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Hybrids Success in the Marketplace - Hybrid Sales Numbers

PF_FlyerPF_Flyer Member Posts: 9,372
edited March 2014 in Toyota
Lots of news stories recently about the increasing sales of hybird vehicles. here's the place to trumpet those numbers and talk about the success of the hybrid offerings in the marketplace!
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Comments

  • PF_FlyerPF_Flyer Member Posts: 9,372
    Just a couple of quotes with links to the articles to kick this one off...

    (AP) The lure of the Toyota Prius and other hybrid cars helped drive healthy sales of electric and alternative-powered vehicles last year, according to new data that shows the hybrid market has grown by 960 percent since 2000.
    http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/04/25/tech/main690845.shtml

    Gas costs fuel hybrid sales as Detroit spins its wheels
    http://www.usatoday.com/news/opinion/2005-04-12-gas-hybrid_x.htm

    Although hybrid vehicle sales are off and running, American manufacturers are being left at the starting line, with Japanese manufacturers capturing more than 96 percent of hybrid sales in the U.S.
    http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/2005/hybrid_sales.html

    Certainly some of the dramatic percentage increases are due to the fac that the hybrid market is currently only a small portion of the entire automobile market, although it is undeniably increasing.
  • PF_FlyerPF_Flyer Member Posts: 9,372
    Say the word "hybrid," and most folks immediately think of the Toyota (NYSE: TM - News) Prius. There are other hybrids out there, but the Prius dominates the market with 64% of all hybrid registrations for 2004. Toyota is on course to double sales of the Prius this year and can count on additional hybrid sales from the Highlander and Lexus RX400h.

    http://p102.news.scd.yahoo.com/s/fool/20050426/bs_fool_fool/111452492807
  • frenchornefrenchorne Member Posts: 31
    There are a few articles out that claim Lexus sold 2,345 RX 400h and 11,234 Prius vehicles in late April.

    http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/chi-0505070089may07,1,7604178.story?coll=chi-busine- ss-hed&ctrack=1&cset=true
  • falcononefalconone Member Posts: 1,726
    That is a high number for the Lexus as it was only out for half a month. It will be interesting to see the numbers for May.
  • PF_FlyerPF_Flyer Member Posts: 9,372
    Yep, probably way too early to draw any conclusions about the Lexus. Even hard to tell when looking at the 400h topic here since message boards tend to get more posts about problems/complaints than ones that say, "everything's fine".
  • love2scubalove2scuba Member Posts: 34
    I think your comment about more complaints is incorrect. You probably have more messages from the same people that are having problems then you do for those that have nothing to complain about. Please put me in with the 400h owners who state "everything's fine".... :)
  • larsblarsb Member Posts: 8,204
    September Toyota Hybrid Sales -

    Prius - 8,193
    HH - 2,715
    RX400h - 2,113

    Total - 13,021

    Honda Hybrid Sales for Sept 2005:

    Honda also sold an all-time record number of hybrid vehicles, with
    September sales increasing 180.3 percent to 4,351 and year-to-date sales
    increasing 79.4 percent to 35,552. The popular Civic Hybrid had best-ever
    September sales of 1,916, up 24.8 percent over last year, and Accord Hybrid
    posted its best sales month ever at 2,352. There were 83 Insights sold in Sept 2005, a 388% increase over Sept 2004.
  • larsblarsb Member Posts: 8,204
    Era of the Big SUV is on the way out....

    As a telling sign of the times the Toyota Prius Hybrid outsold every large SUV on the market except the Chevy Tahoe in September.

    http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/2005/suv_sales_plummet.html
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    Toyota Prius Hybrid outsold every large SUV on the market except the Chevy Tahoe in September.

