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Lexus LS 460/LS 460L Styling Impressions

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Comments

  • cyclone4cyclone4 Member Posts: 2,302
    Kirstie has much more experience and is much better looking ;-).
  • nvbankernvbanker Member Posts: 7,239
    This topic has sure gone to hell since the "new policy". ; See ya.
  • billsoterbillsoter Member Posts: 49
    With respect to when AWD will be available, I don't understand Lexus thinking by not making it known when (if) it will be available. When MB introduced the S550 last spring they stated that AWD would be available in November. What is the purpose of keeping potential customers, and apparently dealers, in the dark?
  • patpat Member Posts: 10,421
    Here's a tip for you and everyone: go to the top level of this board - Lexus LS - and click on Track This Group. You will then be tracking this and the other LS discussions that are here, as well as any new ones as they are created.

    Using Read New Posts will mean you won't miss anything on the LS board. If a discussion pops up which doesn't interest you, all you have to do is click on Remove Track within the discussion.
  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Administrator Posts: 11,148
    Why yes I am; thank you for noticing my stylish font.
    Lexus LS 600h

    All the cool kids are doin' it.

    MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR
    Need help navigating? kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.
    Share your vehicle reviews

  • gteach26gteach26 Member Posts: 576
    That's a good suggestion. I think I'll reorganize my "tracked items" using that method.

    Perhaps a "tips on working with the new changes" section on the main carspace page will help grumpy edmunds loyalists adopt to these changes?
  • cyclone4cyclone4 Member Posts: 2,302
    Do you mean stylish font or stylish front ;-) ? Sorry, I could not resist.
  • patpat Member Posts: 10,421
    She means stylish shoes. It's all about the SHOES! ;)
  • patpat Member Posts: 10,421
    That's a good idea - I'll pass it on. Thanks!!
  • houdini1houdini1 Member Posts: 8,327
    Oh yes, I do remember those....shoes!!!

    2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460

  • designmandesignman Member Posts: 2,129
    Why has this thread been changed to styling impressions of the LS 460 when it has been a general all-encompassing thread on the model all along? Correct me if I'm wrong but it seemed fine the way it was, or just Lexus 460/460L. Thank you.
  • barrynsbarryns Member Posts: 13
    I think it is a mistake to split apart the forums related to the 2007 LS460 Series. I think that all those that are here are interested in any subject related including style, drive, defects, recalls, problems, How to's, etc. etc. The value of any one forum will decrease significantly. I doubt that anybody is here only to focus on one subect such as first drive, etc. That is too limited. In order to see what is going on with this car, everybody is going to have to jump from forum to forum to get all the information. And what about the posts that are put on the wrong forum. With such limited breadth of subject, the moderators will be kept increasingly busy switching posts from one forumn to another.
  • designmandesignman Member Posts: 2,129
    For some reason they are changing threads to "smaller, more focused" discussions on models. They also shut down the model-specific threads on BMW today. But I still wonder, it seems to preclude talking about a variety of aspects when considering a particular car, requires more thread hopping and disrupts continuity in discussion. Also, threads that had heritage are disappearing. But I suppose an explanation is imminent.
  • oacoac Member Posts: 1,594
    Is what the current "small, more focused" threads will do to many of us regulars here. Already, the interest level is decreasing on our discussions... Maybe Edmund's should have polled the participants on this prior to making the change. Personally, naming the thread "Styling impressions" and "First Drive" are clearly wrong labels.... Designman's simple but direct title - 460/460L may just do it. Of course, what is most important is continuity and less confusion...

    I still say, let us merge the two threads into one singular, easy to find, easy to use and easy to debate thread for the new LS. I am confused as it is today.
  • excelsior88excelsior88 Member Posts: 71
    I agree. I think the 2 threads are not the best idea. Not to be too critical, but I also think 'styling impressions' mislabels this forum, as it has always been a lot more about the car than just styling.
  • houdini1houdini1 Member Posts: 8,327
    The reason for these changes seems obvious to me. The more you have to hop around, the more of a chance you get to be exposed to more advertising. They are also getting more "hits" and can charge more for ads. But, hey, we all got to make a living. Of course I could be wrong.

    2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460

  • barrynsbarryns Member Posts: 13
    I'm glad that the topic of 'interest' came up. I didn't want to sound like anybody would care if I left forever......but the reality is that the more threads for the one cohesive topic "LS 460-450L" the less value of each thread and when the value of the experience becomes less than the hassle of getting the information many will just avoid the hassle.
  • merc1merc1 Member Posts: 6,081
    It took a closure of some dear threads to get all the different sides on the same sheet of music..lol!

    BMW, Mercedes, Lexus you name it, the threads are going away in favor of more threads. Doesn't make any sense to me. Having one thread to talk about the LS460 in this case makes more sense than having seperate threads for each aspect of the car like Oac said. Now we'll have a bunch of threads with a few posts in each.

