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Midsize Sedans Comparison Thread

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Comments

  • thesniperthesniper Member Posts: 44
    "'boring' hyundai could look like this."

    It's beautiful... just like a girl treated by Dr. 90210.
  • bobadbobad Member Posts: 1,587
    The KBB I know only goes back 10 years or less. But I know what you mean. My Mazda 626 never spent a day in the shop after 11 years. It looked absolutely great, and everything still worked the day I sold it. I got $1000 more than the trade-in allowances I was offered, and I was delighted. If I take as good care of my 06 Sonata as I did my Mazda, I have no doubt I will have people lining up to buy it just like my last several vehicles. When talking re-sale value, everyone seems to ignore the seller's reputation. No, I wouldn't pay top dollar for a used car from a used car lot. However, I would pay top dollar for a car I knew, from a private individual I trusted.
  • driverdmdriverdm Member Posts: 505
    The bodykit Sonata is beautiful; however, what wolverine failed to mention is that bodykit, grill, lowering springs, etc. by Studie (a customizer on the same level as Brabus) is about as expensive as buying another Sonata. Over on cardomain there are hundrends of customized Accords and Accord customization is far cheaper. It isn't fair to compare a customized car to a stock Accord in looks. There are custom Accords that blow this Sonata out of the water.

    I don't like either design. I personally prefer the Sonata to the newer Accords, the slightly older (like 2004 models) before the butt surgery looked better. I did see a newer gray Accord yesterday on some beautiful rims that looked good. However, from the concept that Honda showed, the next Accord will look very good. The Sonata's design was based on other vehicles, Audi, Accord, etc. so it will become old real quick which is a drawback.
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    When most people are shopping for a family sedan (me included) "looks" are not a major influence. None of them look like a Porsche or Ferrari. It's what's under the skin, that matters most. When you add up all the pros and cons, the Accord comes out on top.
  • seniorjoseseniorjose Member Posts: 277
    The Honda Accord sets high marks for intelligent aerodynamic design...This design maximizes air flow over the auto...PLUS (if is possible) pedestrians are a bit safer when "attacked" by a Honda -- even break away windshield wipers. My 2 cents.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    Kelley Blue Book has values for cars dating back to 1986, or 20 years.

    Just an FYI!

    Hope everyone's weekend is going great!
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Member Posts: 27,132
    The last time I hit a pedestrian I was saying to myself that I wished the car was more friendly to the pedestrian in the shape of the front and that the windshield wipers would break away so as to do less injury to the pedestrian.

    Somehow that doesn't seem very important in safety design hierarchy.

    2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,

  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    If you ever did hit a pedestrian, suddenly it would be important. Wouldn't it? It's the sort of thing that wouldn't matter, until it happened to you.
  • steve333steve333 Member Posts: 201
    From what I understand the warranty is not transferrable, thats why Suzuki can advertise that they have the best warranty in the business-fully transferrable.
    Without the warranty I wouldn't buy a used Hyundai personally.
  • wolverinejoe80wolverinejoe80 Member Posts: 337
    LOL. you are completely wrong. it isn't as expensive as buying another sonata. no sonata body kits costs 20k. LOL. it's just a bodykit. it's not like they are puting v8 on that thing

    i've seen plenty of these bodykits in korea, so it can't be that expensive. hyundai should have this studie bodykit as an option, or something close to it. hyundai needs to go after young buyers. that would change people's perception dramatically.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    I think the Sonata, especially with the 17" alloys, looks fine w/o any bodykit. All those are good for is getting scraped on curbs in parking lots and on sharply-angled driveways.

    Anyone else notice that there is a strong resemblence between the rear of the '06 Accord and that of the '06 Impala? There wasn't any purposeful copying by either Honda or Chevy, of course, but it shows how easy it is for two sedans to have similar styling cues.
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Member Posts: 7,160
    Working next to a Chevy store I did notice this change this year on the Impala ( for the better IMO ). It looks cleaner and more up to date. Also this :surprise: is not staring back at you when you follow it now.