    I consider that somewhat misleading. The Trailblazer, Grand Cherokee, Explorer & Pilot all outsold the Prius from what I am reading. I would consider those large SUVs. In fact when I returned to work yesterday, my boss had brought me a brand new Excursion Limited diesel. Very nice red one I might add.
  • falcononefalconone Member Posts: 1,726
    Is that the one that brakes from 70-0 in 240 feet?
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    I doubt it, the roads are too icey. I top out about 45 MPH up here. It is blowing snow & 15 degrees right now. The lakes are frozen hard enough to drive on. No place for a hybrid.
  • falcononefalconone Member Posts: 1,726
    Great place for the Highlander or RH. Sounds lovely!
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    They would not last a year on these gravel roads. They sent us an Explorer that lost it's front end in 6 months. 10 ply tires last one year. No 1/2 ton trucks. Unleaded gas only available one place. When you are 100 miles out on the Arctic Ocean at a drill rig the only fuel is diesel. No place for wimpy trucks. 75% of the vehicles are 1 ton Crew Cab Fords. Ford has 3 warranty shops in Prudhoe Bay.
  • railroadjamesrailroadjames Member Posts: 560
    Well, it looks like you've aquired a relic. Non-Production vehicle now days. I'm not sure but isn't it the heaviest production SUV on the market? Never did find out from Ford the mpg of one. I've heard it runs about 13 in the real world of diesels. Less in the gas version. I'll stick with my Prius and its 53 mpgs. Grant you Alaska would put a Prius to the test. I'm sure a big SUV would always fair much better ..BUT...In my real world here in NW Indiana the Prius keeps on chugging. Gotta say that if fuel was cheap I'd love to have an Excursion or Escalade but thats not going to happen. Your point about sales sure seems mis-leading to me. The true measure of impact seems to show the Hybrids far and away experiencing the more intense sales. You don't see them promoting wild sales schemes in order to move backlogged SUV's. Prius' are definitly the vehicles that Americans want these days. :shades:
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    Excursions are never going to outsell the Prius. Quite frankly after having two at work I would not buy one for myself. I don't like driving them as well as the 1 ton Crew Cab Fords. All our trucks are diesel. It is the fuel most available in the oil field. The roads are all gravel. Much of the rock is 1-2 inch in size. That is hard on everything. We go through about 2 windshields on each vehicle every summer season.

    I would say the hybrids will continue with good sales for the foreseeable future. If they ever come down in price they will be popular with the masses. I don't think they will make a big dent in the midsize SUV market.
  • larsblarsb Member Posts: 8,204
    http://www.autospectator.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=2762

    "The Prius gas-electric hybrid mid-size sedan enjoyed best-ever November sales of 7,889, an increase of 29.1 percent."
  • larsblarsb Member Posts: 8,204
    http://www.greencarcongress.com/2006/01/hybrid_sales_in.html

    Hybrids are still cranking up the sales ladder !!!
  • larsblarsb Member Posts: 8,204
    "US Sales of Hybrids Stay Strong in June 2006, Up 20% from 2005
    3 July 2006
    Hybrid_sales_jun061
    Click to enlarge.

    Hybrids in the US had their second-strongest sales month of the year and third-strongest month ever, posting a total of 23,048 units, an increase of 20% from June 2005. May 2006 remains the peak month, with 23,554 units sold.

    Total light-duty vehicle sales in the US declined 10.5% to 1.5 million units in June 2006 from 1.68 million units in June 2005, according to Autodata. Hybrids represented 1.54% of all US light duty vehicles sold in June 2006, up from 1.15% in June 2005.
    Hybrid_sales_jun062_1
    Click to enlarge.

    Toyota again led the way with ongoing strong sales of the Prius— 9,696 units, up slightly from June 2005 and its best performance of the year so far. The new Camry Hybrid followed as the second-best selling hybrid in the US, posting 4,268 units. In only its second full month of sales, the Camry Hybrid now represents 10.3% of the total brand sales.

