Purchasing at the End of Your Lease

ebeths · January 2006

Hope someone can help me sort this out...
I have a '01 Passat coming off lease in April. Right now, we are just at the mileage limit, and we just found out the car is leaking coolant and needs a new radiator. It's in decent shape otherwise.
Bank of the West offered an $11,700 buy-out, which is almost double what the car is worth. I will try to negotiate this down, but I doubt they will come down that far.
I would probably plan to just turn the car in at the end of the lease and start over with a new one, but I really hate to put the money into the new radiator and clearly we cannot continue to drive it without the repair.
My question is, would the bank take the car back early if we just pay off the last 3 payments, and would they do a mechanical inspection and charge us for the new radiator anyway?
Is there any benefit to trying to get a VW dealer to take it off our hands if we want a new Passat lease?
Thanks a lot.

qbrozen · January 2006

I'm curious what the deal is with these baloon note type deals (the ones that work just like a lease and you can turn the car in at the end or buy it) ... can you negotiate at the end of those the same as a lease?

qbrozen · January 2006

is it out of warranty? What caused the leak? Road debris or is it a failure of some sort?

Is there a benefit to getting out of it early? well ... could be. If you are at the limit now, then turning it in now will save you from having to pay the excess mileage you will put on in the next 3 months. And, yes, they would either just have you pay the 3 months payments now or roll it into your next vehicle. then of course there is usually some type of disposal fee. But I believe you pay that either way.

If they are going to charge you for the radiator, then that is no different than you paying to have it fixed before turning it in ... so, in my opinion, might as well take the chance that you could turn it in and NOT get charged for the repair.

pacinko · January 2006

I am turning in my 03 BMW 325i in 3 weeks for lease end. First of all, I am 21,000 miles over my limit at 20 cents a mile. Also, I have body damage to the car. I estimate the damage to be at about 3500. My buyout price is 19,500.

I have been racking my brain for a while now and dont know what to do. Do i turn it in and reap the damages, or is that just plain stupid? Do i buy the car, then trade it in on a new one? Should i fix the damages before i trade it in if i buy it?

Help!

kyfdx · January 2006

Don't buy it, and then trade it in.. If you are in the market for a new car, see what a dealer will give you for it first, as it sits right now... If you trade it, they will pay the leasing company for the car, and you will have to make up the difference between their offer and the buyout price.

If they give you anything over $14K, then it will be cheaper than turning the car in...

regards,
kyfdx

au94 · February 2006

qbrozen is correct, you can trade it to another dealer at the end of the lease but depending on the vehicle you are usually finacially better off just getting out of the lease and starting over again. Sounds like this will be the case for your friend in a domestic(?) full size truck.

I was able to trade my leased 01 Accord in on my 4Runner and come out ahead. The Toyo dealer bought out the lease and I was still able to come out 1200 ahead in the deal. This was in 04 and the Accord was in great shape and super low miles ~30k. I'm sure he was able to turn a tidy profit on his used car lot.

ada1 · March 2006

I am thinking about purchasing my friend's car at lease end. Her lease with AHFC ends in July. Wondering at what price would this be a good deal for me to purchase the car from her? Does the payout quote include taxes already? She wants to avoid any penalties for the slight damage to the car. Can you tell me what additional fees I would have to account for with her buying the car and then selling it to me? Would I be in better shape buying from a dealer? Thank you for any help or advice.

Location: New York
Year/Make/Model: 2003 Honda Civic EX
Body Style: 4dr
Engine: 4 cylinder, auto
Driveline: FWD
Mileage: 34,000
Color: Dark blue/tan
Major Options: standard options, not sure though
Condition: Overall good condition....minor scratches from parking in the city. Dent on side passenger door from another car door banging into it. 2 inch crack in back bumper.
Tires, Brakes, Maintenance - not sure. I am guessing the overall condition of the car is good. It's been taken care of and maintained.

bnels1443 · March 2006

I have an 02 Galant that I am a little bit over on the miles and it's a good car. I would like to buy out as a second car. I've asked twice if the price is negotiable. Both times I have been told they do not negotiate. I was wondering if I am just talking to the wrong person or if this is company policy. I've been told by several sources that Mitsubishi is getting killed on a glut of leases coming back now. I'm more than willing to buy but not at the buyout price.

