Hyundai Sonata vs. Honda Accord vs. Toyota Camry vs. Ford Fusion

haefr · September 2005

Hyundai's 20 years in the North American market and still "catching up" in perceived quality and reliability to the Japanese. The various Japanese makes managed to become accepted within a decade. (I'm old enough to remember the original solid rear-axle, leaf-sprung, 4-cyl OHV "Toyopet". I'd wager more than half the participants on this discussion've never heard of the car.)

210delray · September 2005

Well, I never saw the Toyopet in the East, where I lived, but I've seen plenty of pictures. Looks like a shrunken '54 Plymouth, not one of the prettiest cars to use as a template.

backy · September 2005

That is because quality was Job 1 (sorry, Ford) for the Japanese makes way back in the '70s. It was not a priority for Hyundai until about 1999. Before then, they were content to sell on price alone. Also, their sales were dismal at that point. So you could say they have come around on quality even faster than the Japanese did, going from ground zero to near pairity with the Japanese in a little over five years, based on cars like the '06 Sonata and third-party studies of quality and reliability.

oldjoe · September 2005

The two auto mags you mention have theri reviews edited by the manufacturer of the auto they are testing. motor Trend Car of the year is basically "bought" by the highest bidder. To get a "Motor Trend" car of the year "award", you have to tell Motor Trend just how much money you are going to spend promoting Motor Trend. Highest spender "wins" the award. This isn't a secret, but is well known for years.,

haefr · September 2005

I alluded to as much in an earlier post and was promptly shot down by another poster citing the purity of the press in not accepting "payola". (right...) I gave his response the attention it deserved - none. As you just pointed out, "buying" favorable reviews is the worst kept secret in enthusiast magazine publishing*. Whatever CR's faults (and there are some), at least they PURCHASE their test subjects at retail and accept NO advertising revenue. CR's operations are completely subscriber and news-stand buyer supported. Thanks for posting.

*It's not just automotive publications either. It's rampant in all walks of enthusiast publishing from sports equipment to home entertainment.

backy · September 2005

The two auto mags you mention have theri reviews edited by the manufacturer of the auto they are testing. ...

*Sigh*.

Another urban legend. I've heard this line before. I have yet to see any proof to back it up. I suppose you think the JD Power quality surveys are paid for by the automakers, also.

haefr · September 2005

What impresses me most about J.D. Powers and Associates awards is the frequency with which these coveted awards are handed out to every make in various categories every year. Exactly who does finance J.D. Powers and Associates' day-to-day operations? Or does J.D. Powers and Associates' personnel roster benevolently and selflessly volunteer its time and cognitive skills? (Now, that, indeed, would be an urban legend of the first order!)

backy · September 2005

... every make in various categories every year. ...

*Major sigh*

You know very well that isn't true. Or maybe you don't. But you can prove to yourself it isn't true just by looking at, for example, the JD Power IQS reports for the past few years. Lots of changes from year to year.

If you want to find out who finances JD Powers' efforts, why don't you ask them and let us know?

haefr · September 2005

The only indication on their site about their feduciary operations is a cryptic, "Funds all of its own syndicated research in order to deliver unbiased results." Ha-ha, I wish I could fund all my own needs with no traceable income source.

backy · September 2005

Of course they have income sources. What the public sees (the published IQS reports for example) is only a small part of what they do. Again, rather than wild speculation, why not contact them and ask them?

haefr · September 2005

Obviously we have divergent views on the validity of enthusiast magazine reviews and awards, and so-called "independent" marketing surveys, sponsored by a publishing house, and blatantly used in dealership point-of-sale advertising promotions. Since you've offered nothing more than personal opinion either, let's at least agree to move on, OK? If this compromise isn't agreeable to you, perhaps you might wish to take the matter up with one of this discussion's hosts.

backy · October 2005

I'm happy to move on to the subject of the cars in this discussion--I'm not the one who started the off-topic tirade against the trade mags and survey companies, though.

teashea · October 2005

I think the 2006 Sonata will be seen as a landmark car - like the 1990 Lexus LS400. I find it to be remarkable. I purchased mine as a winter car since I don't want to drive my SLK55 in the winter. But I find that the Sonata is a better car in many respects than a new generation BMW 530. The build qualtity is better - interior and exterior/ One small example is the panel gaps of the Sonata - better than any Mercedes or BMW I have owned.