    Now it seems that the Impala, Accord and Sonata all have the same look from the back.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    Have you seen the '06 Accord? The rear end has been restyled for '06 and the taillamps are like the Impala's, not horizontal stripes that were used from '03-'05 and led some people to think they resembled the Sonata's.
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    These body kits always look great in the companies advertisement pictures. But 90% of the cars I see on the road with body kits look terrible (big flimsy things hanging loosely, with scrapes on the bottom from dragging the ground). Some of them look like someone put a mack truck bumper on their car (way too big). Just my opinion.
  • master1master1 Member Posts: 340
    "led some people to think they resembled the Sonata's."

    I agree! I think it is rediculous. A Honda should NOT look like a Hyundai. Hyundai always copies designs from other car makers, interiors, exteriors, mechanical components. I really wish Honda would sue them for the identical copy of the lights. It really annoys me.
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    The Accord coupe had the triangle tails since 03. I guess people liked them more, so Honda switched the sedan to them too. It must have annoyed Hyundai too. As soon as they copy the Accord taillights, Honda changed them to the triangles. Tricky huh?
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    Honda is a smart company. They would not initiate a lawsuit they knew they couldn't win.

    Or maybe they are afraid of a similar lawsuit from GM, based on the '06 Civic looking a lot like the Saturn SL. Or from DC, based on Honda's copying the minivan design from them.

    Yes, it is certainly ridiculous. A Honda shouldn't look like an Impala.
  • driverdmdriverdm Member Posts: 505
    wolverine, I am talking from experience. I saw that bodykit BEFORE the Sonata was introduced in the US. I have the file if you'd like me to send it to you. Yes, it does not cost as much as a Sonata (that was just sarcasm), but I believe the cost was a little north of $5K.

    Studie, is like Brabus, an independent customizer, Hyundai can't list it as an option. You have to go directly to Studie for it and just like Brabus, they specialize in Mercs, BMWs, etc. and they are extremely expensive.
  • choe13choe13 Member Posts: 348
    Glad to have this forum back up.

    Hyundai with benchmarking both audi a6 and lexus 330 for the sonata i guess have sort of maximized the best of both worlds.

    Those who have driven or test driven this car, would you feel it has more of a european or japanese feel to it?
  • tallman1tallman1 Member Posts: 1,874
    Funny that people are talking about this. One salesman actually pointed out the "pedestrian-friendly" feature of the Accord to me.

    Of course, he's the same guy who keeps leaving me messages saying that he finally found the color I wanted in an Accord with Navi. I was looking for a 4 cyl 5 speed but this one is a "6 speed which would be more fun than the 5 speed." Does he think I don't know that would make it a V6??

    I suppose I should call him back and let him know I found my car two months ago.
  • driverdmdriverdm Member Posts: 505
    Hmmm interesting question. I'd say it is more Camry like in the driving department (older model Camry, not brand new Camry. Interestingly enough to me, the Camry drive like American cars used to. Very soft ride. I which American cars were better though GM and Ford have been fighting back with the Impala and the Fusion. Now if they could just make some hot designs and improve on the Malibu and 500.
  • habitat1habitat1 Member Posts: 4,282
    "The last time I hit a pedestrian"

    No offense, but you make it sound like you have quite a bit of experience in this area. :surprise:
  • bobadbobad Member Posts: 1,587
    Hyundai always copies designs from other car makers, interiors, exteriors, mechanical components.

    Yes, isn't it ridiculous? The Sonata has 4 wheels like a Fusion, 1 trunk like a Milan, 2 tail lights like a Camry, 2 headlights like an Accord, and 1 steering wheel like a Mazda6.

    At this point, I think all car designs have been done before and must eventually be repeated. There's only so many permutations in the universe of car design. Believe me, no car maker wants to copy any other. There is only so much room on these little cars for aesthetic design. If you get radical with the design, you will infringe on something important... like leg room, head room, trunk capacity, engine bay room, or safety. I bet even your car looks like other cars in some respects. Bet? :D
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Member Posts: 27,132
    >Hyundai always copies designs from other car makers, interiors, exteriors, mechanical components.