    M
  • garyh1garyh1 Member Posts: 394
    So I just read the October Motor Trend article on the LS460L. Very interesting and very positive on all fronts - styling, engineering, and most importantly, drivability. Merc, it actually said the suspension stayed flat on hard turns at high speeds (although I note that the standard suspension in the SWB may not do as well). And they loved turning off the computer and actually burning rubber in a lux sedan!

    So where should this comment go -"Styling Impressions" or
    "First Drive"? My suggestion is that we forum users just decide to use this forum (despite its weird name) that has the history of over 3000 messages in it, and ignore the new one. Then it will die on its own, and hopefully the Edmunds execs will get the message that this is a dumb, user-unfriendly approach.
  • hiltonheadhiltonhead Member Posts: 1
    I have only recently started to follow the Lexus thread. I find that having multiple threads for really the same topic is confusing and a big waste of time. My vote is to have only one thread for the LS 460.
  • patpat Member Posts: 10,421
    I'm sorry you aren't happy with the direction we're going in, but it's a policy decision that has been made much higher than my paygrade, I assure you. It's not something we can change.

    If you want to talk about your impressions of the styling, here's the place. If you have other things on your mind about the new (or any) LS, please go to the top level of the board and either find the right place or create a new topic. Here's the link: Lexus LS.

    This isn't the smoothest process in the world, there's no doubt about that. It's difficult to make this drastic of a change, but it's got to be done. I, for one, would really appreciate it if you would try to work with us on it. We could really use your help.
  • patpat Member Posts: 10,421
    I'm going to ask that the conversation about the changes in the Forums be discontinued here. Kirstie has provided a more appropriate link in this post: kirstie_h, "2007 Lexus LS 460/460L: First Drives" #16, 18 Oct 2006 10:44 am.
  • mikeivanmikeivan Member Posts: 42
    LS 460 styling question: Does this thing look like a BMW from the rear to you all? It sure does to me and I do not care for that style. L-finesse or not, they are still imitating Germans, IMHO. OK, I am still going to drive one at the Taste of Lexus, but I don't think I am a buyer.
  • sidgriggssidgriggs Member Posts: 122
    Just looked at swb model at dealership. The car reminds me of a Camry from the side/rear and maybe an ES 350 from the front. Does anyone have a picture of the "18-in Teleios alloy wheels (Available 1st Quarter 2007)" which are shown as an accessory at Lexus.com? I can't stand those 9-spoke wheels that these cars are arriving with.
  • nexuslexusnexuslexus Member Posts: 147
    image
    ??
  • matts2000matts2000 Member Posts: 1
    It's about as exciting as a 1997 Cadillac STS. Check out the rear-end. There's real resemblance. I'm not joking...
  • merc1merc1 Member Posts: 6,081
    Yeah this whole new thing makes no sense.

    Their test drive pretty much matches what I found at the Taste of Lexus when I drove the LS460L. Though burning rubber in a luxury sedan isn't a show of anything other than power. Road and Track did the same thing recently with a Rolls Phantom.

    M
  • atlas7atlas7 Member Posts: 126
    I agree, those 9 spoke wheels are very ugly. I can't believe those are the wheels for this car....Akin to wearing a beautiful dark blue suit with scuffed brown shoes!
  • sidgriggssidgriggs Member Posts: 122
    are these the wheels?? or are you just disagreeing with me as to the look of the car???
  • atlas7atlas7 Member Posts: 126
    I am speaking about the 9 spoke wheels, ugly. Haven't seen the car in person yet, so I will reserve judgement. But, those 9 spoke wheels look like the same as the ones they have on the ES 350.
  • ljflxljflx Member Posts: 4,690
    Just in case no one else posted it, you can download an LS brochure here.

    http://www.lexus.com/models/brochures/ebrochure/ls_ebrochure.html

    Colors (hope this links)

    http://www.lexus.com/images/ebrochures/LS/LS_Page_13.pdf

    I hope they make a boatload of smokey granite mica's. Knockout money color for the car - IMO. My car will be that exterior with the light grey interior - no questions asked. I'll pre-order and deposit that now for late March delivery if I have to.
  • excelsior88excelsior88 Member Posts: 71
    Luxurious Lexus sedan earns brisk sales
    Friday October 20, 2006, 1:59 pm

    Toyota said it has received orders for 12,000 units of the LS460 sedan, the highest end of the luxury Lexus brand, since its launch on September 19, more than nine times its monthly target of 1,300.

    Toyota expects the LS series to help boost domestic sales of Lexus models, which have been slow since the brand's launch in Japan almost one year ago.

    About 70 per cent of LS460 purchasers are above the age of 50, and those who place orders need to wait for about three months to get the car, according to Toyota.

