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Midsize Sedans Comparison Thread

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Comments

  • kwonc71kwonc71 Member Posts: 245
    I just found this post from 06 Sonata forum which is a good example of my point.

    "I have been lurking here for a few weeks and because of Edmunds and this forum my wife and I bought a Sonata (never thought I would). We looked at the V6 with leather heated seats versions of the Mazda 6, Legacy, Accord, Altima and the 07 Camry. We decided we wanted the new Camry XLE. But thought we would check out the Sonata... Glad we did. We were surprised how much we liked the car. The best price for the 07 Camry XLE would have been invoice plus $150 with no factory rebates or incentives. With the Hyundai rebate and financing rebate we paid $18500 for the LX (no sunroof) plus TTL. We did like the Camry a little more than the Sonata but with a price difference of about $7000 I feel that the Sonata was a ‘no-brainer’. Our local dealer is the only one in the area so I was concerned that the lack of competition would affect the price I wanted to pay. But the buying process went quickly and smoothly. So thanks to this forum and to all you that post messages for helping us save $7000 :) "- Hyundai LX Buying Experience In Spokane WA

    It won't be the last case, there will be many people who will share same experience like that person did.
  • kwonc71kwonc71 Member Posts: 245
    "Many woman will still choose Camry LE over LX Sonata, but hard to imagine a Man test drive both cars and still take LE over LX."

    I was saying that woman likely will pick Camry for known reliability and brand name, man will more likely pick bang for the bucks and take a chance. Had nothing to do with which one is more smarter than the other. Simply, talking about preferences.

    I will think twice before I make some comments, from now on. However, I'm not the god who can make everyone happy on this forum.
  • zzzoom6zzzoom6 Member Posts: 425
    or it shows how rabidly loyal sonata fans are...cognitave dissonance maybe? actually saw on motor week (tv show on pbs) that they chose the sonata as their family car choice. although motor week rarely says anything negative about cars they review, the only bad thing they had to say about the sonata was the "awkwardly designed" interior. but steering, brakes, and of course value got them to choose it. props to hyundai! but for those of you who have obviously already drunk the kool-aid, don't let this go to your heads...i'm not holding my breath.
  • zzzoom6zzzoom6 Member Posts: 425
    tinatina writes, "All of this Hyyundai versus Toyota stuff is pretty interesting."

    or it shows how rabidly loyal sonata fans are...cognitave dissonance maybe? actually saw on motor week (tv show on pbs) that they chose the sonata as their family car choice. although motor week rarely says anything negative about cars they review, the only bad thing they had to say about the sonata was the "awkwardly designed" interior. but steering, brakes, and of course value got them to choose it. props to hyundai! but for those of you who have obviously already drunk the kool-aid, don't let this go to your heads...i'm not holding my breath.
  • fsowirlesfsowirles Member Posts: 195
    ... The majority of midsize buyers are families. The V6 LE will still be faster than the V6 LX.. The 4c LE will still be about the same as the 4c LX, so what does that prove?

    Again you have to take this into account... this comparo was only directed to top-shelf buyers.. it was not directed to economy buyers or even low $20K buyers...

    I would not have looked at the Sonata as a potential purchase because it lacks features that were must haves for me, mainly OEM Nav and Bluetooth. The Camry had everything I wanted in a price that was a better value than the other cars that had what I wanted (TL, 330i, S60, MazdaSpeed6).
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    or it shows how rabidly loyal sonata fans are...

    Or how about those Camcord fans who don't mind shelling out thousands more for a Camcord than for a car like a Sonata or Fusion. Now that's rabidly loyal.
  • lightfootfllightfootfl Member Posts: 442
    Yeah Backy, ;) But you are forgetting about the lighted cup holders that are now available. You really need to get them.
    ;)
  • patpat Member Posts: 10,421
    Sweeping generalizations are almost always dangerous and certainly unneccessary. We don't need to broadly categorize buyers in this manner. All we need to do is talk about our own preferences.