The way it stand now either I have to get screwed overpaying to buy it or they have to get screwed taking it back and losing several grand at auction. There has to be a middle ground.

qbrozen · March 2006

exactly. if they will get killed taking it back, then it is in their best interest to negotiate. not that they will do what is in their best interest ...

sebring95 · March 2006

I've also heard that Mitsubishi finance has insurance policy on the residuals. But that's just a rumor. I personally don't know anyone that negotiated the buy-out on one.

michaellno · March 2006

My guess is that more manufacturers are starting to do this .. I believe that Ford does this.

When we bought our VW at the end of its lease, we got VW Credit to shave off a few hundred in the residual and throw in an extended warranty. In addition, they offered us a pretty decent financing rate.

rroyce10 · April 2006

..... They're insuring the fleet for "X" amount of $$ .. not specific vehicles ....

.... so if the market changes, there is plenty of supply and the auctions get loaded up, then they will negotiate -- which is 60/70% of the time ...

Terry.

isellhondas · April 2006

I don't understand...

Why are you getting screwed? You were aware of the residual at the time you leased it, right?

Suppose they decided to RAISE the amount of the residual after you told them you wanted to buy the car?

Same difference!

steine13 · April 2006

I don't understand...

I thought he explained it quite well.

By sticking to the agreement and buying the car, he gets a bad deal.

By sticking to the agreement and turning in the car, Mitsubishi gets a bad deal.

You were aware of the residual at the time you leased it, right?

He was.
He still is.
That's what he's been talking about.

Negotiating a lease buyout is not immoral, illegal, or fattening. In this case, it's the smart thing to do.

-Mathias

isellhondas · April 2006

Why come here to complain?

He was hoping they might negotiate the residual and they wouldn't do that.

End of story. He doesn't have to buy the car.

sebring95 · April 2006

The folks he talked to haven't negotiated yet. He wanted to know if anyone else has gotten them to negotiate the residual. Perfectly good question. I learned via forums that you could negotiate with XM to get a better price when your free subscription expires. So instead of paying $145 or whatever they wanted, I called 6-10 times until I got someone willing to work with me. I paid $77 for a year instead of $145. Not bad for dialing the phone a few times. If someone else out there has recently gotten Mitsu finance to negotiate, it would be worth his effort to press on.

qbrozen · April 2006

I think you are reading a bit too much into it, isell. The poster was not saying he "is getting screwed," he merely stated that, if he bought the car at the stated residual, he would be getting screwed. He didn't attribute blame to this or anything. The way I took it is that he would be screwing himself by paying so much.

audia8q · April 2006

Another thing to remember...

Assuming the car is good enough to own it is worth MORE than the same exact car on a lot somewhere....the reason is simple. The consumer knows the car...they know who was driving it and how it was serviced, etc....a used car on a lot is a mystery.....I personally would value my own car up to $1000 more than the same car on a lot because there is no mystery.

theflush · April 2006

****Honda Finance will usually not negotiate** ...
**
** Thats not true .. it depends on the area of **the country, right now they are negotiating in the **Midwest area -if- properly done ...........
**
** Terry.

Terry, (or anyone else):

What is the proper way to negotiate with AHFC? I have an '04 Ody EX-RES (residual $20,575 IIRC)that I am condsidering buying in Ohio. It seems like there should be a lot of '04 Odys coming off lease at the same time due to the great deal they offered 2 years ago, which might slightly lower their value. There is no damage to it, although I'll have 5,000 extra miles on it at lease end. I still have not decided whether to buy it, take their lease extension offer, or turn it in and get something else.

rkramb · April 2006

I am interested in this question also. I plan on buying out the lease on my 2003 civic when it ends in March 2007. Do they negotiate on anything? Can I finance the purchase loan through AHFC? Does taking the lease extension reduce the residual? When does AHFC start contacting you about lease end options? Any help is much appreciated.

theflush · April 2006

Another Honda question. Can a friend of mine buy my off-lease Ody directly from AHFC at the residual value if I decide I do not want it?

wale_bate1 · April 2006

I just purchased my leased IS300 Sportcross from the big T financial. Negotiation at the end of the lease is something I have done previously on a couple domestics - to the tune of $5K off the residual - but it really depends on how badly the company positions itself in the lease.