    The Highlander Hybrid stayed in its ongoing band of performance, with 2,705 units sold, and 25.9% of total brand sales."


    http://www.greencarcongress.com/2006/07/us_sales_of_hyb.html
  • yerth10yerth10 Member Posts: 431
    Sales are Hybrids increasing in 1 thing, but even if the sales of light duty vehicles in general declines, the share of Hybrids may increase.

    Light duty vehicle sales declined 10 % in June mainly led by Truck sales decline. If Disposable income in people's pockets decline, they may simply continue with their older vehicles which may actually give better mileage since they are lighter than today's models.

    Also people may wait for automakers to launch alternative fueled vehicles.

    All these things may bring a radical change in automotive industry.

    If June had 10 % decline, what about July with even higher gas prices.
  • larsblarsb Member Posts: 8,204
    TORRANCE, Calif., Aug. 1, 2006 -- Toyota Motor Sales (TMS), U.S.A., Inc., today reported its all-time best-ever monthly sales of 241,826 vehicles, an increase of 16.2 percent over July 2005. Calendar-year-to-date (CYTD) sales total 1,465,368 units, up 10.8 percent over the same period last year.

    "Market conditions are playing to traditional Toyota strengths of fuel efficiency, a strong passenger car offerings as well as our comprehensive hybrid lineup," commented Jim Lentz, TMS executive vice president. "We fared reasonably well in the tough truck market, where fuel costs and heavy incentives are ongoing challenges."

    The Toyota Division posted its all-time best-ever sales month of 214,867, up 17.7 percent. The Lexus Division reported best-ever July sales with 26,959 units sold, an increase of 5.6 percent.

    Toyota Division

    Toyota Division passenger cars recorded all-time best-ever monthly sales of 130,109, up 24.9 percent over the same period last year. Passenger car sales were led by the Corolla, which posted July sales of 41,800 and an increase of 42.3 percent over last July. The Camry Hybrid, which went on sale in late April, reported sales of 5,023 units in July. Total Camry enjoyed combined July sales of 41,892 units, up 1.3 percent. The all-new Yaris subcompact, which went on sale in March, posted sales totaling 10,137 units for the month. The Prius gas-electric hybrid mid-size sedan posted July sales of 11,114, an increase of 19.3 percent.


    http://www.theautochannel.com/news/2006/08/01/016769.html

    P.S. TMS calendar-year-to-date hybrid sales broke the 100,000-unit sales milestone, reporting 105,808 hybrid units. In July, hybrids sales totaled 20,298 units.
  • larsblarsb Member Posts: 8,204
    There was a "big naysayer" comment last month about how the Prius was a "whole 3 percent" below the 2005 sales figures.

    As of the end of September, it's now 0.6 percent behind, or in total cars sold, 103 cars behind the 2005 pace.

    I doubt it surpasses 2005 by very much, but I think it will.
  • terry92270terry92270 Member Posts: 1,247
    Exactly.

    Remember the rush to buy before the Federal Tax Credits expired helped them deplete standing inventories, and are not reflected in those figures, which won't be released until next month, or the end of Quarter. ;)
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    I doubt it surpasses 2005 by very much, but I think it will.

    What great incentive to buy a hybrid now? Cheap gas and no HOV stickers left. If they did not pass 2005 it could be Toyota holding back on manufacturing also. The statement was made that Toyota would sell 250,000 hybrids in 2006. I don't think it will be close to that.
  • terry92270terry92270 Member Posts: 1,247
    How funny human nature is, that we so easily forget the past, and consider only now.

    You think there is "cheap" gas now? Simply because it has declined from $3.30 for regualr unleaded to $2.85 :confuse:

    What was it one year ago? 18 months ago? Two years ago?

    Saving even $50 per month is a big deal to most people. Hybrids save, no matter what the retail price of gasoline is, and no matter what, they will go farther on less gas, than anything else made for the mass market. Period.