    Thanks.
  • tinatinatinatina Member Posts: 388
    Thanks for your comments. I saw only three Sonata versions at the Auto Show back in November. I only sat n the GL whose seats were cheap. I would seriously consider a Sonata, but the only problem here is that the nearest dealership are at least 25 miles each way to/from my home.

    The only problem with the latest Camry CE/LE are the following: cheap interior seats (the Accord I have are better) and the front end styling of the grill. When I mentioned transplanting the Accord engine/tranny into the 2007 Camry, its because that powerplant works well. Very smooth shifts.

    Two other concerns about the Hyundai - if I remember correctly, no 5 speed auto available on the GL/GLS, right?
    and another issue would be the huge depreciation.

    I do like their SUV and I saw an awesome looking Azera the other day that reminded me a bit of a German car/ Alfa Romeo sedan
  • cxccxc Member Posts: 122
    "Yet, suspension and interior of the Hyundai are clearly inferior to the Cam/Cord"

    2007 Camry has the cheapest and simplest suspension (worst) – front McPherson-Strut and rear two links while Fusion, Sonata, and Accord have front double-wishbone and rear multi-links that are the same as that of LEXUS GS and LS.

    The interior is subject to personal preference.

    Hybrid has good fuel economy while it has bad "money" economy.
  • alpha01alpha01 Member Posts: 4,747
    Components only tell one part of the story; its how they actually function together that matters. By all accounts thus far, Toyota has significantly improved the Camry's suspension in the softer LE/XLE as well as (and especially) the SE for this generation.

    Consider this- in this month's Car and Driver 3 of the tested $15,000 cars, using "cheapest and simplest(worst)" rear drum brakes- were able to stop from 70 MPH in under 170 feet. Whats the argument for the more expensive rear discs?

    ~alpha
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Member Posts: 7,160
    Hybrid has good fuel economy while it has bad "money" economy.

    And this statement is based on what data?

    XLE 4c Base + VSC but no SKS is : ~$25700
    LE V6 Base +VSC, JBL, BT, AW, Auto dimming mirror is : ~$25800
    But this trim lacks several interior niceties.

    TCH Base is : $26500

    All three models are within $800 of each other but the TCH has somewhat nicer features inside... oh
    and about 30% better fuel economy than the XLE 4c
    and about 50% better fuel economy than the LE V6
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Member Posts: 7,160
    2007 Camry has the cheapest and simplest suspension (worst) – front McPherson-Strut and rear two links while Fusion, Sonata, and Accord have front double-wishbone and rear multi-links that are the same as that of LEXUS GS and LS.

    From all reports and comparo's, including the most recent here the Camry is the benchmark for quiet smooth ride, which the sonata seems to have matched very well. It seems that Toyota has always done very well in the ride aspect over every other competitor.

    Are you speaking about slalom tests or racing now. See the SE for this, not the LE or XLE. Otherwise it's a non-issue. Very few ever complains about the Camry ride. It's one of it's strongest qualities.

    The interior is '..eye of the beholder.'
  • pocono35pocono35 Member Posts: 89
    According to Edmunds recent test the Sonata has the lowest decible rating benchmarking even the Camry. Accords tend to be more noisey and roady.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    I don't mind the seat fabric on the GL but I don't like the lever-type height adjuster--I prefer a dual-knob height adjuster like Hyundai offers on some of its other cars, or the power adjuster that is available on the GLS and standard on the LX.

    The automatic on the I4 Sonata is a 4-speed now, but it works well and returns fuel economy comparable to that of the Camry and Accord. So what is the issue? There are rumors that Hyundai will start offering a 5-speed auto on the I4 in the future, since they offer it in other countries and the 2006.5 Kia Optima with the same engine has the 5-speed auto standard.