On the Lexota, the subsidized lease was written with a little less than a 50% residual on a car capable of holding some value and not price-incentived to death in the marketplace to begin with. Result is that the buyout at $17.4K and change is far below the NADA retail book at $26K+. Considering the value and saleability of the product as used or CPO, not much reason for them to negotiate on the residual, which they wouldn't (don't think I didn't ask). What was a little surprising is that they weren't interested in offering any competitive rate on financing the residual, especially in light of my being a "preferred customer" as they told me in three mailings and two follow up phone calls! No matter; Patelco took care of me on rates and with impeccable service.

So it would seem to me that negotiation really depends on equity position and demand.

wale_bate1 · April 2006

Why not just sell it to him directly for the payoff. I know in CA he'd be responsible for the sales tax and transfer fee; not sure if it's that way everywhere, but assuming a bank check seems like low liability to me.

kyfdx · April 2006

Honda Finance will only sell it to the lessee... or to a licensed dealer (through a trade-in)... They won't sell it to an individual third party...

wale_bate1 · April 2006

What about if I leased, like, a Maxx or somethin'?

no_clever_name · May 2006

So I'm at the end of my first lease. I leased an '04 Acura TSX and I'm pretty sure I know what I want to do with it, but I have some questions about the process.

The buyout is 16800. KBB lists the "good" price as about 18k, but doesn't account for the fog lights and underbody kit I had installed by the dealer when I bought it. Not sure that even matters. Either way, this is probably an indication that I got hosed on the lease deal, but that's water under the bridge.

'04 TSXs with roughly 45k mileage (same as mine) are selling for about $23-$25k at dealerships, so it seems reasonable that I could get a dealer to take it off my hands as a trade-in and maybe even get some money towards my next car. Dealer pays 18k, puts 500-1000 bucks to recondition it and sells it for $23k+, everyone's happy, right? Never having done this before, am I being too optimistic?

Next question: Honda says they don't negotiate end of lease buyouts, but there's a fair amount of evidence showing that's not true. I have no interest in buying out this car, but would they dicker with dealers? The cynic in me says probably. I guess I don't really care, but I'd like my car to be as attractive as a trade in as possible.

Final question, but it's a two-parter. Honda says that I can only trade it to other Honda/Acura dealers. Is that true? Seems unlikely. Second part, if that is true, presumably these dealership networks that have multiple locations selling various brands would be a loophole through this problem, right? Like a dealership sells Hondas at one location but Lexuses (Lexi?) at another, I could still trade it in at the Lexus dealership. Or is there no cooperation among dealers even under the same name?

Thanks in advance; apologies for the length.

wale_bate1 · May 2006

To the two-parter first:

Kyfdx can step in here and correct me if I'm wrong, but I say you can use it as a trade anywhere you please, or I'm several dutchmen. Happens many times every day. Honda Finance will have to release their interest in the vehicle, but will do so upon receipt of a valid check for the payoff. Any dealer interested in selling you a new car will take care of the paperwork and payment transfer. The answer second part of the question is, in my experience, dealers within a network are cooperative, and are so for their own benefit.

Your other option is to secure a simple car loan (with no pre-payment penalty, which you should never accept anyway) from your favorite financial institution a few days before you finalize your deal on the new car, and let the new car dealer send them a payoff before your first payment is due. My credit union processed my paperwork in less than 40 minutes, and my first payment isn't due until June. But I really don't think it's necessary if you want to use it for a trade.

First question: no I don't think you're being unrealistic at all. I had an equity split like yours and was figuring on getting at least $2K of that equity in a trade, after proposing nearly $3K, so my opinion is you're about on the money if not a tad low.