    The LS460, powered by a new 4.6-litre V-8 engine, is being sold through 160 Lexus dealers in Japan, for suggested retail prices ranging from Y7.7 million ($A85,976) to Y9.65 million ($A107,749.

    http://au.biz.yahoo.com/061020/30/xt1r.html

    12,000 vehicles sold in Japan so far...
  • ikey78ikey78 Member Posts: 28
    Len, have you seen the grey wood that goes with the grey leather and if so what do you think about it? How about the Alabaster interior? Have you seen that with the SGM exterior color?
  • ljflxljflx Member Posts: 4,690
    I've seen that grey wood on the LS430 ultra in the early years of that model and loved it. It's more of a granite/stone look than it is wood. Alabaster I haven't seen.
  • ljflxljflx Member Posts: 4,690
    It will be interesting to see how Lexus plays the lease deals on the LS460 and the LS460L in particular. Most LS460L's will probably be in the $80-82K range and that should run $1200-1300 per month, zero down - I would think. I have seen several S 550 leases in the last few weeks that were $1350-$1399 on $86-88K prices with zero down. The S-class seems to be getting $2-4K discounts right now (which is why the advertised prices were $86-88K) and that won't happen with the LS for the first 4-6 months. I would think Lexus would be careful to keep lease prices tucked in under MB similar to the MSRP's. But there's no guarantee on that.
  • landilandi Member Posts: 44
    The $86,000 LS is $1,650 for 36/12K. Too rich for my blood. I will be exploring other options. I am not sure how long Lexus can demand these rates and prices.
  • ljflxljflx Member Posts: 4,690
    You can't go by Lexus.com as those prices are always higher than dealer prices. But if that price is right than an S-550 is the value play these days.

    For the heck of it I put an $86000 price in for 3 years and 15K miles, zero down at Lexus.com and got a $1494 price. Usually that includes sales tax as they calc based on your zip code. My guess is that at 80-82K about 3 months from now you'll be around $1200-1250 on 15k/36 months, zero down.
  • landilandi Member Posts: 44
    This is a price from a dealer which is higher than Lexus.com. The $72,000 SWB is $1,350 36/12k with zero down. Both include taxes. Considering that my 04 LS430 with 62k sticker was $861 including taxes, these prices are very high. I should note that I received a $5,000 discount on the LS430 to get it down to $861. One dealer told the $72,000 car should lease between $1,500 and $2,300 which is truly laughable. Seems like right now the only way is to purchase the car or wait a few months for the lease.
  • ljflxljflx Member Posts: 4,690
    Landi,

    Clearly your dealer is charging prices over list price right now. That's the only way you can be higher than Lexus.com. Lexus.com always uses MSRP and the highest interest rates. Usually dealers will discount (though not now and in fact may be giving prices over list) and can provide better rates from Lexus depending on volume of cars they sell or they have better rate deals with banks. The problem we have is Lexus prominence is sky high now and a new LS is now as big a deal as a new S-class so it's going to take longer and longer for demand to wane.

    As for $2300 a month for a $72K car - well that's more than it would take to buy the car outright in 3 years. So it's not even laughable - it's an absurdity that mathematics exposes.

    BTW - In 2001 I heard that $72K LS ultras were leasing as high as 1350-1400 in the first few months and were pricing as high as $81K on full purchase. At my dealership the price was $1250 and full sticker as they were not price gouging. Remember also that interest rates were high and just starting to fall back in 2001. As well Lexus had a better residual percentage on the $62K car in 2001 then they did on the $72K car. My bet is that on cars like the LS460L the higher you go the less the residual percentage will be.

    Again - this demand is what scares me about the LS600HL. It may go well over list price.
  • cyclone4cyclone4 Member Posts: 2,302
    Len, are you still waiting for the LS600HL or have you changed your mind and going with the LS460L? As you know I am first in line for the LS600HL at my dealer. However, I am starting to have second thoughts after hearing the horror stories about its trunk. I was at my dealer the other day for the showing of the LS460 and LS460L. A couple of sales reps were telling me that they have seen the trunk and it is minuscule. It extends only two feet inward from the rear. That is very disappointing to me. A trunk size as big as the LS460L with rear seat upgrade would be acceptable. But the 600HL will be considerably smaller according to these guys. The AWD is one of the reasons I wanted the 600HL. Do we know for sure if the LS460L will be available with AWD next year? If so, that would probably clinch it for me. The past few days, I have been going back and forth with this dilemma. One moment I am thinking that I can adjust with a tiny trunk but then the next moment I am thinking that I will not be happy. What happens if my wife and I are taking a trip with a couple of friends? What do we do with the luggage? We cannot lay it on the back seat. What to do? It's driving me wacko.