TEAShea

iluvmysephia1 · October 2005

come on, now. What will the naysayers say? You're making them angry with your statements right now. They're already thinking thoughts like, a Hyundai that is built better than a Toyota or Honda? Bite your tongue! I believe you, I'm all for what Hyundai and Kia are up to these days. World-class automotive work from a huge South Korean car maker that originates from a country which turns out the brightest students in the world consistently. It's true, South Korean students score better than students from anywhere else in the world. Lots of quality math minds and engineering talent coming out of their schools. Does that necessarily mean that they're better car engineers than anybody else in the world? Maybe not-then again, I sure like their vehicles from the late 90's up to now and into the future.

thegraduate · October 2005

Can the Fusion make it in a world where the top models of each of these cars outpower it, some by more than 30 horsepower?

motownusa · October 2005

The Fusion sounds like a nice car. But I do not think it is class leading in any way. Basically you got a rebadged, re packaged Mazda 6. But it is better than the Taurus I must admit. Remember, the Fusion will most likely be competing with the next gen. Camry which should be an awesome car.

teashea · October 2005

Ford did a nice job on the Fusion... except. The biggest problem with the Fusion is that pathetic lump of an engine. Why didn't Ford complete the job and put a good engine in it. The Sonata engine is terrific - very smooth, good power - with that ripping sound of a fine engine like a Honda.

TEAShea

thegraduate · October 2005

You're right about the Camry, especially if they go and do something crazy like give some steering feel to go with all those horsepower, making it a high powered sports sedan with Lexus luxury!

thegraduate · October 2005

Ford has been promising us a 3.5 liter V-6 to be competitive, unfortunately, they keep pushing back the release date for it. It was originally slated for the Five Hundred and Freestyle, and it STILL isn't here yet! By the time Ford brings its engine to market with its (estimated) 250 hp, Toyota will have already upped the ante. I dont guess it matters since the old Camcordnataltima beats the fusion handily in top horsepower honors.

steve71 · October 2005

All this fuss over horsepower ignores the fact that most family sedan buyers drive their cars around town and in city highway traffic where big engines don't matter. That's why most Camcords are sold with the 4 cyl, 160 HP engines. Style, comfort, and handling are much more important to sales than top end horsepoer on the optional V6. In these areas, all the reviews I've read say Fusion is competitive.

thegraduate · October 2005

The Fusion is stuck between a rock and a hardplace on the power front. It delivers less power than the foreign V-6s, and less economy than the Accord V-6 (21/30 for Honda V-6, 26/34 4-cyl, Fusion's one model gets 21/29 but delievers less power. I agree that the lesser models are competitive for price:horsepower ratio, but a loaded model (around $25k or more) should deliver more. Let's get the 3.5 ready, Ford!

fsmmcsi · October 2005

Yes, it amazes me that they are moving so rapidly. The center stack and console are the worst aspects of the brand new 2006 Sonata, but Hyundai has completely re-done it for 2007!

56shoeboxfan · October 2005

i have been told that hyundai outsells mazda and mitsubishi in the US. doesn't sound like begging to me."THAT" time is gone friend.

56shoeboxfan · October 2005

consumer reports has not even mentioned the 06 sonota as of the nov.05 issue.

56shoeboxfan · October 2005

sorry but your wrong and corrected. cr has not ,not,not tested or reviewed the 06 sonota. if i am wrong please give me the issue and page number!

ctalk · October 2005

Well, I do remember reading it somewhere, it may not have been CR. I distinctly remember reading a first drive, that CR was not impressed with. I do not subscribe to CR, and I'm not going to go out and buy their magazine. The next time I visit a shop that has a CR magazine, I will check to see if its there.

Edit: I found some evidence of a first impression done by CR.

http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/ConsumerReportsSnapshot.aspx?year=2006&make=Hyundai&mode- l=Sonata

First impressions indicate that handling is secure but not sporty. The ride is firmer than the previous model's. The 235-hp V6 is refined, but not as punchy as expected, while the 162-hp four-cylinder engine seems civilized and competitive.

ctalk · October 2005

Can you provide a link to where you read that?

I've searched the internet and can't seem to find anything on that.
I'm not saying your wrong though.

backy · October 2005

That doesn't seem like an overall negative opinion to me. I doubt they would call the handling of competitors like the Camry "sporty". And they think the engines are "refined", "civilized", and "competitive". I'm not sure what kind of punch they expected in the V6, but the V6 I drove had gobs of power for a family sedan, and the same 0-60 time as the V6 Accord according to tests by C/D. The CR folks are not performance freaks, so I'm surprised by their comment.

bhmr59 · October 2005

Thanks for the link, ctalk.

I think you'll agree that the "first impression" doesn't claim they gave the car a test, or even drove it around the block. They could have written that "review" from a brochure...or from reading this forum!!!

frasierdog · October 2005

The picture which you saw was a Korean Sonata.

It may very well be a Korean 2007 model, but it may not be here for the 2007 model year.