    The accord copied the LaCrosse/Impala tailights for it's 2006 corrections of its earlier Buick-like tailight design.

    2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,

  • bobadbobad Member Posts: 1,587
    The accord copied the LaCrosse/Impala tailights for it's 2006 corrections of its earlier Buick-like tailight design.

    I seriously doubt that. Do they look alike? Yes. Were they copied? Not likely at all. Designs are usually "locked in" about 2 years before the cars are released to manufacturing. Designs are kept under the strictest secrecy. Just like ladies wearing the same dress to a party, coincidence's do happen. :D
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    Those who have driven or test driven this car, would you feel it has more of a european or japanese feel to it?
    Japanese styling with American handling and ride. No Euro-feel to me (GLS I-4); European cars I drove had much more body control and tighter steering (Audi A4 Cabriolet, VW New Beetle, etc...).

    The closest "non-European" car to the European driving feel benchmark for under $25,000 IMO is my Accord. It steers and handles closest to the Audi A4 I drove; and while not quite as sweet to drive, I can fit four people in comfort (did it this weekend on a trip to the lake) and got 32 MPG to boot (no interstate, just twisty roads near Mt. Cheeha in AL, the tallest Mtn. in the state).

    P.S. I haven't driven a 2007 Camry, just a 2006 LE, which drove similarly to the Sonata; so i can't judge that car's handling.
  • bobadbobad Member Posts: 1,587
    The Sonata definitely handles like the Japanese cars. Not severe on bumps like the Euro cars, a good dose of understeer. It handles somewhere between the Accord (sportier) and the Camry (softer).
  • bobadbobad Member Posts: 1,587
    The closest "non-European" car to the European driving feel benchmark for under $25,000 IMO is my Accord.

    Among the cars I have driven, I would give that to the Mazda6. But you're right, the Accord leans toward a "Euro" feel.
  • ar39ar39 Member Posts: 61
    I agree with bobad. If you would like to see imitations, check-out that new Chinese car which will roll out in the US around 2010. I dont remember the name but, I thought I saw a Merc C class at first glance. Closer observation revealed a different class all-together or was there any class :confuse:
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    The Mazda 6 IS a great handling car, but it lacks the dampening feel that BMW offers, which I feel like the Accord does a little better (though it's no Bimmer). The Mazda is MORE athletic than the Euro cars I had driven. Impressive for a family car, eh?
  • bobadbobad Member Posts: 1,587
    Impressive for a family car, eh?

    Darn right. But the Secretary of the Treasury said it was "too rough and noisy". OK, when I buy my new pickup truck, she doesn't get any input. :)
  • choe13choe13 Member Posts: 348
    I don't think the sonata looks japanese at all. The sonata is much better looking than japanese mid size cars, more euro. It is quiet like japanese cars in sacrifice of euro handling, brakes like a strong euro car. American cars have usually heavy horses, i dunno waht else they are known for, so the sonata has no american in it(maybe cept dimensions) in my opinion.

    But I think for overall feel i got more european feel(substance, styling, braking, more torque at lower rpms).
  • choe13choe13 Member Posts: 348
    In the non euro handling department, the mazda 6 or tsx meet that department in my eyes. Mazda 6 i think even edges the tsx. Prob the best fwd steering/car right now.

    Mazda 6 is has as telepathic steering/handling feel as the bmw, but of course the bimmer, has double the engine tech, and everything else better but with a higher price.
  • alpha01alpha01 Member Posts: 4,747
    This may have been true of the last generation, but the new Camry's handling feels sharper to me than that of the Sonata's, and I would guess even moreso in SE trim (though I have only driven an 07 Camry LE).