    As for HOV stickers, that depends upon where you live, and most quotas re-set in January elsewhere.
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    Not sure where you are paying $2.85 for regular. Even in San Diego it is under $2.50 now and oil dropped into the $58 range today. There have been volumes written on whether you save any money buying a hybrid. You say yea, I say nay. It will be a long time before any real data will be available to sort it out. If there was to be a big year for hybrid sales this was it. Big tax breaks and HOV lane privileges. I agree that saving $50 a month is a lot for some. Is it enough to take on another payment for a more expensive vehicle? I don't think so. Or jam your teenagers into a Civic when they would be more comfortable in a larger vehicle. If you commute more than 50 miles a day I would probably recommend a hybrid. Otherwise I think they are a waste of money.
  • terry92270terry92270 Member Posts: 1,247
    We don't disagree. It is merely a matter of degree. ;)

    Gasoline in Reno, Nevada is still above $2.85, and that was the case last week in the Bay Area and Sacramento.

    Highlander Limited Hybrids, as posted in this very forum, have been going for very little over $2000 over their ICE counterparts at dealers lately. As my Dad once told me while calling me an idiot for forgoing AC because of the price: "You're financing the car! How much, in the end, do you think that $600 for AC is really going to save you?". Even $3000 extra, over 60 months is $50 per month. So the minimum savings on gas washes the extra price in 5 years, and if a person drives 15-20K per year, or the price of gasoline really dives back upward again, the savings are very real indeed. And of course the Hybrid Highlander has more power than the ICE one. :P

    Add in the intangibles, like being better for the environment and its cool tech display, it really isn't a big issue, the price. Besides, even Consumers Reports has reversed itself, and they once agreed with you. ;)
  • larsblarsb Member Posts: 8,204
    Wednesday, 4 October 2006
    Despite Oil Change Hybrids Sell
    Topic: New Vehicles
    Event though gas prices have fallen well below $3 in most of the country the top-selling hybrid models continue to move out of dealerships. Truck sales are still slipping, but not as badly as in the previous months. Perhaps consumers who are opting for fuel efficiency won't ever go back to larger vehicles.

    A quick scan of the numbers from September:

    Toyota boosted passenger car sales in September by 12.4 percent over last year, including a 23.1 percent jump in Prius' sales. Honda's best selling Civic Hybrid shot up 25.9 percent, while Honda car and light trucks rose 7.3 percent.


    Hybrids still hot
  • zodiac2004zodiac2004 Member Posts: 458
    Saving even $50 per month is a big deal to most people. Hybrids save, no matter what the retail price of gasoline is, and no matter what, they will go farther on less gas, than anything else made for the mass market. Period.


    Save 50 a month in gas, while spending 4000 more to buy the vehicle.

    Can you say "penny wise and pound foolish"
  • terry92270terry92270 Member Posts: 1,247
    The prices, as posted in these forums, don't support your statement at all.

    People are buying Toyota Camry Hybrids for no more than the price of a LE or XLE. Read the prices paid forum. ;)
  • larsblarsb Member Posts: 8,204
    Sales of Toyota hybrids were down 4,136 vehicles in October 2006 versus September.

    Some of that I'm sure is lower gas prices.

    Wonder how much is a lower tax credit as of Oct 1st for the 'Yota/Lexus hybrids?

    Let's hope people (car buyers) are not so shallow and sheep-like that so many of them were only buying hybrids for the tax break.

    Shame on them if they were !!! :mad:
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    Let's hope people (car buyers) are not so shallow and sheep-like that so many of them were only buying hybrids for the tax break. Shame on them if they were

    You are funny guy. It was not just the price of gas or the tax break. It was also the HOV sticker. When they are all gone NO one will buy a Prius or HCH.

    I think the TCH has a better chance of making it on its own merit. As long as they sell them at a price break that is acceptable to the buyers.

    I guess you also noticed that Prius sales are lower for the year. In fact Toyota overall sales increase is mostly in the truck division. The Corolla and Scion have kept the numbers high for Toyota cars. People really want an SUV. The knee jerk reaction to higher gas prices was go buy a Corolla or Scion. When the gas prices were peaking out is when they should have bought that SUV they wanted.