    By the way, I also test drove the LS460L while at the dealer this past Friday. I only drove it for about 15-20 minutes (others waiting to drive it). It is a wonderful automobile. I found nothing wrong with the breaks. I bring this up this a few on the HELM board were complaining about the breaks. It is incredibly smooth and quiet but you now hear a roar of the engine if you step on it. The seats are definitely more comfortable than my current LS430. I love the auto break feature when in heavy stop and go traffic. You only need to activate it once and it will stay that way on the other stops. My salesman demonstrated the advanced parking feature for me. I was impressed. I think that it will be something quite useful. It does not take much time at all to activate. Once you get use to it, it should be a piece of cake. The power trunk is also neat. There are obviously many other amazing features to this car besides the above.

    I suppose the second paragraph of this post should have gone on the first drive forum, but I do not want to break it up and place the first paragraph here and the second there. If the hosts want to move it than so be it. This is one of the problems of multiple boards for the same car.
  • sysweisyswei Member Posts: 1,804
    Do we know for sure if the LS460L will be available with AWD next year?

    Not known for sure, but I was told that we wouldn't get AWD on the 460 until late calendar 2007 at the earliest. For more info see this post.
  • cyclone4cyclone4 Member Posts: 2,302
    syswei, your information is very much appreciated. I see that you also have a problem with the LS600HL trunk size. It is a shame because I really wanted to purchase this car. Has anyone actually seen the specs on the 600HL trunk?

    AWD cannot get here soon enough on the LS460L.
  • ljflxljflx Member Posts: 4,690
    Cyclone - My news is similar to Syswei's but someone mentioned to me that March or April may be the point where AWD becomes an option. I'll have to see the trunk on the 600HL but a well equipped $82-83K LS460L with air suspension and AWD looks like a great deal to me as well. I'd love to test that sport suspension on the LS460L and I've thought seriously about that car. But you'll need snows in winter plus AWD if you're in a snow climate and take the sport suspension. The only thing I've ruled out right now is the SWB car. I'm listed for both the LS460L and the HL right now. My lease is due in late March. If AWD is right around the corner I'll just extend my lease. My 430 is the usual perfect car.

    I'm dropping by the dealership on Thursday or Frday and will let you know what info I gather.
  • oacoac Member Posts: 1,594
    http://www.clublexus.com/forums/showthread.php?t=244679

    very nicely done.... great read as well.... Would help some of us aspiring 460 owners get some more info on this car.
  • ljflxljflx Member Posts: 4,690
    Some of the initial LS prices from these guys, in case anyone wants to bypass dealers who are pricy or have no stock, and get the car shipped. One way or another this is a good benchmark for lease deals though. The lease prices include 10% MSRP down so interest effect that and divide by lease term and then add to the advertised lease prices to get a zero down lease. You can price MB, BMW, Bentley and others here as well.

    One thing to note is they only have 3 cars to sell and usually they have tons. Bad sign for early buyers as this is indicative of high demand. Fleetrates initially was purely Lexus and then expanded so they typically have a lot of Lexus cars available vs their other brands.

    http://fleetrates.com/index.htm?start=0&certified=&SBmake=Lexus&SBmodel=LS+460
  • cyclone4cyclone4 Member Posts: 2,302
    I would definitely go for the air suspension. I really do not want to deal with snow tires if at all possible.

    I'll be waiting for some good news after your visit to the dealer late this week.
  • woppenhewoppenhe Member Posts: 61
    LS is about being smooth, powerful, and quiet. Why would anyone wnat a tighter suspension. Or oversize touring tires?
  • patpat Member Posts: 10,421
    ... housekeeping!

    In an attempt to make it easier to follow the LS 460 discussions, I have renamed this board and moved all the LS 400 and LS 430 discussions to a new board here: Lexus LS 400/LS 430. There are a few discussions shared across both boards (one example: Meet the Members).

    If you were tracking any discussion I moved, I believe you will have to re-track it now. You can go to that link and check them out.

    You should not have lost any of the discussions you were tracking in this group, nor should you have lost tracking of the entire group, if that's what you were doing.

    If you are not tracking the entire group, I again urge you do so here so you don't miss anything. I encourage you to make new discussions for different LS 460 topics and I will be doing the same.

    If you have logistical questions, feel free to email me or post them in the Software discussion.

    Carry on! :)
  • nvbankernvbanker Member Posts: 7,239
    LS is about being smooth, powerful, and quiet. Why would anyone wnat a tighter suspension. Or oversize touring tires?

    It's beyond me why anybody would change the dynamics of this car with any wheel changes not available through Lexus. Engineers have spent millions matching the suspension with wheels and tires that optimize the handling characteristics of this expensive car. You can't improve it - only screw it up with any aftermarket changes at all.
  • patpat Member Posts: 10,421
    elmer3, "Lexus LS: Dealers & Service Issues" #34, 5 Nov 2006 1:23 pm
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