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Buick Lucerne
Isn't the replacement for the Buick Le Sabre and Park Avenue supposed to be based on the Zeta platform? Edmunds says that the Lucerne will be FWD and will use Le Sabre's current platform, but several other sources say that it will be RWD and Zeta-based.
The same goes for the next generation Pontiac Bonneville. I have heard that it would only get a restyling, that it will be switched to RWD, and that the name would be dropped. Have any of those rumors been confirmed as true, or is it still too early to say at this point?
Personally I would favor rear wheel drive for both cars. The Bonneville could definitely use it to be more competitive in the segment. It's going to face stiff competition from the Chrysler 300 and Dodge Charger, so Rear Wheel Drive makes sense, particularly in the handling department...
The same goes for the next generation Pontiac Bonneville. I have heard that it would only get a restyling, that it will be switched to RWD, and that the name would be dropped. Have any of those rumors been confirmed as true, or is it still too early to say at this point?
Personally I would favor rear wheel drive for both cars. The Bonneville could definitely use it to be more competitive in the segment. It's going to face stiff competition from the Chrysler 300 and Dodge Charger, so Rear Wheel Drive makes sense, particularly in the handling department...
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Hopefully this thread will stay open and active so we can keep a watchful eye on any developments in the near future.
LX is the platform name for the 300/Magnum/Charger.
~alpha
As for the news of it being on the same platform as the Caddy DTS, that sounds pretty good to me. RWD can definitely help them improve in the handling department, especially if the choose to add more power to the Bonnie. And from what I've seen (at least working at Ford) rear wheel drive is also a bit more likely to take a beating. Probably depends a lot on the manufacturer though, but Front wheel drive as a whole seems a bit fragile in comparison. That's just my opinion on the matter. (Not that I would never buy a FWD car.)
The Lucerne still sounds like an appealing vehicle, but I'm a big fan of RWD myself so I'd be more interested in the G8 or Invicta. Of couse it does depend on the styling, and (more likely) the fit and finish. Hopefully I got it right this time around. Thanks for the information on the upcoming models. I appreciate it!
The car should be revealed in Chicago in February.
I have read some rumors that GM may cancel plans for RWD Buicks, but today's Automotive News had an article on a RWD sedan, coupe, and possible convertible for Buick, so these rumors may be wrong.
http://www.detnews.com/autosinsider
Now whose brilliant idea was it to have the Lucerne's rear end look just like an Acura TSX? First the LaCrosse copies the old Taurus, now the Lucerne copies Acura... will the upcoming VElite convertible look like a Sebring?
*sigh*
The taillights remind me more of the VW Toureg, an association which not many will make since the two cars are not at all competitors. I think this may just be the most attractive Buick to date- I hope the dynamics and appointments have been similarly improved. Very classy, IMO.
And A V8 to boot. Very nice.
Bonneville is being cancelled, FWIW, so maybe the name of the thread needs to be changed.
~alpha
If you want to pick nits, you can find something on any car that looks very much like the same feature on some other car.
This is the best looking Buick in decades, FWIT.
To me, nicely optioned would mean: leather, moonroof, grippier wheel/tire pkg, Stabilitrak.
~alpha
One could say they are similar, but hardly that the "Lucerne's rear end looks just like an Acura TSX" as you put it.
I personally would never look at the rear of this car and think TSX.
And seriously, the 3800 as standard is such a faux pas, but there are many who just dont care as long as the vehicle feels strong. A pity that GM wouldnt make the 3.6L the base engine, but at least the kick-[non-permissible content removed] Northstar is available on the mid-trim level, unlike the availability of the high feature engine on the LaCrosse/Allure.
~alpha
The headlights would be more swept back, following the Velite design. This way they would look nice like the Sydney opera. Hope Tom Peters takes note.
Overall I'm fairly impressed with this car. I will be interested to see how it's priced and positioned. Everything about it seems way upscale of the LeSabre, except the old standby 3.8 engine. I hope it doesn't get too pricey though, at least in base trim. Buick needs to remember that last year they sold over 130,000 LeSabres and Park Aves. If they don't offer an affordable trim of this thing, that will be tough to match, let alone exceed, no matter how good the car is.
-Andrew L
The Lucerne won't win any major converts who are more focsued about what's under hood...and I think that, at least in 2006, the majority will ship with the 3800. It will keep the cost down, avoiding sticker shock. Buick needs a winner right from the start that easily replaces the '00-03 LeSabre's current owners may be looking to trade.
You can argue all day long about what engine should be in the Lucerne, but they have to be SOLD to be successful, and I just don't feel the averge 50/60-something is tinkering under the hood. I doubt he rarely opens it, and ride, handling, comfort will matter more than pushrod vs. whatever to 80-90% of potential Buick buyers, IMO.