You are speculating.

ctalk · October 2005

Well, I disagree with what CR said in their 'first impression'
The Sonata's V6 is one of the most powerful engines in its class.
Although it is still beaten by the Altima, and I assume is beaten by the 2006 Accord with its HP increase and 6speed manual option.

fsmmcsi · October 2005

No speculation involved. However, the information I saw on another discussion forum dedicated to GM vehicles may be wrong, but it does include a photo. Unfortunately, Edmunds will not allow links to other discussion forums.

backy · October 2005

Well, if you want to compare apples to oranges--stick shift cars vs. automatics--sure, I'm sure the 6-speed Accord can beat the Sonata 0-60. The stick will shave at least a second off the time.

pat · October 2005

In an effort combine some of the duplicative comparisons we've got going on, I added the Fusion to the title, moved some posts and redirected several other discussions here. Hope this makes things a little less confusing.

:shades:

backy · October 2005

I got the chance to see the Fusion close-up last night; my local dealer had just one, sitting right out by the road. A red, loaded ($26k sticker) V6 model. I was impressed by the interior. Looked very classy, with perforated tan leather seats to go with the dark dash. The optional alloys were good-looking also. The main problem I have with the car is the "hey, look at me!" chrome front end and the overall retro styling of the car, particularly the roofline and the overall blockiness of the car. I prefer smoother lines on a car. But that's personal preference and I expect that many people will be drawn to the looks of the Fusion, which is at least unique in the class and doesn't copy the Generic Mid-Sized Sedan look. I will wait until they get a 4-cylinder stick to drive one. No use spending big bucks on a underpowered V6, IMO. And the 4-cylinder Mazda6's I've driven had enough power to suit me.

tbear503 · October 2005

One man's goose is another's gander. I think the center stack is excellent. I bought my GL after driving a rental Mazda 6 for about 33 days. Now, that vehicle's center stack is a ball of confusion!

iluvmysephia1 · October 2005

that's my take on the Fusion, too. Not regarding it's engine power the Fusion will be a hit, though the price of the one you saw is a little steep vs. value quotient vs. the competition. That is only one reason why I traded my '97 Ford Escort in on a '99 Kia Sephia back in may of 1999. Value given for the buck, and styling. Yes, I did favor the styling of the Sephia over the Escort and I feel even stronger now about it than I did 6 years ago after joining the Kia owner/driver's camp.

The Ford Fusion will be a hit, though, engine power notwithstanding. It's looks are appealing and that chrome will work in it's favor. It's engine power will not matter to thousands of American buyers. I now reside in vast-land South Dakota, and this is GM-Chrysler-Ford territory, tried and true. Only the daring in this crowd will consider Toyota-yes, Toyota, with it's dynamic reputation. The people of the Midwest must be fueled by severe patriotism or something, I noticed the same thing in Missouri. GM, DCX and Ford products abound. I have never seen so many Chevy Cadavaliers in my life that I saw on the streets of Missouri.

I much prefer the Hyundai Sonata for looks and the value package. It's hard to beat.
I rented a 2005 Toyota Camry last week and never found out it's engine size. All I know is I drove all over eastern Idaho and my gas mileage was 32.5 mpg upon rental return. The quarters were surprising cramped in the cabin, but I only adjusted my seat several comfort directionals, and couldn't seem to fumble the right knob to move the driver's seat back about 4 inches. It didn't really matter, overall in the '05 Camry driving experience, knobs and controls were easy to read and the car was very easy to learn controls on. My grade for the Camry was 96 out of 100. It was hard to find anything to knock-I figure I must've had the 4-cylinder Camry and yet power was adequate to zip up to freeway speed. More than enough power for me. That's what brings me to think that I would get a 4-cylinder Hyundai Sonata if I were to go that route. Anyhow, I can easily understand the success of Toyota's Camry with the American people. A great car and Toyota is no doubt very proud of it.

It only makes me yearn to test drive the Sonata, yet I have my serious sights on much smaller new rigs.

I just think that the "American rigs for one and for all" mentality of at least America's Midwest section will drive buyer's who want the smaller full-size cars to Ford's Fusion. Just one take on it, that's all.

motownusa · October 2005

While I haven't driven the Mazda6, I was a passenger in one. My cousin owns an 04 4 cylinder and he drove to Houston airport to pick me up. The ride from Hobby International to his house is about 40 minutes. As he was driving I was noticing the details of the car. The inside looks very well put together no unsightly panel gap that I could see. The seats were pretty comfy and the ride quality wasn't as bad as I thought, although certainly no were near as comfortable as my 03 Camry. However, my biggest complaint about the 6 is noise. And I mean it is noisy to the point that you almost have to shout to have a conversation. My Camry is almost silent by comparison. If you want a quiet car, the Mazda isn't it. I hope the Fusion is better in that regards. The Honda and Toyota I4 engines are vastly superior to the Mazda engine (IMHO)

stickguy · October 2005

the Fusion seems to be very quiet from my test drives, and I believe the reviews have noted this too.

stickguy · October 2005

test drove a Milan at lunch today. Mostly stoppped in to look at the styling compared to the Fusion, but the sales person wanted to take a ride (ended up being a 10 mile loop, a real good work out). Anyway, the rear looks nice, but I didn't care too much for th egrill. It would look better if it wasn't silver IMO.