    Re depreciation, Hyundais do tend to depreciate faster than Hondas and Toyotas. If you plan on keeping the car only a couple of years, that can be an issue. But when you factor in the huge difference in up-front costs compared to the Camcords, it's at worst a wash if you own the car a few years. If you are really concerned about depreciation, you can lease. Right now Hyundai is offering a special lease on the V6 GLS, it was $199/month for 30 months with about $3k down in my local paper yesterday. I think that included a moonroof. In other words, the lease deal on the V6 Sonata is about the same or even a little less than that on an I4 Camcord.
  • choe13choe13 Member Posts: 348
    "The ES Lexus is the same as the V6 Camry"



    Can i ask then who in heavens if they had a logical mind then buy a es lexus instead of a camry?? They share basic structure but thats about it. The lexus has different set up and engineering for suspension, it clearly is more luxuiously made, it has quite better sound insulation etc. So there is no way they are the same cars(almost 50-60 percent not same in my books).

    In regards to suspension setup of the camry with its cheap struts and two link rear set up, you can tell , they have done a good job after numerous amount of refinements, but just adding a stiffer bar to them to make it sportier is not very classy at all. The ride maybe good, but when you drive a camry you can tell how disconnected the steering feels to the road(reasons of suspension). To me this is an intagible that maybe better than say a higher quality stereo system.

    The sonata and accord on the other hand though are still family cars, have a much more connected feel to the road.

    And this talk about generation behind issue, i have no problem stating honda, toyota, bmw, mercedez are more the innovators of this industry however they do charge a premium for their makes and they don't want to go beyond for the cutomers(no value).

    To sum it up I see a , sonata as a poor mans audi a6(styling, luxury feel)+ hyundais japanese like quality made + best value and a camcord leaders in their segments(just good enough exterior design, just good enough brakes, no esc std, good engine, interiors) and priced too high. The sonata clearly in a overall sense is a better buy
  • alpha01alpha01 Member Posts: 4,747
    That was an incredibly difficult post to read please do not use, bolded font so extensively I really couldnt understand exactly what. you were tyring to say?

    ~alpha
  • bobadbobad Member Posts: 1,587
    2007 Camry has the cheapest and simplest suspension (worst) – front McPherson-Strut
    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

    Unbelievable. McPherson struts were originally developed to save money, space, and weight in tiny FWD cars. Some don't even have camber adjustment if wheel alignment is needed. Profits on the Camry must be very high if they cut corners this frugally.

    Not to say McPherson struts are totally bad mind you. They can obviously be tuned and isolated and make a nice quiet ride. I don't think they will stand up to pot holes as well as wishbone and multi-link suspension.
  • kwonc71kwonc71 Member Posts: 245
    Sunday, had nothing to do. Went to Toyota dealership for a test drive on LE. $21,300 no discount, sales person said may be knock $300 off if manager is in a good mood today. "New Camry is so popular, we could not have enough" he said. Anyway here is actual impression of new camry LE silver I test drove @ $2,000 more than my LX.

    Front end looks very different than sedan we used looked at. Reminds me of an Angry Monkey. Depends on a person, he or she might actually like that sensational look, but not me. Rear end was better looking than front, but I will choose the Sonata's back over Camry's too. Given 100 points to my favorite shape of car TL, I would give Sonata's look 90 points, and 80 points goes for new Camry.

    Inside, looks more up to date and soft wider cloth seat was more comfy than the seat in Sonata. However, LE's lack of wood trim and leather seat of my LX Sonata made cheesy looks, sticking out middle dash makes LE's inside feel smaller than Sonata too. If it is XLE I will give more points on Camry, but same inside points goes for both LX and LE.

    Handling and performance. LE's I4 was not bad, felt same as GL I had or slightly faster. May be mid 9 sec 0-60. Its not makes sense to even compare my LX's V6 to LE's I4. Shift smoother than GL, but hard to tell between my LX. Center feel was too soft. Body rolls at corner more than my LX, but less than GL. Brake felt soft too compare to my LX, and GL Sonata had even better brake feel than LX.