The Lucerne sure is a heck of a lot more interesting that the outdated Grand Marquis - the LeSabre's major competitor!
2. Looked at an 04/05 bonneville with a v8 and loaded with options last week. Nice looking car but sticker was over 38k. Seems pretty steep to me and since the buick label usually adds a few bucks I'm wondering if the v8 lucerne will be a 40k sticker price? If so it better be an awesome car since comparison shoppers will have lots of traditionally better respected nameplates to choose from for that kind of cash.
3. In this thread someone refers to the lucerne as the "mid" level Buick. Since it replaces the Park Avenue as well as the La sabre I would think that is also the hi end model? Am I correct or is there another flagship in the works for Buick?
Not much to elaborate on...the Bonneville is cancelled. Production will stop around 6/2005. Supposedly there will be a new RWD Pontiac at the end of the decade, but that may be more of a Grand Prix replacement than a Bonneville.
"3. In this thread someone refers to the lucerne as the "mid" level Buick. Since it replaces the Park Avenue as well as the La sabre I would think that is also the hi end model? Am I correct or is there another flagship in the works for Buick?"
There is expected to be a new RWD Buick in the next few years, which will probably be a large sedan but may be a convertible like the Velite concept. GM hasn't said much officially about this though, other than to admit they are looking at a RWD flagship for Buick.
-Andrew L
I have almost 7k miles on it and other than a small sunroof rattle that was fixed on the first try, the car has been incredible. I'm now averaging right at 20 mpg combined city/highway driving. I got 23.5 mpg on a recent 2k mile trip from VA to FL. The car is a blast to drive.
Like you, I thought $38K was a little steep. I imagine there will be some incentives as spring approaches which may make an '05 GXP more attractive to you. It sure worked for me.
I was a two time owner of a Buick Electra and Park Avenue from 1986-1995..Just had a look at the new Lucerne and Wow! I was impressed..It appears to be a nice looking car, better looking than the ES330.
I wonder how they are going to price it however..Pricing the high end one at $38K is going to put it in dangerous competition. As a former Buick owner, I'd definitely give it a go, but I think the price will have to be competitive to get others to as well. But I believe the mid-range one will have the V-8 as an option.
I haven't bought a GM car in a long time, so have the deals changed at all? What is a typical discount on this kind of car? I normally get 10-12% off my LS400/430 purchases. Is it reasonable to expect more from Buick?
Thanks,
SV
I would definitely expect a loaded Lucerne to hit $38K. People are forgetting how expensive the PArk Ave Ultra is right now. A loaded Lucerne will replace the Park Ave Ultra.
Point 1. The new avalon limited can be bought for around 36K. So pricing the top of the line lucerne over that (or even equal to it) is probably wishful thinking.
Point 2. Nobody likes to pay near sticker price for a car right after introduction only to have them being discounted nearly 33% by years end (a'la GTO)
Point 3. Launching incentives to cure a 130 day supply of a vehicle thats only been out for 140 days is embarrassing ( a'la lacrosse) So why not price the car lower and hold off on the incentives. You can always raise the price if they start selling like hotcakes.
I want to like this car. I want to see the domestics make a comeback. For my money though, the domestics will have to provide more car for the cash until they prove they can make a car equal in quality to the Japanese. I bought an 04 Sierra pickup because I thought it was the best fit for my needs at the right price. And I would love to put my gm card earnings to use on a new Lucerne in the next purchase. But I looked at a new avalon today and I think GM is still trying to build a competitor for the car toyota made 6 years ago.
-Andrew L
I've driven an '01 Chrysler Concorde for 3 years and have loved the car for all of it's 38k miles .... however, I hate the lack of customer focus from that company and will be looking for an alternate domestic brand in a couple of years.
I rented a LaCrosse recently when travelling and really enjoyed the vehicle (it was great in the snow, by the way). I'm very excited to see the new full-size Lucerne. Maybe this will be the one?
I hope they improve the build quality from previous Buicks. Poor build quality seems to plague all GM vehicles. This leads to low resale value. Acceleration and braking will hopefully be improved, otherwise this vehicle is another average car from GM.
Buick (with the old Century)
What leads to low resale value is the rebates not quality if I buy a new Century for $17,000. Why would I buy a used 2005 for 15,000 or roughly $10,000 of sticker price.
The Lucerne is going to come equipped with a new radio system with auxiliary input jacks. Navigation would be optional.
Ford 500 a class leader with a lame V6. Once the intial buzz wears off the looks of the poor man's Bentley they would be like a PT Cruiser. As far as acceleration I think they would be more than capable with the Northstar V8 in the Lucerne.
As for the Lucerne being equipped with a nav system, where did you learn that? I have been trying to find out whether it would come with it or not, and I still don't know.