Second question: can't say, but I'd imagine a high equity position like yours would be a "no" from Honda Financial. They have little reason to negotiate on something that will make thm new money as a CPO, is what I'm thinking...

qbrozen · May 2006

i agree with wale-bate.

you can trade that car wherever you desire. If you know the total payoff, then start getting quotes on trade-in value from dealers you might want to buy from. I wouldn't even buy it from Honda. Let the dealer your trading it to do that and then give you the difference between buyout and trade-in towards your car, just like you want.

couldn't be easier.

sebring95 · May 2006

It is possible that you'd be required to trade it at a Honda/Acura dealer. Essentially when you're trading a lease, the dealer is buying it out for you. However, the leasing company is technically only obligated to sell the vehicle to YOU at the residual/buy-out price. Unless they decide otherwise which is usually the case. However, sometimes they will enforece this (GMAC has done it to me on a vehicle I had substantial equity in....). They would only transfer the vehicle into my name at the agreed upon buy-out price. That meant I had to pay tax on it before trading/sellling. It's a technicality that they can use if they want.

qbrozen · May 2006

huh. I don't really understand that. I mean, when you trade a vehicle in with a payoff, you sign a power of attorney document that gives the dealer the right to pay off your loan/lease.

I'm not sure how anyone can stop this from happening.

sebring95 · May 2006

I looked over a lot of documents when GM was giving me a hard time. Like I said, it's a technicality that they can use if they want. It's not like a loan where you own the vehicle, a leased vehicle belongs too the leasor and they can do what they want. I can see why they'd want to do it, particularly if you're going to turn in a vehicle that's worth $20,000 and the buyout is only $15,000. Why would they want to bend-over backwards to help you?

kyfdx · May 2006

I'm not a leasing expert... I just play one on Edmunds..

Anyway, I agree with most of what wale_bate says.. I've always assumed that I could trade my leased car in anywhere, as long as the dealer remitted the current payoff to the leasing company... In fact, I've done it several times...

That stated, my name is not on the title, and the only contractual obligation that the leasing company has with me, is to sell it to me for the residual amount at the end of the lease. So, they don't have to comply. Although, in my experience, most will.

Specifically regarding the TSX.. This was a very popular model when introduced 3 years ago (4/1/03).. As such, Honda Finance did not have to offer stellar residuals, as the cars were in short supply. Since the car has remained popular, it is one of the few cars that lessees actually might have positive equity in, as they near lease end..

I'm sure this fact hasn't escaped the people at Honda Finance... It is entirely possible that they will not allow you to trade the car in to any other dealer than Honda/Acura... It is certainly their contractual right. I also doubt they would negotiate on what is already a below market residual amount...

In 95% of deals, you can trade your leased car into any dealer you wish.... and some leasing companies will even transfer the car directly to another individual that agrees to buy it (not Honda Finance).. but, in this case, I believe they are not going to help you make any money on your leased car... They took the risk, and if you don't exercise your purchase option, they will reap the reward.

regards,
kyfdx
(often wrong, but never unsure)

wale_bate1 · May 2006

Just to clarify, I'm assuming it's the end of the lease and the final payment has been made, as it was in my case. Don't know if that's of any impact in relation to your experiences or not.

Should Honda be able, and decide, to exercise a right to disallow a trade for another mfr's product, one could always excercize their residual buyout option as I stated before, and trade away at will. So I fail to see why they would make the least noise were the paperwork and check to come from a dealer versus a lender or any other viable entity.

Interestingly enough, as an aside, I received the pink slip in the mail just after making the final payment in April. I found that unusual, as did my branch manager at the credit union. I wouldn't think Toyota would offer that piece of paper up.

I find the equity position I'm in on the IS300 Sportcross delightful and somewhat amusing. I give Toyota full marks for writing the lease in such a way as to protect their interests from all sides and still make it so very attractive to me. I'm not going to don the safron robes and pray at the Big T altar by any means, but it is a stark contrast to the way my previous Chrysler, GMAC and GECAL leases were written; all of which could be, and some were, heavily negotiated at expiration.