    Look at the XLE I4 with moon,wood trims, 6 cd, NO leather, and 16" wheels. $25,800. The dealership did not have any V6 yet I can try. Sales person said 80-90% of sales will be I4 anyway.

    After the test drive, sales person asked me how I like Toyota compares to my Hyundai, and if I want to trade in LX today for a LE. I told him, My $19,500 LX is twice more car than LE. He ran back to office.

    On my way back, I stopped by the Tonkin Kia, take a look at the new Sedona my wife wanted. They said I can swap MDX with 06 Sedona EX with rebates. As soon as my wife ready, we will go to dealership. I hope we can come back with new rig today.
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Member Posts: 7,160
    Not to say McPherson struts are totally bad mind you. They can obviously be tuned and isolated and make a nice quiet ride. I don't think they will stand up to pot holes as well as wishbone and multi-link suspension.

    This is such a mountain out of a molehill. You'd think that there have been massive complaints over the past 10-15 yrs that Camry's have been falling apart and shaking to pieces due to the '..cheapest..' suspensions. The exact opposite is true and everyone knows it. Camry's last well into 200K+ miles if cared for normally. I've had 4 since 1989 and put over 500,000 miles on them with nothing major ( one needed a tranny job at 187,000 mi so I traded it as-is ).

    This is a silly subject. It's the smoothest ( Sonata is very good after benchmarking the Camry ) and quietest in the long run. It is not an offroad vehicle and it's not a racing car. It's a family sedan.
  • pocono35pocono35 Member Posts: 89
    When Hyundai put a shot across Toyota's bow with the Sonata, Toyota was preparing to launch a Camry that is as much of an advance in the mid-size segment as was the Sonata an advance for Hyundai. I think we all need to realize that Toyota's planners probably knew Hyundai was planning a major assault and this new Toyota is a massive response. None of us would dispute that Toyota can put out a car that would severely raise the bar like a 'Lexus in Camry clothing'if they desire. I think they have. They are also offering a hybrid. Price is nothing spectacular, but it doesn't need to be because it is not meant to take buyers away from Hyundai but buyers in mid-size segment who aren't buying a Hyundai or Honda or Nissan. It is the benchmark!
    The other day, I saw the new Camry for the first time and was rather surprised by its presence. I realized Toyota wasn't fooling around with this car. I understand as well that Toyota has halted the production of the new Corolla and set it back 6 mos. after seeing the new Civic. Toyota wants increased market share and will use their huge corporate resources to get it.
    This is the first Camry I have ever considered buying.
  • tinatinatinatina Member Posts: 388
    There is a noticeable difference between the 4 speeed automatic that I had in my 2000 Accord versus the 5 speed automatic in my 2004. When I tested the Camry in the Summer of 2003, they did not yet have a 5 speed automatic. With the 5 speed, there's better shifting and better fuel economy. Its by far the best shifting automatic I ever owned. I get about 27 miles to the gallon in mixed city/freeway usage, which is not bad considering the stop and go traffic and the hills of the City by the Bay. I also went with the Accord because of the dealership and salesperson. The Toyota service/sales practice at the dealerships I went to or was familiar with through contacts, were not that good.

    I will check out the V-6 Sonata, especially if I can get one for about $17k after rebate, exclusive of TTL. As far as the suspension in the Sonata, that's is the only minus they indicated with that vehicle. I'm use to the Honda suspension which provides very good handling, but transmits a bit more road noise. This is just a personal preference.