    ~alpha
  • w9cww9cw Member Posts: 888
    I guess Honda should also sue Toyota too with similar "look-alike" tail lights on the new Camry. If they do, they will certainly lose as Toyota has much deeper pockets than Honda.

    Check out the old Audi A6 tail lights also . . . now who's copying whom?
  • w9cww9cw Member Posts: 888
    Park a 2006 Accord next to a 2006 Impala . . . you will be surprised at the overall similar shape and appearance.
  • fitguyfitguy Member Posts: 220
    I recently rented a '06 Impala and was amazed at how much the rear end resembled the Accord. Not amazed with much else, though. I'm seeing more & more '07 Camrys around and have to say, they did a pretty decent job with the re-style; not beautiful, but way better than the previous gen. Will no doubt lure some Accord fans, heck I might even drive one this Fall and haven't driven a Camry in years (Accord fan, now Mazda6 fan). Should be interesting to see how much they have improved the handling.
  • scape2scape2 Member Posts: 4,123
    I am not going to claim the Fusion/Milan as all powerful and superior mid-size sedan. All these cars have thier strenghts and weaknesses. Just test drive one, be open minded. The Fusion/Milan are serious contendors in this market. The Value, fit/finish, substance is all their...
    Cheers... ;)
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    My 03 Accord was in the body shop for 2 weeks ( wife got rear-ended ). So Enterprise has an 06 Impala. I keep hearing that the American car companies have improved. I'm sorry, but they are not even close. The interior is made from cheap materials, has a terrible ergonomic layout ( the air conditioner controls are behind the shift lever, and the little light that indicates the A/C is on/off is so small and low that you practically have to get in the back seat and lean over to see it ). If they can't design something better themselves, they should at least copy someone else's ( who know what they are doing ) design. It's pretty sad that a brand new 06 Impala felt so inferior to a 3 year old Accord. I guess I won't be switching back to American cars any time soon.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    I don't think anyone would doubt that each car has its strong points...for example, your new wheels has style on its side, as well as handling.

    I look at $23.5k for a Fusion and see what I can get for roughly $500-$1000 more in an Accord EX-V6 (Check out prices paid forum, it happens often)...It felt better put together to me, but lacks the exterior style of the Fusion. The Accord offers more power with similar efficency, a tighter interior (that's my opinion, not necessarily everyones), much better resale in the long run based on history for Fords, and a better warranty.

    It's been said before, but: Different Strokes for Different Folks...

    Personally, I wouldn't pay for a V-6 when the I-4s out now are more powerful than the V-6s of ten years ago, and offer better economy of the I-4s of that time, too. Like I said, this is only my perspective...your opinions may (and likely will) vary, and that's ok.
  • tncarmantncarman Member Posts: 82
    Whatever happened to the Galant? I remember the commercials where a Camry drove off a brisge and lost control from crap out of a semi. I thought it was a good car, but I never see any. Whats wrong?
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    What turned me off from Galant: Styling and reliability.
  • alpha01alpha01 Member Posts: 4,747
    Have you driven the current Galant? It has not a single thing about it that could possibly distinguish it. When I drove the redesigned '04 model, I thought it had an ambitious-styled, overly plasticky interior, a VERY noisy 4 cylinder that was no more than adequately powerful, and a so-so ride. It also lacked the handling finesse of the better Galants of the past, and fuel economy is nothing special, but crash scores are indeed impressive...

    Big issue for me: Mitsubishi's future... dicey at best...

    I thought Mitsu also packaged the Galant much to its disadvantage. Not a single Galant offers a split folding rear seat, and you can't get a manual no matter what. I realize that this segment is perhaps 96% automatic, but you can get a manual in each of the Accord, Camry, Fusion, and Sonata, in some way or another. Also, last time I priced an '05 out, the only way to get ABS on the 4 cylinder was to check every option box, which added things like leather, auto climate, etc... that not everyone wants or needs. The sticker was then $24K +, at which point, you could actually get an LS V6 cheaper (with fewer lux features) but with ABS standard.