The Chrysler one was actually comical. I got a phone call from Chrysler Financial and the lady asked if I was in fact the gentleman (a stretch) on the registration, and how did I like the car. I said I liked it fine. She asked how I would feel about purchasing it if they knocked five grand off the residual. Bang! Just like that without a word from me. I said I would like it even better if they would take nine grand off. She said she was only authorized to go to six and a half! I said OK.

sebring95 · May 2006

I attempted to trade my leased '03 Silverado about 3 months before the end of the lease. My buy-out at that point (residual + payments) was around $15,800. The KBB trade-in value was around $17,500 and that's what I was being offered on trade for my Tundra. GMAC refused to allow the dealer (a Toyota/Chevy dealer) to buy the vehicle for the $15,800. They claimed the price was only good if sold to me and that how the title would be sent. That means I'd have to pay tax on the truck in order to transfer it to the dealer which would only give me $500 equity.

After I made the last payment, I called them to try and negotiate the buy-out price. No way, they were essentially rude and said if I didn't want to pay the price as agreed upon in the lease, then I should turn the vehicle in. So I sent them a check and they sent me the title. I ended up private selling it and came out ok, but it certainly made things difficult for no good reason besides the fact they chose to be idiots about it. There was no way I was turning it in.

no_clever_name · May 2006

I confess I haven't read through the contract recently, but in all of the "end of lease" nonsense they've sent me, Honda has certainly said I can trade the car into a Honda/Acura dealer. If they mention a new car at all, they only talk about it as a new lease, though. I suspect that's just because they assume that if you leased once you'll want to do it again (not true in this case).

And as has been mentioned, there's nothing stopping me from buying the car from Honda and then trading it in immediately. In fact, I rather expect a dealer could facilitate that at the same time I buy a new car. So it sounds like at the very worst, I'm out around 500 bucks in sales tax, but with 1000-1500 using it as a trade, it'd still be worth it. I could live with that.

rprossil · May 2006

Does anyone have any recent experience with NMAC on negoiation of a lease end purchase? I have an '04 Nissan Quest minivan with 8 months left on lease and am starting to think about my options. We like the van, will still have some warranty with Nissan's extension, but Nissan has big incentives on '06s, and the updated '07 is due out in the next few months. I'm wondering with the big incentives on the current style if I might have some wiggle room on a purchase at the end. Any thoughts? Thanks.

solaraman2003 · June 2006

Hello,

CHASE lease on 2003 Toyota Solara SLEv6 ends in 2 months. I want to purchase the vehicle.

Where I can find any info about helping me NEGOTIATE a better purchase price for it, if this is possible?

Also, I'm getting conflicting estimates on value between edmunds.com and kbb.com. WHY such a difference? The difference in prices is about $4,000, which is QUITE A LOT.

steine13 · June 2006

Help me out here; the '03 is the last of the original Solara?

If so, good for you; they're still popular; not everyone likes the newer body style, and they haven't been as bulletproof either. The 1st gen cars are worth a lot of money.

There's a good chance that it'll make sense for you to buy it at lease end, but I doubt they'll cut you much slack. Your best bet is to drop a full description -- use the template provided -- over in Real-World Trade-In Values and go from there.

Also, if you do a search around the old (now read-only) leasing thread, you'll find good advice on how to negotiate with the leasing companies... I wouldn't get my hopes up, but it doesn't hurt to ask.

Good luck,
-Mathias

isellhondas · June 2006

Residuals are normally set in stone so most likely you will have to pay the residual.

On the flip side, if they calculated it too low, thye wouldn't be able to adjust it upward.

Banks use either KBB or NADA to determine loan values.

qbrozen · June 2006

On the flip side, if they calculated it too low, thye wouldn't be able to adjust it upward.

Well, heck, why would they? If they calculated too low, that means you paid too much during the life of the lease.