    To that other poster, the fact that the Camry has a mcpherson suspension does not make it the worst. I think you are equating the worst with being of a very simple design. This does not necessarily equate. I will hold judgment of the 2007 Camry until/unless I test-drive it in terms of ride handling/suspension versus my 2004 Accord. One thing that would be worse on the Camry is the fuel economy projectsions versus a 2006 Accord, and horsepower. Also, with the front grille, you don't know if you are driving a Mazda 3.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    A five speed auto will also help optimize where the RPMs lie in a given situation. Ex:

    My 4-speed Accord LX will go to about 4,300 RPM at 75 MPH when floored (well short of the power peak in the mid 5k RPM range). My 2006 Accord EX w/5 Speed Auto goes to 5,500 RPM or so given the same conditions, MUCH better power when needed. It also allows for a better overdrive gear (500 less RPMS at 75MPH in my 5-speed vs. my 4-speed = 3 MPG better highway).
  • seniorjoseseniorjose Member Posts: 277
    "According to Edmunds recent test the Sonata has the lowest decible rating benchmarking even the Camry. Accords tend to be more noisey and roady."

    ...but nobody is buying them...lack of perceived value and Daewoo engines!
  • cxccxc Member Posts: 122
    You have had 4 Camrys! My former boss' wife bought a MB E-class diesel in 1990; it costs about 3 - 4 Camrys. She is still driving it. She said that she was going to make 1 million miles.
  • tinatinatinatina Member Posts: 388
    Perhaps even more importantly, there is a big difference in the 4 speed of the earlier Hondas/Acuras, which shifted poorly or had hestitation issues. This is gone in the current generation Accord - no hesitation or poor shifting. I've driven three Hondas since the 1980s, and the current generation Accord has the best tranny/engine response of any Accord, or any of the compentition(again excluding the 2007 Camry-since I have not tested it). Honda has clearly leaped ahead of the competition with respect to this area (again excluding the latest version of the Camry-since I have not yet tested it).
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    Daewoo engines! LOL! That was a good one! :D
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    ...but nobody is buying them...lack of perceived value and Daewoo engines!

    Daewoo engine? Um, no. No Daewoo motors here.
  • ctc1ctc1 Member Posts: 66
    Daewoo engines were did that come from?
  • creduluscredulus Member Posts: 10
    Properly applied and executed, a McPherson strut front suspension can work very well, both from a handling and ride perspective. The McPherson strut rear suspension, actually called a Chapman strut, can also work well. Colin Chapman of Lotus was the first to apply a McPherson strut to a rear suspension design, hence the name Chapman strut. And, if any of you remember the Lotus Elan sports car, it was one of the best handling cars on the planet. Lotus F1 cars were no slouch either!!
  • creduluscredulus Member Posts: 10
    Hey Joe,

    Which planet Earth do you live on? Not selling them, that's an absolute lie . . . And, Daewoo engines, not quite sir. I think you're thinking of another Korean brand that supplies cars for GM. Remember the Pontiac LeMans, circa 1990? That was also a Daewoo.

    Hyundais have never used Daewoo engines. Unfortunately, your posts no longer have any credibility, as you do nothing but bash Hyundai - or, anything else that isn't Honda or Toyota.
  • alpha01alpha01 Member Posts: 4,747
    I believe the Daewoo engines comment came from ignorance, of which there's been a sharp rise lately on the edmunds.com boards.

    The rest of us know that Hyundai's latest engines are seriously competitive, and thats good enough...

    ~alpha
  • tinatinatinatina Member Posts: 388
    Alpha,

    Can you or maybe some else give me the pro/cons of the Hyundai GLS V-6, either in general or on the V-6 engine. Nice to see you on this thread - I just came here yesterday, and see that you also post/have posted here.

    Credulus - It was not me who made any comment about the MacPherson Suspension became cheap/inadequate/inferior in any way. I heard that this suspension was less complicated than others in terms of design. I think the other poster equated this with the suspension being cheap/inferior/inadequate/etc.



    Thanks,

    Tina (
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    A SHORT list of Pros/Cons from what I've heard from owners/testers:

    Pros:

    Features/Power/Car for the dollar
    Nice, inoffensive styling
    Many Stndrd Safety Features
    Better Ride Than Accord, nearly as good as Camry
    Roomy Inside

    Cons:

    Questionable Resale
    Reliability improving, but still unproven
    Inoffensive Styling low on the emotion meter (for me)
    Handling not as good as Accord, Mazda6
    Roomy interior still not at the quality of Honda/Toyota (9/10ths of the way there though!)

