&pageurl=www.edmunds.com/new/2007/volkswagen/jetta/100778032/roadtestarticle.html&articleId=105254
I really don't understand what a Golf, Jetta comparison, or your inability to purchase a new vehicle has too do with Future Toyota Corolla :sick:
This is higher than I'd like to see (remains only $1,300 less than the new xB even though xB now has a bigger engine). This is $2,200 more than a comparable Yaris (both are very similiarly sized inside and out with the big differences being the number of doors and engine displacement). Note that the xD will use the new 1.8L (like Corolla) versus the well known 2.4L and 1.5L of the xB and Yaris.
This really makes me wonder where Corolla pricing will come in. Can they really price it the same (or higher :confuse: ) than the xB?
I would like to see the Corolla LE go back to being a luxury model, as the Mazda3 and VW Jetta have reenergized the luxury compact market.
DrFill