    What's the bet Prius does not make their 110k goal for 2006?
  • larsblarsb Member Posts: 8,204
    Prius will not hit 110,000 for sure, because that would mean 10,164 each month in Nov and Dec, and that's not very likely.

    Anyone with a brain knew the TCH would take some sales out of the Prius camp. And lower gas prices are probably the most damaging issue.

    The HOV stickers were extended to take in 10,000 more hybrid owners, so that's probably not much of a factor.

    And saving the best for last:

    gary says: "When the HOV stickers are all gone NO one will buy a Prius or HCH. "

    Let's make a bet on THAT one big fella.....are you saying Prius and HCH sales are based SOLELY on HOV access? In what state? There's no hybrid HOV access privilege in Arizona, but they still sell plenty of hybrids.

    Anyone who buys a hybrid for only ONE reason, the HOV privilege, is a fool. That's right, a FOOL. :shades:
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    If anyone is looking for a Prius. Check out Bob Baker Toyota of Lemon Grove. They have 30 Prius on the lot with 30 more coming in. Prices start at $21,725 according to their website?

    Prius fire sales

    PS
    They show 64 Highlander Hybrids in their inventory. Is that possible for one dealer, even a big one?
  • larsblarsb Member Posts: 8,204
    Google search of news finds no stories about hybrid glut.

    However excited you are about the prospect Gary, I think it's a little early to start thinking that dealers will be selling them off at invoice prices..... :shades:
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    They have been selling the Highlander Hybrid at invoice for several months. Several posters have gotten big discounts on the Prius over the last month. The Tax credit strangle hold is a non issue now.

    I have not seen the HCH sales figures for Honda. I doubt it is anything to shout about. The Civic sales are off 10% over last year. The old generation Corolla ate their lunch. If it were not for big gains in SUV and minivan sales, Honda would have a losing year.
  • larsblarsb Member Posts: 8,204
    Allow me to enlighten you:

    Honda Civic sales in October were:

    2,288

    and for the year are:

    26,637, which is 25.3% higher than the YTD HCH sales in October of 2005.

    So they are UP.

    HAH sales are down 67.8% in 2006 versus 2005.

    Insight sales however are UP 27.1% over 2005 figures.

    YTD Honda hybrid sales are:

    32,278

    which is down 13% from this time last year, mostly on the tanking of the HAH sales.

    from this page:

    Honda reports Oct 2006 sales
  • terry92270terry92270 Member Posts: 1,247
    I understand what you are saying, however if you look at all sales figures, for all models and manufacturers, what do you see?

    Lots of models are way down. :P
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    No comment on the fact that Toyota and Honda are making their real gains selling SUVs and trucks? That is the real story of American vehicle sales. Those of us that would like to use less energy are not winning. The main reason? Polarization. I want to save with diesel you want to save with complex technology. The same battle is being fought at a much higher level. Where we have little or no say in the matter.

    Look at the bright side. Honda can probably sell their hybrids for at least another year before the incentive gets cut in half. Then GM will get a shot at the Pork with their new hybrids.
  • terry92270terry92270 Member Posts: 1,247
    "The main reason? Polarization"

    Exactly.

    Just as we see in most other areas of society; Polarization, impatience, anger and intolerance of other points of view.

    Including board forums. ;)
  • larsblarsb Member Posts: 8,204
    No, absolutely the main reason is not POLARIZATION between diesel and hybrid advocates. That's a little egotistic to say that we are so important, eh?

    Even diesel and hybrid combined is less than 8% of the market.

    Us battling amongst ourselves has nothing to do with Joe SixPack taking up GM on that 6-yr zero interest SUV offer.

    People in the USA like trucks and SUVs when gas prices are "low" and nothing we diesel or hybrid advocates can do will change that.
  • terry92270terry92270 Member Posts: 1,247
    So, somehow the people posting here are different, more elite than "Joe Six Pack" :confuse:

    And here I thought users here included Joe....