    There are many more pros than cons with this car.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    Specifically on the GLS V6 compared to other Sonata trim levels:

    * "Interesting" cloth pattern--almost a terrycloth texture. Grippy though.
    * 16" wheels/tires standard vs. 17" on the LX (17" available as an option). Ride is softer with the 16", but handling not quite as sharp. 17" alloys better looking IMO than the 16-inchers.
    * Power seat not standard. Seat height adjuster is a lever type and tends to tip you forward as you raise the seat--can be disconcerting for some, sit before you buy (also try the optional power seat, it has independent height adjustments for fore and aft).
    * Manual HVAC vs. automatic climate control (on LX).
    * Steering wheel doesn't telescope as on the LX--check that all drivers have a comfortable reach to the wheel.

    Note that if you find you need the power seat, by the time you add the package that includes it you are getting pretty close to the price of the LX. And there is more markup on the LX, so actual pricing may not be very far apart.
  • kwonc71kwonc71 Member Posts: 245
    It's little off topic, but it happened because of this forum. Thanks for Camry vs Sonata debate, I end up with EX 06 Sedona today. I happened to stop by Kia dealership to look at the o6 Sedona on my way back from the Toyota dealership that I had test drive. They agree with the price with MDX trade in. Took my wife back and got EX Sedona with 3.8L Azera engine, tire monitor, alloy wheels, power sliding doors, back door power lift,ECS with traction, ABS, remote entry, power middle window, mp3, trip computer, auto dimming, compass, shiftronics......... and so much more for $21,500. I could save another $2,000 if I still had 03 Sedona. That same engine Azera has moves this van fast. I can't imagine the power of Azera with less weight than Sedona and use same engine. Now the van has only 30 miles on it, already gets 20 MPG which is about 4 MPG better than turtle MDX had. Like the Sonata does in family sedan, I am happy to inform you that we have another cheap alternative for Oddiena.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    Good luck and congrats on your new van. I like the looks of yours MUCH better than the new revised Sienna, and the price can't be beat! The only flaw I can find with it is the fact that it drinks the good stuff. Premium. (yes, i realize it will take regular, at slightly diminished power, but why not make the engine run on regular to begin with; would it be that much more expensive to do? I'm asking seriously, not sarcastically.)
  • kwonc71kwonc71 Member Posts: 245
    I did on MDX because it required, not on Sedona.
  • meateatermeateater Member Posts: 123
    Why can't he bash Hyundai if he wants? You don't have to listen to him. Not everybody wants a Hyundai. That's for damn sure. Yea I think the Sonata is a decent car, but they're not selling many around here too. So it's not a lie that they're not selling everywhere. Chill.
  • goodegggoodegg Member Posts: 905
    Wow - amazing stuff. A Korean buying a Korean vehicle.
  • kwonc71kwonc71 Member Posts: 245
    Sure! Korean car made in America ( Sonata made in AL and Kia will soon have same size assembly line near by, give 1000s American good place work for). What can you ask for more? I like to support my mother country and the America where I happily live in, when American buy Japanese.
  • bobadbobad Member Posts: 1,587
    This is such a mountain out of a molehill. You'd think that there have been massive complaints over the past 10-15 yrs that Camry's have been falling apart and shaking to pieces due to the '..cheapest..' suspensions.
    ---------------------------------

    Actually, I think it's a tribute to Toyota's ingenuity to get so much from a cheap, simple suspension design. Haven't driven an 07, but I had no idea the 06 had McPherson struts until I heard it here. The dealer never mentioned it.
  • tinatinatinatina Member Posts: 388
    The 2007 Sonatas should be out next month or in June per an article I read last night. I don't have access to that Article but they blasted Hyundai for selling 30% of the vehicles to rental car companies. That is why with the new incentives one could get $3,000 in rebates plus 2.9% financing for a GLS V-6, 2006.
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Member Posts: 7,160
    1st Qtr Sales are out today...