On the other side, calculating too high means they'd take a bath when they take the car back and have to auction it off. Seems to me it would be in their best interest to deal with the leasee and negotiate the buyout (as long as its more than they'd get at auction).

isellhondas · June 2006

I see your point but once they start that, everyone who wants to buy at the end will expect to haggle over the residual.

steine13 · June 2006

People sometimes get hung up on the "residual". Aside from the fact that it determines the payment amount, that number does not mean anything.

The car is just a used car. It does not no way no how ne pas nicht kein bisschen have a "fixed price".

All there is is an option for the customer to buy at a predetermined price. It's an obligation on the part of the finance company to sell the car for that price.

Aside from that, it's just another of the millions of used cars out there looking for an owner. Its price will either be determined at the auction (most cases) or by haggling over it with someone.

And plenty, if not most, of the finance companies will haggle with customers, because it's in their best interest.

Some companies figure they don't want to get into that, and there's probably an argument to be made, as it helps to protect the resale value of their product. But it ain't cheap...

-Mathias

qbrozen · June 2006

well, sure. I think everyone just wants to pay the "right" price.

If Honda doesn't want to haggle, that's certainly their perogative. But it might not be the best business practice if they keep losing money at auction (not that they are, because Honda, in particular, has such crazy resale values that I'm sure they are doing just fine).

In any case, I MAY purchase my honda at lease end (not likely since i love changing cars so much). If I do decide to, I'm certainly not overpaying for it. If the residual is market-correct at the time of lease end, great. If not, they can either drop the price for me or take it back and lose even more. Doesn't seem like a tough choice to me. But maybe that's why I don't make the big bucks. :confuse:

qbrozen · June 2006

I'm with you.

I'm not sure I agree about that protecting their resale value, though. I doubt a few hundred or even a few thousand people who may negotiate their lease buyout would do much of anything to affect the marketplace.

zhenliu · June 2006

2002 Mercedes c240 with 49 month lease, 15K per yr, will mature on the 08/31/06. Residual value is 15,320. Bank One (now Chase) dont want to negotiate the buyout price. Any suggestion?

qbrozen · June 2006

suggestion as to what? if you should buy it? how many miles? what options? what condition?

steine13 · June 2006

Two suggestions:
(i) Unless you really know cars, and got some money to spend on them, don't own a Benz past the warranty

(ii) Run Forest Run!

Seriously. I wouldn't buy it unless it has been absolutely, Toyota-ain't-in-it, trouble-free. AND you really liked it.

-Mathias

rprossil · June 2006

I'll second that. Volvos and almost any European brand fall into that category. Even with all the amenities the dealers provide, the enjoyment fades quickly when you have to pay the cashier all the time to get your keys back after a service visit.

wale_bate1 · June 2006

Third that, but more because of Benz's recent history (now clearing up a bit thankfully) on QC issues, and the fact that it's a C240 as opposed to a 320, though that's a very minor distinction. A 2002 puts it right about square in the middle of the more troubled years IIRC.

I'm not sure I would recommend holding on to any lux or near lux brand beyond coverage. I bought out my Lexus residual only because I couldn't find anything else on the market right now that appealed to me more, not so much because of any bullet-proof reliability. RWD compact sport wagons are now impossible to buy here; I have the last model sold in the US.

And it isn't major mechanical I would sweat, but rather the nigglings of "luxury" electronic and electric conveniences, which are most often the usual suspects. Costly and annoying suspects at that...

sebring95 · June 2006

And it isn't major mechanical I would sweat, but rather the nigglings of "luxury" electronic and electric conveniences, which are most often the usual suspects. Costly and annoying suspects at that...

Exactly, and even the Japanese brands will cost you an arm and a leg to upkeep once the warranty is up. A friend keeps his luxury vehicles a long time and drops about $4,000/year on his '98 LX470. Seats/steering columns that move everytime you enter/exit won't last forever. Electronic suspensions crap-out, stereo/video quits working, all expensive stuff on cheap brands, let along Lexus/Audi/MB/etc. I'd rather spend the money on new ones than maintaining old ones, even if it does cost more. My wifes GX is about out of warranty and it will be going bye-bye soon.

Purchasing at the End of Your Lease

Comments

Helpful Tools

Most popular vehicles