    You can tell from the strident tones and urgency in these forums, they reflect the public at large, which is polarization, short tempers where people who disagree with them are concerned....... IMO.
  • larsblarsb Member Posts: 8,204
    Actually, most people on here ARE different (not better or worse than Joe) because they care enough to spend time on a "hybrid vehicle" computer forum.

    JoeSixpack driving his Tahoe, if he has time for computer use, is going to be on the TAHOE forum, not likely the hybrid forums.

    Any Joes are of course welcome here; it's just that mostly they don't CARE about what we hybrid and diesel car advocates have to say.
  • terry92270terry92270 Member Posts: 1,247
    I would submit, that is exactly the problem.

    People assuming. And of course we all know what that stands for. ;)

    Tahoe drivers, large engine cars, and I do own a S Class, know the technology exists to give us what we want, with alternative fuels. Many alternative advocates spend most of their time arguing for smaller, tiny cars, and the market place, not experts proves people don't want them.

    Lets watch the sales figures on the Highlander and Camry Hybrids, and the coming entries from Mercedes, shall we?
  • larsblarsb Member Posts: 8,204
    I would contend that high or low gas prices have a lot to say about dictating to people what they need to drive.

    Hybrids and smaller cars became hot sellers after Katrina last year, and that mostly kept pace with higher gas prices.

    As prices drop, and people realize they can still afford the bulky SUV or truck and not get hammered in astronomical fuel bills, they go for the big stuff.

    It's sad, really. The family that rationalized and said "we REALLY CAN make do with a Sentra instead of a Tahoe" when prices were $2.98 are now at $1.85 saying "nope, we'll just keep the Tahoe."

    My guess is that hybrids will continue to sell in reduced numbers as long as gas prices stay low, and trucks and SUVs will increase or stay high.

    A total shame......
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Member Posts: 7,160
    The difference in annual sales thru 10 mo's is inconsequential. In the end it will end up in the 105,000 to 110,000 unit range just as expected. Looking at one month's sales doesn't prove much.

    What is a very likely factor in any decline is that this model is now entering it's 4th year and just now the prices are coming off of MSRP in most areas. For the next 24 months I think the Prius will be just like any other vehicle getting up in age. It's the normal cycle.

    I want to see what the new HH is. If it's the same as the TCH with much better FE ratings and a lower price it will be a hit. If it's the same as this model, just with a nicer skin and features, well it will be a small part of the product mix.
  • terry92270terry92270 Member Posts: 1,247
    Yes, totally agree. We need to see about two Quarter's worth of sales figures, maybe three, to determine that.
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    Looking at one month's sales doesn't prove much.

    The proof is in what the dealers have left on the lots. I don't know what the current average time is for a Prius to sit on the lot. If it goes out a long ways that can be critical for the hybrids. Early on there were Prius that sat for longer periods of time and it caused issues with the batteries draining and being ruined. If some dealers are sitting with 30-100 Prius on the lots, it could be a problem. If you are a potential hybrid buyer and you are getting a great deal on a HH that has been sitting for 3 months on the lot. I would want proof that the battery was in new condition.
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Member Posts: 7,160
    This is true of the Prius'. They do need to be driven every week.. or disconnected entirely if sitting for more than 2 weeks.
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Member Posts: 19,250
    the best strategy is to limit your driving. then it doesn't matter much what you choose, it is all semantics.
    2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
  • tpetpe Member Posts: 2,342
    My guess is that hybrids will continue to sell in reduced numbers as long as gas prices stay low,

    That's a very significant statement. We now consider $2.20/gallon gas to be cheap. It is cheap but a few years ago when gas first crossed the $2 threshold people were up in arms wondering how they would make ends meet and what would the government do about it. Our definition of what we consider to be cheap gas is going up much faster than the inflation rate. That's good, we are starting to get in touch with reality.
This discussion has been closed.