    Finally, I don't know what the wheel covers look like now, but the original ones on the 04 4s and LS V6 were REALLY terrible.... very cheap looking, like 4/$25 kind you can buy at Sears Auto...

    Why would anyone buy a Galant? Price can't be the argument. The Fu/lan and Sonata both have that covered, and are TREMENDOUSLY better vehicles.

    ~alpha
  • choe13choe13 Member Posts: 348
    I test drove it the other week as a rental for two days. I was not impressed with the front and rear end treatment though overall it is a nicely shaped in the way the sonata is. But i dun understand the front end with so much dayam chrome, and the back end looking like a boi racer red to clear aftermarket change(unlike the altimas rear which is more classy).

    The interior was not as tight as the sonata nor accord, but it was decent enough like the altima i guess.

    I personally don't like the way this car wants to drive. Somehow by messing around with the mazda 6 dynamics and trying to give it a ford dna touch, It felt confused. I guess it is not called fusion without a reason rite

    Whereas mazda 6 really nails it in steering/handling, this car is a weaker version of that and tries to be a quieter car(which we all know, ford is very weak at compared to its japanese , euro even korean counterparts).

    It is a good try for a first time car, just needs to be refined. And i guess thats where the Milan comes in. Even without driving it, the milan should have been fords fusion. That would have given the japanese mid sizes a better battle

    Fusion is too raw
  • driverdmdriverdm Member Posts: 505
    Ever so often you have to stop and really look at a car. Some cars are like Tom Brady. Everybody thought at first, "who is this guy?" and he, upon further inspection, proved himself as good or better than some of the greatest. Two mid-size cars on the market are like this right now, at least to me. You have the Hyundai Sonata, which from its introduction, everybody questioned could Hyundai make a car to really compete with the Accord and Camry on their level. The other car is the Mazda6. Many believe it is better than the BMW 3 Series in handling. Many would cross shop the two if the Mazda's interior was more premium in nature. The styling of the Mazda6 is like a super model put in at a fat club. The handling is like something $10K more. Who would have thought when Mazda was out on the ropes it would produce the Mazda6. And we all hear wild claims. When I read that Mazda benchmarked a 3 Series, I said yeah right. As I write this, there is a nice white one, in my driveway.

    zoom zoom
  • bobadbobad Member Posts: 1,587
    Park a 2006 Accord next to a 2006 Impala . . . you will be surprised at the overall similar shape and appearance.

    You can bet that both Honda and GM regret the similarities.
  • patpat Member Posts: 10,421
    Posts not addressing the cars directly and posts including some sort of political statement have been removed.

    Cars. We are only talking about cars here, not what the manufacturers are being arrested and not what's American or what isn't. If you want to talk about those things, look them up in News & Views.
  • mtnman1mtnman1 Member Posts: 431
    I looked at the Endeavor back in 2004 when I was in the market for an SUV. Looked at the top of the line Limited. Very cheap interior materials. Audio and Climate controls were on the underside of the steering wheel. Had to go by feel to find them. Seats were very flat. No side support. Just not a well made vehicle especially when it had a MSRP of about $32,000. I ended up buying a Mountaineer loaded instead. I think so many of Mitsubishi's cars have that dated interior look. At least back in 2004. So many better choices out there.
    2012 Highlander Limited AWD V6 and 2015 Ford Fusion Hybrid SE
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    Hyundai with benchmarking both audi a6 and lexus 330 for the sonata i guess have sort of maximized the best of both worlds.

    Making ridiculous statements like this one drops your credibility to zero. I guess next you'll tell us they designed the Sonata to look better than a porsche 911.
  • ctalkctalk Member Posts: 646
    Making ridiculous statements?

    "The participants especially liked the Audi A6, which became a key benchmark for the new Sonata. "Internally, NF is known as an affordable A6," says a Hyundai director."

    link title

    The side profile of the Sonata looks like the A6 to ;)

    *I'm not sure about the ES330 though, I haven't read an article saying that.
This discussion has been closed.