    Monthly '06 vs '05
    Camry .. 93800 ... 98500
    Accord .. 78700 ... 80900
    Taurus .. 51800 ... 65000
    Fu /lan .. 37500 ... zero
    Sonata .. 42900 ... 28000

    1st Qtr is normally the slowest of all.
  • joe97joe97 Member Posts: 2,248
    Surprised to hear Taurus still leads in Ford car sales (at least at the top) for almost all of last year and this year. Looks like Fusion/Milan/Zephyr, combined, have exceeded its target goal so far, Kudos!! However, I thought total sales of the above triplets, combined, would have surpassed Taurus' figures (despite the fact to fleet) - I think this month it was somewhere around ~20K for Taurus and ~17K combined for F/M/Z - Fusion (~10.5K)/Milan(~3K)/Zephyr(~3.5K) - perhaps next month...

    Glad to see Hyundai making strides in the midsize class. Should this trend continues, Sonata will easily surpass 150K units/yr. As they say, quality products will sell themselves :)

    17.5K units moved this month for the Sonata should place the model in the top five (car sales)??
  • kwonc71kwonc71 Member Posts: 245
    "When Hyundai put a shot across Toyota's bow with the Sonata, Toyota was preparing to launch a Camry that is as much of an advance in the mid-size segment as was the Sonata an advance for Hyundai."

    I suggest you test drive a new Camry like I did. Test drive and compare LE which is about $2,000 more than top LX, and tell me what you think. I could not test drive V6 Camry, non on the lot. If you can test drive V6 Camry and compare to LX Sonata, will be very interesting to read. As far as LE goes, there is no comparison to my LX. $19,500 LX feels more luxury, sporty, way more fast, solid, and feel roomier than LE. I can say XLE will be more attempting than LX for many people. However, $7,000 to $11,000 price gap will make people think twice before they buy XLEs.

    Just reading what other people say and believe it, did not make sense to me. That Y I went to the Toyota dealership. I hope other people do same thing and see the fact.
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Member Posts: 7,160
    What is interesting enough is that people are not shopping the LX vs the XLE but rather the Acura TL vs the XLE. This has been my point. While the Hyundai is a very nice car it lacks enough features that certain shoppers wont consider it at all.

    A $30000 vehicle buyer is not a $19000 vehicle buyer.

    It's not being uppity it's a matter of content. The two vehicles are different enough in content that the buyers see the comparison immediately. Now the Azera is a different story. That may very well be a competition to the XLE Camry, but the Sonata is not.

    The V6 XLE and V6 SE +Navi + leather + BT will compete with the Azera and the LE/CE/SE 4c will compete against the V6 Sonata's. This in fact are the two comparo's that Edmunds did except they left out the Azera and put the Sonata in its place.

    At the end of the year the sales figures will still be
    450,000 Camry's
    200,000 Sonata's

    Both companies will make money on this product line.
  • kwonc71kwonc71 Member Posts: 245
    And 90% or more 450,000 Camrys owners will buy LE even though they wish to have XLE, only 10% or less will be lucky XLE owners. On the other hand, 70% or more of 200,000 Sonata owners will have happy V6. That means that most of Camry owners will have to stare at nice looking sedan with Big H logo from the behind, and that will be a shock for many proud Camry owners.
  • jhinscjhinsc Member Posts: 399
    ...That means that most of Camry owners will have to stare at nice looking sedan with Big H logo from the behind.

    That may mean something to you, but not to most Camry buyers.
  • alpha01alpha01 Member Posts: 4,747
    Wow, thats an awesome exaggeration. FWIW, according the recent Car and Driver article (Mar 06), 60% of this generation of Camrys will be 4 cylinders, not 90%.

    Where is your 70% figure coming from? According to the recent automotive news posted here, Hyundai is starting to produce more 4 cylinder Sonatas.

    ~alpha
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