This was my first time getting one up to highway speed (even hit 70!) Overall, I was impressed. It has plenty of pep (I drove a 4 cyl. 5 speed), and a nice ride. Excellent handling, and road noise was modest. Accelerated well.

One quibble, which I expected, is that the gearing is still a bit short. 70 was ~2,900 RPM. Better than my current ride (a tC), but buzzier than an Accord. If they could know 3-400 RPMs off it at 70 it would make for a quiter cruise, with better MPG and still plenty of passing power.

Anyway, a very nice package, and since most people will get the AT, the cruising RPM of the manual is irrelevant. For the $$, it will be a very good choice, and should certainly be considered a viable option in this class.

tbear503 · October 2005

Amen to the fact that the Mazda 6 is noisy. My first test drive in the Sonata really punctuated that.

ilikecars23 · October 2005

I see alot of people stating that the fusion's V6 is underpowered. I was able to test drive the V6, and i must state this engine is very approprioate for this application. I never felt this engine lacking in power, the 6 speed auto is geared perfectly to keep the V6 in its sweet spot. Also, this engine is suprisingly quiet and refined, it features every technology that the others have in this class. Im 23 and i dont need a engine that pins me back in my seat when i drive, i need a engine that has an excellent powerband and one that goes about its business unobtrusively. And again this is a midsize sedan designed for family duty and it without a doubt does its job with the best of them, while offering more style. Just my opinion

goodegg · October 2005

I can't believe anyone would compare a Sonata to an Accord or Camry. The Sonata I drove seemed like it was doing a constant mild vibrate. And yes the 6 is loud. Haven't driven a Fusion - will soon - but I doubt this car is a threat to the 2 clear leaders in this class. IMO - the Accord is the top dog.

backy · October 2005

You needed to turn off the seat vibrator switch on the Sonata--it's to the left of the steering column.

The '06 Sonata you drove must have had something wrong with it. The two that I've driven (I4 and V6) were two of the smoothest cars I've ever been in. The I4 was no slouch either. No vibrator. The Accord, OTOH, did vibrate my body with its constant thumps over every little bump in the road.

Maybe you didn't notice that Edmunds.com did the unfathomable--compared the Sonata to the like-priced Accord and Camry (the unmitigated gall of those people!). And the Sonata took first place.

ctalk · October 2005

The Sonata, is actually more smooth and quieter than the Accord. But the Accord has a more 'sportier' character. I find it has a nice balance between sport, and comfort, some may find it a little to harsh.

I currently own he 2005 Accord EX V6, I did look at the Sonata and if it did not have its (in my opinion) bland interior, I would have bought the Sonata. Its probably the most improved car I have driven this year. It is years ahead from its previous model.

Like Backy stated, edmunds compared like-priced models of the Accord and Camry to the Sonata. The Sonata came out on top as their favorite budget priced family sedan.

I still find the Accord to be at least near the top of its class, or even at the top. The Camry on the other hand, is dated, and is simply out-classed by many of its competitors (but you have to remember, it's in its last year)

goodegg · October 2005

Who's paying edmunds to write that nonsense? Real world (and long term) usage will tell the tale. One good model year does not a winner make. Period. Hyundai might have fooled ya once, but Honda and Toyota will up the ante again with their new versions coming out soon. Booyah.

bhmr59 · October 2005

One year? How about looking at the last 3 or 4 years when the Sonata was rapidly approaching the Accord & Camry, gaining each year? The '06 Sonata is causing the Honda/Toyota to take notice. Camry is getting long in the tooth? That may be, but for today's buyer, why buy an inferior, tired design when something better (and newer) is available from another manufacturer.

If you want to be a loyal Hondo/Toyo fan, that's fine. Others are looking for the best value for their buck.

ctalk · October 2005

How about looking at the last 3 or 4 years when the Sonata was rapidly approaching the Accord & Camry, gaining each year?
The Sonata has improved so much to a point that it is actually better then the Accord and Camry in some ways. But in sales, it still has a long way to go. I would say the Nissan Altima and Chevrolet Impala are the ones that are slowly gaining on Accord and Camry.

backy · October 2005

Who's paying edmunds to write that nonsense?

I can tell there is no hope of having a dialogue with you. Hope you enjoy driving your Honda product(s)!

motownusa · October 2005

You know that the new Camry is coming out in less than six months right ? Maybe the Sonata should be compared to that car and we will see how it fares against it.

Hyundai Sonata vs. Honda Accord vs. Toyota Camry vs. Ford Fusion

Comments

Helpful Tools

Most popular vehicles